What killing the Mobility Fee Moratorium means for you
(http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/photos/2101301672_tpFqrKk-M.jpg)
This upcoming Tuesday, October 9th, the Jacksonville City Council will consider a bill to extend the mobility fee moratorium. Enacted a year ago by a desperate council who viewed it as Jacksonville's stimulus package, the moratorium basically places the long term tax burden on Jacksonville residents in hopes of spurring development that would be exempt from covering it's negative financial and quality-of-life impacts on the surrounding community. The job creation and development that was to be stimulated by the moratorium failed to deliver. If allowed to rightfully die, here is a list of potential projects the mobility plan and fee can bring to each neighborhood and area of Jacksonville.
Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2012-oct-what-killing-the-mobility-fee-moratorium-means-for-you-
great article Ennis....provides all the data people need to know about what the mobility plan means for their area of town
Thanks Lake for doing this.
This is a great article because it shows that every area of town will benefit from a fully funded Mobility Plan. I've seen and listened to many people who focus solely on what will be happening in the downtown and surrounding metro areas of Riverside Avondale, Springfield and San Marco.
Well, guess what, every part of town had a vision for their neighborhoods. To fulfill those visions, we must find the money and the one logical place is the Mobility fee. People come to Jacksonville to stay because it is a great way of life - not a city where cheapness replaces vibrancy. Jobs don't happen because someone builds a big box building more cheaply here than in other counties. Jobs don't happen when we have no sidewalks, safe roads for cars and bikes and better transit. Jobs certainly don't happen when Jacksonville continues its image as the nation's most unsafe unattractive place to walk or ride a bicycle.
So wake up Council people! Jacksonville residents expect better of you than continuing down the same old high speed highway by-passing the Late Great City of Jacksonville.
Do they really expect better though? I know we do, but I'd wager the majority of people here are just fine with the way things are, don't know any better, and probably don't even know that there is such a thing as a mobility fee/plan.
^The majority of people just don't know about it. Once they do, they think it is a great plan for Jacksonville. It is a matter of education.
^Agreed. Unfortunately there's not a lot of time left for that.
Here's my question: the job creation and development that was hoped for hasn't happened. So why do they think extending the moratorium will lead to MORE job creation and development? Or are they scared that businesses will be driven away by having to actually pay the mobility fee?
Perfect. Well done! I feel it is time for me to email blast council again!
Quote from: Bativac on October 05, 2012, 10:47:15 AM
Here's my question: the job creation and development that was hoped for hasn't happened. So why do they think extending the moratorium will lead to MORE job creation and development? Or are they scared that businesses will be driven away by having to actually pay the mobility fee?
Check the campaign contributions
Quote from: copperfiend on October 05, 2012, 10:56:45 AM
Quote from: Bativac on October 05, 2012, 10:47:15 AM
Here's my question: the job creation and development that was hoped for hasn't happened. So why do they think extending the moratorium will lead to MORE job creation and development? Or are they scared that businesses will be driven away by having to actually pay the mobility fee?
Check the campaign contributions
That & they're scared of ending the unsustainable growth methods that have plagued this city (and country) for decades now. What they don't realize is that it will end either way.
Great article, just e-mailed mr love and a few others.
Quote from: Bativac on October 05, 2012, 10:47:15 AM
Here's my question: the job creation and development that was hoped for hasn't happened. So why do they think extending the moratorium will lead to MORE job creation and development? Or are they scared that businesses will be driven away by having to actually pay the mobility fee?
The majority of municipalities across the country charge impact fees to cover the costs of new development on public infrastructure. When you don't, you're basically saying you want the Bativacs, Lakelanders, and Copperfields of Jacksonville to reach in their pockets to subsidize the developer because he's too poor to pay his own way. In reality, when an LA Fitness or 7-11 comes to town, if there is a market for their product, they're coming and an impact fee is just part of doing business.
Also, the mobility fee replaced the old concurrency system, which has been around for decades. It isn't something extra that developers have to pay. The fee, itself, is a significant reduction when compared to the old concurrency system. In addition, the fee's structure provides credit adjustments that reduces the fee for smart fiscally sound development. For example, if you decided to revamp or construct on an existing shopping center site, you could easily end up not having to pay anything as opposed to building a new retail strip mall, next door to an existing half vacant one.
As for driving people away, St. Johns County charges $11k per new house. They are currently using their money generated to construct additional schools, which in turn, will pull more residents and economic development their way. This is proven by the fact that they continue to outgrow us, Clay and Nassau combined, despite still charging a fee.
Legislation has been introduced to City Council to extend the moratorium on the Mobility Fee. Second hand report says it was introduced by Doyle Carter.
One thing that seems better about the Mobility Fee than the old Concurrency System is a one-size-fits-all means. Before, if I were a developer I'd look for new places to develop to avoid the fee, which was like TIF in reverse (i.e. fee increases for each new development on single road or in one area just as available TIF decreases with each new development in boundary). There was less reason to build infill on existing infrastructure as the fee was increased.
Now it doesn't matter where you build, you're going to pay a fee, so now it actually makes sense to build in areas with existing and sufficient infrastructure near complementing uses, rather than creating new Race Track Rds everywhere. Hope the moratorium sunsets.
There are cases where you won't pay a fee. For example, if you redeveloped or replaced an existing blighted shopping center, such as Arlington's Town & Country Shopping Center, you'd get credit for the trips the previous development already had approval for. Depending on what you put in its replacement, you'd end up not paying anything or a significantly lower fee than building on a never developed site. This credit adjustment system is intended to level the playing field and help drive market rate redevelopment opportunities to areas of town where a significant investment in public infrastructure has already been made.
I think the fear of existing developers in Jax is that they have no development experience other than finding "undiscovered" or "off-market" pine forest and developing/selling SFR lots and new spec strip/neighborhood centers to serve those new communities (or suburban garden apartments in Vestcor's case). This, of course, goes on in every city, but usually these aren't the developers that hold sway with the central city council and usually aren't familiar to most of the public in central cities. I guess in Jacksonville's case since there is no infill happening and hundreds of square miles of developable pine land left the influence is had by a different breed of developer.
I think Hallmark is really the only deal in town that has done basically everything at this point, from infill office (Everbank) to infill apts (220 Riverside I think) to industrial to garden apts to suburban office, limited-service hotel, institutional, etc. What are leaders there saying about the moratorium?
Website seems to be UC right now, but here it is:
http://www.hallmarkpartners.com/
QuoteI agree with many of your points except number 3 which I know first hand is not true. There has been development because of the moratorium. If you are going to be credible I would suggest you verify your claims. I do agree though that we need to look hard at not extending. The purpose was short term and I think it has seen its usefulness.
Sincerely,
Bill Gulliford
Gulliford back to me. My 3rd point in my list was to point out the LA Fitness we've all talked about. I said they were coming to Jacksonville regardless of the moratorium, citing their current corporate strategy and existing developments around the state.
I'm not sure I fully understand his last sentence, but it sounds like the moratorium has more sympathizers than we think.
Quote from: simms3 on October 05, 2012, 01:07:09 PM
What are leaders there saying about the moratorium?
I was actually coming to post about this. Does anyone know where Mayor Brown stands on the matter and whether or not he intends to get involved?
Really great piece Ennis. Hopefully that information is able to rally the unusual suspects (those not in the urban core).
To the Lakelander's last post, in SJC those redevelopment credits are often given out to reduce or eliminate impact fees on projects, despite not being nearly as built out as Jax. Given our plethora of HORRENDOUS and outdated strip shopping centers all over town, the Mobility Fee may be the only way to encourage redevelopment of those areas (Beach Blvd, Regency, Westside, etc). Otherwise, Jacksonville may be strongly in the running for America's ugliest large city in 10-20 years.
Bridges - Gulliford also reached back out to me. I think it's impressive when CC members respond to voter emails.
CityLife - was referring moreso to the leaders/partners at Hallmark Partners, which I would consider to be a reputable, experienced Jacksonville-based development firm. Of course I would also love to hear a firm opinion from Mayor Brown, as well, but have come to expect no leadership from him in any arena.
Is Gulliford claiming that LA Fitness would have never come to Jax without the moratorium in place? LA Fitness signed an agreement with Sleiman to be their local master developer before discussion about the original moratorium started. Also, at least two of their selected locations would not have had to pay a fee anyway because they are either in an existing center (University Blvd) or in an existing center in another city (Atlantic Beach). We ended up subsidizing the construction of a new location in a Sleiman development. If we didn't, it probably would have ended up redeveloping a space in another existing center, if the fee were truly a problem.
The very real fact is that LA Fitness signed a master development agreement before the moratorium (a concurrency fee was calculated on that LA Fitness project at Atlantic and Kernan before the Mobility Plan went into place).
Additionally, the cost associated with that project went down DRAMATICALLY under the Mobility Plan. Under the old fair share program, the developer would have had to pay $993,448 in concurrency payments. Under Mobility, the developer would have had to pay $247,448 in mobility fees... a reduction of 75%.
That same developer has a multi-family project that applied for a Mobility Fee calc, but that has since expired and is merely trying to extend the moratorium to save money on that project along with two gas stations.
Quote from: simms3 on October 05, 2012, 02:37:28 PM
CityLife - was referring moreso to the leaders/partners at Hallmark Partners, which I would consider to be a reputable, experienced Jacksonville-based development firm. Of course I would also love to hear a firm opinion from Mayor Brown, as well, but have come to expect no leadership from him in any arena.
Sorry, I was skimming your post, but that is an excellent point about Hallmark. Perhaps you can shoot them an email or a phone call? As someone who is in the game, you should have an in there. And sadly, you are probably right about Brown.
I plan to make a call to an out of town development firm who has a stake in the Mobility Fee debate and hope to have something concrete before the hearing.
QuoteI think Hallmark is really the only deal in town that has done basically everything at this point
There are in fact several others.
Interesting article in the Business Journal today about the building boom going on in St Johns County, the permits pulled there outpace Duval for home building and guess what they did not completely suspend or do away with their impact fees or fair share assessments. They did reduce them, i believe.
The impact fee in St Johns County is $11,000 per single family home.
If an impact fee hurts growth in Duval County, why are building permits in St Johns County still outpacing Duval?
Quote from: fieldafm on October 05, 2012, 03:13:35 PM
QuoteI think Hallmark is really the only deal in town that has done basically everything at this point
There are in fact several others.
Who?
Quote from: fsujax on October 05, 2012, 04:18:02 PM
Interesting article in the Business Journal today about the building boom going on in St Johns County, the permits pulled there outpace Duval for home building and guess what they did not completely suspend or do away with their impact fees or fair share assessments. They did reduce them, i believe.
We reduced ours between 50-75% by replacing concurrency/fair share with mobility fees. Then we decided not to collect anything at all.
Quote from: thelakelander on October 05, 2012, 02:46:13 PM
Is Gulliford claiming that LA Fitness would have never come to Jax without the moratorium in place?
I think it just shows the kind of misinformation out there. Especially when a developer(s) has a direct line to the council and mayor's ear.
Quote from: fsujax on October 05, 2012, 04:18:02 PM
Interesting article in the Business Journal today about the building boom going on in St Johns County, the permits pulled there outpace Duval for home building and guess what they did not completely suspend or do away with their impact fees or fair share assessments. They did reduce them, i believe.
They actually just increased them this fiscal year, which started October 1st. At least for commercial projects. I'll check on residential Monday.
SJC did in fact raise their impact fees. Commercial fees used to be $4,218 per 1,000 sq ft. Now it is $4,333 per 1,000 square feet. Residential used to be $11,000 something (don't have it at home) and they are now $12,114 per home.
Thanks for the update CityLife. It just goes to show developers will build with these fees in place if they really want to be there. This needs to be pointed out to City Council.
The fact that St Johns is getting around $12,000 per house and is leading the housing recovery is about as compelling evidence as I can find proving that fees have nothing to do with quantity of permits. They have everything to do with quality of living.
And lest anyone think that we should try to compete with St Johns by being cheaper, I ask - how is that working so far? Can we go any lower?
We charge nothing and they are pulling away. Check out the gap in 3rd quarter of 2011 and look at it now.
(http://i49.tinypic.com/2me8f1w.jpg)
Doug we have to make the case to the Council. Great graph.
Quote from: Bridges on October 05, 2012, 02:04:09 PM
QuoteI agree with many of your points except number 3 which I know first hand is not true. There has been development because of the moratorium. If you are going to be credible I would suggest you verify your claims. I do agree though that we need to look hard at not extending. The purpose was short term and I think it has seen its usefulness.
Sincerely,
Bill Gulliford
Gulliford back to me. My 3rd point in my list was to point out the LA Fitness we've all talked about. I said they were coming to Jacksonville regardless of the moratorium, citing their current corporate strategy and existing developments around the state.
I'm not sure I fully understand his last sentence, but it sounds like the moratorium has more sympathizers than we think.
Here is the best response I have for the LA Fitness question:
LA Fitness announces pre-moratorium that they are coming to Jacksonville. They are excited and so are we. From all accounts they are a good company, provide a quality product and will create jobs.
They have four sites under construction now. Only one shows up on the Mobility Fee moratorium list. Why? The other three went into abandoned big box locations at existing shopping centers. Those centers had existing trips associated with them and would have paid no Mobility Fee had the moratorium not been in effect. This aspect is, IMO, even more valuable than the money collected from the fee. We could finally begin to utilize existing assets and clean up some of the blight.
I can't argue that the 4th location (Atlantic & Kernan) may not have built at that site without a Mobility Fee moratorium. However, I feel pretty certain that the only one getting the benefit here was the developer. Within about 2 miles of that location, there are at least half a dozen underutilized big box centers between Southside and 9A (basically Regency). What would have happened, is LA Fitness would have said, either you pay the fee, or we are going somewhere where there is no fee (which would have been a mile or so away).
Quote from: fsujax on October 05, 2012, 07:18:58 PM
Doug we have to make the case to the Council. Great graph.
I have had a several meetings in the past 2 weeks with council members and will have more next week. If anyone wants to set up a meeting with their district council representative, and would like me to come along, please send me a PM. We'll try to coordinate schedules.
Quote from: dougskiles on October 05, 2012, 07:29:50 PM
I can't argue that the 4th location (Atlantic & Kernan) may not have built at that site without a Mobility Fee moratorium. However, I feel pretty certain that the only one getting the benefit here was the developer. Within about 2 miles of that location, there are at least half a dozen underutilized big box centers between Southside and 9A (basically Regency). What would have happened, is LA Fitness would have said, either you pay the fee, or we are going somewhere where there is no fee (which would have been a mile or so away).
Yes. Exactly. And to add, perhaps there isn't really a strong enough market for 4 new LA Fitness locations (though they do rely on having many locations as part of the membership package), but the developer was able to make it work for them cost-wise without the fee, signaling potential oversupply (so LA Fitness can cram 4 new centers in one area and a developer gets fees and/or cash flow, and "everybody" wins" except for the city of course).
Besides SJC, every developer's dream is to be able to participate in Manhattan, Boston, DC or SF. These make the cost of developing in SJC in terms of fees and taxes look like building for free for practice. It's not about the cost to do business, it's about having the market and means for your development. If Jax finds a way to attract every Harvard grad and those who serve them, and every company wants to be in Jax as a result, and there is 0% unemployment...you could charge every developer a million dollars just to wait in line to develop in the city and they would still flock.