QuoteBy Karen Brune Mathis, Managing Editor
Developer Peter Rummell is making a formal pitch to develop his "Healthy Town" concept at the 28.6-acre JEA Southbank site.
He hopes for a home run.
"There really is a big idea here," the Jacksonville businessman and investor said Wednesday, a week before bids were due from developers who want to buy the vacant property.
RELATED STORY: About the JEA site up for grabs.
Rummell considers the idea so big that he is trademarking "The Healthy Town" as well as "Generation H."
Gen H is defined as a growing market of all ages, single and married, families and retirees, who seek "happier, more fulfilling, productive lives" achieved by healthy living that includes their personal habits and living environment."
"We are at the point now where financially it makes sense. Now we have to execute," Rummell said.
Rummell didn't provide an overall investment estimate, but he said it could be $150,000 per unit. At 1,000 units, and there likely would be more, that indicates an investment of at least $150 million.
Full article: http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=544007
Started a big discussion on my FB page. The consensus is it doesn't fit the urban core from the up & coming young professionals in the city. Not that we speak for everyone and my FB page is definitely skewed. But worth bringing up.
Personally, I like it. A nice, dense, walkable community a la San Marco in the 1920s... is that a fair comparison?
I'm still of the opinion that Deutsche Bank is moving in. Obviously things could change, but until there are clear indications otherwise I'll just tentatively assume that's the plan and hope for the best.
Would Rummell's plan adapt for different large scale sites, or is it necessary to be in that location?
I thought young professionals wanted dense walkable areas? So what would this young professional group prefer at this particular site?
Quote from: edjax on October 03, 2014, 12:12:43 PM
I thought young professionals wanted dense walkable areas? So what would this young professional group prefer at this particular site?
Me too! The overall feeling was "it's lame" "is it a retirement community?" etc. There were other concerns that people of the "healthy" lifestyle this development is geared towards will be the bane of making Met Park a cool venue for concerts etc. "...people that like to be in bed at 10pm and not have any noise are not going to fit downtown."
In other words, they expect a bunch of geezers to move in like the ones that live in St Nicholas that would complain about making Jacksonville's nightlife more exciting, when big events are held at Met Park or the Stadium or whatever will happen to the Shipyards.
I'd actually prefer to see an urban scale residential development on this site than more office space. It will all depend on how integrated it can be with the surrounding area. But what we don't need is suburban-style developing (residential, office, or anything else) on such a key piece of land.
Quote from: BoldCityRealist on October 03, 2014, 12:23:48 PM
Quote from: edjax on October 03, 2014, 12:12:43 PM
I thought young professionals wanted dense walkable areas? So what would this young professional group prefer at this particular site?
Me too! The overall feeling was "it's lame" "is it a retirement community?" etc. There were other concerns that people of the "healthy" lifestyle this development is geared towards will be the bane of making Met Park a cool venue for concerts etc. "...people that like to be in bed at 10pm and not have any noise are not going to fit downtown."
In other words, they expect a bunch of geezers to move in like the ones that live in St Nicholas that would complain about making Jacksonville's nightlife more exciting, when big events are held at Met Park or the Stadium or whatever will happen to the Shipyards.
That's an interesting point. Knowing who the developers are, I assume the price point they have in mind isn't exactly going to attract the younger professional demo. Plus, it's hard to imagine "Whiskey Night In Healthy Town". The article makes it almost sound like The Villages.
Not every project has to suit "young professionals". Not everyone interested in urban living fits that demographic.
that's exactly right. The question is whether or not the vision is in conflict with the concept of the Core as an entertainment district with all of its commotion and late night activity. I bought a place in the Core because I wanted to be in the center of all that, and I ain't exactly what you would call a Young Professional.
All in all, I like the vision whether it sounds like The Villages to the young folks or not.
Quote from: Tacachale on October 03, 2014, 01:41:21 PM
I'd actually prefer to see an urban scale residential development on this site than more office space. It will all depend on how integrated it can be with the surrounding area. But what we don't need is suburban-style developing (residential, office, or anything else) on such a key piece of land.
Agreed!
Choosing between infill residential and landing something like Deutsche Bank on that site is a tough decision. I'd first like to see if both could work together but if forced to choose, I'd probably lean towards Deutsche. Primarily because that's something that will create a market for supportive residential/commercial development throughout the urban core.
If I had a magic wand, I'd actually prefer something like this developed in a place like the area formerly known as Sugar Hill or the land surrounding the Prime Osborn. In fact, JTA should get with COJ and seek RFPs for all the land they own in that section of LaVilla. Roadway and transit infrastructure is already in place and land has already been cleared. If green space is desired, perhaps it's time to seriously look at what can be done with McCoys Creek. Combined with what's taking place in Brooklyn, you could have a pretty decent walkable/already connected urban environment in a few short years. It will be interesting to see how all of this plays out.
After reading the article I would live there if I didn't have my house lol. The sketch of the area looked nice. The description of the area sounds ravishing.
Quote from: thelakelander on October 03, 2014, 03:37:00 PM
Choosing between infill residential and landing something like Deutsche Bank on that site is a tough decision. I'd first like to see if both could work together but if forced to choose, I'd probably lean towards Deutsche. Primarily because that's something that will create a market for supportive residential/commercial development throughout the urban core.
If I had a magic wand, I'd actually prefer something like this developed in a place like the area formerly known as Sugar Hill or the land surrounding the Prime Osborn. In fact, JTA should get with COJ and seek RFPs for all the land they own in that section of LaVilla. Roadway and transit infrastructure is already in place and land has already been cleared. If green space is desired, perhaps it's time to seriously look at what can be done with McCoys Creek. Combined with what's taking place in Brooklyn, you could have a pretty decent walkable/already connected urban environment in a few short years. It will be interesting to see how all of this plays out.
Brilliant. LaVilla is prime for a master plan. And it makes much more sense for that area.
That would be so weird if people lived by one of the Skyway stops...
QuoteWhat would make it work? As designed on the JEA site, Rummell said the residential and amenity mix to attract all age groups and a range of demographics would have included:
• 700-800 multifamily units for sale and for rent
• A unit mix from studios to penthouses that would attract, for example, residents ranging from new college graduates taking their first jobs to more affluent professionals to retirees.
• Multistory residential buildings of three to four floors that are designed with the stairs up front and the elevators in back, which could entice residents to take the stairs. "If you walk to your fourth floor five times a day, that's a lot of exercise you wouldn't get otherwise," he said.
• 75,000 to 85,000 square feet of retail, food and beverage space to serve residents and visitors.
• "A riverfront cool bar and restaurant."
• Garden space for rent that encourages residents to plant and reap their produce, but would be tended by staff if the residents prefer.
• The "hardware" of fitness centers and amenities that encourage a healthy lifestyle.
• Most important, he said, is the "base camp" and software services that would be staffed by people who could help residents with questions ranging from finding a church to booking an appointment with a medical center.
Quote from: finehoe on October 04, 2014, 12:11:44 AM
QuoteWhat would make it work? As designed on the JEA site, Rummell said the residential and amenity mix to attract all age groups and a range of demographics would have included:
• 700-800 multifamily units for sale and for rent
• A unit mix from studios to penthouses that would attract, for example, residents ranging from new college graduates taking their first jobs to more affluent professionals to retirees.
• Multistory residential buildings of three to four floors that are designed with the stairs up front and the elevators in back, which could entice residents to take the stairs. "If you walk to your fourth floor five times a day, that's a lot of exercise you wouldn't get otherwise," he said.
• 75,000 to 85,000 square feet of retail, food and beverage space to serve residents and visitors.
• "A riverfront cool bar and restaurant."
• Garden space for rent that encourages residents to plant and reap their produce, but would be tended by staff if the residents prefer.
• The "hardware" of fitness centers and amenities that encourage a healthy lifestyle.
• Most important, he said, is the "base camp" and software services that would be staffed by people who could help residents with questions ranging from finding a church to booking an appointment with a medical center.
This all sounds super awesome to me. If it comes down to this or the Deutsche Bank complex, I'd be happy with either.
^^^ or a blending of the two. Both are incredible uses for this property.
I am not too enthused at this project. What recent college graduate wants or can afford to live alongside affluent retirees? This idea seems thrown together and I am not sure its the right fit for downtown.
Quote from: jaxlore on October 08, 2014, 11:36:56 AM
I am not too enthused at this project. What recent college graduate wants or can afford to live alongside affluent retirees? This idea seems thrown together and I am not sure its the right fit for downtown.
that's actually the demographic makeup of many urban downtowns now....millenials and active retirees
I see your point. But still cant see how you would market that. "Workout and live right downstairs from your grandparents". Maybe once the full plan is released it will make more sense to me.
Not all retirees are in their 70 and 80s. So if you have young professionals in their 30s and early retirees in their 50s and 60s, not a bad mix.
JEA gets 2 bids for Southbank site
The process to sell JEA's riverfront property along the Southbank Downtown that began nearly 14 years ago may soon come to an end.
On Tuesday, two bid proposals were accepted by the public not-for-profit utility. One was from Elements Development LLC, a partnership between developers Michael Balanky and Peter Rummell.
Their plan for the site is a Healthy Town concept, a residential community for all ages designed for people seeking a healthy environment and lifestyle.
The other respondent, Atlanta-based RocaPoint Partners, is an investment firm comprising Phil Mays, former portfolio manager and legal affairs manager for EverBank Commercial Advisors; Patrick Leonard, former residential and commercial real estate development executive at EverBank; and Adam Flatto, president of the Georgetown Co., a privately held real estate investment and development company based in New York City, according to the company's website.
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=544040
Quote from: jaxlore on October 08, 2014, 02:05:00 PM
I see your point. But still cant see how you would market that. "Workout and live right downstairs from your grandparents". Maybe once the full plan is released it will make more sense to me.
I don't think the idea is as much about marketing to groups of old and young people as it is marketing ideas that attract people of all ages.
From the Jax Business Journal:
QuoteRummell's Healthy Town project gets preliminary approval from JEA
Based on its offer of a higher price per acre for JEA's Southbank property, Peter Rummell's Elements project has gotten the preliminary nod from the utility.
Rummell, along with development partner Mike Balanky, have proposed a healthy living-focused mixed use project for the site.
In the proposals, which were unveiled Tuesday, Elements offered $608,164 — or about $200 per acre — for the 30-acre site.
The other bidder, RocaPoint Partners, bid $404,169, or $133 per acre...
RocaPoint has proposed a mixed use project for the site.
...The decision now moves to the full board, which will be meeting later today.
Full story at: http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2014/10/21/rummells-healthy-town-project-gets-preliminary.html
It would be nice to see some kind of site plan.
Quote from: jcjohnpaint on October 21, 2014, 11:48:49 AM
It would be nice to see some kind of site plan.
Agreed. I've searched all over for one, to no avail.
The story above does not mesh with one currently up on JBJ in a very important way. The story states on the site states the $600,000 plus figure is PER ACRE , not the total amount as indicated above thus the total amount is in excess of $17 million. This would make more sense as when I read the above figures I was like, really??
It's $608k per acre. They corrected it. Not sure how that got out though.
My big question here is will the Riverwalk be extended down to this? Because I feel that would be essential.
I also hope they make the Skyway more accessible from this area. If the Skyway was extended to Brooklyn as well, it would really fulfill its potential as a people mover. You could grab dinner at the new restaurant in 200 Riverside, stop by downtown for a cocktail and get home early enough to wake up for a gym sesh in Healthy Town - all without getting in your car!
Quote from: BoldCityRealist on October 21, 2014, 03:21:10 PM
My big question here is will the Riverwalk be extended down to this? Because I feel that would be essential.
I also hope they make the Skyway more accessible from this area. If the Skyway was extended to Brooklyn as well, it would really fulfill its potential as a people mover. You could grab dinner at the new restaurant in 200 Riverside, stop by downtown for a cocktail and get home early enough to wake up for a gym sesh in Healthy Town - all without getting in your car!
"Healthytown" is a short walk to the Kings Avenue Skyway Station.
Will be interesting to see the site plan for this, but that much residential in that area is certainly promising. Good access to the Riverwalk, Skyway, and hopefully the adjacent neighborhoods as well.
http://www.youtube.com/v/xF77Y1JLScc
Gotta make a move to a town that's right for me
Town to keep me movin', keep me groovin' with some energy
Well, I talk about it, talk about it
Talk about it, talk about it
Talk about, talk about
Talk about movin'
Gotta move on
Gotta move on
Gotta move on
{Bridge}
A-won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
{Bridge}
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
{Bridge}
Gotta make a move to a town that's right for me
Town to keep me movin', keep me groovin' with some energy
Well, I talk about it, talk about it
Talk about it, talk about it
Talk about, talk about
Talk about movin'
Gotta move on
Gotta move on
Gotta move on
{Bridge}
A-won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
{Bridge}
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me to Healthytown?
Won't you take me down to Healthytown?
Won't you take me down to Healthytown?
Won't you take me down to Healthytown?
Won't you take me down to Healthytown?
(Won't you take me to) Healthytown?
(Won't you take me to) Healthytown?
(Won't you take me to) Healthytown?
(Won't you take me to) Healthytown?
Take me, won't you take me?
Take me, won't you take me?
Take me, won't you take me?
Take me, won't you take me?
I wanna go to Healthytown
I wanna go to Healthytown
I wanna go to Healthytown
I wanna go to Healthytown
1,000 to 1,200 multifamily residential units for sale and for rent as well as the "base camp" and 100,000 to 150,000 square feet of space for retail, food and beverage.
Balanky said the project could accommodate professional office uses and possibly a hotel, making it a mixed-use development.
I really hope that don't go forward with that name if it goes through...
Thank you finehoe for that musical interlude. :)
Quote from: thelakelander on October 03, 2014, 09:56:20 AM
QuoteBy Karen Brune Mathis, Managing Editor
Developer Peter Rummell is making a formal pitch to develop his "Healthy Town" concept at the 28.6-acre JEA Southbank site.
He hopes for a home run.
"There really is a big idea here," the Jacksonville businessman and investor said Wednesday, a week before bids were due from developers who want to buy the vacant property.
RELATED STORY: About the JEA site up for grabs.
Rummell considers the idea so big that he is trademarking "The Healthy Town" as well as "Generation H."
Gen H is defined as a growing market of all ages, single and married, families and retirees, who seek "happier, more fulfilling, productive lives" achieved by healthy living that includes their personal habits and living environment."
"We are at the point now where financially it makes sense. Now we have to execute," Rummell said.
Rummell didn't provide an overall investment estimate, but he said it could be $150,000 per unit. At 1,000 units, and there likely would be more, that indicates an investment of at least $150 million.
Full article: http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=544007
Thought others may enjoy reading this Letter to the Editor about Healthy Town from my neighbor:
"Mr. Rummell's plans for a 'Healthy Town' are definitely different from the cookie-cutter suburban development that Jacksonville seems to be addicted to and a breath of fresh air for those of us who see the value of living within the urban core. I like it; Jacksonville's urban core needs to be seen as a good and healthy place to live if we want to grow up and be taken more seriously as a city. I have one challenging idea for Mr. Rummell and a silver lining to Deutche Bank's potential acquisition of the JEA site. His concept already *mostly* exists and merely needs his extended vision.
Rummell essentially wants to build what we already have nearly all of in Springfield. That's right, Jacksonville's red-headed stepchild, Springfield. This is the neighborhood my family and I have called home and watched transform almost totally through the hard work and determination of ourselves and our neighbors for the past sixteen years. From the perspective I've gained having grown up in the suburbs, choosing Springfield as our home when starting our family, and visiting more than one tier-1 city I think if more developers had the vision to look past building all-new and explored a mix of creative re-use and new construction stitched into existing fabric on the scale of what he wants to do, they'd find plenty fertile sites for germinating their grand ideas and seeing them fruit bountifully in ways that they hadn't expected. There are also fantastic neighbors already here - many neighbors who will admit their initial hesitance about the neighborhood given the perceived risk who have been overwhelmingly rewarded with what most of us feel is the best neighborhood we have ever lived in.
See - an existing open and inclusive community such as ours that already has the mindset of a "Healthy Town" is one heck of an amenity that cannot be engineered and constructed. It has to grow organically from several diverse individuals and families who are of like-enough mind to make it work. 9 of his 10 Principles are already at work here. It's that second one that is constantly overlooked.
Mr. Rummell, don your imagineer glasses and peer up Main St. less than a mile outside of Downtown and you'll see plenty available retail space, vacant land that can handle multistory residential building, existing parks and recreation infrastructure, and easy ingress + egress to and from the other urban core neighborhoods. You'll also see that Springfield is a mere healthy bicycle ride, jog, or stroll from the Downtown riverfront. The Springfield neighborhood is a location of economic value; it's time for it to be fully recognized and enable all 10 Principles to be applied and in effect."
Quote from: comncense on October 21, 2014, 08:47:18 PM
I really hope that don't go forward with that name if it goes through...
What name? Healthy Town? That would not be the name of the development, that is just the concept. Currently e name would be Element.
Saw a site plan on WOKV Reporter Stephanie Brown's twitter page of both proposals. I am sure someone can import them that is not as tech challenged as me.
Quote from: edjax on October 22, 2014, 06:25:08 PM
Saw a site plan on WOKV Reporter Stephanie Brown's twitter page of both proposals. I am sure someone can import them that is not as tech challenged as me.
Thank you!
(http://media.cmgdigital.com/shared/img/photos/2014/10/21/f6/5d/southbank.jpg)
Hmm. That's a decent layout!
And that nearby Skyway station is perfectly positioned to connect the Northbank with this development. ;D
Would love to see a direct walking path to the skyway but it is close enough.
I like it.
word is that a 3/2 condo is going to be priced around 350k. Pretty attractive entry point for that location, I think.
That seems steep, though I guess it's not much over what a lot of homes farther south in San Marco go for, even those not right on the river.
The JEA board member who heard the proposal told me that they, the board, were blown away by the local Jacksonville presentation. These folks did their homework and were able to overcome every single objection that the New York investors came up with during the Q&A timeframe. Balanky and Rummell put together a great group, after seeing what they have done in Jacksonville, I know this is the beginning of something very special. Balanky worked to build San Marco Place, so this is not that far from that facility.
My problem with this location is I wonder how the retail component will fair. The site doesnt have the easiest access and isn't in anyones direct path commuting in the area, kindof tucked away. I wonder how the retail component will survive honestly.
The retail area will be fine. After all, the community is supposed to support the residents. Right now, that area of town is a ghost barn, nothing there, so something is better than nothing.
Who knows, maybe they will build the "Landing" the way Sleiman wants to build his Landing, but poor Tony will have
to use his own checkbook, instead of the citizens.