I've read that it is possible in Florida, although very expensive, but as this city grows the increased population may justify such an expenditure.
There's already underground parking in downtown. The Wells Fargo Center and city hall are two structures with parking below them. However, the last thing downtown needs is more parking of any variety. We have twice as much parking spots than people down here now.
Underground parking is not feasible until rents come up.
Imagine spending a fortune on the construction of underground parking for a rental tower or mid-rise community and then you rent out 1 BRs for $1,000 and 2 BRs for $1,500...you'd have to not mind making any money on that deal. Likewise with office...build that garage into the foundation and then rent out class A office space for a max of $23 for small tenant and less for larger blocks? I don't think so. The Wells Fargo tower was built as the headquarters for an insurance firm no longer operating. The financing of that building was a little different than a spec or multi-tenant office tower constructed today.
Granted if the bedrock/soil is anything like DC, it's not the most expensive place in America to go underground (try Atlanta where the rents don't quite justify it and the bedrock is spotty if not pure granite).
Even water proofing can't stop the water. Shut the pumps down and you get wet. The underground parking cost does not stop with construction.
Quote from: thelakelander on June 14, 2012, 01:11:00 PM
There's already underground parking in downtown. The Wells Fargo Center and city hall are two structures with parking below them. However, the last thing downtown needs is more parking of any variety. We have twice as much parking spots than people down here now.
Bingo.
While I was in St. Petersburg (Leningrad / Petrograd) in 2001 buying a Russian wife from the FWFM (Russian Wife Flea Market), I used the subway. It is amazing how deep this subway goes into the earth….. about 300 feet; and this, in an area which used to be a swamp. I’m not sure of the geology, but it probably was quite a project regarding the water in the environment. This thing is so big, it is used by over 2 million people per day.
Given this successful underground project in Russia, which was I think basically completed in the 1950’s, it seems possible to build underground parking or subways here in Jax.
Possible, but probably not feasible, or even desirable.
The purchase at the FWFM was basically a good one, but I decided to return the merchandise. Got a partial refund.
Quote from: ben says on June 14, 2012, 06:58:23 PM
Quote from: thelakelander on June 14, 2012, 01:11:00 PM
There's already underground parking in downtown. The Wells Fargo Center and city hall are two structures with parking below them. However, the last thing downtown needs is more parking of any variety. We have twice as much parking spots than people down here now.
Bingo.
Well any new residential development is going to need spaces, and I'm sure code agrees. A surface/vacant lot next door to a new tower in LaVilla will not suffice, and people aren't going to park their cars on uncovered dirt in a seemingly unsafe area. Office will want to be able to advertise a good parking ratio, too, if another building is ever built.
The problem with Jacksonville is that many of the garages dotting the cityscape are city garages that aren't attached to a specific building, so more will have to be built eventually. And unfortunately city garages are often fugly. Private garages are usually prettier to look at and them well with whatever building(s) they serve. We'd be complaining less if that were the case.
Ron just gave me a great idea on how to improve RAM. 8)
Subway cost would make the skyway look cheap. Mass excavations in semi plastic or loose soils can be interesting when the construction dewatering causes settlement outside of the containment walls. You basically do an excavation to get room for the mole. You can have a swamp on the top and rock down below. We often have water, sand, more sand, less sand, clay like stuff, and rock. But when we say rock the builders up north laugh at us and our gravel.
Well Miami is in the process of actually boring a tunnel for the port authority (at an extremely high cost). The soils in north Florida are likely more suitable for this type of tunneling versus the south florida swamp.
Still, tunneling is very expensive and isn't considered unless the built environment above forces it.
Underground garages are very doable here but I agree with the others that because of the available space for above ground parking it likely won't happen for a while.