I'll kick this off and see if anyone else cares, enjoys, and / or knows their military history... I have quite a collection of favorites and it's tough to narrow them down. Let's not just stay with the GREAT ARMIES and NAVIES of the world either, the small groups can count here too... just tell us why?
1. Prince Vladislav Dracula, national hero of Romania who so terrorized the Saxons and the Ottoman Empire with a small army that the Ottoman King, known for extreme tortures, was thrown back in horror at Dracula's methods. Hit, massacre and impale the enemy troops, then run. The Ottomans finally decided they had no fight with the prince.
2. General Tomoyuki Yamashita, the "Tiger of Malaya," The Japanese General of WWII who was perhaps their most gifted field commander. Taking Sinapore early in the fight, the British had bragged was "impossible no one will march in and take this city, " They were right, Yamashita issued his troops bicycles! He also abandoned Cities that could not be held rather then waste his men. He was sacked by Tojo for being too good, and sent to the frontiers of the Empire. In the end, we hung him for war crimes that took place where he wasn't even in command!
3. Erwin Rommel, The "desert Fox" of WWII, vastly out numbered, and largely told just to hold North Afrika, he rolled over everything in his path. It wasn't until we broke the German code and starved him of resupply, fuel and men that he finally was transfered to France. Hitler had him executed shortly after D-Day as one of those who tried to kill Der Fearless Leader... Sorry but Rommel wasn't in on the deal...
4. J. J. Dickinson, Florida's Confederate Swamp Fox, who managed to so scare the Yankee army that he held everything between the St. Johns and the Chattahoochee with only 400 or so men. Credited with being the only Cavalry commander ever sink a US warship. He boldly walked into a large Yankee camp at Welatka, and asked what all the fuss was about... They quickly explained, "Dicie" as they called him, had crossed the river and was now trapped, they were going to kill him and all his men... To which Dickinson said with a chil, "No sir
you don't have him at all, he has you, you are surrounded and I am the Captain!"
5. Admrial Bull Halsey, Okay, he was my daddys CO, got to give him credit, Damn if he hadn't been sick and near death at midway, the Japanese navy would have lost more then 4 carriers and a cruiser... They'd been lucky to survive with a tug boat. Wake Island, had he been given command, would never have fallen IMO.
6. It's a tie... Robert Bruce or Wallace.... Gee both grandparents of mine, got to love the spirit of those fighters taking on England and handing them their butts... By the way there was no "princess", Bruce was a HE MAN fighter, and the stupid movie was missing a bridge... Scotland Forever!
7. Simon Bolivar, who fought to liberate South America against a power as tough as England, and in complete military control of it's territory. Working with a people so divided as to not even speak the same languages, he even recruited entire mounted companies of canibals... It worked, Spain left town...
VIVA LA REPUBLICA DE COLOMBIA!
That's a few of mine... Who are yours?
Ocklawaha
Charles Martel, stopped the Mustlim advance into Europe in 732 at the Battle of Tours(Poitiers). Using only infantry, defeated an Army with heavy cavalry forces by use of terrain and superbly trained soldiers.
Nathan Bedford Forrest, natural military genius who had no formal training. Greatly feared by Grant and Sherman, he was a master at using "mobile" forces to raid, harass, destroy supplies, and participate in numerous engagements and battles. His personal courage and aggressivness was beyond dispute. His birthday was yesterday, July 13.
I was thinking Dick Winters, 101st Airborne, WWII. He wasnt really a big name, but a great leader from a unit with an amazing story.
Henry Knox. Not bad work for a book store owner from Boston with no military training.
Robert E Lee, an amazing man and general.
Ethan Allen has always interested me, and of course, George Washington.
I have been reading a lot of revolutionary war history of late, so I am a little single tracked Im afraid.
Wow... where to start?
Washington... Not so much as a tactician but as a leader.
R.E. Lee... Amazing
Stonewall Jackson... Inspirational
Sherman... Loyal subordinate... Father of total warfare.
Puller... the Marines marine.
Patton... Father of American Mechanized warfare
Halsey... Father of Carrier warfare and the value of Naval Aviation.
Omar Bradley who in WWII made the other general's successes possible. A quiet, super-intelligent guy who put the welfare of his troops at the top of his lists. Read his autobiography, "A General's Life" and prepare to be impressed.
General Anthony Clement McAuliffe, Commander of the 101st Airborne who defended Bastogne with limited men and ammunition power, and when he was asked to surrender by the Germans he responded “Nuts!†By successfully defending Bastogne, it was the beginning of the end of Germany in WWII.
General Hannibal Barca, his ability to outwit and crush the Roman Legions at such a young age is very impressive.
Tokugawa Ieyasu, who overthrew the governing dynasty of Japan and created a regime that lasted centuries.
General Subodai Bahdur, leader of the Mongol invasions. He was able to command multiple armies at once while in different regions of the battlefield. He is the only military leader to beat the Russians and basically crossed all of Asia, Russia and Eastern Europe, conquering all.
And of course the one and only:
I am Spartacus! No, I am Spartacus! No, I am Spartacus! No, I am Spartacus! No, I am Spartacus!
QuoteGeneral Subodai Bahdur, leader of the Mongol invasions. He was able to command multiple armies at once while in different regions of the battlefield. He is the only military leader to beat the Russians and basically crossed all of Asia, Russia and Eastern Europe, conquering all.
I remember doing some reading and study on the Mongol invasions years ago and a few things stuck in my mind. First off, if I remember correctly, the Central and Western European principalities and kingdoms never combined their forces to meet this common threat. This played into the hands of the Mongols as the Europeans were introduced to a type of mobile warfare and tactics they had never faced. It also appeared that the only thing that stopped the Mongols from continuing across the continent was the return of the Mongol leader to his country in response to a succession situation.
Indeed! Especially surprising of the British who didn't seem to learn their lesson from the Boer War where they were whipped in the beginning of the conflict by irregular, transplanted Europeans, who were armed with the modern weapons of the time.
Admiral Thad W. Allen
Quote from: stephendare on July 15, 2009, 06:17:57 PM
On Hannibal. Elephants always help of course.
they only help if you remember to feed them, not to mention feeding them is very difficult on a long trek.
If it wasn't for the British campaign in India, there would be no IPA to drink today. Had they survived the Zulu, would we also be drinking an APA? Damn it Chaka!
Well, just to be historically correct, the Zulu Wars were fought a decade or so before the Boer War, Chaka never fought the Brits(even though I'm sure his namesake sang to them at one time or another ;), and the Zulu's were still fighting with primitive weapons(probably one of the last the British fought). The Zulu's early victories were only achieved with overwhelming numbers against small garrisons at a very heavy price. They were quickly defeated after their initial successes.
I'll start out with the Battle of Chancellorsville in the American Civil War. Jackson and Lee, taking advantage of the unimaginative and slow to react Union commander, did the unthinkable and split their numerically inferior force and pulled off a classic flanking movement. Only the late start of the battle saved the Union army from possible destruction. Further impeding the Confederate follow up was the unfortunate death of General Stonewall Jackson, fatally wounded by his own pickets during the night returning with a scouting party.
Great example...! The Union general was Hooker...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Chancellorsville
Battle of Tsushima (May 27-29, 1905),
A Naval engagement of the Russo-Japanese War. A naval engagement caused by a fight over control of Korean natural resources. Russia with it's massive battle fleet was summarily trounced by little upstart Japan and their small fleet.
Battle of Thermopylae,
Thermopylae. A battle where 300 defending Spartans were killed. Their defence and courage provided inspiration to the Greeks. The Spartans delayed the vast enemy buying time for the hoplights. The last Spartans were killed by a barrage of arrows
Battle of Gainesville,
About 400 Confederate troops under Captain J. J. Dickison attacked the city from two flanks and sent a Federal raiding force numbering as high as 4,000 men to hell. The battle had a Hollywood ending with Captain Dickison riding down the federal leader (known as The RED FOX for his tactics and blazing red hair) in a swamp near the St. Johns River. Dickison's words were classic, "How is it that the Red Fox should be captured by the Swamp Fox?"
Battle of Lawrence, KS,
Engineered as pay back for the murder of the bushwhacker's wives, the Federal garrison folded in seconds with their commander at a full trot. The climax of Quantrill's guerrilla career came on August 21, 1863, when he led a force of 450 raiders into Lawrence, Kansas, a stronghold of pro-Union support and the home of Senator James H. Lane. Lane managed to escape, racing through a cornfield in his nightshirt, but Quantrill and his men killed 183 men and boys, dragging some from their homes for execution, and set the torch to much of the city.
OCKLAWAHA
QuoteOne of my all time favorite battles (aside from the Battle of Mollwitz) is the crushing defeat handed to Peter the Great of Russia in the Great Northern Wars.
Brings to mind the disasterous 20th century adventure of the Russkie invasion of Finland at the beginning of WW2. The Russians attacked with overwhelming forces but were stopped cold for four months in what has become know as The Winter War. The Finns tactics were based on terrain and the unbelievable fighing prowess of their forces. They found ingenious ways to stop the Russian tanks and created the "molotov cocktail" during this conflict.
One of the most disasterous defeats of the Russians occurred at the Battle of Raate-Road. Two divisions of Soviet infantry(about 25,000 men), supported by tanks were ambushed along a section of road. Taking advantage of the narrow confines, the Finns blocked the advance and retreat options with small forces and wreaked havoc on the Russkies. The Russians had 18,000 casulties, lost 85 tanks and tons of equipment. The Finns lost about 250 men out of a force of 3600.
Unfortunately, the numerical superiority of the Russian forces and the lack of equipment, ammunition, and resupply of materiel to the Finnish forces forced the signing of a treaty with the Soviets to their advantage.
The Finns proved one thing... Tiger Tanks are worthless in 12 feet of snow (JUST KIDDING). Another lesson learned was Never trust a German with a funny little moustache to send you equipment and troops.
Any of you ever think in the abstract? What if?
Imagine the Finn's with Tigers, Leopards and King Tigers on the ground and Stukas and ME109's in the air... Hum...
What if the Confederates had owned a fleet of submarines? What if Stonewall was never shot? What if J.E.B. Stuart had gotten word to Robert E. Lee before Gettysburg?
OCKLAWAHA
I'm not sure who, but someone mentioned Cincinnatus. Here's a website about him: http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Cincinatus (http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Cincinatus). I wonder if anyone knows about the Order of Cincinnatus. One story I remember -- which may not be true -- was that after the Revolution, some military officers proposed that a dictatorship be established with Washington as king or something along that line. The story has Washington showing up at the meeting and describing how Cincinnatus had left his farm to run the army when he was needed and then went back to his farm when it was over. After hearing his story the military officers stopped their plans and that's why we have a free country with an elected president instead of a king. Do I have it right?
Admiral Horatio Nelson "The hero of Trafalgar".
In the battle of Trafalgar he easily could have watched the battle from another ship, but instead chose to lead the battle form the HMS Victory. A decision that ended up costing him his life.
Quote from: Ocklawaha on July 18, 2009, 03:59:17 PM
Any of you ever think in the abstract? What if?
OCKLAWAHA
what if my aunt had balls . . . she'd be my uncle
By Job, me thinks we have a winner!
Good form JaxNative, good form! Remember too, If June bugs had landing lights, they could steer clear of my teeth on my bike at night... Ummm
OCKLAWAHA
Quote from: JagFan07 on July 18, 2009, 08:08:07 PM
Admiral Horatio Nelson "The hero of Trafalgar".
In the battle of Trafalgar he easily could have watched the battle from another ship, but instead chose to lead the battle form the HMS Victory. A decision that ended up costing him his life.
An admiral is a "flag" officer, which means he has a flag denoting his rank. As fleet commander, the ship which carries his flag would be called a "flagship." Strangely enough, a fleet admiral does not normally command his own ship -- the ship has a captain who is primarily responsible for that vessel and acts under the admiral's orders the same as the commander of any other ship in the fleet. Was HMS Victory his flagship or did he choose to move to it from another vessel? I'm not familiar with the real Nelson, having only read about him in C.S. Forester's Horatio Hornblower series of books. I know he was a real person and really was a hero but I'm not familiar with him.
Here's the answer to my question: http://www.sculptor-iangb.com/hms-victory.htm (http://www.sculptor-iangb.com/hms-victory.htm). The Victory was the Admiral's flagship which means he probably would have led the battle from there -- though he could have chosen to move his flag to another ship. The original statement made it appear that Nelson chose to move to HMS Victory from another ship -- I have no idea, perhaps he did.
It was called a flagship because it was the command ship from which an admiral transmitted command signals by flags, a system developed by the British navy. Nelson, as the Admiral, had to be on the flagship to command the battle. He wasn't there to watch it. The flagship was usually in the thick of the battle and was usually one of the largest ships in the fleet.
HMS Victory is still in commission in the British navy, although not floating, in Portsmouth, England. It is well worth the trip to see it. There is a brass plaque on the deck where Nelson was shot and another below where he died.
From Wikipedia:
"As the fleets converged, the Victory’s captain, Thomas Hardy suggested that Nelson remove the decorations on his coat, so that he would not be so easily identified by enemy sharpshooters. Nelson replied that it was too late 'to be shifting a coat', adding that they were 'military orders and he did not fear to show them to the enemy'. Captain Henry Blackwood, of the frigate HMS Euryalus, suggested Nelson come aboard his ship to better observe the battle. Nelson refused, and also turned down Hardy's suggestion to let Eliab Harvey's HMS Temeraire come ahead of the Victory and lead the line into battle."
That is what I meant by chose to lead the battle. I think Nelson knew what he was heading into and chose to be brave in the face of danger.
That's a good post, JagFan07. While it is correct that orders were transmitted by flags, another reason for the name was the flagship carried the admiral's flag and was the ship from which the admiral exercised his command. See my previous comment and references regarding "flagships." If anyone's interested, here are a couple of other references to Admiral Lord Nelson http://www.solarnavigator.net/history/horatio_nelson.htm (http://www.solarnavigator.net/history/horatio_nelson.htm) and to the HMS Victory: http://www.solarnavigator.net/history/victory.htm (http://www.solarnavigator.net/history/victory.htm). The first of the references in this post contains the flags which transmitted a famous quote attributed to Admiral Nelson "England expects every man to do his duty."
When I was reading the reference above regarding Nelson, I came across the following: “It is a common misconception that Nelsons last words were ‘kiss me Hardy’ or ‘kismet Hardy,’ said to captain of HMS Victory, Thomas Hardy. His actual last words are believed to be:
"Kiss me, Hardy. Now I am satisfied. Thank God I have done my duty. Drink, drink. Fan, fan. Rub, rub." The final words were in reference to his thirst, heat and chest pains.
Looking at that quote, I kind of doubt he was asking the ship’s captain to “kiss†him which makes Nelson sound like a homosexual, something I’m sure he was not. I think what he said was “Kismet, Hardy†meaning that getting shot and killed was his fate or destiny.
This may help clear the water here... Nelson could well have had HIS FLAG (a command flag usually with stars for each star on the commanders shoulder boards) on an inferior ship. Somehow history has linked FLAGSHIP with the heavy weights of the battle and that is simply not true. In fact today it would hardly ever be true. In Nelsons time there was much more leadership by the hands on method, but the American War of Yankee Aggression put an end to that worldwide. Stonewall Jackson: Killed, J.E.B. Stuart: Killed, Clebourne: Killed, etc...
bad idea in modern warfare. I'm sharing the Japanese Order of Battle at Midway in 1942. Note that the Admrials were in the front line vessels, Yamamoto was 200 miles to the rear in Yamato, the worlds biggest battleship. But Nagumo, was front and center with the strike force on the carrier Akagi. When the carrier sank, Nagumo shifted his flag to the Destroyer Nagara. This simple act set a precendence for almost all future commanders.
About Midway, had the invasion force under the very able hands of (battle ship sailor and early convert to total air war), admrial Ugaki, gone ahead with the invasion Japan may well have taken the island anyway. Had the reserve "jeep" carriers been sent in, they might have struck back. Had the diversionary force with the carriers Ryujo and Junyo been in the main attack force, history would read differently... Interesting what if's.QuoteJapanese Order of Battle at Midway
Ship "Classes" in parenthesis.
COMBINED FLEET
Adm. Isoroku Yamamoto, in Yamato
Chief of Staff, RADM Matome Ugaki
Main Body, Admiral Yamamoto
BatDiv 1, Admiral Yamamoto
BB Yamato (flagship, Yamato), Captain
BB Nagato (Nagato), Captain Hideo Yano
BB Mutsu (Nagato), Captain Teijiro Yamazumi
Carrier Group, Captain Kaoru Umetani
CVL Hosho (Hosho), Captain Umetani
Air Unit (8 bombers), Lieutenant Yoshiaki Irikiin
DD Yukaze (Minekaze), Lieutenant Commander Shizuka Kajimoto
Special Force, Captain Kaku Harada
Chiyoda (seaplane carrier, Chitose), Captain Harada
Nisshin (seaplane carrier, Nisshin), Captain Katsumi Komazawa
Screen (DesRon 3), RADM Shintaro Hashimoto
CL Sendai (flagship, Jintsu), Captain Nobue Morishita
DesDiv 11, Captain Kiichiro Shoji
DD Fubuki (Fubuki), Captain Shizuo Yamashita
DD Shirayuki (Fubuki), Captain Taro Sugahara
DD Hatsuyuki (Fubuki), Captain Lieutenant Commander Junnari Kamiura
DD Murakumo (Fubuki), Captain Commander Hideo Higashi
DesDiv 19, Captain Ranji Oe
DD Isonami (Fubuki), Commander Ryokichi Sugama
DD Uranami (Fubuki), Commander Tsutomu Hagio
DD Shikinami (Fubuki), Commander Akifumi Kawahashi
DD Ayanami (Fubuki), Commander Eiji Sakuma
1st Supply Unit, Captain Shigeyasu Nishioka
Naruto (Oiler), Captain Nishioka
Toei Maru (Oiler)
GUARD (Aleutians Screening) FORCE, VADM Shiro Takasu in Hyuga
Chief of Staff, Rear Admiral Kengo Kobayashi
BatDiv 2
BB Hyuga (flagship, Hyuga), Captain Chiaki Matsuda
BB Ise (Hyuga), Captain Isamu Takeda
BB Fuso (Fuso), Captain Mitsuo Kinoshita
BB Yamashiro (Fuso), Captain Gunji Kogure
Screen, RADM Fukuji Kishi
CruDiv 9, Rear Admiral Kishi
CL Kitakami ( flagship, Kuma), Captain Saiji Norimitsu
CL Oi (Kuma), Captain Shigeru Narita
DesDiv 20, Captain Yuji Yamada
DD Asagiri (Fubuki), Commander Nisaburo Maekawa
DD Yugiri (Fubuki), Captain Masayoshi Motokura
DD Shirakumo (Fubuki), Commander Toyoji Hitomi
DD Amagiri (Fubuki), Captain Buichi Ashida
DesDiv 24, Captain Yasuji Hirai
DD Umikaze (Shiratsuyu), Commander Nagahide Sugitani
DD Yamakaze (Shiratsuyu), Commander Shuichi Hamanaka
DD Kawakaze (Shiratsuyu), Commander Kazuo Wakabayashi
DD Suzukaze (Shiratsuyu), Commander Kazuo Shibayama
DesDiv 27, Captain Matake Yoshimura
DD Ariake (Hatsuharu), Commander Shoichi Yoshida
DD Yugure (Hatsuharu), Commander Kiyoshi Kamo
DD Shigure (Shiratsuyu), Commander Noboru Seo
DD Shiratsuyu (Shiratsuyu), Lieutenant Commander Kimmatsu Hashimoto
2nd Supply Unit, Captain Matsuo Eguchi
San Clemente Maru (oiler), Captain Eguchi
Toa Maru (oiler)
FIRST CARRIER STRIKING FORCE (1st Air Fleet), VADM Chuichi Nagumo
Carrier Group, VADM Nagumo
CarDiv 1
CV Akagi (flagship, Akagi) 21 Zero fighters, 21 dive bombers, 21 torpedo bombers (Sunk)
CV Kaga (Kaga) 21 Zero fighters, 21 dive bombers, 30 torpedo bombers (Sunk)
CarDiv 2 -- RADM Tamon Yamaguchi
CV Hiryu (flagship, Hiryu) 21 Zero fighters, 21 dive bombers, 21 torpedo bombers (Sunk)
CV Soryu (Hiryu) 21 Zero fighters, 21 dive bombers, 21 torpedo bombers (Sunk)
Support Group -- RADM Hiroaki Abe CruDiv 8
CA Tone (flagship, Tone)
CA Chikuma (Tone)
2nd Section, BatDiv 3 --
BB Haruna (Kongo)
BB Kirishima (Kongo)
Screen (DesRon 10) -- RADM Susumu Kimura
CL Nagara (flagship, Nagara)
DesDiv 4 -- 4 DDs
DesDiv 10 -- 3 DDs
DesDiv 17 -- 4 DDs
Supply Group -- 5 oilers, 1 DD
MIDWAY INVASION FORCE, (2nd Fleet), VADM Nobutake Kondo
Invasion Force Main Body
CruDiv 4 (less 2nd section)
CA Atago (flagship, Takao),
CA Chokai (Takao)
CruDiv 5 (less 2nd section)
CA Myoko (Myoko)
CA Haguro (Myoko)
BatDiv 3 (less 2nd section) --
BB Kongo (Kongo)
BB Hiei (Kongo)
Screen (DesRon 4) -- RADM Shoji Nishimura
CL Yura (flagship, Nagara)
DesDiv 2 -- 4 DDs
DesDiv 9 -- 3 DDs
Carrier Group Zuiho (CVL) -- 12 Zero fighters, 12 torpedo bombers; 1 DD
Supply Group -- 4 oilers, 1 repair ship
Close Support Group -- VADM Takeo Kurita
CruDiv 7
CA Kumano (flagship, Mogami)
CA Suzuya (Mogami)
CA Mikuma (Mogami) (Sunk)
CA Mogami (Mogami)
DesDiv 8 -- 2 DDs 1 oiler
Transport Group -- RADM Raizo Tanaka
12 transports carrying troops
3 patrol boats carrying troops
1 oiler
Escort (DesRon 2) -- RADM Tanaka
CL Jintsu (flagship, Jintsu)
DesDiv 15 -- 2 DDs
DesDiv 16 -- 4 DDs
DesDiv 18 -- 4 DDs
Seaplane Tender Group -- RADM Riutaro Fujita
Seaplane Tender Div 11
Chitose (CVS) -- 16 fighter seaplanes, 4 scout planes
Kamikawa Maru (AV) -- 8 fighter seaplanes, 4 scout planes
1 DD;
1 patrol boat carrying troops
Minesweeper Group
4 minesweepers
3 submarine chasers
1 supply ship
2 cargo ships
NORTHERN (Aleutians) FORCE (5th Fleet) -- VADM Moshiro Hosogaya
Northern Force Main Body
CA Nachi (flagship, Myoko)
Screen --
2 DDs
Supply Group --
2 oilers, 3 cargo ships
Second Carrier Striking Force -- RADM Kakuji Kakuta
Carrier Group (CarDiv 4)
CVL Ryujo (flagship, Ryujo) -- 16 Zero fighters, 21 torpedo bombers
CV Junyo (Junyo) -- 24 Zero fighters, 21 torpedo bombers
Support Group (2nd section, CruDiv 4) --
CA Maya (Takao)
CA Takao (Takao)
Screen (DesDiv 7) --
3 DDs
1 oiler
Attu Invasion Force -- RADM Sentaro Omori
CL Abukuma (flagship, Nagara)
DesDiv 21 --
4 DDs
1 minelayer
1 transport carrying troops
Kiska Invasion Force -- Capt. Takeji Ono
CruDiv 21 --
CL Kiso ()
CL Tama ()
AMC Asaka Maru (auxiliary cruiser)
Screen (DesDiv 6) --
3 DDs
2 transports carrying troops
Minesweeper Div. 13 --
3 minesweepers
Submarine Detachment -- RADM Shigeaki Yamazaki
SubRon 1 -- I-9 (flagship)
SubDiv 2 -- 3 submarines
SubDiv 4 -- 2 submarines
ADVANCE (Submarine) FORCE (6th Fleet) -- VADM Teruhisa Komatsu
CL Katori (flagship, Katori) at Kwajalein
SubRon 3 -- RADM Chimaki Kono
Rio de Janeiro Maru (submarine tender, flagship) at Kwajalein
SubDiv 19 -- 4 submarines
SubDiv 30 -- 3 submarines
SubDiv 13 -- 3 submarines
SHORE BASED AIR PATROL (11th Air Fleet) -- VADM Nishizo Tsukahara
Midway Expeditionary Force -- Capt. Chisato Morita 36 Zero fighters (aboard Nagumo's carriers) 10 land-based bombers at Wake; 6 flying boats at Jaluit
24th Air Flotilla -- RADM Minoru Maeda at Kwajalein
Chitose Air Group -- 36 Zero fighters, 36 torpedo bombers at Kwajalein
1st Air Group -- 36 Zero fighters, 36 torpedo bombers at Aur and Wotje
14th Air Group -- 18 flying boats at Jaluit and Wotje
OCKLAWAHA
I just don't understand this. What is wrong with calling the ship from which Nelson commanded the battle his flagship? Did you even check the references? The term flagship has nothing to do with its size -- it could be a pt boat if the admiral commanding chose to base his command there.
Good Point macbeth25, If you'll notice in my illustration, Nagumo the commander of the Carrier Strike Force could have put his flag on any ship of the fleet, but he put it on a destroyer which in most navies is one of the smaller fighting vessels. So your right, he COULD HAVE put it on a PT boat if he wanted to...
Hum? Did the IJN have PT Boats? They did have anti-submarine helicopters (which we knew NOTHING about) and pulled off a sinking of one of our subs. The story is garbled as nobody knew how to report this "Thing" that sunk the submarine. TRUTH!
OCKLAWAHA
They probably didn't call them "pt boats," but I'll bet they had and still do have vessels of similar size and function. BTW, I'm sure you know the story of PT-109. Here's a bit more about pt boats: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PT_boat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PT_boat).
Here's a website which describes how Admiral Yamamoto died. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Vengeance (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Vengeance) He was shot down by Army P-38G Lightning fighters on April 18, 1943, during the Solomon Islands campaign in the Pacific Theater of World War II. Information concerning Yamamoto's route and when he would be vulnerable had been gained through "Magic," the decoding of Japanese Imperial Codes. At the time, pilots were told that a "coastwatcher" had spotted Yamamoto's aircraft, something which was done to avoid compromising Magic. When his body was found, the admiral was clutching his katana or Samarai Sword and looked as though he were deep in thought.
To make the kill, the Lightnings had to travel a total of nearly 900 miles, far beyond their normal maximum range. While I haven't been able to confirm his involvement with the Admiral's being shot down, I do know that Lindberg, who had been a colonel in the Army Air Corps prior to World War II, shot down a Japanese fighter while flying as a civilian. He also taught pilots how to extend the range of their aircraft based on his historic Atlantic flight. If you're interested, what happened to Admiral Yamamoto is quite a story.
QuoteThey probably didn't call them "pt boats," but I'll bet they had and still do have vessels of similar size and function. BTW, I'm sure you know the story of PT-109. Here's a bit more about pt boats: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PT_boat.
Jacksonville was one of the three primary builders of the PT boat... Huckins Yacht in Ortega...
US Navy PTs were predominately built by Elco Navy Division of Electric Boat Company, Bayonne, New Jersey, Higgins Industries in New Orleans and Huckins Yacht Corp in Jacksonville, Florida.
http://www.ptboats.org/20-12-05-trivia-001.html
http://www.huckinsyacht.com/
Now that's interesting. I wasn't aware of Jacksonville's involvement. Do they have a museum or anything?
No. Jacksonville likes to demolish it's history rather than boast and profit from it.
There is a museum in Louisiana to both PT (Higgins) Boats and landing craft which were also built in all these places.
Jacksonville was also where a large number of Liberty ships were built. One of the shipyards that built them is the site where the Church of the Assumption and Bishop Kenny High School are now. The ships were built here, would pick up military cargo a port on the east coast, gather with other ships and escorts in Halifax, Nova Scotia and then convoy across the Atlantic to England. We were just about the southernmost point on this process.
Jacksonville was a major shipbuilding center for nearly a century. Museum about that heritage? One small space put together by volunteers. Pitiful!
Those convoys across the Atlantic could be awfully dangerous. Many ships didn't survive the trip. The Winds of War , starring Robert Mitchum, is one of the movies which gives a fairly accurate description of what they faced. Another movie, also based upon fact, is Proud .
This is the story of the crew of the USS Mason , quite possibly the only American warship in WWII which was manned (except for its officers and petty officers) entirely by Black sailors.
As she did in getting the Tuskegee Airmen into the air, Eleanor Roosevelt may have played a part in getting the Mason to sea in time for combat.
This was an escort ship; I think either a destroyer (DD) or a destroyer escort (DDE). Among their many exploits was one in which the Mason’s deck was actually cracked by a “storm of the century,†and they welded it back together. I can’t remember if that came from the movie or from the book, but the story is based on fact and, I think, very well done.
President Clinton had something to do with the crew’s finally being presented a citation. That’s how long it took for them to receive the recognition they deserved.
Jacksonville also turned out some 100 +/- regular warships, transports, tankers etc... The old buildings sat along the "Shipyards Property." They were shaped like massive concrete stairs, with the lower stair closer to the river.
When I toured them I was with Eric Smith and Mildred Andru, we found HUGE museum like bunker buildings, with giant marine railroad tracks riding the roofs all the way into the river. The whole affair would easily have fit most any WWII ship this side of a BB, or CV.
Eric and Mildred wanted to rattle the cage and get the city to preserve one of the buildings for a hair brained idea that WE could actually have a maritime museum. So much for dreaming in Jacksonville.
OCKLAWAHA
goes back to my comment above
Rommel
brillant tacktitioner.
Yes, he was. However, he was tricked by British magicians at least once. On being told that there was no possibility the British could attack for about a month, Rommel returned to Germany, but on October 23, 1942, Operation Lightfoot unleashed about 150,000 men, a thousand guns and a thousand tanks in an attack which turned out to be a complete surprise. Upon his hurried return, Rommel found his army in complete flight and disarray. See Deceptions of World War II, William B. Breur, Castle Books, 2001, pages 143-149 for details. If readers want, I'll tell more about it here.
Keep in mind he was DRASTICALLY limited by Hitler and his insaned orders. Under a leadership that was you know not crazy, and with other leadership not so scared to make a move or pass information without consulting higher authorty first I question if he would have fallen for it.
Alot of his failure was his leadership. If you cant get your own scouting information without asking the leader your doomed to lose one or two fights. The fact alone that he did so well under such limitations is amazing to me
(http://snyderstreasures.com/images/germanmilitaria/insignia/AfrikaKorpsM43PatchF.jpg)
Erwin Rommel studied Nathan Bedford Forrest, CSA, and Patton studied John S. Mosby, CSA. Patton came from a long line of soldiers, including General Hugh Mercer of the American Revolution. His grandfather, Col. George S. Patton was killed during the Battle of Winchester VA. Col Patton was promoted to Brigadier General by the Confederate Congress, but, at the time, had already died of battle wounds, so that the promotion was never official. A great-uncle, Waller T. Patton, died of wounds received in Pickett's Charge during the Battle of Gettysburg. Two other great-uncles, John M. Patton and Isaac Patton, served as colonels in the Confederate States Army. A great uncle was CS Navy officer William T. Glassell. Another relative, Hugh Weedon Mercer, was a Confederate general.
Rommel was never susposed to create a blitz campaign across North Afrika, time and again he was called on the carpet for moving when Hitler had told him to HOLD. He was even sacked of command at least once for the same problem. He had the genius for winning battles that were never susposed to happen. The whole Afrika Korps plan was simply to open another front to occupy the enemy so pressure would be less on the German armys in Russia. Rommel made sure the plan was not followed and with allied attacks on his fuel supply, his army was doomed.
OCKLAWAHA
One impression I've always had of Patton was that if he died during the war he wanted to be killed by the last bullet fired in the last battle. I can only imagine how frustrating it must have been to die as a result of what may have been an automobile accident. I've sometimes wondered if the event were an accident or someone assassinated him. I think it took several days for him to actually die but I might have gotten that impression from the movie Patton. This Wikipedia article has some interesting points: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_S._Patton (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_S._Patton)
Charlie Chaplan: He and his evil Nazi regime enslaved Europe and tried to take over the world.
definitely Hamilcar Barca, what a badass and the father of Hannibal, who couldn't love that guy!