JTA Skyway to Remain Fare-Free for Another Year
(http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/photos/1919854982_j8CKTvM-M.jpg)
During last year's mayoral race, Metro Jacksonville offered five affordable solutions that we believed would dramatically increase the JTA Skyway's ridership. Today, we are happy to report that one of those recommendations, which involved making the skyway fare free, has led to a 62% increase ridership.
Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2012-aug-jta-skyway-to-remain-fare-free-for-another-year
I'm happy to see that the skyway will remain free for another year. Just from my observations, it seem that eliminating the fare has caused an increased ridership. Keeping it fare free will hopefully continue that trend. Of the options presented above, the most attractive are three, four, and five. Allowing vendors and advertisers, though it my seem like a sell out, will make the stations seem more inviting. I'm sad to see that for events downtown that the skyway is only rarely used. I would like to see Artwalk utilized some of the station. Maybe so installations or musicians. It needs something new to liven it up.
Im surprised the Jaguars havent considered the wrap advertising yet.
Maybe the skyway and the food truck ideas could be combined?
Great idea gedo3. There could be one or two trucks at each stop, thus encouraging using the skyway to get to the food trucks.
Now we need to get them to run it at night and on the weekends.
During the superbowl, there were several that wanted to do advertising/wraping, but JTA or somebody said it would look offensive. Not sure why it was OK for the buses, but not on the skyway.
This is a positive move. Let's keep this momentum going!! Next step, allow the mobility fee moratorium to sunset.
Yes great news indeed. And Doug I totally agree. I remember I took the skyway over from San Marco one night during art walk. It was only 9 when I went to take it back and it was closed. It was kind of funny because art walk was still in swing. The experience was pretty crappy.
Quote from: dougskiles on August 31, 2012, 07:48:57 AM
Now we need to get them to run it at night and on the weekends.
Yes! A thousand times yes!!!
I'm having a pub crawl idea....
I am against the idea of plastering every square inch of space with advertising (see Sao Paolo and it's ban on outdoor advertising!!) but I can't help to see that large chunk of concrete under the Hemming Plaza sign (last photo) used as a 3'x12' banner ad space.
I live in New York and spaces like Times Square CAN BE and ARE interesting because of the dynamic energy the onslaught of moving ads/people/vehicles.. (See Rem Koolhaas's 'Delirious New York')
If it means increased ridership and free fares then I'm all for it (I would draw the line at cover-wrapping the whole train in adverts though- some things should remain pristine and origional!)
Renting the lower skyway plaza areas to Food Trucks parked at the base is an excellent idea the JTA should pursue b/c they wouldn't be in competition with Brick and Mortar businesses and pull people into space, then invite them to explore via the Skyway..
^^leasing space to vendors is in the works.
I ride the skyway alot now, and most of the time it's pretty busy. I'm thinking of hanging out and collecting signatures for a petition for them to finish the skyway as it was intended. How would I go about organizing a petition drive?
And JTA might like this idea; When the skyway actually goes to the Sports Complex, Shands, Five Points, maybe even the beaches, they can start charging again. People will pay a fare if it goes somewhere.
Perhaps they can get Federal grant money again to expand.
As a downtown resident I have used the Skyway for years, several times a week.
Now that it is free I have seen a great uptick in the number of riders.
However, I have noticed something different. In many trips that I have been on recently between Hemming Plaza and Rosa Parks there has been standing room only. During this trip, the Skyway car seems to tilt more than I remember it in doing in the past when there were less riders. In some cases, the tilt during the turn has become so severe that I actually became uneasy.
I am sure that JTA is monitoring on their cameras and would not allow them to travel with unsafe capacity, but I do feel I have a keen perception of things like this based on years of use, and I do notice a dramatic difference in turns when the car is at 'max capacity'.
Just adding my thoughts. Glad it's going to keep being free. It helps a lot of people. I'd keep using it, free or pay.
Wow, JTA finally has an original idea... and it's ours!
Quote from: BigGuy219 on August 31, 2012, 03:18:47 PM
However, I have noticed something different. In many trips that I have been on recently between Hemming Plaza and Rosa Parks there has been standing room only. During this trip, the Skyway car seems to tilt more than I remember it in doing in the past when there were less riders. In some cases, the tilt during the turn has become so severe that I actually became uneasy.
Might want to tell the people standing to lay on the ground instead...keep that center of gravity low :P
Quote from: Ocklawaha on August 31, 2012, 03:52:55 PM
Wow, JTA finally has an original idea... and it's ours!
Sorry to burst your bubble there Ock - but I heard Michael Blaylock talked about his desire to make the Skyway free long before there was a MJ. I think that that often times (and especially in local/state government) - politics gets in the way of a good idea. Just glad this free thing is working out as well as it is. I've always considered the Skyway a vastly underappreciated resource in Jacksonville.
If I recall, making the skyway fare free was included as a "project" in the Downtown TCEA. However, it was never acted on. It probably still wouldn't be free if the old fare collection equipment was working properly.
WJXT was taking credit for the free fare, due to their investigation of fare evaders.
WJXT never took the position that going free fare and terminating bus routes into it would significantly increase ridership without raising costs. In the last six years, I've only seen that position openly promoted here. WJXT's stuff was focused on people jumping the turnstiles.
Well I hate to be the 800 pound gorilla in the room, but um, I believe I might have a newspaper clipping from around 1990-95 where that suggestion was made. Though the concept might not have been so pure, something about FREE transfers if I recall.
Ever wonder why tollroads have lower auto trips in general than freeways? There is no gorilla in the room. It should be common sense that going fare free and reducing parallel bus routes would lead to an increase in ridership. What's being discussed on this site isn't anything groundbreaking, if one takes a detailed look at these things outside of Duval County.
Exactly, it ain't rocket science. I've been pestering them about transfers for just a year shy of how long I've been hollering about streetcars. George Harmon did a story on this and the 'subscription bus' concept too. I think the idea of 'fare free' and 'free transfers' might have been confusing for some. The idea of a standard 2 hour bus ticket, usable on SKYWAY, BUS, MAX BUS, WATER TAXI, STREETCARS, COMMUTER RAIL AND POGO STICKS, is perhaps the easiest form of increasing both ridership and revenue.
QuoteThe Jacksonville Transportation Authority Board of Directors has approved a staff recommendation to continue the Skyway as a fare-free mode of transportation. The Skyway has been fare-free since Jan. 30, and will remain so for at least the next fiscal year, which ends Sept. 30, 2013.
JTA’s latest report on the progress of the Skyway details the impact that the fare elimination has had on ridership. In the six-month period analyzed (February-July), Skyway ridership grew by 62.7 percent or 480,956 boardings, compared to 295,602 boardings for the same period in 2011.
The report also found that the fare-free Skyway has supported JTA’s transit redesign efforts, including the elimination of the Beaver and Bay Street trolleys, the truncation of bus routes into Skyway stations and the linking of additional bus routes to Skyway stations.
Free is great and it really builds downtown transit use over time, but you have to have the will to maintain it.
Seattle Metro implemented a "free transit zone" in downtown since 1973, but unfortunately due to some significant costs of restructuring the area mass transit, they are eliminating the "free zone" this month.
(http://seattletimes.com/ABPub/2012/09/13/2019149961.jpg)
Interesting that it only costs Seattle Metro $400k annual to maintain that subsidy, which is economical considering the number of buses that they run downtown.
The report is here:
http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2019150572_ridefree14m.html (http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2019150572_ridefree14m.html)
One thing going for us is to get rid of free, we'd have to invest big money up front in purchasing a new fare collection system. The cost spent in doing that may not be worth the resulting drop in ridership at this point.
Now that we've proved the damn thing will carry hoards of transfer passengers if it was operated right as a downtown transfer/circulator, its time to finish this little railroad.
1. Get that stadium line done.
2. Head to Atlantic, west of the tracks in San Marco.
3. Brooklyn is about to bloom, SERVE IT.
4. That new VA clinic, the Public Health Department and Shand's would spell success for a northward line.
5. The farmers market expansion and the ability to leap over the railroad yards would make Woodstock Park a extension worthy of study.
The work that lies ahead will be in the funding. There are two viable sources that I see:
1) Mobility Fee (if we ever start collecting it)
2) Value capture from the land development that occurs around the stations (in TIF districts) - which I am working to setup for the San Marco extension. If successful, it could be the model for the other extensions.
^I agree with these potential revenue streams. The concept of the mobility fee helps generate funds for long term capital improvement projects, plus redevelopment and infill around major transit corridors. The concept of TOD on JTA owned properties and in TIF districts helps generate additional funds for annual maintenance. I sat in a presentation a few weeks back where transit officials in Miami discussed how TOD around Metrorail's stations generates millions annually (and more built in riders) to help maintain transit operations.
Quote from: Ocklawaha on September 24, 2012, 11:19:31 PM
Now that we've proved the damn thing will carry hoards of transfer passengers if it was operated right as a downtown transfer/circulator, its time to finish this little railroad.
1. Get that stadium line done.
2. Head to Atlantic, west of the tracks in San Marco.
3. Brooklyn is about to bloom, SERVE IT.
4. That new VA clinic, the Public Health Department and Shand's would spell success for a northward line.
5. The farmers market expansion and the ability to leap over the railroad yards would make Woodstock Park a extension worthy of study.
Ock...you do realize you won't get a massive skyway expansion and streetcar...so which do you prefer?
Quote from: dougskiles on September 25, 2012, 06:55:30 AM
The work that lies ahead will be in the funding. There are two viable sources that I see:
1) Mobility Fee (if we ever start collecting it)
2) Value capture from the land development that occurs around the stations (in TIF districts) - which I am working to setup for the San Marco extension. If successful, it could be the model for the other extensions.
_________________________________________
I think a quick thank you for your part in "2)" is in order. Much appreciated.
Quote from: stephendare on September 25, 2012, 09:43:03 AM
Quote from: tufsu1 on September 25, 2012, 09:39:00 AM
Quote from: Ocklawaha on September 24, 2012, 11:19:31 PM
Now that we've proved the damn thing will carry hoards of transfer passengers if it was operated right as a downtown transfer/circulator, its time to finish this little railroad.
1. Get that stadium line done.
2. Head to Atlantic, west of the tracks in San Marco.
3. Brooklyn is about to bloom, SERVE IT.
4. That new VA clinic, the Public Health Department and Shand's would spell success for a northward line.
5. The farmers market expansion and the ability to leap over the railroad yards would make Woodstock Park a extension worthy of study.
Ock...you do realize you won't get a massive skyway expansion and streetcar...so which do you prefer?
Because you are chairing the committee?
Lets not self edit to the point that we are doing the bad guys work for them....
It's because there's not enough money laying around to fund multiple initiatives without overthrowing the entire political system currently in place. Not only locally, but at the state and federal levels as well. That's the simple reality of the world we live in today.
Realistically speaking, the one true local funding source we have for any type of fixed transit is the mobility plan/fee, which generates cash for a streetcar....and it has a moratorium on it.
That's not to say things can't change but they won't overnight and implementation will happen incrementally. That's a reality all of transit advocates should understand as we push for improvement of Jacksonville's mobility options. We will have to prioritize projects and get a successful one or two off the ground to enable change for more wholesale improvement.
Visioning online and implementing are two totally different things. No one is stopping Ock from dreaming. He's had concepts for decades but now we have to chance to make one reality through strategic planning and implementation.
The reality is to push something through, you do have to take the proper steps to move it forward. That's not just here in Jax. That's anywhere. We've visioned for over 40 years. A plan is already out there, now lets see some of it through. That's where the dreaming stops and working within the confines of the actual environment begins.
It's why we've been successful in finding a way to take the transit discussion from complaining online and at public meetings to getting actual projects added to JTA's long range plans, the TPO's LRTP (which qualifies them for federal funding) and becoming a part of the mobility plan, which provides a local way to fund them.
You still have to find away to implement. That's my basic point. What good is a dream is all it does is remain in your head? We've either dreamed or complained for 40 years while others have continued to implement things that have been a detriment to the community and taxpayer. My view is, why not focus and drive something home in the short term that can actually help support and implement your long term dream. So going back to tufsu1's comment, I understand his position on seeing at least an initial streetcar line through before focusing too much attention on something that will probably set you back a decade in getting anything off the drawing board?
You've made it to the world series and you have a chance to round third base and score the winning run. You don't focus on going back to Spring Training and rethinking your overall strategy. Score the freaking run... You can wait to next season to implement some modifications to help your game better so you can win two championships in a row.
The date went great and you've been invited back for a night cap. Don't screw yourself by deciding you need to rethink your strategy. Get in there and break the freaking backboard.
Ok, seriously though, all I'm illustrating is you do prioritize and even when you dream, work to find a way to make the dream reality without compromising the score you already have in hand. In terms of time (which it how tufsu1's post read to me), it won't happen at the same period because of funding limitations and politics (unless you're advocating pushing the implementation of an initial starter back).
Kinda unrelated question, does the skyway operate during the Jaguars game? I'm taking the kids to see Elmo at the Times-Union at 4 and I'm sure that will finish before the Jags game. Do you think I'll be able to catch the skyway back over to the Southbank or count on the water taxi?
I've always found the river taxi to be reliable on game day.
Quote from: Jason on September 25, 2012, 03:08:44 PM
I've always found the river taxi to be reliable on game day.
thanks, will they run that during the game? I'm thinking we will get out of there at 5:30 and will want to go back.
Quote from: fsquid on September 25, 2012, 02:38:35 PM
Kinda unrelated question, does the skyway operate during the Jaguars game? I'm taking the kids to see Elmo at the Times-Union at 4 and I'm sure that will finish before the Jags game. Do you think I'll be able to catch the skyway back over to the Southbank or count on the water taxi?
The Skyway does not typically run on Sunday, except for the occasional special event.