More crime is caused when children and young adults are walking that would have never happened had they been on a bike.
I have never heard of anyone stopping a bicyclist and then dragging them into their car.
Everyone thinks I am being silly but no one ever disputes what I am saying enough to convince me I'm wrong
end the helmet law, it does more harm than good.
You've never been convinced of anything because you suffer from "Not invited here syndrome" which means if it doesn't come from you it's wrong. Irrespective of your mental challenges:
Helmets save lives. Helment are designed to slow down the rate at which the brain slams into the skill. Period.
* There are 85 million bicycle riders in the US.
* 773 bicyclists died on US roads in 2006, down just 11 from the year before. 92% of them died in crashes with motor vehicles (720).
* About 540,000 bicyclists visit emergency rooms with injuries every year. Of those, about 67,000 have head injuries, and 27,000 have injuries serious enough to be hospitalized.
* Bicycle crashes and injuries are under-reported, since the majority are not serious enough for emergency room visits. 44,000 cyclists were reported injured in traffic crashes in 2006.
* 1 in 8 of the cyclists with reported injuries has a brain injury.
* Two-thirds of the deaths here are from traumatic brain injury.
* A very high percentage of cyclists' brain injuries can be prevented by a helmet, estimated at anywhere from 45 to 88 per cent.
* Many years of potential life are lost because about half of the deaths are children under 15 years old.
* Direct costs of cyclists' injuries due to not using helmets are estimated at $81 million each year.
* Indirect costs of cyclists' injuries due to not using helmets are estimated at $2.3 billion each year.
* Helmet use in the US varies by orders of magnitude in different areas and different sectors of our society. White collar commuters probably reach 80 per cent, while inner city kids and rural kids would be 10 per cent or less. Overall, our best wild guess is probably no more than 25 per cent. Sommers Point, NJ, where a state helmet law is in effect, found that only 24 of the 359 students who rode to school in one week of the Winter of 2002 wore helmets (6 per cent) until the School District adopted a helmet rule. North Carolina observed 17 per cent statewide before their law went into effect in 2001.
* Helmets are cheap. The typical discount store price has risen from under $10 to about $20, but there are still models available for under $10 at major retailers.
Let me say I like having the option of not riding with a helmet sometimes...like up to the store to get a beer, or around the block; however, during high traffic hours you'd be crazy not to wear a helmet.
This is from the Florida Bicycle Law. Only those under the age of 16 must wear helmets.
http://www.massbike.org/resources/florida.htm (http://www.massbike.org/resources/florida.htm)
Quote316.2065 Bicycle regulations:
A bicycle rider or passenger who is under 16 years of age must wear a bicycle helmet that is properly fitted and is fastened securely upon the passenger's head by a strap, and that meets the standards of the American National Standards Institute (ANSI Z 90.4 Bicycle Helmet Standards), the standards of the Snell Memorial Foundation (1984 Standard for Protective Headgear for Use in Bicycling), or any other nationally recognized standards for bicycle helmets adopted by the department. As used in this subsection, the term "passenger" includes a child who is riding in a trailer or semitrailer attached to a bicycle.
I ride all the time, my wife rides my kids ride, and unless I am riding at 5 mph or less I never ride without my helmet. I am a competitive cyclist and have had many crashes in my days and fully understand the benefit of keeping my melon safe. It is always easier to wear the helmet than to re-learn your A-B-C's.
I JUST DON'T HAVE TIME NOW, PLEASE FOR NOW LETS JUST SEPARATE KIDS INTO FOUR OR FIVE GROUPS.
one) TO YOUNG TO CARE ABOUT HOW SILLY THEY LOOK.
two) OLD ENOUGH TO CARE ABOUT HOW SILLY THEY LOOK AND NOT RIDING BIKES BECAUSE OF IT.
three)OLD ENOUGH TO CARE ABOUT HOW SILLY THEY LOOK AND RIDING BIKES WITHOUT A HELMET IN SPITE OF IT.
four) COULD ALSO BE MEMBER OF two or three BUT HAVE PARENTS WHO DISAGREE WITH THE LAW AS WELL.
five)any group you wish
GROUP TWO EASILY ACCOUNTS FOR THE LOWERING OF BICYCLE RELATED DEATHS
All these groups don't need the government to step outside of its roll of pursuit of happiness just to screw with them one out of a million times a kid rides a bicycle without a helmet. (because its another law that no one really pays attention to)
If you care about this country, and your childs future role in it then you'd care about protecting them, including buying a helmet making sure they wear it, foster an understanding of obeing laws, and instill in them the value of an education. However, if their brain is incapable of learning because of a childhood trauma to their noddle your' child will not benefire from what this great conuntry has to offer one with better skills and education.
This goes far beyond just riding a bike with a helmet it goes more into caring about this socieity.
ok Rush Limbough wanttobe I CONCEDE seeing as trying to get in a simple discusion with you leads to a "I DON'T CARE ABOUT MY COUNTRY" realization, but you haven't convinced me of anything, except that you could never convince me of anything. (neither does Rush)
flip the dial to1460 and learn how educated people try to talk
Quote from: gatorback on January 27, 2008, 02:14:25 PM
If you care about this country, and your childs future role in it then you'd care about protecting them, including buying a helmet and help them as much as you can to get them educated. If their brain is incapable of learning because of a childhood trauma to their noddle your' child will not beneftire from what this great conuntry has to offer people with better skills and education.
Have fun visiting your child in the mental hospital, taking care of him/or her for the rest of their live because mommy was too dumb to insisit the kid puts on a helmet; or worse going to their futural when a helmet could have prevented the death of your child all along.
Who said that it's mommy....that's too dumb?
my bad. you are right...what was I thinking. Mom's are awesome and certainly nurturing to the point where they want their baby to be safe. I wont go there again for all the awesome moms out there forgive me.
See...a mom just gave you...you know what...(just messing with you)
Anyway, I agree, that children should wear their helmets...us adults are old enough to make those decisions, children aren't.
Quote from: Radio Talk Show Host on January 27, 2008, 02:26:43 PM
ok Rush Limbough wanttobe I CONCEDE seeing as trying to get in a simple discusion with you leads to a "I DON'T CARE ABOUT MY COUNTRY" realization, but you haven't convinced me of anything, except that you could never convince me of anything.
You're right...I'd never convince you of anthing. Since I don't work for the JSO I couldn't; however, If you could get tickets for riding w/out helmets, and I was a JSO agent, I'd issue them. It's the law. Perhaps, a couple of 100 tickets issued to you would change your mind. I see that's how you work now.
PS I've not heard that old Rush Cliché since the days of Sandra Day O'Connor.
GB and JBM are absolutely on the mark. These laws are in place to protect children that otherwise wouldn't be protected. The same reason there are laws in place saying you can't abuse your children. Incidently, the safety belt law, which impacts adults, was also created for this reason. If you're lifeless body is rolling around in a vehicle at 60+ mph with a child strapped in back, the odds that you're going to kill that child are pretty damned good.
I am 100% for the helmet law. I don't think there are kids choosing not to ride their bikes because they "look silly." Those kids are riding around without helmets or they're in front of the tv and don't give a damn about bikes anyway. I have a 12 year old and 8 year old, both ride their bikes with my husband and I. The oldest has been out on the road riding with my husband on the tandem as well as independently and he understands the reasons helmets are worn. If it's not enough to him to be told, he learned plenty about it watching his dad go down at 25 mph head first into the pavement and live to spend another day with him. We kept the helmet and gave it to him to remember how lucky his dad was to walk away. The helmet is cracked completely in half.
Doing away with the law in no way is going to encourage kids to ride, nor is it going to do anything positive for the biking community. We already have to deal with our own police force not ticketing drivers when they cut-off, hit, or otherwise harrass cyclists and break the law, we shouldn't have to deal with a bunch of uneducated kids and their parents too. Talk about 2 steps backward for the cycling community. It's apparant you don't ride, Radio Host.
I have yellow recumbent. I ride constantly. I would be willing to bet I will go all of February without seeing a teenager on a bicycle with a helmet.
some things government shouldn't control
Ask a middle school principle if any student wears a helmet, probably not.
ALL THE HELMET LAW DOES IS STOP KIDS FROM RIDING BICYCLES LEGALLY.
RTSH A very high percentage of cyclists' brain injuries can be prevented by a helmet. What the hemlet does it protect the brain from injury. We feel the law incourages helment use.
Ask a middle school principle if they educate students on helmets.
Help educate the bicycle riding public on helmet saftey.
Or, you could just bla about the law.
GATORBACK I don't think you realize that the helmet law only reduces the number of 13-16 year olds that ride bikes. I think they are safer riding a bicycle then walking. I KNOW THAT THIS ISN'T A SIMPLE ISSUE AND THAT MIGHT BE PRETTY HARD FOR YOU. Maybe if people like you would rally that kids should just wear helmets at all times they might ride bikes again.
Please don't respond until you have actually seen a 13 year old riding a bicycle with a helmet on.
OR
Please don't respond until you spend 20 bucks a week driving a teenager around that would be happy to ride a bike if she wouldn't have to wear a helmet.
QuoteGATORBACK I don't think you realize that the helmet law only reduces the number of 13-16 year olds that ride bikes.
Really? But I thought you just said that you see 13-16 year olds riding around with no helmets all the time. I think you're underestimating and patronizing kids this age. They're going to do what they want to do. What teenager have you known to listen to their parents all the time and play by the rules? That's what being a teenager is all about...pushing the line. The kids that want to ride will ride regardless of what the law is. Just like they rollerblade and skateboard on sidewalks right past signs that say "no skating." Removing the law is not going to change this. In fact, you may see fewer kids in this age bracket riding because they're not sticking-it-to-the-man anymore.
It sounds like you're opposed to this law because you have a child that is more concerned about what her friends think or what her hair looks like than safety. If you could only realize what would happen to her if she got hit and reiterate that to her, she might start caring. Bicycle helmets might look nerdy, but having your head bandaged and having to have your face completely recontructed is much nerdier.
Adulthood is legally defined as being 18 years of age. It is not until that time that a person can legally choose what is best for them and their own well-being. A 13 year-old is still a child. A 16 year-old is still a child. No matter how mature that child acts or appears to be, they do not get to decide what to do with their life until they are out in the world and actually have a life. Up until they're 18, everything is just play-acting. It is up to you, as a responsible adult, to teach them the ways of the world and responsibility as it pertains to their life and others so when they are of age to make decisions, they make the right ones. Maybe you have an exceptional child. In that case, I would suggest emancipation. I lived on my own at the age of 16 and my only transporation was a bicycle. But, of course, I understood the importance of my brain so I wore a helmet. Your girl might not fair so well.
Btw, like I stated before, I have an 8 and 12 year old. They wear helmets. They've seen kids who don't wear them, get seriously hurt simply by falling off their bicycle. They've seen their dad crash at 25mph, land on his head WITH a helmet and walk away. They've seen people riding at 5 mph on the sidewalk and have a car pull out right in front of them nearly hitting them. They know what can happen. Kids like that don't need the law, they'd wear a helmet regardless. Kids like the ones you're describing DO need the law because they simply don't know what's best for them.
Quote from: Radio Talk Show Host on January 28, 2008, 08:44:14 AM
GATORBACK I don't think you realize that the helmet law only reduces the number of 13-16 year olds that ride bikes. I think they are safer riding a bicycle then walking. I KNOW THAT THIS ISN'T A SIMPLE ISSUE AND THAT MIGHT BE PRETTY HARD FOR YOU. Maybe if people like you would rally that kids should just wear helmets at all times they might ride bikes again.
Please don't respond until you have actually seen a 13 year old riding a bicycle with a helmet on.
OR
Please don't respond until you spend 20 bucks a week driving a teenager around that would be happy to ride a bike if she wouldn't have to wear a helmet.
Well then, that's your problem RTSH. Next time, don't think. Continue to let your kid demand your time because "Daddy" is to much of a pussy-whip to say Ride Your Bike With Your Helmet. Sell the bike to pay for gas and demand gas money from their allowance. :)
ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GB, you are freakin killing me! ;D
Did anybody pick up the Wall Street Journal today and notice the Front Page coverstory "Hidden Trauma?"
Quote
Studies Cite Head Injuries As Factor in Some Social Ills.
Brain Researchers Link Mental Woes, Alcoholism, To Long-Ago Blows.
By Thomas M Burton
THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
Researchers studying brain injury believe they've found a common thread running through many cases of seemingly unrelates social problems: a long-forgotten blow to the head.
They've found that providing therapy for an underlying brain injury often helps people with a variety of ills ranging from learning disabilities to chronic homelessness and alcoholsim...That severe head injuries can lead to cognitive and behavioral problems....What's new is the contention of some researchers that there are many other cases where a severe past blow to the head...is the unrecognized source of such problems.
There's a nice little graph with "Causes of traumatic brain injuries: Falls 28%, Bike accident 3%..."
Okay, here's the kicker, the study shows "Children at risk."
We were talking about this over appetizers at McCormick and Schmicks this evening. Turns out, my next door neighbor mentioned his nephew is pretty much brain dead from a skateboard accident. To make matters worse, other horrific stories came up that speaks directly to head injury.
Perhaps we should all start wearing our helmets event to breakfeast. ;)
Many moons ago, there was this guy where I worked that would put on a football helmet before getting in his car and driving home. He looked really weird and people commented that he might have a mental issue, which may/may not have been true, but if he were to ever go through a windshield I bet dollars to doughnuts he'd fair a hell of a lot better than those of us bare-headed.
Quote from: gatorback on January 28, 2008, 02:34:18 PM
Quote from: Radio Talk Show Host on January 28, 2008, 08:44:14 AM
GATORBACK I don't think you realize that the helmet law only reduces the number of 13-16 year olds that ride bikes. I think they are safer riding a bicycle then walking. I KNOW THAT THIS ISN'T A SIMPLE ISSUE AND THAT MIGHT BE PRETTY HARD FOR YOU. Maybe if people like you would rally that kids should just wear helmets at all times they might ride bikes again.
Please don't respond until you have actually seen a 13 year old riding a bicycle with a helmet on.
OR
Please don't respond until you spend 20 bucks a week driving a teenager around that would be happy to ride a bike if she wouldn't have to wear a helmet.
Well then, that's your problem RTSH. Next time, don't think. Continue to let your kid demand your time because "Daddy" is to much of a pussy-whip to say Ride Your Bike With Your Helmet. Sell the bike to pay for gas and demand gas money from their allowance. :)
After reading the Wall Street Journal's article, I realized that I've been a little rough in my blogging. I am now retracting the above. Forgive me. You never really know where somebody is coming from. I need to give people the benefit of the doubt...that perhaps there was a head injury in the long ago past and that's why you'll never be able to change somebody's mind. ;)
ITS FEBRUARY THIRD I HAVE YET TO SEE A TEENAGER RIDING A BIKE WITH A helmet,HAVE YOU?
I RODE PROBABLY 30 OR 40 MILES TODAY PUTTING UP SIGNS FOR 1460
have you seen them yet?
Oh, so you're the one putting up illegal signs in the public right-of-way? Litter-bug!! :D
Actually, I don't see that many teens riding, helmets or no.
Quote from: Radio Talk Show Host on February 03, 2008, 11:23:45 PM
ITS FEBRUARY THIRD I HAVE YET TO SEE A TEENAGER RIDING A BIKE WITH A helmet,HAVE YOU?
I RODE PROBABLY 30 OR 40 MILES TODAY PUTTING UP SIGNS FOR 1460
have you seen them yet?
Saying more teens will ride bikes with/without helmets by doing away with the helmet-law is like thinking America's obesity problem will be cured by taking away all trans-fat, portion-control, and various other food regulations. People aren't suddenly going to start eating right because the government is not controlling what goes into their food and kids aren't suddenly going to start riding because the state helmet-law is eliminated. And, if what you say does happen (more kids riding) then they'll be an increased number of deaths and serious head-injuries because of it. Do you really want that on your conscience?
Hey, RTSH? Were you perchance riding down Scotten Road today at 5:14 pm? A man on a yellow recumbent, wearing a helmet, passed my window as I was reading this thread. Interesting coincidence...
As a (regretfully former) motorcyclist, I know full well how valuable a helmet is, and the law about wearing them meant nothing to me, as I did it regardless, and owe my life, on at least one, and probably two, occasions to doing so. However, I do think that adults should be allowed to make their own decisions in such matters, though I also think that the burden of care for those who chose not to do so should be borne by those who make that choice, not the taxpayer, in the form of cost-underwritten EMR treatment, ambulances, etc.
However, for kids its a different story. If their parents aren't willing to enforce safety rules on their behalf, it falls to society, in the form of laws, to do so.
lynnegh: I totally agree with you that for kids it's a different story. Us old folks have already formed learning modalities that with the younguns, an insult to the brain will form differently if at all. That's proven.
so you still think its better to make riding a bicycle the way most kids actually ride them illegal even after you haven't actually seen a 13-16year old riding a bicycle witha helmet
its a sad commentary on the way people perceive what is meant by pursuit of happiness
in a related story, i signed up for the ms150 today & booked the hotel room in daytona
Quote from: Radio Talk Show Host on February 19, 2008, 07:42:27 PM
so you still think its better to make riding a bicycle the way most kids actually ride them illegal even after you haven't actually seen a 13-16year old riding a bicycle witha helmet
its a sad commentary on the way people perceive what is meant by pursuit of happiness
Kids don't have the same rights as adults. That they can't vote, bare arms etc., and correct me if I'm wrong, as soon as they turn 18 they can take the helmet off. Us adults have to show them the way to the pursuit of happiness and wearing a helmet is the way fror them on their bikes.