Ex-CEO of failed bank running for office
By Michael Braga
Herald-Tribune
Published: Wednesday, August 6, 2014 at 1:00 a.m.
Jay Fant ran one of Jacksonville's oldest banks before it was seized by regulators during the Great Recession.
Now, he now wants to represent the people of District 17 in the Florida Legislature.
http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20140806/article/308069991
My father was one of the first depositors in the Five Points Guaranty Bank in 1947. I did my personal banking there for thirty years. They were hard nosed, cautious and tight-fisted with their loans.
When Jay took over he started making loans to social friends against the advice of some of his officers. He lost staff because he started pushing his fundamentalist version of Christianity on them. His staff called him lazy. Took him just a few years to ruin the solid bank created by his grandfather and father. The bank was not a victim of the Great Recession, it was a victim of his foolishness and would have failed anyway just not so quickly.
When I saw what was happening and talked to some departing staff, I moved all of my banking affairs out.
Jay Fant isn't capable of running a hot dog cart much less representing us in the state legislature.
I am wholeheartedly supporting Paul Renner and look forward to voting for him later this month. Real solid guy.
It's pretty easy to pile on the failings of Fant at First Guaranty. Anyone with a shred of sense knows why the bank failed (and it wasn't because of their rock solid deposit base), why they took so long to try to unwind their balance sheet, why they held out so long to sell, etc.
I so hope Fant is defeated. I honestly believe he would take his district and our area back a century or more.
Jay Fant is a wonderful candidate. Tall, handsome, with a beautiful wife and handsome children. He would be a disaster as a legislator. He has been able to afford a bunch of TV ads which are a good venue for him and will avoid anything like a forum or debate where his shortcomings would be very evident.
Entitled, spoiled, arrogant, lazy are all appropriate adjectives. So are bigoted, misogynistic, narrow minded.
Quote from: Dog Walker on August 09, 2014, 09:02:34 AM
Jay Fant is a wonderful candidate. Tall, handsome, with a beautiful wife and handsome children. He would be a disaster as a legislator. He has been able to afford a bunch of TV ads which are a good venue for him and will avoid anything like a forum or debate where his shortcomings would be very evident.
Entitled, spoiled, arrogant, lazy are all appropriate adjectives. So are bigoted, misogynistic, narrow minded.
I bet $100 you have never met him.... It's easy to be anonymous and throw around slander on the interwebz. what's funny is most posts are mere projection...
fatuous much?
Quote from: stephendare on August 09, 2014, 11:52:13 AM
Quote from: Sentient on August 09, 2014, 11:44:32 AM
Quote from: Dog Walker on August 09, 2014, 09:02:34 AM
Jay Fant is a wonderful candidate. Tall, handsome, with a beautiful wife and handsome children. He would be a disaster as a legislator. He has been able to afford a bunch of TV ads which are a good venue for him and will avoid anything like a forum or debate where his shortcomings would be very evident.
Entitled, spoiled, arrogant, lazy are all appropriate adjectives. So are bigoted, misogynistic, narrow minded.
I bet $100 you have never met him.... It's easy to be anonymous and throw around slander on the interwebz. what's funny is most posts are mere projection...
fatuous much?
Actually, Dogwalker is hardly anonymous around here Sentient, and is very well known and active in this community, and actually has family history here.
You would lose that 100 dollars, and I hope you have the good sense to withdraw the offer to bet.
:)
appreciate your concern... I really look forward to his backing up the bigoted statement with some facts. Let's see if he can. Can you Mr. D? That is quite a claim.
Quote from: Sentient on August 09, 2014, 11:44:32 AM
Quote from: Dog Walker on August 09, 2014, 09:02:34 AM
Jay Fant is a wonderful candidate. Tall, handsome, with a beautiful wife and handsome children. He would be a disaster as a legislator. He has been able to afford a bunch of TV ads which are a good venue for him and will avoid anything like a forum or debate where his shortcomings would be very evident.
Entitled, spoiled, arrogant, lazy are all appropriate adjectives. So are bigoted, misogynistic, narrow minded.
I bet $100 you have never met him.... It's easy to be anonymous and throw around slander on the interwebz. what's funny is most posts are mere projection...
fatuous much?
I've met him on a number of occasions. I was a major depositor in his bank after all. I've had lunch with him at Sushi Cafe when it was in the old location after a chance meeting there. I've sat in his office to work out a mortgage problem that a family member had with the bank.
His father granted me one of the first commercial construction loans and one of the first commercial mortgages that the bank had ever given to anyone. I've put several million dollars through First Guaranty Bank over the years when I was building my business.
His brother-in-law, Councilman Greg Anderson, is now my banker. He and his wife lost a chunk of their net worth when the bank failed as she was a shareholder. Greg started his banker career under Jay's father.
Enough?
Fant has Billie Tucker, of tea party and JEA fame, on his campaign payroll.
He also has Raymond Johnson, very much a bigot, on the payroll.
He also claims that he will work to repeal Obamacare which is a joke. Obamacare is a federal law and someone needs to tell him that he is not running for congress.
Jay Fant may be a nice guy but not someone I want representing my neighborhood in Tally.
Quote from: Intuition Ale Works on August 09, 2014, 02:11:38 PM
He also has Raymond Johnson, very much a bigot, on the payroll.
Mr. Johnson's involvement in Jay's campaign has really made me question Jay's judgement. Johnson has been investigated by the State Attorney's Office for conduct in previous campaigns and he has been shunned by most reasonable people of good will in this city.
Quote from: Dog Walker on August 09, 2014, 02:01:04 PM
Quote from: Sentient on August 09, 2014, 11:44:32 AM
Quote from: Dog Walker on August 09, 2014, 09:02:34 AM
Jay Fant is a wonderful candidate. Tall, handsome, with a beautiful wife and handsome children. He would be a disaster as a legislator. He has been able to afford a bunch of TV ads which are a good venue for him and will avoid anything like a forum or debate where his shortcomings would be very evident.
Entitled, spoiled, arrogant, lazy are all appropriate adjectives. So are bigoted, misogynistic, narrow minded.
I bet $100 you have never met him.... It's easy to be anonymous and throw around slander on the interwebz. what's funny is most posts are mere projection...
fatuous much?
I've met him on a number of occasions. I was a major depositor in his bank after all. I've had lunch with him at Sushi Cafe when it was in the old location after a chance meeting there. I've sat in his office to work out a mortgage problem that a family member had with the bank.
His father granted me one of the first commercial construction loans and one of the first commercial mortgages that the bank had ever given to anyone. I've put several million dollars through First Guaranty Bank over the years when I was building my business.
His brother-in-law, Councilman Greg Anderson, is now my banker. He and his wife lost a chunk of their net worth when the bank failed as she was a shareholder. Greg started his banker career under Jay's father.
Enough?
And you say he is a bigot? Based on what? You had a chance encounter with him and banked with his family (which is completely irrelevant). How do you explain your statement, your statement sir, that he is a bigot. I am all ears.
Quote from: stephendare on August 09, 2014, 12:36:08 PM
I think we might have very different ideas on the definition of the word 'bigot'.
And I think if you read up a little further in the thread, you will find that DW actually already outlined the foundation for his opinion.
It would be disheartening to think a real journalist would have a "different" definition of bigot, I hope you are not serious. How about the word truth, what is your definition of that? Maybe you should have a Metrojax dictionary link up on here and I can catch up.
I will stick with Webster...
and I do not see where DogWalker outlined any foundation for his libelous statement that Jay Fant is a bigot, please point this out. And I think he has to prove it. Or is credibility completely irrelevant here...
Quote from: Apache on August 08, 2014, 06:24:03 PM
I'd be interested to hear more opinions on these two. I've done some prelim research and I'm leaning to Renner also. But I'm not seeing a while lot of differences other than one appears to be very wealthy and connected. Interested to hear any personal experiences with the men. I also recall reading that Fant was far ahead in some preliminary poll although I can't find where I read that or where the info was gather.
Check this out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ez0ZRMoebsI from 2009, in the dark of the financial crisis... And make up your mind.
The Fant's have ideals and values, lent to local businesses and DID NOT move to foreclose early on their customers - many of which they had done business with and were friends with for years - which would have driven down values of everyone's property faster, hurting their balance sheet in the meantime, and they tried to forestall the collapse of their bank. But yes they failed.
Failed via remaining true to their ideals and good people. The only people that were hurt by this idealism were the family. Their equity was wiped out. Depositors remained whole the entire time. And please, there were many of others in seasoned leadership positions in First Guaranty who wanted to grow the bank once Hickory stepped down. This was not Jay's big idea, if anything he was overly trusting of the staff.
So the whole "bank failed because of Jay" spiel really lacks a foundation... success has a thousand fathers, failure stands an orphan...
i would prefer someone in office who walks their talk, everyday, not just come election promise time...
Quote from: Flash60 on August 08, 2014, 08:56:34 AM
Ex-CEO of failed bank running for office
By Michael Braga
Herald-Tribune
Published: Wednesday, August 6, 2014 at 1:00 a.m.
Jay Fant ran one of Jacksonville's oldest banks before it was seized by regulators during the Great Recession.
Now, he now wants to represent the people of District 17 in the Florida Legislature.
http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20140806/article/308069991
from the same 'news" article... Funny the race has been going on since October, but two weeks before the vote this "news" comes to light in the TU... wonder who they are supporting?
"According to research conducted by the Herald- Tribune for its Breaking the Banks series, First Guaranty failed because it made many of the same mistakes that 69 other Florida banks made during the Great Recession -- and those mistakes were made when Fant held the title of chief executive."
Hey I bet a lot of you guys banked with WACHOVIA... remember them? Oh yeah... complete hatchet job, and worse, just poor "journalism". More disgrace for Jokesonville.
Good god Sentimental, settle down. No one with a brain would vote for Fant. When you lose peoples money they tend to get testy.
If you need to know more about Renner do research or I am happy to facilitate a meeting. PM
Quote from: Sentient on August 09, 2014, 09:16:39 PM
Quote from: Apache on August 08, 2014, 06:24:03 PM
I'd be interested to hear more opinions on these two. I've done some prelim research and I'm leaning to Renner also. But I'm not seeing a while lot of differences other than one appears to be very wealthy and connected. Interested to hear any personal experiences with the men. I also recall reading that Fant was far ahead in some preliminary poll although I can't find where I read that or where the info was gather.
Check this out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ez0ZRMoebsI from 2009, in the dark of the financial crisis...
And make up your mind.
The Fant's have ideals and values, lent to local businesses and DID NOT move to foreclose early on their customers - many of which they had done business with and were friends with for years - which would have driven down values of everyone's property faster, hurting their balance sheet in the meantime, and they tried to forestall the collapse of their bank. But yes they failed.
Failed via remaining true to their ideals and good people. The only people that were hurt by this idealism were the family. Their equity was wiped out. Depositors remained whole the entire time. And please, there were many of others in seasoned leadership positions in First Guaranty who wanted to grow the bank once Hickory stepped down. This was not Jay's big idea, if anything he was overly trusting of the staff.
So the whole "bank failed because of Jay" spiel really lacks a foundation... success has a thousand fathers, failure stands an orphan...
i would prefer someone in office who walks their talk, everyday, not just come election promise time...
Wow, he loosened his sleeves and he is ready to work!
I viewed the video. Jay has been a customer of mine for many years. Nice people. Jay and Hickory. When I wanted a commercial loan in about 2006, Vystar and BOA refused to lend to me, as my documentation was weak. First Guaranty did the loan so I could buy and renovate the building downtown. It was a gamble for them, although I was confident in my business strategy.
As a trade-off, I transferred my main accounts and my credit card processing from BOA to First Guaranty. I was disappointed when the bank was taken over by Centerstate Bank. I lost nothing as a consequence of the failure, as my deposits were minimal.
Soon after, I spoke to Hickory. Nice man. Even though I was weak financially, I have been able to pay every payment to them, and am able to do so now to Centerstate.
I suspect that the loan officers, perhaps encouraged or permitted by Jay, were caught up in the hoopla of the false economy. Oblivious to the realities of the economy, they lent money carelessly to individuals not grounded in solid businesses. An intolerable number failed to repay loans, and pushed the bank to failure.
Of course Jay lives in the opposite spectrum of the economy than I, and in an opposite political ideology. I tend to approve of reserved engagement of what is called socialism ... a term related in some ways to the idea of communism, both of which over the years being negatively propagandized and belittled by those in positions of power and wealth, so as to maintain their wealth and power.
Therefore Jay (whom I admire in many ways), apparently isolated from the realities of the lower and middle classes in our country ... and being I suspect, excessively a friend of the conservative, the devoutly religious, and the wealthy, will not see my vote, as I am concerned about the unfortunates living in the opposite extremes of our economy.
The video allowed me to determine that Jay is a classic politician, oblivious to the realities facing our nation, and to the realities facing 90 percent of our population ... or at least he was oblivious at the time of the video. Perhaps, he has become, or will become as time passes, a man genuine in having concern for the average worker, for the unfortunate, for the 90 percent.
He didnt say Jay Fant was a bigot he said Raymond Johnson is a bigot..which he is. Go check out Raymond Johnson's facebook page. He is obsessed with homosexual men. Most likely one himself and uses his hate and venom towards them to cover up his own sexual issues...the fact that Jay has someone like this man working so closely with him makes me question his integrity and reasoning skills.
I have read many posts by Sentient and find them to be mostly ethnocentric, anti-Jacksonville, or just plain argumentative. I am anti-Fant, but I don't like either candidate. To run for state office saying you "will fight to repeal Obamacare", is ridiculous. One must choose from the better of two buffoons.
Quote from: Apache on August 10, 2014, 11:47:06 AM
Quote from: Snaketoz on August 10, 2014, 11:40:42 AM
I have read many posts by Sentient and find them to be mostly ethnocentric, anti-Jacksonville, or just plain argumentative. I am anti-Fant, but I don't like either candidate. To run for state office saying you "will fight to repeal Obamacare", is ridiculous. One must choose from the better of two buffoons.
What do you dislike about Renner? Good to hear both sides.
I don't know Jay Fant, but I've known Paul Renner for many years. Although it may be tempting to characterize anyone running for office as a "buffoon," those who know Paul well would tell you that he is a good man. He is one of a handful of people from Jax that graduated from Davidson College (one of the best liberal arts colleges in the country), he has a law degree from UF, and he put his life on the line for our country in actual combat service during Desert Storm. He later took a sabbatical from a successful law practice to serve our country again as an Intelligence Officer in Afghanistan. That's not a "buffoon" . . . that's a well-educated, intelligent man who now wants to serve his country in a different role.
Thankfully I can't vote in this race...I say this because neither candidate is ideal. Renner is by far the better option, but in my discussion with him the other night, he didn't even seem to understand that many in areas like Riveriside-Avondale are pretty progressive. Both candidates are trying to out-conservative each other, which I find wholly unattractive. And then there's the whole "pro-family" thing, whatever that means.
QuoteJay Fant isn't capable of running a hot dog cart much less representing us in the state legislature.
+1
Really all you need to know in this race.
The first time I saw a Jay Fant sign I was shocked and surprised at his nerve to run for any office after running a very fine bank into the ground.
Quote from: GatorNation on August 10, 2014, 05:10:16 PM
Quote from: Apache on August 10, 2014, 11:47:06 AM
Quote from: Snaketoz on August 10, 2014, 11:40:42 AM
I have read many posts by Sentient and find them to be mostly ethnocentric, anti-Jacksonville, or just plain argumentative. I am anti-Fant, but I don't like either candidate. To run for state office saying you "will fight to repeal Obamacare", is ridiculous. One must choose from the better of two buffoons.
What do you dislike about Renner? Good to hear both sides.
I don't know Jay Fant, but I've known Paul Renner for many years. Although it may be tempting to characterize anyone running for office as a "buffoon," those who know Paul well would tell you that he is a good man. He is one of a handful of people from Jax that graduated from Davidson College (one of the best liberal arts colleges in the country), he has a law degree from UF, and he put his life on the line for our country in actual combat service during Desert Storm. He later took a sabbatical from a successful law practice to serve our country again as an Intelligence Officer in Afghanistan. That's not a "buffoon" . . . that's a well-educated, intelligent man who now wants to serve his country in a different role.
Gator, I've said that I prefer Renner, and I'm sure that he is intelligent and well educated. My only problem with him is his own words. Does his own words sound intelligent to anyone? "If elected I will fight Obamacare". Really, a man is running for state office talking about repealing Obamacare? Is this a display of being well educated and intelligent? Reminds me of the old saying "I thought the candidate was a fool until he spoke and removed all doubt."
Quote from: Snaketoz on August 11, 2014, 08:29:02 AM
Does his own words sound intelligent to anyone?
hmmm
I certainly hope the better of the 2 wins the election. This city needs deserves to have the best the field has to offer in positions of power. As for disagreements I get where the opposing posters who are possibly a bit newer are coming from. After all I have been in that position and I can tell people one thing. I made a pretty good acquaintance here and he once told me that the field of people on this board are very extensive and I can tell you that he was absolutely right. So please do be cautious when trying to put people in their proverbial places, as the masses of people here are pretty more involved in different areas than one may think. That is of course unless you already know someone personally, but the majority of people do not use their real names here so it can be hard to research a person before making a comment. So keep it civil people :)
On to the race. I do not know both parties running nor have I seen any of the corresponding endorsed messages or propaganda. I would be interested in hearing a public debate or statement explaining what exactly led to the demise of that bank. I mean it could have been just another bank merger as we have seen them hundreds of times over the past 20 years, or it could have been something far worse. However, as another poster said before when people think their money is at stake they are going to put the iron gauntlets on and go out swinging. So I think Mr. Fant should definitely make an attempt to offer the people who may be skeptical of his ability a forum where he can shut down those that may think lower of his abilities. This would be a good thing for the people because they can accurately tell if you are genuine or full of it. If you do nothing then of course they will think you are full of it.
Perhaps, this will help.
Failed Bank Information
Information for First Guaranty Bank and Trust Company of Jacksonville, Jacksonville, FL
https://www.fdic.gov/bank/individual/failed/fgbtcj.html
There is also this about Jay Fant
"In HD 15, Jay Fant falsely claiming endorsement of NRA & Florida Right to Life"
By Peter Schorsch on August 11, 2014
Move over HD 74, the GOP primary for HD 15 is quickly becoming the most contentious legislative race in the state.
In a press release, HD 15 hopeful is accusing opponent Jay Fant of misleading voters by falsely claiming endorsements he does not have. In a video released by the Florida Times-Union, Fant falsely stated that he has received endorsements from the National Rifle Association (NRA) and the National Right to Life. The video interview was posted on Friday on the Times-Union website as part of an editorial page blog.
In the video, at approximately :09 – :10, Fant states that he has been "endorsed by the NRA and the Florida Right to Life" in the race for House District 15. This statement is categorically false and is in violation of state campaign laws says Renner's camp.
The Florida Times-Union has since edited the online video cutting out Fant's false comments, but the original clip can be viewed here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fy7qRvqFna4
Fant, like Paul Renner, received an 'A' rating from these organizations, but did NOT receive their official endorsement.
"Neither the NRA or Unified Sportsman of Florida has endorsed anyone in the race for House District 15," said Marion Hammer, past president of the NRA and executive director of the Unified Sportsmen of Florida.
"Unfortunately, you cannot un-ring the bell in today's world of online media, and there is no telling how many people Mr. Fant has actually made these false claims to throughout the district," said Sarah Bascom, spokesperson for Renner's campaign."
Not only did he run a fine bank into the ground now I see in todays paper he is a bold faced liar.
Who in the world could vote for such a man?
Quote from: funguy on August 13, 2014, 11:07:07 AM
Not only did he run a fine bank into the ground now I see in todays paper he is a bold faced liar.
Who in the world could vote for such a man?
Sounds like Renner is getting increasingly desperate... First he goes back on a clean campaign pledge, then his minions go out and steal signs and now he is parsing old videos...
Predict Fant will win.
Quote from: stephendare on August 13, 2014, 12:30:40 PM
never really got the whole 'stealing signs' thing.
But literally every campaign does it. The volunteers and supporters get pretty passionate about it.
That's the thing, the crap that "every" aspiring politico does creates our failed legislative system. It is time to break with this, which is what has the machine and the lobbyists so concerned with Fant. He is not some mere striver who will sell out to the powers in Tallanasty (he has his own money). He actually has convictions and beliefs. He has suffered for these and you may not share them, but someone who follows a principled path is worth something.
Predict more crass and increasingly lunatic behavior to come from the very well funded lobbyists...
Quote from: stephendare on August 13, 2014, 12:41:48 PM
Welcome to the south, sentient. In the north side races, the sign sabotage usually resorts to fisticuffs and sometimes gunplay. :)
Im sure Jay Fant is sincere in his beliefs, but surrounding himself with people like the Tea Party/ JEA seamster isn't very comforting is it?
I would take Tea Party over the old guard Republican Machine any day. The machine is unwelcome to free thinkers with conviction.
Quote from: Sentient on August 13, 2014, 12:38:58 PM
Quote from: stephendare on August 13, 2014, 12:30:40 PM
never really got the whole 'stealing signs' thing.
But literally every campaign does it. The volunteers and supporters get pretty passionate about it.
That's the thing, the crap that "every" aspiring politico does creates our failed legislative system. It is time to break with this, which is what has the machine and the lobbyists so concerned with Fant. He is not some mere striver who will sell out to the powers in Tallanasty (he has his own money). He actually has convictions and beliefs. He has suffered for these and you may not share them, but someone who follows a principled path is worth something.
Predict more crass and increasingly lunatic behavior to come from the very well funded lobbyists...
The 'machine and lobbyists concerned with Fant'?
Hardly, he has hired some pretty entrenched political weazles to run his campaign. He bears little resemblence to the political maverick you are painting him as.
'He has suffered'?
Jay Fant has hardly suffered in life. He did run a ridiculously solid bank into the ground, and taxpayers suffered as a consequence. So yes, there is some 'suffering' in his life, but he does not bear the brunt of that suffering.
Do 'principled paths' lead down a road of lieing on camera?
Quote from: fieldafm on August 13, 2014, 01:00:18 PM
Quote from: Sentient on August 13, 2014, 12:38:58 PM
Quote from: stephendare on August 13, 2014, 12:30:40 PM
never really got the whole 'stealing signs' thing.
But literally every campaign does it. The volunteers and supporters get pretty passionate about it.
That's the thing, the crap that "every" aspiring politico does creates our failed legislative system. It is time to break with this, which is what has the machine and the lobbyists so concerned with Fant. He is not some mere striver who will sell out to the powers in Tallanasty (he has his own money). He actually has convictions and beliefs. He has suffered for these and you may not share them, but someone who follows a principled path is worth something.
Predict more crass and increasingly lunatic behavior to come from the very well funded lobbyists...
The 'machine and lobbyists concerned with Fant'?
Hardly, he has hired some pretty entrenched political weazles to run his campaign. He bears little resemblence to the political maverick you are painting him as.
'He has suffered'?
Jay Fant has hardly suffered in life. He did run a ridiculously solid bank into the ground, and taxpayers suffered as a consequence. So yes, there is some 'suffering' in his life, but he does not bear the brunt of that suffering.
Do 'principled paths' lead down a road of lieing on camera?
I'd call losing all of your equity suffering... The rest of your post is kind of shrill.
This was an interesting read... since we're getting all truthful and all that... also interesting the FMA backed PAC is targeting two races, one in sarasota and one here... Guess they see a guy who would vote for lower medical costs on the horizon. Hint, that isn't Renner.
http://www.bizpacreview.com/2014/08/05/florida-races-heat-up-fant-vs-renner-whos-telling-the-truth-in-hd-15-136684
Florida races heat up: Fant vs Renner, who's telling the truth in HD 15?
August 5, 2014 by Yolanda Armstrong 0 Comments
Every election cycle, it's the same. We get to the last month before the primaries, and the otherwise-boring political season of predictable slogans and policy proposals melts into a fiery inferno of traded barbs.
Like heat-sensing missiles, mail pieces and media fill the air, delivering blows and, ultimately, what most people hope for: the knockout.
It's always interesting to see who fires first, how the opponents respond, and how the one who fired first tries to deny responsibility. It has become a farce.
Consider what happened in Florida House District 15 last week.
Fant Brenner 1Republican candidates Jay Fant and Paul Renner are vying to replace term-limited Rep. Daniel Davis in the Jacksonville-area district.
In June, Fant challenged Renner to sign a clean-campaign pledge. Renner responded within a day or two, and they worked out the terms for what seemed like a good compact.
Well, here we are with three weeks to go, and all hell has broken loose. At the end of last week, the Better Florida Fund Corp. delivered a karate-chop mailer, criticizing Fant for the way he handled his family banking business during the recession. Every community bank in Florida had difficulty during the recession, so no big deal, right?
Not the way the Better Florida Fund sold it, using the most lurid vocabulary to try to make Fant out to be nothing short of Bernie Madoff.
Disappointing tactics, but that's the way the cards are played.
But then the fun began. Fant issued a strongly-worded statement accusing Renner of breaking his pledge to run a clean campaign. Renner insisted the mailer was the work of the Better Florida Fund, not him, and that Fant was breaking their pledge by accusing Renner of the assault.
Who's right? BizPac Review did some digging.
According to the Florida Times-Union, Renner hired gunslingers Marc Reichelderfer and Brian Hughes to run his campaign last year.
Reichelderfer has a good reputation as a capable consultant, despite a recent bump in the road as a star witness in the redistricting trial.
The Better Florida Fund is basically a subsidiary political committee for the Florida Medical Association — the association is the only donor, and its president is the registered agent — and the doctor group did endorse Renner.
But unless you checked the lobbyist directory, you wouldn't know that Reichelderfer is also a paid lobbyist for the Florida Medical Association. BizPac Review's Tallahassee sources confirmed that for a long time, the medical association has taken much of its political direction from Reichelderfer.
BPR is no stranger to how these independent committees work, so we are quickly calling baloney on Renner's insistence that he was not involved in the Fant attack.
Surely, there will be retaliatory attacks on Renner, but at least for now, Fant has the high ground.
Renner's denials of involvement raise questions about his honor or intelligence. He's either lying, or his campaign is being controlled solely by his consultants.
Neither scenario would sit well with conservatives.
Good luck on the response, Mr. Fant.
We will continue to watch this race and others around the state to help sort out the details.
QuoteI'd call losing all of your equity suffering
Reality called and they wanted you to know that Jay Fant is not 'suffering'. Losing all equity in the bank holding company was a situation he created himself, and he refused to face reality... chosing instead to stay loyal to his buddies instead of his fudiciary responsibility to the health and well being of the bank and its customers.
If that's the kind of politician he will be (being loyal to 'friends' instead of the general public), then God save us all.
Quote from: fieldafm on August 13, 2014, 01:58:36 PM
QuoteI'd call losing all of your equity suffering
Reality called and they wanted you to know that Jay Fant is not 'suffering'. Losing all equity in the bank holding company was a situation he created himself, and he refused to face reality... chosing instead to stay loyal to his buddies instead of his fudiciary responsibility to the health and well being of the bank and its customers.
If that's the kind of politician he will be (being loyal to 'friends' instead of the general public), then God save us all.
I think you meant "customers" not buddies... Local businesses like Chamblin's... too bad so many other FG customers defaulted on THEIR loans, you know the ones THEY took out and AGREED to pay back...
Oh yeah - I guess Jay made up all the appraisals the bank lent on as well, covering those loans... Your hind sight is quite remarkable.
Quote from: Sentient on August 13, 2014, 12:38:58 PM
Quote from: stephendare on August 13, 2014, 12:30:40 PM
never really got the whole 'stealing signs' thing.
But literally every campaign does it. The volunteers and supporters get pretty passionate about it.
That's the thing, the crap that "every" aspiring politico does creates our failed legislative system. It is time to break with this, which is what has the machine and the lobbyists so concerned with Fant. He is not some mere striver who will sell out to the powers in Tallanasty (he has his own money). He actually has convictions and beliefs. He has suffered for these and you may not share them, but someone who follows a principled path is worth something.
LMAO. How has Jay Fant suffered?
Once upon a time, a person ran for elected office because people within the community valued that person's leadership skills and believed that the person could make a difference. Individuals were asked and convinced to run for office. Very few ran for elected office because they intended to make a career of being an elected official.
How has Jay Fant impacted our community? What successes has he had in his business career that would lead me to believe that he will be successful at representing our interests in Tallahassee? I ask those questions because I do not know. What I see is a person who has failed miserably at business. I also see a person who looks like he needs a job. I'll pass on a state representative that is running for office because he needs a job.
Quote from: MEGATRON on August 13, 2014, 02:19:40 PM
Quote from: Sentient on August 13, 2014, 12:38:58 PM
Quote from: stephendare on August 13, 2014, 12:30:40 PM
never really got the whole 'stealing signs' thing.
But literally every campaign does it. The volunteers and supporters get pretty passionate about it.
That's the thing, the crap that "every" aspiring politico does creates our failed legislative system. It is time to break with this, which is what has the machine and the lobbyists so concerned with Fant. He is not some mere striver who will sell out to the powers in Tallanasty (he has his own money). He actually has convictions and beliefs. He has suffered for these and you may not share them, but someone who follows a principled path is worth something.
LMAO. How has Jay Fant suffered?
Once upon a time, a person ran for elected office because people within the community valued that person's leadership skills and believed that the person could make a difference. Individuals were asked and convinced to run for office. Very few ran for elected office because they intended to make a career of being an elected official.
How has Jay Fant impacted our community? What successes has he had in his business career that would lead me to believe that he will be successful at representing our interests in Tallahassee? I ask those questions because I do not know. What I see is a person who has failed miserably at business. I also see a person who looks like he needs a job. I'll pass on a state representative that is running for office because he needs a job.
You guy need to get your story straight - has Jay not "suffered" and is living on easy street down by the river, or does he need the $30k a year position to make payments on that river house? Which is it?
Quote from: stephendare on August 13, 2014, 12:30:40 PM
never really got the whole 'stealing signs' thing.
But literally every campaign does it. The volunteers and supporters get pretty passionate about it.
I don't much care for Renner but I certainly see him as the lesser of two evils...
Quote from: Sentient on August 13, 2014, 02:24:49 PM
Quote from: MEGATRON on August 13, 2014, 02:19:40 PM
Quote from: Sentient on August 13, 2014, 12:38:58 PM
Quote from: stephendare on August 13, 2014, 12:30:40 PM
never really got the whole 'stealing signs' thing.
But literally every campaign does it. The volunteers and supporters get pretty passionate about it.
That's the thing, the crap that "every" aspiring politico does creates our failed legislative system. It is time to break with this, which is what has the machine and the lobbyists so concerned with Fant. He is not some mere striver who will sell out to the powers in Tallanasty (he has his own money). He actually has convictions and beliefs. He has suffered for these and you may not share them, but someone who follows a principled path is worth something.
LMAO. How has Jay Fant suffered?
Once upon a time, a person ran for elected office because people within the community valued that person's leadership skills and believed that the person could make a difference. Individuals were asked and convinced to run for office. Very few ran for elected office because they intended to make a career of being an elected official.
How has Jay Fant impacted our community? What successes has he had in his business career that would lead me to believe that he will be successful at representing our interests in Tallahassee? I ask those questions because I do not know. What I see is a person who has failed miserably at business. I also see a person who looks like he needs a job. I'll pass on a state representative that is running for office because he needs a job.
You guy need to get your story straight - has Jay not "suffered" and is living on easy street down by the river, or does he need the $30k a year position to make payments on that river house? Which is it?
I don't know, which one is it?
QuoteI think you meant "customers" not buddies
There are these pesky things called fair lending laws in the banking world. Apparently, we all have to live by them.
It doesn't take a genius to have found irregulatories throughout the bank's balance sheet. This isn't speculation or hindsight. These very real concerns were cited by an organization that goes by the initials 'FDIC' for many, many years.
If Jay Fant did "allegedly" lose all his equity in the FGB failure where did he come up with the $138,000 of his own money he initially funded his campaign with?
http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2013/12/24/high-profile-house-races-teed-up-for.html
If my business failed and I lost all my equity I would be hard pressed to come up with $138,000 to fund a campaign. I am also interested to learn what Mr. Fant has been doing since the bank failed that now prepare him to be a competent legislator in Tallahassee?
Quote from: CutterJ on August 13, 2014, 06:19:40 PM
If Jay Fant did "allegedly" lose all his equity in the FGB failure where did he come up with the $138,000 of his own money he initially funded his campaign with?
http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2013/12/24/high-profile-house-races-teed-up-for.html
If my business failed and I lost all my equity I would be hard pressed to come up with $138,000 to fund a campaign. I am also interested to learn what Mr. Fant has been doing since the bank failed that now prepare him to be a competent legislator in Tallahassee?
+1 I hope to see some explanation from him in the future if it is ever brought up at a debate or article. I doubt he will want to entertain the topic though.
Quote from: CutterJ on August 13, 2014, 06:19:40 PM
If Jay Fant did "allegedly" lose all his equity in the FGB failure where did he come up with the $138,000 of his own money he initially funded his campaign with?
http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2013/12/24/high-profile-house-races-teed-up-for.html
If my business failed and I lost all my equity I would be hard pressed to come up with $138,000 to fund a campaign. I am also interested to learn what Mr. Fant has been doing since the bank failed that now prepare him to be a competent legislator in Tallahassee?
Well that's a naive statement...
Quote from: Apache on August 14, 2014, 08:25:26 AM
Quote from: Sentient on August 14, 2014, 08:11:40 AM
Quote from: CutterJ on August 13, 2014, 06:19:40 PM
If Jay Fant did "allegedly" lose all his equity in the FGB failure where did he come up with the $138,000 of his own money he initially funded his campaign with?
http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2013/12/24/high-profile-house-races-teed-up-for.html
If my business failed and I lost all my equity I would be hard pressed to come up with $138,000 to fund a campaign. I am also interested to learn what Mr. Fant has been doing since the bank failed that now prepare him to be a competent legislator in Tallahassee?
Well that's a naive statement...
Agreed. not sure why quite a few people are confusing ones equity in a single business with his net worth or "losing it all". Clearly he's not hurting. He's a wealthy guy, from a wealthy family.
These days I don't know if that hurts or helps him though.
I do not begrudge Mr. Fant for being the offspring of a wealthy family, I do question weather he was/is so wealthy that he operated FGB with financial impunity. If his personal wealth is that vast that it allowed him to maintain his lifestyle for 32 months without seeking employment in addition to personally funding his campaign with a loan of $138,000 why was this vast wealth not used to shore up FGB? Why did Mr. Fant not have the confidence in himself to put it all on the line when his business needed it the most? He is now asking the voters of Jacksonville to demonstrate their confidence in his ability to lead and govern while just 32 months prior he did not appear to see that quality in himself when it came to running his family business.
I previously asked what Mr. Fant has been doing since the failure of FGB. What lessons or knowledge did he take with him from the bank failure and how has he applied this knowledge in a manner that demonstrates the qualities of a good legislator?
At this time I remain undecided on this race and while I believe it unfair to focus purely on the prior failure of one candidate it does factor predominantly on his record. I would like to hear evidence of his recent business successes in support of his qualifications as a leader.
So if the CEO of the bank isn't responsible for running it into the ground, who else would be?
Quote from: LunaticFringe on August 14, 2014, 03:11:24 PM
So if the CEO of the bank isn't responsible for running it into the ground, who else would be?
You are late to the party, see my earlier post... "success has a thousand fathers, failure stands an orphan"
BTW how did your real estate portfolio perform for you from 2007-2012? You caught the news that over 60 Florida banks failed in the meltdown right?
Quote from: Sentient on August 14, 2014, 03:35:06 PM
Quote from: LunaticFringe on August 14, 2014, 03:11:24 PM
So if the CEO of the bank isn't responsible for running it into the ground, who else would be?
You are late to the party, see my earlier post... "success has a thousand fathers, failure stands an orphan"
BTW how did your real estate portfolio perform for you from 2007-2012? You caught the news that over 60 Florida banks failed in the meltdown right?
Banks with fickle deposit bases (with a high amount of brokered deposits) that made bad bets (IE not run well) certainly did not fare well during the recession.
Banks with very strong deposit bases (IE First Guaranty) that didn't consistently double down on bad bets to a curiously suspect group of the same borrowers and then aggresivley acted to maintain capital ratios by correcting their balance sheets, performed much better (that's called fiscally responsible management)
FG had many opportunities to clean up their balance sheets and/or merge with other institutions for many years during the meltdown. They chose not to, and then the FDIC finally took over (and blocked a ridiculously bad sale attempt).
You are using broad, macroeconomic factors to gloss over some very specific microeconomic failures at FG. Not every bank or every bank employee in the world was put out on the streets from 2007-2012.
QuoteBTW how did your real estate portfolio perform for you from 2007-2012?
Quite well actually.
Fant's campaign is aware of this thread. They are free to submit an op-ed about their positions and/or respond to what is being discussed in this thread.
Quote from: fieldafm on August 14, 2014, 04:02:10 PM
Quote from: Sentient on August 14, 2014, 03:35:06 PM
Quote from: LunaticFringe on August 14, 2014, 03:11:24 PM
So if the CEO of the bank isn't responsible for running it into the ground, who else would be?
You are late to the party, see my earlier post... "success has a thousand fathers, failure stands an orphan"
BTW how did your real estate portfolio perform for you from 2007-2012? You caught the news that over 60 Florida banks failed in the meltdown right?
Banks with fickle deposit bases (with a high amount of brokered deposits) that made bad bets (IE not run well) certainly did not fare well during the recession.
HYPERBOLE ALERT - "bad bets" really? Bets? Sure when loans don't work out they look "risky"... How many developers went down here in Jax during the same period?
Banks with very strong deposit bases (IE First Guaranty) that didn't consistently double down on bad bets to a curiously suspect group of the same borrowers and then aggresivley acted to maintain capital ratios by correcting their balance sheets, performed much better (that's called fiscally responsible management)
AGGRESSIVELY ACTED - yes that's code for dumping all the loans - of local people, many of whom did try to work things out - and further cratering the local real estate market faster, WHILE decimating your held asset values ... see they get marked down as well when everything gets marked down. ergo spiral.
FG had many opportunities to clean up their balance sheets and/or merge with other institutions for many years during the meltdown. They chose not to, and then the FDIC finally took over (and blocked a ridiculously bad sale attempt).
Yeah a business owner can sell their business any day they want to. Merge = sale. You know there were lots of flat lining banks looking to prop each other up. A hail mary. I said at the outset, FG's big mistake was believing in people and thinking they could work out the loans as the defaults climbed, at a slow enough pace not to crater the rest of the assets held/values. Was it a mistake, yes, because it didn't work. But it was also principled way to try and get out of a mess. Not cut and run and flush everything and everyone.
Friends - Field sounds like he would have your ass in court in 60 days and be looking to unload on another bank...
You are using broad, macroeconomic factors to gloss over some very specific microeconomic failures at FG. Not every bank or every bank employee in the world was put out on the streets from 2007-2012.
YOU CAN"T UNLINK THE MACRO
QuoteBTW how did your real estate portfolio perform for you from 2007-2012?
Quite well actually.
Hyperbole?
Umm, over 1/3 of FG's loans were chronically delinquent for the three years prior to the FDIC seizing the bank. That's a direct result of suspect lending practices. FG's Texas ratios were horrid and the capital ratios were dangerously low as a direct result of not aggressively trying to fix the health of their balance sheets and doubling down lending to a network of friends. This is all factual information that is publicly available, and cited repeatedly by the FDIC for many years prior to FG failing. No hyperbole, just facts.
Yes, merge does equal sale. One of many options available to save the bank from failure. Pride is a terrible sin to have when reality is kicking you in the nuts. Sometimes you have to check your ego at the door, and do what's best for the future of your business when you can't cover your obligations. It's called responsibility. I would hope an elected official would understand the concept.
Biggest mistake was believing in people?
There are some people that think that its everyone else's fault but their own. I sure as hell don't want that kind of person representing me in Tallahassee.
Today, i received no less than 4 direct mailers about how much of a victim Jay Fant is. One had the audacity to say that the FDIC didn't 'raid' First Guaranty, instead painting a rosy picture about how the FDIC simply assisted in a transfer to another bank and that taxpayers weren't on the hook. I'm sorry, but that is complete and utter BULLSHIT. The FDIC comes in and physically locks the door while federal officers physically separate the officers of the bank from handling records and money. Men and women with sidearms tell you to leave. They then transfer a portion of the bank's assets and liabilities to another bank, and then eat the remaining loan loss provisions. FDIC premiums were depleted long before FG got taken over, meaning almost $30 million of chronically bad debt (that FG REFUSED to deal with) was paid for by taxpayers.
I don't work for Renner, nor have even donated to his campaign. But Paul Renner has more integrity in his smallest toenail than what Jay Fant has shown over the last 8 years.
This thread has actually made me want to personally call every voter I know in this district to make sure they understand the stakes in this election. Congratulations, you just made me a Paul Renner activist.
Paul Renner's HQ is at the corner of Dancy and Park, for those interested.
Quote from: fieldafm on August 14, 2014, 08:14:49 PM
Hyperbole?
Umm, over 1/3 of FG's loans were chronically delinquent for the three years prior to the FDIC seizing the bank. That's a direct result of suspect lending practices. FG's Texas ratios were horrid and the capital ratios were dangerously low as a direct result of not aggressively trying to fix the health of their balance sheets and doubling down lending to a network of friends. This is all factual information that is publicly available, and cited repeatedly by the FDIC for many years prior to FG failing. No hyperbole, just facts.
Yes, merge does equal sale. One of many options available to save the bank from failure. Pride is a terrible sin to have when reality is kicking you in the nuts. Sometimes you have to check your ego at the door, and do what's best for the future of your business when you can't cover your obligations. It's called responsibility. I would hope an elected official would understand the concept.
Biggest mistake was believing in people?
There are some people that think that its everyone else's fault but their own. I sure as hell don't want that kind of person representing me in Tallahassee.
Today, i received no less than 4 direct mailers about how much of a victim Jay Fant is. One had the audacity to say that the FDIC didn't 'raid' First Guaranty, instead painting a rosy picture about how the FDIC simply assisted in a transfer to another bank and that taxpayers weren't on the hook. I'm sorry, but that is complete and utter BULLSHIT. The FDIC comes in and physically locks the door while federal officers physically separate the officers of the bank from handling records and money. Men and women with sidearms tell you to leave. They then transfer a portion of the bank's assets and liabilities to another bank, and then eat the remaining loan loss provisions. FDIC premiums were depleted long before FG got taken over, meaning almost $30 million of chronically bad debt (that FG REFUSED to deal with) was paid for by taxpayers.
I don't work for Renner, nor have even donated to his campaign. But Paul Renner has more integrity in his smallest toenail than what Jay Fant has shown over the last 8 years.
This thread has actually made me want to personally call every voter I know in this district to make sure they understand the stakes in this election. Congratulations, you just made me a Paul Renner activist.
You're just repeating yourself now... with the same hyperbole... at least this is clear of you "a Paul Renner activist". ETA: my mistake, in your first post on this thread you declared yourself a "wholehearted Paul Renner supporter"... so I guess I didn't make you one after all...
"I am wholeheartedly supporting Paul Renner and look forward to voting for him later this month."
As to Renner's alleged integrity... how do you sign a clean campaign promise and then have your team put out a hatchet piece? Hmmmmm. Sounds like something a win at all costs litigation attorney would be used to doing. Is this what passes for integrity in office?
"It's always interesting to see who fires first, how the opponents respond, and how the one who fired first tries to deny responsibility. It has become a farce.
Consider what happened in Florida House District 15 last week.
Fant Brenner 1Republican candidates Jay Fant and Paul Renner are vying to replace term-limited Rep. Daniel Davis in the Jacksonville-area district.
In June, Fant challenged Renner to sign a clean-campaign pledge. Renner responded within a day or two, and they worked out the terms for what seemed like a good compact.
Well, here we are with three weeks to go, and all hell has broken loose. At the end of last week, the Better Florida Fund Corp. delivered a karate-chop mailer, criticizing Fant for the way he handled his family banking business during the recession. Every community bank in Florida had difficulty during the recession, so no big deal, right?
Not the way the Better Florida Fund sold it, using the most lurid vocabulary to try to make Fant out to be nothing short of Bernie Madoff.
Disappointing tactics, but that's the way the cards are played."
Quotewith the same hyperbole
What I have found in my career, is that Federal regulators don't deal in hypotheticals. They deal in reality. In reality, First Guaranty was run into the ground. Period.
QuoteAs to Renner's alleged integrity
When Jay Fant was running a century old business into the ground, Paul Renner left a lucrative private practice (which he didn't bankrupt, btw) to go defend his country.
It's clear you don't know the first thing about integrity.
Is it possible that Fant asked for the clean campaign pledge because he knew he had baggage and Renner was clean? Of course. Actually a smart tactic. And unfortunately, since our newspaper is utterly worthless, another party had to bring Fant's past to light. Otherwise, he gets to skate by framing the failures in his professional life in his own way. Shouldn't the hometown paper at least take a look at:
1. JEA rates substantially increasing while Fant was a board member who voted for every one of them
2. Fant using our money to pay his current campaign consultant while on the JEA board
3. The lack of complete financial disclosure to the state. How can you loan your campaign the amount he did while reporting the relatively low assets he claims? We all know that since he choked on his own silver spoon he decided to try his wife's golden one.
Quote from: Sentient on August 15, 2014, 07:04:00 AM
Quote from: fieldafm on August 14, 2014, 08:14:49 PM
Hyperbole?
Umm, over 1/3 of FG's loans were chronically delinquent for the three years prior to the FDIC seizing the bank. That's a direct result of suspect lending practices. FG's Texas ratios were horrid and the capital ratios were dangerously low as a direct result of not aggressively trying to fix the health of their balance sheets and doubling down lending to a network of friends. This is all factual information that is publicly available, and cited repeatedly by the FDIC for many years prior to FG failing. No hyperbole, just facts.
Yes, merge does equal sale. One of many options available to save the bank from failure. Pride is a terrible sin to have when reality is kicking you in the nuts. Sometimes you have to check your ego at the door, and do what's best for the future of your business when you can't cover your obligations. It's called responsibility. I would hope an elected official would understand the concept.
Biggest mistake was believing in people?
There are some people that think that its everyone else's fault but their own. I sure as hell don't want that kind of person representing me in Tallahassee.
Today, i received no less than 4 direct mailers about how much of a victim Jay Fant is. One had the audacity to say that the FDIC didn't 'raid' First Guaranty, instead painting a rosy picture about how the FDIC simply assisted in a transfer to another bank and that taxpayers weren't on the hook. I'm sorry, but that is complete and utter BULLSHIT. The FDIC comes in and physically locks the door while federal officers physically separate the officers of the bank from handling records and money. Men and women with sidearms tell you to leave. They then transfer a portion of the bank's assets and liabilities to another bank, and then eat the remaining loan loss provisions. FDIC premiums were depleted long before FG got taken over, meaning almost $30 million of chronically bad debt (that FG REFUSED to deal with) was paid for by taxpayers.
I don't work for Renner, nor have even donated to his campaign. But Paul Renner has more integrity in his smallest toenail than what Jay Fant has shown over the last 8 years.
This thread has actually made me want to personally call every voter I know in this district to make sure they understand the stakes in this election. Congratulations, you just made me a Paul Renner activist.
You're just repeating yourself now... with the same hyperbole... at least this is clear of you "a Paul Renner activist".
As to Renner's alleged integrity... how do you sign a clean campaign promise and then have your team put out a hatchet piece? Hmmmmm. Sounds like something a win at all costs litigation attorney would be used to doing. Is this what passes for integrity in office?
"It's always interesting to see who fires first, how the opponents respond, and how the one who fired first tries to deny responsibility. It has become a farce.
Consider what happened in Florida House District 15 last week.
Fant Brenner 1Republican candidates Jay Fant and Paul Renner are vying to replace term-limited Rep. Daniel Davis in the Jacksonville-area district.
In June, Fant challenged Renner to sign a clean-campaign pledge. Renner responded within a day or two, and they worked out the terms for what seemed like a good compact.
Well, here we are with three weeks to go, and all hell has broken loose. At the end of last week, the Better Florida Fund Corp. delivered a karate-chop mailer, criticizing Fant for the way he handled his family banking business during the recession. Every community bank in Florida had difficulty during the recession, so no big deal, right?
Not the way the Better Florida Fund sold it, using the most lurid vocabulary to try to make Fant out to be nothing short of Bernie Madoff.
Disappointing tactics, but that's the way the cards are played."
Looking at the Fant mail piece that includes the "Florida Republican Code of Conduct" that he an Renner both signed and then comparing it to the information that I received about the bank, it is hard to see how Renner could be outside the terms of it.
Let's take a look:
"I will limit any charges against my opponent(s) to legitimate differences regarding opinion, record, qualifications, experience, conduct and past positions held"
Check--Fant's tenure as CEO during the banks demise would seem to be in bounds.
"I will at all times tell the truth, with complete documentation from legitimate verifiable sources for any charges against my opponents (s)."
Check--Mail, radio and television have all source cited either credible media sources or the actual FDIC documents regarding the forced closure of FGB.
All these crocodile tears from Fant's team are starting to smell like desperation.
Quote from: fieldafm on August 15, 2014, 08:00:59 AM
Quotewith the same hyperbole
What I have found in my career, is that Federal regulators don't deal in hypotheticals. They deal in reality. In reality, First Guaranty was run into the ground. Period.
QuoteAs to Renner's alleged integrity
When Jay Fant was running a century old business into the ground, Paul Renner left a lucrative private practice (which he didn't bankrupt, btw) to go defend his country.
It's clear you don't know the first thing about integrity.
Ummm... according to Renner's own web site, he was a reservist who was
mobilized. You do know that right? It's great he was serving our country as a reservist, but don't propagandize that he stopped chasing the law bucks in his 10 attorney firm to go enlist...
"Paul has served as a naval officer, both on active duty and in the reserves. He was recently mobilized to Afghanistan where he served with a Joint Task Force."
You do realize that you actually have to volunteer to be in the military, right? They don't just sentence you to enlist when the FDIC takes over your failing bank.
Quote from: stephendare on August 15, 2014, 10:17:05 AM
I dont.
What is the difference between "mobilized" and 'left to go defend his country"?
Serious question.
The difference is between a voluntary action an an involuntary action. Reservists/Guard can be involuntarily mobilized and have been heavily all through the last decade in the mid east fracas.
Quote from: LunaticFringe on August 15, 2014, 08:11:44 AM
2. Fant using our money to pay his current campaign consultant while on the JEA board
3. We all know that since he choked on his own silver spoon he decided to try his wife's golden one.
-Who is Mr. Fant's campaign consultant? I tried to google this information but did not find any results
-Can you please expand on your reference here, does Mr. Fant's wife work?
Quote from: Apache on August 15, 2014, 10:44:00 AM
By the way what is the May River Company and the Caroline Family Office? What does Mr. Fant's workload their consist of?
Is this where Mr. Fant's wife is employed or is this some sort of family wealth office? I would like to learn what Mr. Fant has been doing for the past 2.5 years.
Quote from: CutterJ on August 15, 2014, 11:07:41 AM
-Who is Mr. Fant's campaign consultant? I tried to google this information but did not find any results
Billie Tucker (taking an educated guess that is the person being referanced by LunaticFringe) and Raymond Johnson are Fant's primary campaign consultants.
Quote from: fieldafm on August 15, 2014, 11:17:49 AM
Quote from: CutterJ on August 15, 2014, 11:07:41 AM
-Who is Mr. Fant's campaign consultant? I tried to google this information but did not find any results
Billie Tucker (taking an educated guess that is the person being referanced by LunaticFringe) and Raymond Johnson are Fant's primary campaign consultants.
http://members.jacksonville.com/news/metro/2010-09-14/story/local-tea-party-leader-has-consulting-contract-jea
Quote from: Sentient on August 15, 2014, 10:03:27 AM
Quote from: fieldafm on August 15, 2014, 08:00:59 AM
Quotewith the same hyperbole
What I have found in my career, is that Federal regulators don't deal in hypotheticals. They deal in reality. In reality, First Guaranty was run into the ground. Period.
QuoteAs to Renner's alleged integrity
When Jay Fant was running a century old business into the ground, Paul Renner left a lucrative private practice (which he didn't bankrupt, btw) to go defend his country.
It's clear you don't know the first thing about integrity.
Ummm... according to Renner's own web site, he was a reservist who was mobilized. You do know that right? It's great he was serving our country as a reservist, but don't propagandize that he stopped chasing the law bucks in his 10 attorney firm to go enlist...
"Paul has served as a naval officer, both on active duty and in the reserves. He was recently mobilized to Afghanistan where he served with a Joint Task Force."
Hmmmm.....your previous posts led me to believe you were a certain long time bright, but egotistical, local politico. But after reading your hair-splitting post on military service it is clear to me that you are an amateur. It is Campaigns 101 to go nowhere near your opponent's military record...especially when your guy didn't serve.
Quote from: stephendare on August 15, 2014, 11:45:00 AM
lunaticfringe. We observe rules of civility here, and while this post doesn't violate them it comes awfully close.
Please keep debate civil.
Public figures are fair game, within reason. But how we debate with each other on these pages is held to a higher standard.
We prefer to not call people names, which you don't really do here, Although it would be closer to our custom to say that tactics are amateurish rather than the person.
SInce both of you are new posters, just thought i would drop a line in on this. carry on.
my apologies.
Bottom line rich idle bank buster buying his way into the rich man's game of politics..
Quote-Can you please expand on your reference here, does Mr. Fant's wife work?
Mr. Fant's wife is the daughter of a very prominent corporate finance individual- google Radford Lovett. Her family has multiple millions of dollars. Mr. Fant is definitely not hurting by any sense. Personally donating 138k to his campaign is chump change to him.
Quote from: funguy on August 15, 2014, 01:03:43 PM
Bottom line rich idle bank buster buying his way into the rich man's game of politics..
Naive... all politics is bought my friend. How do you think Renner is paying for his smear ads? The PAC that paid for the negative ads is funded by $1.5M of the Florida Medical Association's money....
What's worse.. putting up $138k of your own money (how can putting money up for yourself ever be bad?) or accepting in kind advertising from a lobby?
Do you really believe there are no strings attached with these negative ads? Hahaha
The Lobbyist and Republican Machine are scared of Fant, that's why they persist in negative campaigning. isn't that obvious?
They want a tool in place that will do what they are told or pay back...
Quote from: Sentient on August 15, 2014, 05:52:55 PM
Quote from: funguy on August 15, 2014, 01:03:43 PM
Bottom line rich idle bank buster buying his way into the rich man's game of politics..
Naive... all politics is bought my friend. How do you think Renner is paying for his smear ads? The PAC that paid for the negative ads is funded by $1.5M of the Florida Medical Association's money....
What's worse.. putting up $138k of your own money (how can putting money up for yourself ever be bad?) or accepting in kind advertising from a lobby?
Do you really believe there are no strings attached with these negative ads? Hahaha
The Lobbyist and Republican Machine are scared of Fant, that's why they persist in negative campaigning. isn't that obvious?
They want a tool in place that will do what they are told or pay back...
My friend.. Smear?? Naïve??.. When you are as incompetent in finance as Jay Fant proved to be by breaking the bank I don't see that fact as smear rather bringing out the truth that the public should be aware of. Come on now is that the qualifications of a man we want to represent the people..
Quote from: funguy on August 16, 2014, 08:34:14 AM
Quote from: Sentient on August 15, 2014, 05:52:55 PM
Quote from: funguy on August 15, 2014, 01:03:43 PM
Bottom line rich idle bank buster buying his way into the rich man's game of politics..
Naive... all politics is bought my friend. How do you think Renner is paying for his smear ads? The PAC that paid for the negative ads is funded by $1.5M of the Florida Medical Association's money....
What's worse.. putting up $138k of your own money (how can putting money up for yourself ever be bad?) or accepting in kind advertising from a lobby?
Do you really believe there are no strings attached with these negative ads? Hahaha
The Lobbyist and Republican Machine are scared of Fant, that's why they persist in negative campaigning. isn't that obvious?
They want a tool in place that will do what they are told or pay back...
My friend.. Smear?? Naïve??.. When you are as incompetent in finance as Jay Fant proved to be by breaking the bank I don't see that fact as smear rather bringing out the truth that the public should be aware of. Come on now is that the qualifications of a man we want to represent the people..
You should read some history, you may be shocked at the things you come across.
President Harry Truman for example, had two business ventures fail, a zinc mine and a clothing store (which filed bankruptcy) before he went into politics... Abe Lincoln had a business fail, was sued by creditor's and the assets sold. Look at most of the early presidents...
So you prove nothing with your one dimensional rhetoric, except what you don't know about people, finances, markets and business... But keep plugging away, the gallery loves this kind of stuff [insert forum style emoticon here] ;)
When a picture of your opponent's house (shock $2.8M! value) becomes the main thrust of your campaign, you are bankrupt of ideas and leadership.
as you mentioned Good old Harry Truman I can't help but be reminded of one of his quotes..
"My choice early in life was either to be a piano-player in a whorehouse or a politician. And to tell the truth, there's hardly any difference." — Harry S. Truman
Quote from: funguy on August 16, 2014, 10:07:48 AM
as you mentioned Good old Harry Truman I can't help but be reminded of one of his quotes..
"My choice early in life was either to be a piano-player in a whorehouse or a politician. And to tell the truth, there's hardly any difference." — Harry S. Truman
That's a good line...
Quote from: Sentient on August 16, 2014, 09:47:14 AM
Quote from: funguy on August 16, 2014, 08:34:14 AM
Quote from: Sentient on August 15, 2014, 05:52:55 PM
Quote from: funguy on August 15, 2014, 01:03:43 PM
Bottom line rich idle bank buster buying his way into the rich man's game of politics..
Naive... all politics is bought my friend. How do you think Renner is paying for his smear ads? The PAC that paid for the negative ads is funded by $1.5M of the Florida Medical Association's money....
What's worse.. putting up $138k of your own money (how can putting money up for yourself ever be bad?) or accepting in kind advertising from a lobby?
Do you really believe there are no strings attached with these negative ads? Hahaha
The Lobbyist and Republican Machine are scared of Fant, that's why they persist in negative campaigning. isn't that obvious?
They want a tool in place that will do what they are told or pay back...
My friend.. Smear?? Naïve??.. When you are as incompetent in finance as Jay Fant proved to be by breaking the bank I don't see that fact as smear rather bringing out the truth that the public should be aware of. Come on now is that the qualifications of a man we want to represent the people..
You should read some history, you may be shocked at the things you come across.
President Harry Truman for example, had two business ventures fail, a zinc mine and a clothing store (which filed bankruptcy) before he went into politics... Abe Lincoln had a business fail, was sued by creditor's and the assets sold. Look at most of the early presidents...
So you prove nothing with your one dimensional rhetoric, except what you don't know about people, finances, markets and business... But keep plugging away, the gallery loves this kind of stuff [insert forum style emoticon here] ;)
When a picture of your opponent's house (shock $2.8M! value) becomes the main thrust of your campaign, you are bankrupt of ideas and leadership.
Fair enough. So please enlighten us with what DOES, aside from rhetoric, qualify him for office?
On 690 WOKV am 104.5 fm right now.
Quote from: Sentient on August 16, 2014, 09:47:14 AM
Quote from: funguy on August 16, 2014, 08:34:14 AM
Quote from: Sentient on August 15, 2014, 05:52:55 PM
Quote from: funguy on August 15, 2014, 01:03:43 PM
Bottom line rich idle bank buster buying his way into the rich man's game of politics..
Naive... all politics is bought my friend. How do you think Renner is paying for his smear ads? The PAC that paid for the negative ads is funded by $1.5M of the Florida Medical Association's money....
What's worse.. putting up $138k of your own money (how can putting money up for yourself ever be bad?) or accepting in kind advertising from a lobby?
Do you really believe there are no strings attached with these negative ads? Hahaha
The Lobbyist and Republican Machine are scared of Fant, that's why they persist in negative campaigning. isn't that obvious?
They want a tool in place that will do what they are told or pay back...
My friend.. Smear?? Naïve??.. When you are as incompetent in finance as Jay Fant proved to be by breaking the bank I don't see that fact as smear rather bringing out the truth that the public should be aware of. Come on now is that the qualifications of a man we want to represent the people..
You should read some history, you may be shocked at the things you come across.
President Harry Truman for example, had two business ventures fail, a zinc mine and a clothing store (which filed bankruptcy) before he went into politics... Abe Lincoln had a business fail, was sued by creditor's and the assets sold. Look at most of the early presidents...
So you prove nothing with your one dimensional rhetoric, except what you don't know about people, finances, markets and business... But keep plugging away, the gallery loves this kind of stuff [insert forum style emoticon here] ;)
When a picture of your opponent's house (shock $2.8M! value) becomes the main thrust of your campaign, you are bankrupt of ideas and leadership.
Did any of those examples involve a bank venture? Were any of those examples businesses which handled peoples money or assets? Did a federal agency take control of any of the other businesses? Seems they all did damage control prior to an outside agency being forced to step on in order to protect peoples money and assets. I see what point you were trying to make, but be honest those referenced businesses and a bank are two completely different machines. A bank handles money it is a position of trust as opposed to a clothing store or mine. So those comparisons hold no weight to me. I am all for the fact that people deserve a shot at redemption. So let's kill all the petty talk and cut to the chase. In your opinion what qualifies him to be in that position? I think thats all anyone wants to know.
^ It is also apples and oranges to compare candidates from 1860 and 1948 with a candidate in 2014. This is the information age after all.
QuotePresident Harry Truman for example, had two business ventures fail, a zinc mine and a clothing store (which filed bankruptcy) before he went into politics... Abe Lincoln had a business fail, was sued by creditor's and the assets sold. Look at most of the early presidents...
Good grief man, TRUST is the issue here, not what some President or politician did to lead to greatness. Let Fant prove his salt somewhere else, rebuild a new bank, if anyone will lend him a penny, see if people trust him with a bank, prove that he can be trusted. Prove he can be trusted in the private sector, before giving him keys to the public sector coffers.