Thoughts?
http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/blog/2013/07/cuba-the-next-big-thing.html
I think John Burr is often way off target....in this case, Jax. would at best be the 5th choice city in Florida for increased relations with Cuba (behind Miami, Fort Lauderdale, Tampa, and Orlando)....I think we are better off focusing on our connections with the rest of this country, where we have a geographic advantage over other Florida markets.
Quote from: tufsu1 on July 09, 2013, 08:54:35 AM
I think John Burr is often way off target....in this case, Jax. would at best be the 5th choice city in Florida for increased relations with Cuba (behind Miami, Fort Lauderdale, Tampa, and Orlando)....I think we are better off focusing on our connections with the rest of this country, where we have a geographic advantage over other Florida markets.
How would Tampa offer any logistical benefits over Jaxport from Cuba other than a shorter trip by sea?
Not sure where you get Orlando from, they don't have a seaport.
Jaxport already has a strong footing in the Carribean trade routes and available dock space for agricultural shipments (and specialty manufactured items, like pharma products... If Cuba ever opens up, it will eventually become a manufacturing mecca with it's cheap and well educated labor force once the country's infrastructure catches up). Tampa doesn't have the break bulk dock capacity that Jaxport does (that and RO/RO capacity is what Anderson is focusing on now in Tampa).
Frankly, I think it is a great idea. Jaxport should be developing these niche markets where they would have a competitive advantage over deeper water ports (that also means more trans shipping agreements with Savannah incidentally). Think about what Jaxport would be like without Puerto Rico? If you really let that sink in, you'll quickly realize the potential in Cuba.
Good points field...though doesn't Tampa have a lot more historical and cultural ties to Cuba than Jax?
^Sure, but I can't imagine that matters more than adequate facilities and infrastructure.
Downtown Jax had several cigar factories filled with Cuban workers at one point (many prominent citizens actually funded several wars in Cuba). However, in the end no modern day logistics company chooses what port to call on based on what happened to the cigar industry and Cuban revolutionaries before even my father was born.
What if FEC restarts it's cuban rail ferries of yesteryear 8)
Cuba already is a huge shipping market. The US is cuba's largest source of agricultural products. Crowley, which is headquartered here in Jacksonville, was the first carrier to re-enter cuba in 2001 and completes regular shipments there.
CNBC did a good story on it: http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000079888
Quote from: CityLife on July 09, 2013, 10:52:53 AM
Good points field...though doesn't Tampa have a lot more historical and cultural ties to Cuba than Jax?
None of this stuff matters. Think about it. Do you care what port your bananas or car arrived in when you purchased them from the store or dealership? Probably not. Neither do most of the companies shipping goods. It's all about time and efficiency in getting the product shipped to certain spots. Savannah is kicking our ass because they've developed their port to be a one stop shop for a variety of shipper's needs. There, you have multiple on-dock rail facilities, warehousing, etc. Here, we're still focusing on building a facility that only accommodates CSX, while ignoring that NS and FEC also run through this town.
Crazy enough, FEC is investing in their connectivity with South Florida's ports. From what I understand, the philosophy is that a ship coming from the Panama Canal can reach that US port before any other in the Gulf or Atlantic Coast. At that point, you can utilize FEC for rail bound product and turn your ship around, as opposed to burning additional time reaching ports further north. While that strategy focuses on the post panamax race, it illustrates planning efforts from a global level and realization that business doesn't care what port they ship into, as long as product is quickly delivered to its final destination for a competitive price.
Locally, I think we need to start thinking about how we can find our niche in the overall larger logistical chain. If we can do that successfully, we can appeal more to potential Cuban markets and others as well.
Quote from: CityLife on July 09, 2013, 10:52:53 AM
Good points field...though doesn't Tampa have a lot more historical and cultural ties to Cuba than Jax?
and that's what I meant....
on sea trade, I'll give in that Jacksonville has potential with Cuba....but I was talking trade in general (some of which comes by plane)...Orlando and Tampa have a whole bunch more people that speak the language and that gives them a serious leg up.
Quote from: tufsu1 on July 09, 2013, 02:15:43 PM
Quote from: CityLife on July 09, 2013, 10:52:53 AM
Good points field...though doesn't Tampa have a lot more historical and cultural ties to Cuba than Jax?
and that's what I meant....I'm not talking about sea trade, just trade in general (some of which comes by plane)...Orlando and Tampa have a whole bunch more people that speak the language and that gives them a serious leg up
Orlando has the rather notable disadvantage of not having a port with which to compete.
^ but they do have a pretty nice airport....and guess how Tampa started building its new relationship with Cuba....that's right, weekly flights.
and as for a seaport, Port Canaveral is less than 1 hour away by expressway....kind of like how Jax. boosters claim having three interstates (I-75)
My point about ties to Cuba never in any way implied that those ties would be a deciding factor. Was merely pointing out that it may be a factor and I absolutely think it may be. There are 63,000 Cubans in the Tampa Bay area. Don't have the numbers for Jax, but I'd guess that Tampa has at least 10x more. I'd imagine that means there are a lot more products that would be shipped from Cuba to serve their Cuban residents and that there are more businesses in the Tampa area that would use Cuban products. Not to mention there are probably a lot more ties between prominent Cuban families in Tampa and leaders in Cuba.
Sure at the end of the day logistics and financials are going to be the deciding factor, but having stronger political and societal ties and greater demand for products locally could absolutely make a difference, especially if everything else is equal between the two.
I guess I'm looking at it from a larger level. If I need to move a shipment from a John Deere plant in Moline to Cuba or hand-rolled Cuban cigars to Cincinnati, it doesn't matter to me if it goes through JAXPORT, Mobile, Miami, Savannah etc. I just want the process to be as quick, efficient and cost effective as possible.
There are so many factors involved in this equation. Having shipped goods from South America, I found port destination and cost depended on shipping line as well. Absent a nice market provider like Trailerbridge to PR, I do not know that we would have any real advantage over Tampa and I would think the Port of New Orleans would compete for goods headed to Western U.S. as it already serves most of Central America.
Quote from: stephendare on July 09, 2013, 02:54:11 PM
And until short sea shipping is implemented, Jacksonville is the first logical port to rail connection for any Carribbean or Cuban goods trying to get a cheap distribution throughout the country.
take a look at the investments FEC is making at Port of Miami and CSX is making at Port of Tampa
Quote from: stephendare on July 09, 2013, 02:54:11 PM
Quote from: CityLife on July 09, 2013, 02:25:45 PM
My point about ties to Cuba never in any way implied that those ties would be a deciding factor. Was merely pointing out that it may be a factor and I absolutely think it may be. There are 63,000 Cubans in the Tampa Bay area. Don't have the numbers for Jax, but I'd guess that Tampa has at least 10x more. I'd imagine that means there are a lot more products that would be shipped from Cuba to serve their Cuban residents and that there are more businesses in the Tampa area that would use Cuban products. Not to mention there are probably a lot more ties between prominent Cuban families in Tampa and leaders in Cuba.
Sure at the end of the day logistics and financials are going to be the deciding factor, but having stronger political and societal ties and greater demand for products locally could absolutely make a difference, especially if everything else is equal between the two.
Well the point of trade ports from one country to the next isnt to move product from one country to one city. Its to move it throughout the country.
And until short sea shipping is implemented, Jacksonville is the first logical port to rail connection for any Carribbean or Cuban goods trying to get a cheap distribution throughout the country.
Im sure Lunican could probably provide some insight on the simple issue of freight distribution lines.
I'm clearly aware of that, but as I said, if all things are equal or even close to parity, greater societal and political ties can absolutely make an impact...hence why Tampa is even trying to restore its ties to Cuba. If Jacksonville had the same ties to Cuba that Tampa does, our leadership wouldn't be 18 months behind the curve....
And yes the end game of trade ports is to distribute goods and services throughout the land....but if said land happens to be closer to that port, than that is a major cost reduction. Simply put, Tampa is MUCH closer to the population and business base of Cuban Americans. So it may be much more cost effective to ship there and disperse goods to Cubans in Florida than it is to do the same from Jacksonville vs the savings in shipping from
Jax up the East Coast....and yes I am also aware that not all imports from Cuba will be going to Cuban Americans.
^That seems to be a generally pervasive problem in Jacksonville, so I'd say quite likely an issue...but if we had some prominent Cuban families in this city with some inside scoop on future plans for Cuba's economy, we may have been better prepared to pounce.
Here's an interesting read on Tampa's trip to Cuba
http://www.tampabay.com/news/business/economicdevelopment/cuba-trip-underscores-potential-connections-for-tampa-local-officials-say/2125452
Quote from: stephendare on July 09, 2013, 03:21:12 PM
Quote from: CityLife on July 09, 2013, 03:13:00 PM
^That seems to be a generally pervasive problem in Jacksonville, so I'd say quite likely an issue...but if we had some prominent Cuban families in this city with some inside scoop on future plans for Cuba's economy, we may have been better prepared to pounce.
Here's an interesting read on Tampa's trip to Cuba
http://www.tampabay.com/news/business/economicdevelopment/cuba-trip-underscores-potential-connections-for-tampa-local-officials-say/2125452
How about even a bilingual permanent employee of our Port?
That might be a start in dealing with Latin America, Cuba and Puerto Rico.
Just sayin.....
But there is no amount of family connection that gets additional freight lines built to make better economic sense to a shipper.
Seriously? Nobody at the port speaks Spanish? If so, scary...
To the other point, how much of Cuba's exports will end up in the Tampa/South Florida area and how many end up further up the East Coast of the US?
Quote from: stephendare on July 09, 2013, 02:54:11 PM
Quote from: CityLife on July 09, 2013, 02:25:45 PM
My point about ties to Cuba never in any way implied that those ties would be a deciding factor. Was merely pointing out that it may be a factor and I absolutely think it may be. There are 63,000 Cubans in the Tampa Bay area. Don't have the numbers for Jax, but I'd guess that Tampa has at least 10x more. I'd imagine that means there are a lot more products that would be shipped from Cuba to serve their Cuban residents and that there are more businesses in the Tampa area that would use Cuban products. Not to mention there are probably a lot more ties between prominent Cuban families in Tampa and leaders in Cuba.
Sure at the end of the day logistics and financials are going to be the deciding factor, but having stronger political and societal ties and greater demand for products locally could absolutely make a difference, especially if everything else is equal between the two.
Well the point of trade ports from one country to the next isnt to move product from one country to one city. Its to move it throughout the country.
And until short sea shipping is implemented, Jacksonville is the first logical port to rail connection for any Carribbean or Cuban goods trying to get a cheap distribution throughout the country.
Im sure Lunican could probably provide some insight on the simple issue of freight distribution lines.
Don't know about that. FEC is putting their money into South Florida infrastructure. Ultimately, there's a ton of factors at play. What makes Jax suitable for one company, product or destination may not be for another.