I'm fairly new to Jax but it is my understanding that the Skyway used to charge a small fee back in the day - if that is so, then they are obviously equipped to be able to charge if they wanted to...
I, for one, would pay a buck or two to be able to ride the Skyway later at night or especially on the weekends, when I get out the most. I'm sure that a lot of people would utilize the Skyway much more if it was providing service for the leisure times and not just as a "take it to work" service for those that do not have a car.
Especially now that the water taxi service is stopping, even if it is temporary... I think that having Skyway service late night and on the weekends, the downtown core would get more patronage to the shopping, dining and drinking establishments.
Hmmm, maybe I should gut out my 36' RV and turn it into a party bus...
Why does JTA shut it down so early weekdays and not have it running at all on weekends (unless during the coveted OneSpark)?
Quote from: marty904 on May 30, 2014, 01:14:24 PM
I'm fairly new to Jax but it is my understanding that the Skyway used to charge a small fee back in the day - if that is so, then they are obviously equipped to be able to charge if they wanted to...
Yes, but it's not a very advanced system. The cost was 50 cents pp and required having exact change (I'm not even sure if it accepted anything but quarters) and even when paying sometimes the turnstiles wouldn't function properly resulting in passengers having to hop over them anyway. There certainly is no seamless transfer from bus, or any other theoretical mode of transit.
Quote from: marty904 on May 30, 2014, 01:14:24 PM
I think that having Skyway service late night and on the weekends, the downtown core would get more patronage to the shopping, dining and drinking establishments.
I'm not sure this is so certain. If the Skyway expands to areas of residence (Brooklyn, San Marco) then I'd be more optimistic but right now I think this is a multi-layered issue that needs a comprehensive solution. Just opening the Skyway at night probably wouldn't yield a skyrocketing increase in ridership.***
Quote from: marty904 on May 30, 2014, 01:14:24 PM
Hmmm, maybe I should gut out my 36' RV and turn it into a party bus...
Yes!
***Makes me wonder...Did anyone take the skyway after 2am during one spark? What was it like? The only time I rode it late at night was on Saturday around 12:30a. It was pretty dead and felt mildly "unsafe" at Riverplace and Kings Ave.
Welcome to Jacksonville Marty!
I'm sure by now you've seen firsthand the universal frustration with the Jacksonville Skyway. Especially on a website such as this where the users are, for the most part, in favor of reurbanization and downtown revitalization, the sky rail is an a rather hot button issue. But before going too deep into the failures of its design, take a look at this:
http://www.jtafla.com/AboutJTA/skyway.aspx?Sel=251&AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1
This truth about the skyrail that many uninformed people in this city don't know is that it is simply unfinished. A lot of people (almost all of whom are not on this website) call it "the monorail to nowhere" and accuse lack of vision as the reason for such a useless gimmick. But as you can see, the original plan was to connect San Marco, Riverside and the Sports Complex all together - which had it been completed, would be an invaluable asset.
So, to your point of running it on the weekends and late night - I have no doubt that if one could theorhetically get on the Skyrail at 5 Points and take it to Dos Gatos, Burro Bar, the Volstead et al, then ABSOLUTELY, it would run constantly. However, at its current state, it really only benefits people going from San Marco (i.e., the Strand, San Marco Place) to appox. the Landing. I have to believe that JTA looks at that as more of a novelty than a necessity.
That being said, the solution is both obvious yet difficult to sell - the skyway needs to be completed. A lot of people call constructing platforms at the stadium and in Riverside "expansion," but it really isn't seeing as such "new" destinations were all part of the original plan. The problem begins and ends with one simple factor: money. It's a tough sell to the general public that we need to spend millions on the skyrail when most look at it as a laughable disaster and would just be better knocked down. Conversely, people such as yourself can see its potential as being both useful and profitable. But in order for it to really succeed, it has to be completed to the original plan. Monday-Saturday, the Riverside/Five Points Spur would be heavily used for residents of downtown and Riverside to go back and forth between these neighborhoods. And on Sundays, if you had the line going from the Landing to the Stadium, PLUS it can go to Riverside and San Marco, it could be a gold mine. But many people in this town are weary of spending money on this venture. It's a classic debate of cliches, between "you have to spend money to make money" vs. "don't throw good money after bad."
Hopefully, the right leadership emerges from City Council, the Downtown Development Review Board, the Chamber of Commerce and most of all the Mayor's Office and will one day look at the skyrail as an opportunity and have the political will and creativity to solve it. Until then, let us know when your party van is up and running!
If / when the skyway is extended to Brooklyn and or San Marco I'm certain the hours will be revised. As of right now there really isn't anywhere the skyway could take you at night unless you live in Strand, Peninsula or San Marco Plaza
Me? No, not even if it was free. Aside from major events on nights/weekends, if I want to visit one of the usual spots downtown, I'll just park on the street since there's guaranteed to be a spot within a block or two.
People here should really be more engaged with the North Florida TPO's 2040 Long Range Transportation Plan efforts that are currently underway. Nearly every proposed transit project that could impact downtown and the urban core has been altered in the 2040 LRTP's Needs Plan.
http://pathforward2040.com/get-involved/
Off the top of my head, potential streetcar routes to Springfield have been removed and replaced by a Skyway extension through Sugar Hill to Shands. The S-Line is no longer consider the route for commuter rail to the north. Instead, trains would bypass much of the inner Northside communities for the CSX line that runs from Grand Crossings to Panama Park, just north of Gateway Mall. The Needs Plan also shows a two totally separate streetcar lines in San Marco and Avondale. The Avondale Streetcar route ends in Five Points, which is where the proposal calls for extending the Skyway too. The San Marco streetcar route appears to cross the FEC tracks at grade. Much of this stuff sounds pretty unrealistic from a technical and political point of view. It's also a ton of a lot more expensive than what made the 2035 LRTP and 2030 COJ Mobility Plans. I can easily see a proposal to extend the Skyway into Riverside being politically shot down in flames by the neighborhood itself, as well as the rest of the city, once the $30-$40/mile capital cost price tag starts adding up. I could also see a streetcar crossing the FEC at at-grade in San Marco never happening and there's no real reason to have one in Avondale, over more transit dependent neighborhoods that offer more infill economic development potential around such an expensive infrastructure investment.
If realistic transit ideas aren't included in the 2040 Needs Plan and these alternatives fail to pass the reality sniff test, it's possible some fixed rail projects many think make sense disappear with nothing replacing them. If that happens, it means a streetcar route from Riverside to Downtown or Springfield won't be able to apply for federal funding assistance. Same goes for any type of rail transit idea that would stimulate TOD in neighborhoods like Durkeeville, Springfield, New Springfield, Phoenix and Brentwood. Unfortunately, when the public hearing was held in late April, only 8 people from Duval County bothered showing up. I believe over 40 showed up for the meeting that was held in St. Johns County.
We do a lot of talking about transit and how transit can be improved on this site but if we don't get involved on the ground level, a snowball will have a better chance of surviving a vacation in hell then the ideas forum members routinely propose, have in becoming reality.
Well it would have been nice if the skyway was operating during the Jazz Festival. I was very disappointed as I walked from Springfield with my chairs to the Rosa Parks station, only to find out I had to walk all the way to the river with all my gear. Definitely lack of planning on someone's part. Mine I guess. Should have taken my car instead.
It's a shame more people aren't involved. I am very interested but like many, I feel I don't really know enough to offer any useful guidance. Mass transit is a complicated subject. The mode and route has to be correct, and it does sound as if there are many logical choices in a city this size.
Wow! Lots of great responses and very insightful of not only factual info but how people actually feel about the skyway... I guess I am a little more eager than a lot of people because I do live on the Southbank, very close to the Riverplace station and see it all the time and wish it was available during the "entertainment hours".
Thanks for the "welcome" and please keep sharing your thoughts on this thread...
Better yet, also share your thoughts with the North Florida TPO's 2040 LRTP process (http://pathforward2040.com/get-involved/) so that they can be added to the
Needs Plan. It's as easy as sending an email about what you'd like to see and where. Remember, what doesn't end up in their plans will most likely never happen.
QuoteThe Cost Feasible Plan will identify projects from the Needs Plan that are financially feasible, provide the greatest return on investment, and are consistent with the policies, goals and objectives. This plan defines our path forward for investments to 2040. The Cost Feasible Plan is required by federal legislation and will focus on the four-county area of Clay, Duval, Nassau and St. Johns.
http://pathforward2040.com/what-is-path-forward/
email address for comments and suggestions on what type of transportation investments you'd like to see happen in Jax and where: info@pathforward2040.com
facebook: https://www.facebook.com/NorthFloridaTPO
I guess now that the Y won't be built, it would be more difficult to put a stop where the current Y sits. I always thought a stop in the middle of that parling lot would've been feasible.
^I agree. The new Y being stalled / cancelled is definitely going to take some steam out of that area. Without it the rents at 220 Riverside and Brooklyn Riverside will have to be significantly lower than originally planned for them to keep a reasonable occupancy.
The new Y will be up before the SKyway is expanded to the area. IF (and that's a big IF) JTA wins TIGER grant money to extend the Skyway, it still won't open till 2017.
LOL...y'all are so crazy! Why on Earth would you even THINK about having any kind of rail system in the largest city in square miles in the continental United States? That's just plain cray cray! It makes no sense at all to have the rail system go down Bay Street to the Arena, Baseball Grounds or Stadium. I mean, who would ride it? People can drive their cars there and pay at least $20 or more for the priviledge to park in someone's back yard! Oh, and I hope no one comes up with a good use for the Sacred Shipyards! God forbid someone puts something there that people would enjoy! It would block the prisoner's unobstructed view of our beloved river!
Ummm....ok. I guess.
Lake - I believe you know know that the Historic zealots would shoot down a Skyway extension through Riverside Avondale. I would also not be in favor of it. Take it north into Springfield, feed that historic district, see if they buy into it.
^Yes. That, along with capital costs, along with getting it under/over I-95 are a few reasons I tend to question such a proposal being added at the expense of other alternatives. I doubt those in Springfield would like to see the Skyway possibly running down Pearl Street as well.
You'd rather spend twice as much seeing that happen instead of a streetcar on Main that helps attract infill development on Main & 8th Streets? If so,let the TPO know so your desires can become public record. If not....still let the TPO know.
Nothing false. Reply 5 in this thread will explain the situation in greater detail. We'll also have an article on this tomorrow.
Sorry, im preoccupied at the moment and limited to responding via my cell phone.
But yes. Reply 5 has the details and links. We'll have maps and more information as a part of tomorrow's main story.
The comment period for the Needs Plan has been extended to June 3. They are having a Steering Committee Meeting June 4 to approve the Needs Plan and their Board Meeting is June 12. You can submit comments to info@pathforward2040.com.
For more info on the TPO see http://www.northfloridatpo.com/ (http://www.northfloridatpo.com/).
Brilliant map on that TPO site!
Don't tell them that northern black lined 'future passenger service' corridor is on a track that ends a couple of miles north of Kingsland, GA.
That connecting freight track over on NAS JAX has only been gone about 20 years.
Even without the 'S' line as a LRT route, they completely blew it off as a direct freight link between the FEC and the Talleyrand port terminals.
Yep! I'm in Jacksonville!
If you think the S-Line should be considered as a LRT route, send an email to info@pathforward2040.com highlighting your idea and why it should be included in the 2040 Needs Plan.
Quote from: thelakelander on May 30, 2014, 04:28:13 PM
People here should really be more engaged with the North Florida TPO's 2040 Long Range Transportation Plan efforts that are currently underway. Nearly every proposed transit project that could impact downtown and the urban core has been altered in the 2040 LRTP's Needs Plan.
http://pathforward2040.com/get-involved/
Went to their website and completed a long survey and after getting to the end and clicking submit, I got a white page that said "unexpected error" - Grrrrrrr!
At this point, take a look at the maps in today's article and send an email on what you like, would change or add.
I'm quite fond of intercity passenger rail on I-95. It is very realistic. After all, why would FEC want to run the All Aboard Florida service on their own tracks ;)
Where is the sarcastic font when you really need it?
Quote from: marty904 on May 30, 2014, 01:14:24 PM
I'................I, for one, would pay a buck or two to be able to ride the Skyway later at night or especially on the weekends, when I get out the most. I'm sure that a lot of people would utilize the Skyway much more if it was providing service for the leisure times and not just as a "take it to work" service for those that do not have a car..............
I think we missed something.
Here is someone that actually has a place to go where the skyway goes. The song has changed a little.