I guess the video boards will be operational by then. Too bad it will almost certainly be a relegated Fulham squad...
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=542805
Fulham really dropped the ball today. They had a 2-nil lead before conceding two goals in the final 15 minutes. 3 points would've been huge for staving off relegation.
I know the guys in my family are looking forward to watching them play in Jacksonville. They love them some "football" a/k/a soccer.
Rumor there is going to be a concert in conjunction with the match also. Brett Martineau stated he had heard the name of Blake Shelton.
Quote from: edjax on April 26, 2014, 03:10:30 PM
Rumor there is going to be a concert in conjunction with the match also. Brett Martineau stated he had heard the name of Blake Shelton.
Exciting! Sounds like fun. The more interest and activity that brings positive international attention to our city is wonderful.
On my birthday, wish I could be there.
Quote from: ProjectMaximus on April 26, 2014, 02:43:31 PM
Fulham really dropped the ball today. They had a 2-nil lead before conceding two goals in the final 15 minutes. 3 points would've been huge for staving off relegation.
And it couldn't have come at a worse time with Cardiff and Sunderland playing tomorrow....
Fulham has been relegated from the English Premier League to a lower league. Shad Khad will lose millions with the EPL TV deals etc. I know that Shad has to have some buyers remorse. It's a downer that Fulham's status as an EPL team will be gone at the friendly(exhibition) in Jax. Of course with Jax's inferiority complex, Fulham's relegation means that construction at EverBank Field will be halted indefinitely, and the future of the Jags is shaky and uncertain. JK.
I don't know about buyer's remorse, but yes, it sucks that Fulham is dropping from the Premiere League. Hope they can right the ship and get back up quickly...
This will be free for Jaguars season ticket holders. Also, there will be a concert at the stadium that night with a well known act (Blake Shelton rumored). ALso free for Jaguars season ticket holders.
Supposed to be an announcement this week.
Quote from: I-10east on May 05, 2014, 12:27:31 AM
Fulham has been relegated from the English Premier League to a lower league. Shad Khad will lose millions with the EPL TV deals etc. I know that Shad has to have some buyers remorse. It's a downer that Fulham's status as an EPL team will be gone at the friendly(exhibition) in Jax. Of course with Jax's inferiority complex, Fulham's relegation means that construction at EverBank Field will be halted indefinitely, and the future of the Jags is shaky and uncertain. JK.
Khan knew what he was getting with Fulham..a project. He knew the state of the team so I don't think he regrets buying. But them getting regulated just makes things harder. He mentioned it was one of the worse days hes ever had. Khan does not like failure and Im sure they will bounce back strong in a few years.
How does a team get un-relegated and rejoin the Premier League?
Quote from: Wacca Pilatka on May 05, 2014, 08:47:13 AM
How does a team get un-relegated and rejoin the Premier League?
I have limited soccer knowledge so I have no idea. I know they can, and some teams have gotten deregulated, then rejoined the next year, but it usually doesnt happen that quickly.
Quote from: duvaldude08 on May 05, 2014, 08:55:12 AM
Quote from: Wacca Pilatka on May 05, 2014, 08:47:13 AM
How does a team get un-relegated and rejoin the Premier League?
I have limited soccer knowledge so I have no idea. I know they can, and some teams have gotten deregulated, then rejoined the next year, but it usually doesnt happen that quickly.
Top 3 teams from the 2nd tier league (Championship - the one Fulham will play in next season) are promoted to the Premier League each season. The top 2 automatically go and there is a playoff between teams 3-6 for the last spot.
relegated teams also get parachute payments from the Premier League, so the financial hit isn't as bad as it used to be.
Thanks for the explanations. Between the relationship to Fulham and the arrival of the Armada, I'm trying to further my soccer understanding, which is extremely limited to say the least.
It's fairly difficult to get back into the EPL from the Championship. IMO, there's really not a huge difference between the bottom tier EPL teams and top tier Championship teams. Quite a few teams that were in the EPL for awhile have had a hard time making it back up recently. Bolton, Birmingham, Leeds, Middlesborough, and Blackburn are a few recent examples....and a few of those teams were decent in the EPL.
QPR got relegated last year and still have a lot of EPL caliber talent. In fact, if you look at their roster, pretty much all of their players are successful former EPL players and could play on all of the lower half of the table teams. Yet, they finished 4th this season and have to win the 4 team playoff to make it back.
Basically, Khan is going to have to break the bank personally to get them back.
+1 to everything Citylife said above. Recent history (QPR, Wigan, Wolves, Blackpool, Reading, Blackburn, Birmingham City, Bolton...) all show that getting back to the BPL is a tough road. Most teams are picked clean of quality when they go down (which in Fulham's case would pretty much only mean Stockdale and Dejagah -- Holtby is just on loan) and are forced to balance experienced older slow players with emerging talent. It's a completely different style and run of football in the league divisions than it is in BPL. Fulham need cash, emerging talent (but not bargain bin), and much better management.
FFC fans have endured worse -- the 1990s before the promotion run-up were particularly dark -- but it's always painful to go down and in FFC's case it was completely avoidable if the last two transfer windows hadn't been so unspeakably terrible (save Holtby, but including Parker). Poor decisions with managers and poor tactics on the pitch just exacerbated the problems.
I guess the only positive I can see of this is that at least it quells all talk of leaving Craven Cottage for at least five years.
As a die-hard supporter of SW6 football, I'm glad there's a match here in town, but frankly (unless the trip to JAX is somehow a moneymaker) I wish the money would be spent bolstering the side.
ETA: I cannot think of a worse pairing with English football than a Blake Shelton concert. Seriously? Does anyone remotely involved with the Jag-FFC partnership know anything about the current demographics of and growth-base of BPL watchers in the US?
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 05, 2014, 06:26:10 PM
+1 to everything Citylife said above. Recent history (QPR, Wigan, Wolves, Blackpool, Reading, Blackburn, Birmingham City, Bolton...) all show that getting back to the BPL is a tough road. Most teams are picked clean of quality when they go down (which in Fulham's case would pretty much only mean Stockdale and Dejagah -- Holtby is just on loan) and are forced to balance experienced older slow players with emerging talent. It's a completely different style and run of football in the league divisions than it is in BPL. Fulham need cash, emerging talent (but not bargain bin), and much better management.
FFC fans have endured worse -- the 1990s before the promotion run-up were particularly dark -- but it's always painful to go down and in FFC's case it was completely avoidable if the last two transfer windows hadn't been so unspeakably terrible (save Holtby, but including Parker). Poor decisions with managers and poor tactics on the pitch just exacerbated the problems.
I guess the only positive I can see of this is that at least it quells all talk of leaving Craven Cottage for at least five years.
As a die-hard supporter of SW6 football, I'm glad there's a match here in town, but frankly (unless the trip to JAX is somehow a moneymaker) I wish the money would be spent bolstering the side.
ETA: I cannot think of a worse pairing with English football than a Blake Shelton concert. Seriously? Does anyone remotely involved with the Jag-FFC partnership know anything about the current demographics of and growth-base of BPL watchers in the US?
They just announced it will be Carrie Underwood but your point is still correct. Also as a die hard Arsenal supporter of 15 years, who likes to keep an eye on the championship, while you are absolutely correct about changes in personel being vital to promotion, I would add that having a manager that really understands the in's and out's of the championship is just as important. You think that be easily understood but some teams seem to miss that point. I was hoping FFC might land Ian Holloway (great understanding of the championship, but he is also a fun manger as a fan to have in charge, some of his post match comments are comedy at its best) but I just saw he signed on with Millwall for two years.
Appreciate the background and details of managers, etc. Thanks to you both for that.
as for Carrie Underwood...sometimes the idea is to cross-promote. Just sayin. ;)
Quote from: ProjectMaximus on May 05, 2014, 07:29:04 PM
Appreciate the background and details of managers, etc. Thanks to you both for that.
as for Carrie Underwood...sometimes the idea is to cross-promote. Just sayin. ;)
I considered that... Maybe trying to win some "folks" over, but I don't think fullham vs DC united is the match to do that. Just think they'd probably be better off with something more in line with the crowd, and continuing to nurture the growth of soccer in the region but hey it ain't my dime ;D
Quote from: fsquid on May 05, 2014, 09:20:38 AM
relegated teams also get parachute payments from the Premier League, so the financial hit isn't as bad as it used to be.
Since 2010, the payments have been spread out over 4 years, and the hit is still massive. True 12 million pounds a year makes it a tad bit easier to swallow, but it is still, very, very significant... the financial hit that is
It's the TV revenue and merchandising loss that makes it so tough. Also, many squads get picked clean of talent so those parachute payments often go to satisfying managerial contract buy-outs and getting new players. I hope FFC take the time in the Championship to build a better physio and training program, too. Their injury rate for young players is far too high and if they're going to keep buying aging talent (which I hope they will not) then they need them to be in better playing condition longer. Chelsea and Liverpool have both built gold standard sports medicine programs. FFC need to wander up the Fulham Road to Stamford Bridge and see what Eva Carneiro and Thierry Laurent are doing right.
No debate that this means a loss in value for FFC.
...and here I thought with new investment FFC might seriously start making runs at Europa play.
Quote from: Gamblor on May 05, 2014, 07:07:50 PM
I would add that having a manager that really understands the in's and out's of the championship is just as important. You think that be easily understood but some teams seem to miss that point. I was hoping FFC might land Ian Holloway (great understanding of the championship, but he is also a fun manger as a fan to have in charge, some of his post match comments are comedy at its best) but I just saw he signed on with Millwall for two years.
Completely agree about the need for a Championship manager. I'd take Mackay given his Championship record or Zola who with more funds I think could outpace the performance he's had with Wotford.
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 05, 2014, 07:52:53 PM
Quote from: Gamblor on May 05, 2014, 07:07:50 PM
I would add that having a manager that really understands the in's and out's of the championship is just as important. You think that be easily understood but some teams seem to miss that point. I was hoping FFC might land Ian Holloway (great understanding of the championship, but he is also a fun manger as a fan to have in charge, some of his post match comments are comedy at its best) but I just saw he signed on with Millwall for two years.
Completely agree about the need for a Championship manager. I'd take Mackay given his Championship record or Zola who with more funds I think could outpace the performance he's had with Wotford.
Gianfranco would be outstanding... I totally thought he resigned (forced or not) too early.
If only Khan had listened to me when I begged for DiMatteo as caretaker manager back in October. ;)
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 05, 2014, 08:13:32 PM
If only Khan had listened to me when I begged for DiMatteo as caretaker manager back in October. ;)
Is it me or is it a little odd we are thinking of Chelsea men to lead FFC? ;)
I freely admit to having a life-long SW6 football bias. It's been an embarrassment of riches having two Premier League teams in the same West London postcode for the past 13 years. I'd extend that to cover all of Hammersmith & Fulham borough, but I hate QPR. ;D
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 05, 2014, 09:36:24 PM
I freely admit to having a life-long SW6 football bias. It's been an embarrassment of riches having two Premier League teams in the same West London postcode for the past 13 years. I'd extend that to cover all of Hammersmith & Fulham borough, but I hate QPR. ;D
Lol, north London has had 2 top teams in tier 1 for over 30 years... but thats only if you count Tottenham as a team, which I admit is quite a stretch 8) #ForeverInArsenalsShadow
lol, i'm semi-fluent in soccer but this conversation might as well have been in a different language.
Quote from: Gamblor on May 05, 2014, 07:33:08 PM
Quote from: ProjectMaximus on May 05, 2014, 07:29:04 PM
Appreciate the background and details of managers, etc. Thanks to you both for that.
as for Carrie Underwood...sometimes the idea is to cross-promote. Just sayin. ;)
I considered that... Maybe trying to win some "folks" over, but I don't think fullham vs DC united is the match to do that. Just think they'd probably be better off with something more in line with the crowd, and continuing to nurture the growth of soccer in the region but hey it ain't my dime ;D
I think the idea is not to win soccer fans over to carrie underwood, but to win Jaguars fans over as soccer fans. In that context it actually makes some sense...give them a taste of soccer with a chaser that a lot of em already enjoy.
Quote from: ProjectMaximus on May 05, 2014, 10:08:14 PM
lol, i'm semi-fluent in soccer but this conversation might as well have been in a different language.
Oh well if you'd like any translations feel free to PM me :)
Quote from: ProjectMaximus on May 05, 2014, 10:08:14 PM
Quote from: Gamblor on May 05, 2014, 07:33:08 PM
Quote from: ProjectMaximus on May 05, 2014, 07:29:04 PM
Appreciate the background and details of managers, etc. Thanks to you both for that.
as for Carrie Underwood...sometimes the idea is to cross-promote. Just sayin. ;)
I considered that... Maybe trying to win some "folks" over, but I don't think fullham vs DC united is the match to do that. Just think they'd probably be better off with something more in line with the crowd, and continuing to nurture the growth of soccer in the region but hey it ain't my dime ;D
I think the idea is not to win soccer fans over to carrie underwood, but to win Jaguars fans over as soccer fans. In that context it actually makes some sense...give them a taste of soccer with a chaser that a lot of em already enjoy.
I was saying more that I don't know if the soccer game will win many Carrie Underwood fans over. I could be wrong, and I hope I am. As for winning jags fans over it might. Hoping Eddie Johnson will be out there playing for DC. He is one of my favorite USMNT players of all time, and he is from Bunnell... and he use to play for Fulham
Quote from: Gamblor on May 05, 2014, 09:46:14 PM
Lol, north London has had 2 top teams in tier 1 for over 30 years... but thats only if you count Tottenham as a team, which I admit is quite a stretch 8) #ForeverInArsenalsShadow
Cheating! That's across several post codes... and Spurs aren't a real side. #SpursCantBuyChampionsLeague I give your team, Arsenal, full props for beautiful playing style and a great manager. It's never difficult to convince me to watch one of their matches.
I am sure by July that I'll be happy Fulham are here for a friendly, but the 1-2 gut punch of Chelsea's Champion's League run ending and Fulham's relegation has me a bit down this week. Watching Man City lift another trophy on Saturday just might drive me to drink at noon.
I hope the Fulham-DC united match goes over well, but in truth, Fulham will likely be bringing no players anyone has ever heard of. JAX only sold a few thousand tickets to see Thierry Henry a few months ago.
...and I'm still not convinced that Carrie Underwood is the right artist for those Jags fans who could potentially be swayed to support association football sides.
Obviously they wanted a famous artist for this event.
It has to be somewhat "family friendly".
And like it or not, country acts sell well in Jacksonville.
I don't even think the event is gearing towards soccer fans at all. I think of it more as a Jaguars fan appreciation event. The Fulham game is just a glorified scrimmage.
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 06, 2014, 11:07:47 AM
I hope the Fulham-DC united match goes over well, but in truth, Fulham will likely be bringing no players anyone has ever heard of. JAX only sold a few thousand tickets to see Thierry Henry a few months ago.
That MLS scrimmage was not well planned this year in my opinion. It started at 6pm on a week night. Not mention it ended up being a downpour.
Quote from: pierre on May 06, 2014, 11:25:36 AM
I don't even think the event is gearing towards soccer fans at all. I think of it more as a Jaguars fan appreciation event. The Fulham game is just a glorified scrimmage.
True. I notice Jags season ticket holders get to go for free. That's nice. FFC has managed to bring players to JAX in the past and NOT invited dues-paying members to anything. I know it's only a few of us, but it would be nice to get some acknowledgment from our club that we exist. (That said, they're spectacular with members' stuff when one is in London, as they should be.)
And yes, the MLS friendly was difficult this year time and weather wise -- to say the least. The MX league game last year was fun, too -- hope we have another shot at something like that again.
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 06, 2014, 11:07:47 AM
Quote from: Gamblor on May 05, 2014, 09:46:14 PM
Lol, north London has had 2 top teams in tier 1 for over 30 years... but thats only if you count Tottenham as a team, which I admit is quite a stretch 8) #ForeverInArsenalsShadow
Cheating! That's across several post codes... and Spurs aren't a real side. #SpursCantBuyChampionsLeague
Indeed it is across two post codes, but we're only 3, 4 miles down the Seven Sisters road from each others. I have to admit it's a little strange for me to hear someone like Chelsea and Fulham. I've spent a lot of time in Kensington, and have a few friends who support Chelsea or Fulham. They don't seem to be so friendly, and usually describe one another as "That lot"... However I can totally understand being a fan of SW6. It's one dynamic area that is for sure.
Quote from: pierre on May 06, 2014, 11:27:32 AM
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 06, 2014, 11:07:47 AM
I hope the Fulham-DC united match goes over well, but in truth, Fulham will likely be bringing no players anyone has ever heard of. JAX only sold a few thousand tickets to see Thierry Henry a few months ago.
That MLS scrimmage was not well planned this year in my opinion. It started at 6pm on a week night. Not mention it ended up being a downpour.
True they didn't do a good job. I think it was announced like 3-4 weeks ahead of time, hardly publized till the week off. Although I would have rather watched Thierry (MY MAN) on a crisp clear day, I remember thinking the rain was appropriate. Only fitting our first MLS game is horribly marketed and the fans that might have come were kept away by heavy showers.
Quote from: pierre on May 06, 2014, 11:25:36 AM
Obviously they wanted a famous artist for this event.
It has to be somewhat "family friendly".
And like it or not, country acts sell well in Jacksonville.
I don't even think the event is gearing towards soccer fans at all. I think of it more as a Jaguars fan appreciation event. The Fulham game is just a glorified scrimmage.
You probably are right that it is more just an appreciation event. I just would have preferred the first time much of Jax gets a taste of English soccer in person, that the events correlate a little better. I'm well aware country sells well in this city, but so do plenty of other types of music, and I'd imagine significant portions of the country audience will not appreciate the game.
It wasn't our first MLS game -- Philadelphia Union agreed to a 3-year friendly deal in JAX. The first match was last year against Montreal Impact.
The rain was horrid and I expected to see more people out for the NY Red Bulls. However, the fans that braved the weather were fond of soccer and fun to talk to.
You get the Chelsea-Fulham thing a lot in West London (at least in Fulham proper, Putney, Brompton, parts of Wandsworth, etc.) among the over-30/35 set. We're old enough to remember Chelsea being ify and Fulham being in the lower division. The Chelsea first- Fulham second is the most common permutation as most CFC fans don't think of FFC as a real rival. That's changed since FFC were promoted -- and managed to stay up -- and there's a more intense West London derby/rivalry now. FFC fans have always been rather more bitter toward CFC than the reverse, but the Black & Blue party exists for a reason: there are loads of conflicting loyalties within marriages/families/neighborhoods/and individual supporters. There's a bit of a money/class/pro-English prejudice mess that has lead to increasing FFC-CFC tension, too, which is not something a majority of the fans want to have anything to with but sadly don't often acknowledge. (To sum up: FFC used to be like Brentford. In the neighborhood, but not in the top league for quite some time.)
Depressing to find the MetroJax forum populated by Tottenham-slagging Chel$ki and Le Arse fans. I guess its tradition for Arsenal, and they do run their club the right way (not too dissimilar from Tottenham, by the way, who -- until recently -- played very exciting football).
Anyway, excited to see Fulham come to Jax. What I am wondering is, what does their relegation mean for Jax, Kahn and the Jaguars?
Certainly for the exhibition it means a very different squad for FFC. Is their academy any good? I don't get that impression, but don't really know. It always seemed over the last few years that their strategy was to seek value among players just past their prime.
Quote from: bencrix on May 07, 2014, 08:55:01 AM
Anyway, excited to see Fulham come to Jax. What I am wondering is, what does their relegation mean for Jax, Kahn and the Jaguars?
It means Khan is potentially going to lose a lot of money...and may have to spend a lot of his own cash just to get them back to the PL, which even then isn't a guarantee.
I believe JaxByDefault mentioned it, but Fulham will likely lose most of the quality players they have. Many of them have relegation clauses in their contracts, which stipulate that they must be sold for x amount of money if the club gets relegated. For instance, Fulham just bought a forward Mitroglou from the Greek league for 13 million pounds in January. He has a relegation clause, and will be sold at a loss. Teams usually scavenge players from relegated teams and pay substantially less than their market value. I imagine there are good odds they will lose Steklenburg, Riether, Dejagah, Richardson, and other decent players they have. Then factor in how old their other players are Hangeland (32) Heitenga (30) Karagounis (37), Duff (35), Riise (33), Parker (33), Sidwell (31), Bent (30)...generally players are on the descent of their career after 30...So basically Khan will have some serious rebuilding to do, will have to pay above market salary to be competitive, and will have a tough battle to get them back to the EPL.
Hopefully, his investment in Fulham going south won't hurt his spending with the Jags.
^I can't imagine it will. He'll spend Fulham money on Fulham just as he spends Jags money on the Jags, we won't pump huge amounts of outside money into either team. He may have to put some of his own to get Fulham out of relegation as soon as possible, but it shouldn't affect the Jags, who had revenues of like $260 million last year.
Quote from: CityLife on May 07, 2014, 09:20:03 AM
Hopefully, his investment in Fulham going south won't hurt his spending with the Jags.
Seriously doubt that.
Quote from: bencrix on May 07, 2014, 08:55:01 AM
Depressing to find the MetroJax forum populated by Tottenham-slagging Chel$ki and Le Arse fans. I guess its tradition for Arsenal, and they do run their club the right way (not too dissimilar from Tottenham, by the way, who -- until recently -- played very exciting football).
Oh slag off our clubs and don't say what club you support. Lovely. From the sound of it, is it Spurs? You have the do have the jealous, we won the league in black in white, Spurs vibe. But would a Spurs fan be dumb enough to talk shite after the trashings the boys in red handed out this year? What am I saying of course they are. Anyway, remember...
http://www.youtube.com/v/JN3vwOwiLdI
http://www.youtube.com/v/YTBSX18Kwvg
http://www.youtube.com/v/0e_K2hiayoQ
#AlwaysInOurShadow
Quote from: bencrix on May 07, 2014, 08:55:01 AM
Certainly for the exhibition it means a very different squad for FFC. Is their academy any good? I don't get that impression, but don't really know. It always seemed over the last few years that their strategy was to seek value among players just past their prime.
FFC has a well-respected academy. Their youth side recently lost to Chelsea in the youth FA final.
FFC has pursued a terrible signing strategy for the past few seasons based modified "moneyball" metrics that favored hold/cross Opta stats. Liverpool tried a similar strategy several years ago with horrible results. FFC being a mid-table side at best paid dearly for the mistake. LFC, using similar metrics, invested in (overrated) young players; FFC invested in "undervalued" (but overrated) older players. It was a poor strategy from the jump and was woefully out-of-touch with the newer playing styles of the Premiership. When that strategy went south -- and far too late after the cracks in the foundation were evident -- they went into desperation buying (Mitroglu) from less competitive leagues, something smart sides only do in the summer to avoid high costs and give the players time to be Premiership fit.
The side will now be picked clean of utility players at bargain prices for all of the reasons mentioned by CityLife. This means Khan will have to spend more to strengthen the side. However, Financial Fair Play (FFP) will limit that spending. Since FFP is especially burdensome to one-owner teams (the whole thing is basically a scheme to incentivize clubs to go to a share model a la Manchester United and punish owners who can spend and then buyback/liquidate their club's debt,) FFC is in a bit of pickle. Last year, merchandising, TV, sponsorship, and the FFP rules meant that Fulham could sustain wages of about £73 million and they come in very close to that number. This means they don't have a lot of buying power unless Khan wants to exercise the £105M loophole that exists for another two seasons and
personally cover at least £90M of that expense. I do not know whether some of that loophole money was used in the Mitroglu signing, but my guess is it was.
What this means for Jags fans is that Kahn could spend almost nothing on FFC or he could spend about £90 million. Even the high-end figure isn't likely to impact his spending on the Jags. (Hopefully, it also won't impact the cash he's making available to downtown projects.)
The slog back to Premiership is going to be a lot tougher than most stateside FFC fans I've encountered seem to think. What this certainly hurts for Khan is the ability to cross-promote FFC to Jags fans and leverage his FFC supporters in London to support the Jags. FFC is already the ONLY club in England not to be the most supported side in any UK postcode (thanks to being less than a mile away from and sharing the SW6 postcode with Chelsea), so its following was already small before relegation. The lack of availability of all league Championship games on US TV and legal streaming services means that Khan will lose a ton of exposure for FFC stateside. If anything, that means Khan will be more likely to pay attention to the Jags and their brand, whilst treating FFC as a sideshow.
ETA: I'm not an Arsenal supporter, but even I'll confess that watching The Invincibles was a thing of beauty.
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 07, 2014, 10:35:17 AM
The slog back to Premiership is going to be a lot tougher than most stateside FFC fans I've encountered seem to think.
Very true, it will be interesting to see how many are still riding the wagon in a few years. Really this could be good for the club to move more to a swansea, west brom business model though, what are your thoughts on that?
Quote from: pierre on May 07, 2014, 10:22:44 AM
Quote from: CityLife on May 07, 2014, 09:20:03 AM
Hopefully, his investment in Fulham going south won't hurt his spending with the Jags.
Seriously doubt that.
Without personally knowing Mr. Khan's personal finances and long range plans, nobody but him can say that with any certainty.
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 06, 2014, 03:09:50 PM
It wasn't our first MLS game -- Philadelphia Union agreed to a 3-year friendly deal in JAX. The first match was last year against Montreal Impact.
Since you mention it, I remember when the Union signed that deal. I skipped the Montreal game so that is probably where I got confused.
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 06, 2014, 03:09:50 PM
You get the Chelsea-Fulham thing a lot in West London (at least in Fulham proper, Putney, Brompton, parts of Wandsworth, etc.) among the over-30/35 set. We're old enough to remember Chelsea being ify and Fulham being in the lower division. The Chelsea first- Fulham second is the most common permutation as most CFC fans don't think of FFC as a real rival. That's changed since FFC were promoted -- and managed to stay up -- and there's a more intense West London derby/rivalry now.
This makes a lot of since to me since I'm in that age group and remember Chelsea being ify. I talk about it almost every time I run into American Chelsea fans 8)
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 07, 2014, 10:35:17 AM
Quote from: bencrix on May 07, 2014, 08:55:01 AM
Certainly for the exhibition it means a very different squad for FFC. Is their academy any good? I don't get that impression, but don't really know. It always seemed over the last few years that their strategy was to seek value among players just past their prime.
The slog back to Premiership is going to be a lot tougher than most stateside FFC fans I've encountered seem to think. What this certainly hurts for Khan is the ability to cross-promote FFC to Jags fans and leverage his FFC supporters in London to support the Jags. FFC is already the ONLY club in England not to be the most supported side in any UK postcode (thanks to being less than a mile away from and sharing the SW6 postcode with Chelsea), so its following was already small before relegation. The lack of availability of all league Championship games on US TV and legal streaming services means that Khan will lose a ton of exposure for FFC stateside. If anything, that means Khan will be more likely to pay attention to the Jags and their brand, whilst treating FFC as a sideshow.
Great post, and, I think you are probably right. This may cause him to lose interest in FFC and put more of his time and efforts behind the Jags.
QuoteOh slag off our clubs and don't say what club you support. Lovely. From the sound of it, is it Spurs?
Correct, COYS! (with the caveat that I am an American dilettante w/ no actual tie to the club other than what I've gleaned from following EPL for several years).
As someone raised in the Duke-Carolina rivalry, I probably acknowledge more respect for Arsenal than I suspect is customary. What Arsene has pulled of during these "lean" stadium-financing years is remarkable.
Spurs have had some rotten luck the last couple of seasons (part of a broader tradition, as I understand it), highlighted by Chel$ki inexplicably winning the UCL. That said, this season was really poor w/ nearly unwatchable football.
I'm looking forward to Spurs returning to their attractive attacking ways under someone like Frank de Boer. It will still be a tall order to break into the top 4, but Spurs seem to have a nice core to build on.
QuoteFFC has a well-respected academy. Their youth side recently lost to Chelsea in the youth FA final.
This bodes well. Both a source of revenue and relatively inexpensive new talent.
QuoteReally this could be good for the club to move more to a swansea, west brom business model though, what are your thoughts on that?
Could Southampton be the model, then?
Quote from: bencrix on May 07, 2014, 10:53:15 AM
QuoteOh slag off our clubs and don't say what club you support. Lovely. From the sound of it, is it Spurs?
Correct, COYS! (with the caveat that I am an American dilettante w/ no actual tie to the club other than what I've gleaned from following EPL for several years).
As someone raised in the Duke-Carolina rivalry, I probably acknowledge more respect for Arsenal than I suspect is customary. What Arsene has pulled of during these "lean" stadium-financing years is remarkable.
Spurs have had some rotten luck the last couple of seasons (part of a broader tradition, as I understand it), highlighted by Chel$ki inexplicably winning the UCL. That said, this season was really poor w/ nearly unwatchable football.
I'm looking forward to Spurs returning to their attractive attacking ways under someone like Frank de Boer. It will still be a tall order to break into the top 4, but Spurs seem to have a nice core to build on.
Sorry lad but you won't break into the top 4. Europa league for you.... if you're lucky
I'd love to see a Swansea or a Southampton-style revival of FFC. I'll consider it absolutely amazing work if we're back to playing low-table, relegation worry-free football in the Premiership within 5 years.
As for the American fan base, it's been on the slow dwindle since Dempsey left. I found it staggering how many people here swapped their FFC kits for Tottenham ones as soon as that transfer went through. (On a related note, I never wished to crush the dreams of a player or a team more than I did Dempsey/Tottenham's run for a spot in the CL that season. The only person at Spurs I remotely felt sorry for when Chelsea won Champions League and denied Spurs the CL spot was poor Brad Friedel who was covering the CL final for US TV. :-) )
Quote from: Gamblor on May 07, 2014, 10:56:26 AM
Sorry lad but you won't break into the top 4. Europa league for you.... if you're lucky
"Thursday Nights, Channel 5" as the chant goes.
QuoteDempsey/Tottenham's run
More like Bale's run. I never thought the Dempsey transfer made much sense for Tottenham, though he played reasonably well and Spurs got good value for him from the Sounders. Great goal against United. So in the end: good business, I guess.
QuoteSorry lad but you won't break into the top 4.
It has happened before and will happen again. I believe I've fairly acknowledged the difficulty.
Never a fan of Bale. Watching him flounder for a while at Madrid was relatively enjoyable. Can't say I'm terribly impressed with what Spurs did with the money from that sale. Bit of pot-kettle to send up Chelsea on spending in a year when Spurs spent £117 million in one transfer window and couldn't make the CL with it even with the added bonus of a down season for MUFC.
I'm fairly certain that only Arsenal and Everton can legitimately claim insufferable spending righteousness now. ;)
Sadly, Bale is truly magnificent. I think it is settled even in Madrid now.
The £117 spend is "clean," since it was earned from scouting, developing and marketing talent, not oil. But that's cold comfort. More proof that you can't "buy" glory.
Quote from: bencrix on May 07, 2014, 11:01:38 AM
QuoteSorry lad but you won't break into the top 4.
It has happened before and will happen again. I believe I've fairly acknowledged the difficulty.
Well I wager Arsenal will win the league in your stadium again before that happens...
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 07, 2014, 10:58:07 AM
I'd love to see a Swansea or a Southampton-style revival of FFC. I'll consider it absolutely amazing work if we're back to playing low-table, relegation worry-free football in the Premiership within 5 years.
Ya Southhampton's academy I think is the model for developing talent, but personally in terms of finances i think Swansea is. If they were able to find a way to merge the two, they'd be solid for a long, long time.
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 07, 2014, 11:07:37 AM
Arsenal can legitimately claim insufferable spending righteousness now. ;)
Oh what I would give for us to open the big wallet (by the sound of things we are finally going to this summer). I mean whats the point of having all our money and not spending some on the field?! And ya, I know, I know, I know. We bought Ozil but that was cause Spuds sold Bale and we just had to remind them how we cash in on their mistakes.
http://www.youtube.com/v/e0iO1T33Cik
Oh and ByDefault, I'm enjoying this nice calm between us. I feel like its going to break when our teams fight it out for Diego Costa...
Oh, Spurs fans.
Can't have it both ways: "you can't buy glory" but then turn around and say that Chelsea and MCFC do just that. Chelsea had both struggles and trophies before the Abramovich era. #WeAintGotNoHistory is a great chant, but it isn't precisely true. Even vile City had titles in the black & white days (I begrudgingly admit). Sporting memories are surprisingly short. I'm amused when supporters claim to love like "small clubs" like Everton or Villa with no idea that those clubs had significant time in the sun a "big clubs."
Ozil is every bit a quality player. Always thought his contributions were unvalued by the Mad...er, Special...One at Madrid.
As for Costa: What Abramovich wants... :P
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 07, 2014, 11:34:03 AM
As for Costa: What Abramovich wants... :P
Man i hope we swoop in on your deal for Costa like a certain team did on ours for Eden Hazard....
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 07, 2014, 11:34:03 AM
Ozil is every bit a quality player. Always thought his contributions were unvalued by the Mad...er, Special...One at Madrid.
Ozil is a great player. The rough nature of the BPL in terms of the winter schedule and how rapid fire games are was tough for Mesut to get a handle on, but I'm sure next year his talents will be even more on display, especially after he gets a great striker like Costa to work with :D
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 07, 2014, 10:58:07 AM
I'd love to see a Swansea or a Southampton-style revival of FFC. I'll consider it absolutely amazing work if we're back to playing low-table, relegation worry-free football in the Premiership within 5 years.
Easier said than done. Swansea got lucky by having two of the best managers in Britain in Martinez and Rodgers. Now that Rodgers is gone, they may just become another lower table side (set to finish somewhere between 12th and 16th this season). Southampton has a ridiculous academy that is the envy of every side in England. They've produced a crazy amount of talent like Bale, Oxlade-Chamberlin, Luke Shaw, Lallana, and Theo Walcott in recent years...and have James Ward Prowse, Callum Chambers, and Sam Gallagher as up and coming players already playing well in the senior side.
Fulham do have some good youth talent though. Perhaps the Championship will be a good way to get that young talent some experience that can be built upon in the future. They will probably go from one of the oldest teams in England this year to one of the youngest next year.
Who is having it both ways? Spurs fans?
You really can't buy glory, whether you are Spurs (once in a lifetime) or Madrid, Chelsea, Man City, PSG, Monaco, various Russian clubs, etc. No one does it.
It took Man City years of profligate spending to reach the EPL trophy and blunder through UCL campaigns. Chelsea has financed a long history "almost" finishes. The UCL run was unexpectedly won on the backs of "old" club legends, not expensive new acquisitions.
What quality these clubs have is earned from years of struggle. Money is a *huge* advantage, but it doesn't win trophies.
Quote from: CityLife on May 07, 2014, 11:48:33 AM
Quote from: JaxByDefault on May 07, 2014, 10:58:07 AM
I'd love to see a Swansea or a Southampton-style revival of FFC. I'll consider it absolutely amazing work if we're back to playing low-table, relegation worry-free football in the Premiership within 5 years.
Easier said than done. Swansea got lucky by having two of the best managers in Britain in Martinez and Rodgers. Now that Rodgers is gone, they may just become another lower table side (set to finish somewhere between 12th and 16th this season). Southampton has a ridiculous academy that is the envy of every side in England. They've produced a crazy amount of talent like Bale, Oxlade-Chamberlin, Luke Shaw, Lallana, and Theo Walcott in recent years...and have James Ward Prowse, Callum Chambers, and Sam Gallagher as up and coming players already playing well in the senior side.
Fulham do have some good youth talent though. Perhaps the Championship will be a good way to get that young talent some experience that can be built upon in the future. They will probably go from one of the oldest teams in England this year to one of the youngest next year.
I won't disagree it is a very, very daunting task, but its probably what FFC need to aspire to be.
Quote from: bencrix on May 07, 2014, 11:50:27 AM
What quality these clubs have is earned from years of struggle. Money is a *huge* advantage, but it doesn't win trophies.
PSG has won the French League the past 2 years, was runner up 3 years ago, and finished 4th-4 years ago. Prior to that they finished:
14th in 2010
6th in 2009
16th in 2008
15th in 2007
9th in 2006
Want to guess when they were bought by middle east oil money? The year before they jumped from 14th to 4th.
Manchester City are about to win the league this year, won it 2 seasons ago, and were runners up last season. They were bought in 2008. Prior to that, they had finished:
10th in 2008
9th in 2007
14th in 2006
15th in 2005
I would hardly say jumping from a mid/lower table team to winning the league in a few years is "years of struggle"
^ +1
Although be careful with the PSG analogy. Some of their history has to play a part in the mid-table years...
Quote from: CityLife on May 07, 2014, 10:45:44 AM
Quote from: pierre on May 07, 2014, 10:22:44 AM
Quote from: CityLife on May 07, 2014, 09:20:03 AM
Hopefully, his investment in Fulham going south won't hurt his spending with the Jags.
Seriously doubt that.
Without personally knowing Mr. Khan's personal finances and long range plans, nobody but him can say that with any certainty.
I think what we're saying is, he hasn't had to spend a bunch of outside money on the Jags, NFL teams take in a ton of money. What he's done is invest the Jags' money back into the team (rather than just holding onto it like some sports teams do). I imagine Fulham FC's similar, but even if he does has to pump some outside money to get them back into the EPL, it's most likely not going to be money he would have put into the Jags.
Fulham USA boards are going collectively apoplectic at the pairing of the FFC match with the Carrie Underwood concert and concerns about "limited seating." There's also extreme anger that FFC hasn't reached out to international Fulham Faithful (club members) or current/past Craven Cottage seat holders in regards to the match. Several people got hotel rooms in JAX when the match was announced who are now worried that the concert portion will make tickets very expensive.
Also, any place in the urban core that wants to declare themselves an/the official Fulham supporters bar for the match, I'll put it on every Fulham forum I'm on/moderate!
I'll admit, having to watch the match with a bunch of underaged girls is making me think about skipping the game. Plus, I can't imagine knowing even 3 players on that field after players jump ship.
^You may get to see Moussa Dembele in the Fulham shirt again. Not that Moussa Dembele though, a 17 year old with the same exact name. Pretty random.
Even if Dejagah, Kasami, and Parker don't leave (which they probably will), they're not likely to be in the FFC squad traveling to JAX because of rest periods following World Cup duties.
Supporters are also taking to twitter to ask the club why there are no plans/announcements about a supporters section at the JAX friendly. The Jags should have just announced all of the pieces of this event at once -- a ticket holder concert event with an FFC friendly. The problem is that news of the FFC match leaked out months ago in the soccer community -- with no mention of it being a Jags/concert event.