Just saw Intuition tweet about it. Was Mellow Mushroom tagged this weekend?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BebckYjIAAAgLF6.jpg)
Don't you know? It's just artistic expression and enhances the vibe in the neighborhood.....at least that's the BS we hear to justify graffiti vandalism on public property.
I knew I would get a rise out of you, Stephen! ;D
Actually I do not advocate those things as punishment. I would prefer the removal of thumbs. ;)
Not the thumbs .. the index fingers .. that way its harder to use spray paint .. ;-)
Quote from: stephendare on January 20, 2014, 10:07:01 AM
Quote from: Bridges on January 20, 2014, 09:59:42 AM
Just saw Intuition tweet about it. Was Mellow Mushroom tagged this weekend?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BebckYjIAAAgLF6.jpg)
I wouldnt be surprised to find out that this is a new advertising logo. Its actually pretty catchy.
Already taken, unfortunately.
"Death to False Pizza" is a Portland thing.
Sizzle Pie is the name of the chain that uses it as their marketing slogan.
So, is it real? Or advertising? Or a mislabeled photo to begin with?
Quote from: KenFSU on January 20, 2014, 10:44:28 AM
Quote from: stephendare on January 20, 2014, 10:07:01 AM
Quote from: Bridges on January 20, 2014, 09:59:42 AM
Just saw Intuition tweet about it. Was Mellow Mushroom tagged this weekend?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BebckYjIAAAgLF6.jpg)
I wouldnt be surprised to find out that this is a new advertising logo. Its actually pretty catchy.
Already taken, unfortunately.
"Death to False Pizza" is a Portland thing.
Sizzle Pie is the name of the chain that uses it as their marketing slogan.
Can we call this tagger "Sizzle Pies Ghost"?
DEATH TO THE FALSE PIZZA!
CHEESE FOR THE CHEESE GOD!
CRUST FOR THE CRUST THRONE!
This is how it starts. Soon we shall set the galaxy aflame on an immortal crusade to crush the false pizza. Gluten? Oh yes... there will be gluten.
(http://fixturescloseup.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/sizzle-pie-eat-pizza-main.jpg?w=523)
Quote from: TPC on January 20, 2014, 11:54:29 AM
Quote from: KenFSU on January 20, 2014, 10:44:28 AM
Quote from: stephendare on January 20, 2014, 10:07:01 AM
Quote from: Bridges on January 20, 2014, 09:59:42 AM
Just saw Intuition tweet about it. Was Mellow Mushroom tagged this weekend?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BebckYjIAAAgLF6.jpg)
I wouldnt be surprised to find out that this is a new advertising logo. Its actually pretty catchy.
Already taken, unfortunately.
"Death to False Pizza" is a Portland thing.
Sizzle Pie is the name of the chain that uses it as their marketing slogan.
Can we call this tagger "Sizzle Pies Ghost"?
Or.............Carpenter working on door threshold.
Quote from: stephendare on January 20, 2014, 10:06:01 AM
and now its on there permanently. omg. how will mellow mushroom recover?
you should be ashamed of yourself, dogwalker. please stop conflating the practice of 'tagging' with graffitti art. You know the difference, its been explained several times for you.
Can you explain the difference? Because the
VERY definition of graffiti is that it is unlawful:
https://www.google.com/search?q=define+graffiti
Quotewriting or drawings scribbled, scratched, or sprayed illicitly on a wall or other surface in a public place.
I just don't get how you can defend the stupidity of the criminals in multiple threads. Would you like it if they made your car in to an "art project?" omg, now you can go to the body shop, how will you ever recover??? ::)
Quote from: stephendare on January 20, 2014, 07:39:09 PM
really? wow.
I guess its because Im for anarchy, doom and the criminals, right?
If you arent for burning all of the old women to death as witches, then you must be for Satan, right?
Again, other than being your sarcastic self, can you answer the question on why you're OK with this type of criminal activity when it clearly hurts/costs business owners? No, this isn't murder, but the criminals that do this are pretty low on the human evolutionary scale.
Quote from: stephendare on January 20, 2014, 10:32:00 PM
Other than being offensive, can you explain why you think its ok to say that I support criminality?
Who am I being offensive to? Criminals? And to answer your question from this thread:
Quote from: stephendare
and now its on there permanently. omg. how will mellow mushroom recover?
I'm too lazy to look up your quotes in other threads, but when it comes to this topic you always seem to be of the attitude "oh big deal, so they have to paint over it."
Why do you think these criminals should not be punished for their crimes? What do you suggest instead? A hug? I'm not saying a public shooting is in order, but certainly a fine and definitely jail time for repeat offenders.
Quote from: stephendare on January 20, 2014, 11:19:46 PM
to me, which relieves me of the burden of having to respond to you at all, thank you.
Well, that's one way of avoiding a question that was asked 4 times on a discussion forum:)
All kidding aside, I am sorry if I offended you, that was never my intention. I don't know where I did, but again, sorry.
Thinking out loud: There are crimes of passion (murder of a hated person); of greed (like Madoff); survival (robbery for money to live on); etc. In what category could we put graffiti vandalism? The six or so who were arrested months ago were all old enough to be past whatever motivates juveniles; they were showing off to one another. But juvenile or adult, they all know that they are harming someone else's property and for no reason other than some twisted idea of self-gratification.
We're too damn permissive these days. Lock up some of these folks for a few months and the example it sets will probably bring this kind of vandalism to a screeching halt. Behave, dammit or bear the consequences! It's a life lesson.
Is false pizza some sort of calzone?
Quote from: stephendare on January 21, 2014, 08:45:17 AM
Quote from: WmNussbaum on January 21, 2014, 08:05:56 AM
Thinking out loud: There are crimes of passion (murder of a hated person); of greed (like Madoff); survival (robbery for money to live on); etc. In what category could we put graffiti vandalism? The six or so who were arrested months ago were all old enough to be past whatever motivates juveniles; they were showing off to one another. But juvenile or adult, they all know that they are harming someone else's property and for no reason other than some twisted idea of self-gratification.
We're too damn permissive these days. Lock up some of these folks for a few months and the example it sets will probably bring this kind of vandalism to a screeching halt. Behave, dammit or bear the consequences! It's a life lesson.
actually several of the taggers who were arrested a few months ago, if we are talking about the same people, are in their late teens and early twenties. One of them in particular is a very young man, whose life has been ruined by the onerous and out of bounds response.
And surely there are enough people speculating wildly about the motivations of others that the world is not improved by more of it, william.
The fines and imprisonment that these kids face isnt a 'couple of months'. Its far more onerous. And it didnt bring tagging to a 'screeching halt', so I think that rather takes care of your theory about it.
The greatest irony is that of this era, one of the most important artists who will be remembered and whose work is being celebrated by the very people trying to impose some monstrous act of spite on kids with spray cans will leave an indelible mark on the historic core. His art is right now defining the mental picture that most visitors are forming of the historic neighborhoods, and he comes from the incredible art culture of graffiti.
But irony is lost on the ironic, I suppose.
Correction, Stephen. The crew of graffiti vandals that were arrested a few months ago ranged in age from 23 to 42. One was 27 and the others were in their 30's. Hardly teenagers. The youngest did not get a felony conviction as all of the others did, but is in pre-trial probation, so if he behaves his life is not ruined as he will not have a conviction on his record. He did cost his parents a bundle of money. The oldest went back in jail for a while for violating his probation by getting a DUI late at night during hours he was not supposed to be out.
Cumulatively they did a couple of hundred thousand dollars damage to private and public property. They even named themselves the Bastard Sons of Vandalism (BSOV) so they certainly knew what they were doing was wrong.
We will just have to agree to disagree on the graffiti issue. Actually one of the few areas where we do disagree. I guess that I'm just more of a property rights person. Don't paint on my buildings and don't keep me from enjoying the inside of my house with your amusements.
I don't feel a bit sorry for the graffiti vandals and what happened to them. Breaking the law has consequences. If they now have troubles, they brought them on themselves.
Artists can graffiti all over their own property or property owners who request their "art".
The people of Jacksonville should not have to look at public buildings or utility boxes painted because some people have mommy and daddy issues.
Private businesses should not have to pay to clean up somebody else's spray paint.
Would you like your car, house or clothes spray painted in the middle of the night by people who have personal issues they don't have any other outlet to deal with?
It's fascinating that starving and misunderstood artists throughout history managed to create great works of art & largely forgetable third rate art without having to spray paint public and private walls.
Good deflection, Stephen, working it back to the same old dead horse flogging about noise complainants. Only comparing the monetarily short sighted and doesn't tell the complete picture. Noise issues are primarily civil, criminal mischief is criminal. The various members of that crew were either warned in person about what was going to happen if they continue or have been previously arrested for the same. Nearly all scoffed and then went about their way continuing to commit their chosen crime.
In terms of the artist you mention, there is no irony there, unless you consider the laws regarding protection of property spiteful in nature.
That assault on your aesthetics is something the civil realm needs to address, not the criminal. How many other crimes should we turn a blind eye to for the sake of a few people's opinion of what is better.
Essentially the same rights that protect your property also protect your property from the government. How much trust do you have in the government, both local and federal, to decide what is best for yours? In the case of noise violations?
Since pizza is Italian, technically that's a hate crime. JK
Totally in agreement with every statement Stephen has said in this thread. Kinda' baffled how nobody can see even an inkling in Stephen's way, here.
This is a "tag", and is not street art. The loosest term for graffiti encompasses both, but the word graffiti is more and more coming to be associated with "officially" uncommissioned art in public space. Tagging is most closely associated with gangs, and is often considered a nuisance and potential public hazard (what with certain signs saying certain things and influencing certain behavior in public spaces), however, I have seen some tags that to me seem quite artistic and are appreciated.
This "tag" is a very very very minor nuisance. Yes, it will cost the owner some money and some mental grief, but it's not going to come close to impacting his business. It could have been MUCH worse, like when Justin Bieber threw eggs at his neighbor's house and caused $20,000 worth of damage.
Finally, Jacksonville's aesthetic is about the most boring of any city/metro > 500,000 people I have ever been to. Frankly, at minimum, a little more tagging here and there would spice things up. At maximum, clever street art from talented artists placed appropriately around town, perhaps even at the request of some property owners who think it could add to their building, would be a creative and bold way to make the city appear brighter, friendlier, and livelier.
My hair stylist worked with a couple other artists to spray paint something on the security doors of a shop in the seedy 6th and Market section of San Francisco, and instead of gray metal doors with some gang tags on it, now when the business is closed and the doors are pulled down, there is actual art. And thus far, months later, there are no tags on top of the art. Even gangs have some amount of R-E-S-P-E-C-T.
My company owns a mid-rise office tower in SF (~17 floors visible from the highway), and we are commissioning some of the city's best street artists to paint a mural at the very top, like a frieze. We think it will be cool and unique.
Anyway, that's my take on street art. The COO of my company has a nephew in NYC who was arrested one night for street art; he is really well known in the city and is supposedly acquaintances with "Banksy".
Now I don't want to hear any of you all gripe on about how Jax is too strict with signage and Bill Brinton needs to cool it, bla bla bla. Your colors are all revealed - you are all boring party poopers who believe in a totally "clean" image of the city with nothing that fits your definition of "filth" or clutter (yet I bet half of ya'll have an overgrown un-landscaped yard and a roof that needs replacement and paint peeling from the outside of your house - that very typical Jax/Avondale/Riverside look is much more unsightly than the tags and graffiti I hope and expect to see in any major city). :D
Simms3, this
QuoteFinally, Jacksonville's aesthetic is about the most boring of any city/metro > 500,000 people I have ever been to. Frankly, at minimum, a little more tagging here and there would spice things up. At maximum, clever street art from talented artists placed appropriately around town, perhaps even at the request of some property owners who think it could add to their building, would be a creative and bold way to make the city appear brighter, friendlier, and livelier.
"At the request" of the property owner, is the key - otherwise, no matter how artistic, it is vandalism. Now, should more owners of dull, boring, walls be open to having art on those walls? Yes!
QuoteMy company owns a mid-rise office tower in SF (~17 floors visible from the highway), and we are commissioning some of the city's best street artists to paint a mural at the very top, like a frieze. We think it will be cool and unique.
Good for you. Now, how would your company feel if some of the not-so-good street artists - still learning their craft, perhaps - were to paint the ground floor of your building?
^^^We have graffiti removal in every one of our budgets, for every building in every city we invest in. It's one of the costs of being in a place inhabited by humans.
Also, many of our office buildings have a mandatory requirement to clean and care for the surrounding city sidewalks. in SF, with the amount of homeless there are and despite all the public toilets, we still need to budget for power washing the sidewalks on a regular basis. Again, people are the basis for our buildings, but they also inadvertently increase the costs. It's just part of doing business. Sometimes a problem can turn into a wonderful solution or idea. Other times, what starts off as a wonderful "commissioned" idea (like our fancy lobby LED display and waterwall in this same referenced building) turn into f**king nightmares.
We have a "living wall" on one side, with plants and what not, and a waterwall that messed with the electrical systems of the whole tower when it leaked, on the other. At this point, random and tasteful graffiti by a street artist, on that wall instead of the waterwall, may have been significantly more appreciated (and free), had we the foresight.
Quote from: Apache on January 21, 2014, 06:37:14 PM
^^ you have a hair stylist???
Yes, do you cut your own hair?
^^Haha, ok. I am not one to be ashamed to admit I have a stylist - I have been known to serially date my stylists, so I know right off the bat that it ain't happening with some musty old barber with antiquated views of how hair should look on a "man"! ;)
Somewhere Ron Swanson is weeping (on the inside).
A team of queens and bees works on Ron Swanson's hair for 1-2 hours a day! Here is Nick Offerman's many Dos:
Ron Swanson look (a barber is NOT piecing this thing together each day, LoL):
(http://www.blogcdn.com/www.aoltv.com/media/2011/01/ron-swanson-250fp011911.jpg)
Conan look:
(http://images.amcnetworks.com/ifc.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/nick-offerman-conan.jpg)
Awards look (seriously?):
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/Nick_Offerman_2012_(cropped).jpg)
Jack Nicholson look:
(http://b.vimeocdn.com/ts/442/418/442418922_640.jpg)
Hood look:
(http://cdn.crushable.com/files/2011/02/Nick-Offerman.jpg)
Rugged look:
(http://thecommittedindian.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/nick-offerman.jpg)
Appalachian look:
(http://splitsider.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Nick-Offerman-1.jpeg)
Early 2000s gay look?:
(https://s3.amazonaws.com/webassets.ticketmob.com/TS/images/comedians/Nick-Offerman.jpg)
...
...
...
I'm pretty sure this is all actually one guy!
Every one of the 33 spray paint cans I have,I had background check conducted for each, except for the one that was given to me.(no color....'Clear Insight/Satin' on the label)
The Shoppes have become neighborhood graffiti for some.Yep- some cheer!
A visitor, former resident (Douglas Anderson student) checked out the ol' neighborhood and a couple of other elements and surmised; we're tryin' too hard
Murray Hill has an "H3" problem. Seems to be everywhere.
Where is the We love Murray Hill brigade?
Quote from: stephendare on January 22, 2014, 08:21:02 AM
Josh Taylor has some pictures coming up, and apparently the vandalism was a lot more than the original pictures, including some pretty direct threats to the business. Sounds like the We Love Avondale crowd got what they wanted.
Seems like a nice place to raise children.
Sounds like We Love Avondale crowd did the tagging! Nice people
Unreal what those fine upstanding Avondale neighbors have done this time. The tagging wasn't confined specifically to the door on the rear of the building. It also covered the decorative wood paneling behind the building, much of the back wall, the A/C units on top of the building, and some of the front facade as well. Here's a few examples:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v403/rav4guy/IMG_0114_zps853f08de.jpg)
On the rear of the building, overlooking the gravel parking lot.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v403/rav4guy/IMG_0115_zps61382edc.jpg)
A bit further down the wall. You can also see a small portion of the vandalism on the rooftop above.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v403/rav4guy/IMG_0113_zpsf3ac3ee7.jpg)
Every one of the boards on the left side of the picture was covered with what one of the MM crew described as "hate speech and death threats". They have since been removed and replaced.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v403/rav4guy/IMG_0109_zpsecb0ef30.jpg)
This gentleman was in the process of scrubbing "Pizza Nazi" off the Avondale Avenue sidewalk facade of the building when I snapped the pictures. He later gave up and covered the stone with cardboard. The entire limestone block will have to be cut from the facade and replaced later this week.
Definitely reeks of WeLoveAvondale crowd.
Probably one of the "upstanding citizens" of WLA got wasted on spritzers at the Brick and took out some of their aggression on the facade. I haven't been by in a couple weeks, but unless they have recently put up new signage, I don't know how the run of the mill hoodlum would know what the building is for.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on January 22, 2014, 04:45:57 PM
Probably one of the "upstanding citizens" of WLA got wasted on spritzers at the Brick and took out some of their aggression on the facade. I haven't been by in a couple weeks, but unless they have recently put up new signage, I don't know how the run of the mill hoodlum would know what the building is for.
The MM signage is now painted over the old Emly Benham/Town space, and a large lit sign proclaiming "THE MELLOW" hangs on the corner of the building nearest The Brick. There's still one lit sign yet to be hung, atop the middle building.
The couple of WLA people I know are among the strongest anti-graffiti people you will ever meet and they are WAY beyond the graffiti age group. Probably done by a delivery person from Hungry Howies up the road. :)
There is plenty of footage.Well, how about snaps.
I lost a camera when the oak went down.(*)I figured the very act of placing the very most recent tech teeny tiny camera in that beat up oak tree,as if a clump of moss, climbing up a wee bit to boot for good measure for crying out loud ( I lost a placement debate) was sure to be a matter of survey,and in fact, the possibility was so easily addressed.
Luckily I grew up on Carl Hiaasen novels.And in a neighborhood Sans Graffiti.
*(good thing by the way- clear out the corner,canopy. Breath! Open!)
Quote from: Captain Zissou on January 22, 2014, 04:45:57 PM
I haven't been by .............I don't know how the run of the mill hoodlum would know what the building is for.
Maybe run of the mill resident
If this thread was a Carl Hiaasen novel (apologies Carl!) it would be................... Susan Fraser.
Cast as former Clay County Planner, Beltway Booster et al, (and a couple of tangles with "Know Growth") all the while an Avondale resident....eventually, WLA. Metro Jax blunted even in the face of such Copious News & Information.
Not all Hiaasen is fiction.
Perfect.
Everyone looking at WLA, but this seems like the actions of crowd that's a little more disorderly, a little more crazy.....a little more....ROWDY...
Quote from: Bridges on January 22, 2014, 09:22:22 PM
Everyone looking at WLA,
"Everyone"?
That's a small common denominator as it relates to anything here
QuoteThe entire limestone block will have to be cut from the facade and replaced later this week.
Just paint it, come on, how hard is this?
This is just punks from the restaurants in the neighborhood, they are about to see their income go down.
I got my camera back!
40 acre tree boneyard off Hipps Road.
Quoteum, thats a super bizarre claim, and it doesnt do anything but make it worse that WLA, which has apparently decided to walk the line of being a criminal enterprise, would like to blame this kind of thuggery on the wonderful young waiters and servers of the neighborhood.
YAWN!!!!!
Just drove by the new MM. Looks fantastic. Good work! 100000x better looking than Mojos. Hell, better looking than 9/10 businesses on the strip.
The Mellow Mushroom on St.Augustine Beach has outstanding architecture too. Same owner? Same architect?
It was nice to see MM crowded yesterday. The building looks very nice and I think it is an indictment to the idiots in the neighborhood who whined about it.
Speaking of MM. There have been numerous cars parked on the edge of Boone Park over the weekend and today. It is clear that MM is doing some training leading up to their opening next week. These cars are parked legally. Parked where people park all the time and are within the time limits (Not parked there after 10 PM).
Today, however, some resident decided they did not like this and called Parking Enforcement. So 2 Enforcement officers arrived and assessed the situation. I walked over and talked to them some and they stated that a resident had called and told them they did not like looking out their window and seeing cars. They wanted to see the park. Parking Enforcement told them that the cars were parked there legally and there was nothing that Enforcement could do. They officers stated that the Mellow Mushroom owner knowing he would have an influx of cars due to training told his employees to try and not park in the spaces near the shop or in front of residents' houses to avoid getting people upset. I guess he had more faith in some of the residents than I do.
Of course, as I have stated before the residents in this area have no problem piling personal vehicles on the road as well as the park went it suits their needs.
There are several businesses in the Shoppes of Avondale that are directing their employees and customers to park legally by Boone Park and walk in. It's not just MM.
The Riverside/Avondale Night Trolley is running again this Friday and Saturday nights which should ease some of the parking issues for those nights. Everyone who has tried the night trolley has been very enthusiastic about it. If this trial period works out JTA will run it every Friday and Saturday night.