wow. Surprised this wasn't picked up sooner. Very cool and great of Ron to do this.
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/downtowntoday.php?dt_date=2012-05-14
We've got a detailed story coming this week. Ron gave me a tour of the interior on Friday.
Fantastic!
I wanted to buy that property but it was already under contract when I found it :-(
cool. can't wait to read the story.
yep...I got a tour of it last month....he changed his mind a bit on how tio configure the buiklding...I believe the plan now is to do a studio, a 1 bdr, and a 2 bdr on each floor
Ron Chamblin: Jacksonville Legend.
There is a ridiculous amount of work to be done in that building, the floor is sagging on the third floor. There are nice old fixtures in there though that I hope he salvages!
Small scale rental over retail was the historic pattern in downtowns for a long time and still is in a lot of cities. Wonder if that has anything to do with why their center cities are vibrant and alive and ours is dead?
Ours may be dead but at least we have a $400 million shiny new courthouse that is spurring ZERO
ECONOMIC ACTIVITY AROUND IT.
Quote from: MusicMan on May 14, 2012, 05:12:27 PM
Ours may be dead but at least we have a $400 million shiny new courthouse that is spurring ZERO
ECONOMIC ACTIVITY AROUND IT.
Begs the question...WTF is going on with the old Wormans building!?!?!
Quote from: JFman00 on May 14, 2012, 03:28:16 PM
I wanted to buy that property but it was already under contract when I found it :-(
I had a shot, but they wanted $550,000 for it in 2007. Couldnt get a bank to loan on four walls and a roof. Which, FWIW, had some asbestos issues with it.
All the more reason to salute Ron Chamblin.
Ron Chamblin, you rock!
Thanks for the support, kind persons. I could not have obtained a bank loan at this time either, being too much in debt from my earlier loans. The seller is holding the note, with a balloon for the entire balance due in three years. JFYI, I paid 290K, with 58K down, financing 232K over 15 years at 5%, with a balloon due in three years of abt 185K. Within a year or two, I will sell my house, which is empty, to get funds to pay the seller off, and have money to assist with the project. The entire renovation will be at least 600K. I live in a small apartment in the rear/upper of the bookstore, and will continue there, renting out the new apartments to pay for beer and drugs. ;D
I'm currently having my architect, Fred Podris, the same who did the bookstore building, begin as-built drawings. We will then decide the best use of the upper two floors, each currently having five small apartments. A couple of the apartments have absolutely no kitchen facilities, only one room and a bathroom. The remaining have either a kitchen/bath/bedroom/living ( 4 rooms), or a kitchen/bath/bedroom-living combined ( 3 rooms)……. small indeed.
My objective is to attempt having only three apartments per level, two one- bedroom apartments facing west, toward Hemming and Snyder, and one two-bedroom apartment in the rear. Having fewer apartments will require less plumbing, fewer washing machines and dryers, fewer a/c’s, and fewer persons to engage about rent. Having fewer apartments will allow less space devoted to hallways. Once we determine which are the load-bearing walls, we can then make decisions about layouts.
The square footage per level is a little less than 2,400 sq. ft., about 30’ x 80’, the stairs and hallways taking up some of the space. Being residential, I do not have to install an elevator. Although not required, I plan to sprinkle the building, and rebuild the fire escapes along the south wall. Doing these two things gives much flexibility concerning other code requirements about fire and safety. For example, if I do neither of these things, then I must supply a fire exit out of each bedroom window, with a path to the ground. I would much rather do the sprinkling and re-build the fire escape.
Greg, of Gus’s Shoe repair, is currently utilizing the lower floor, paying per month a figure just below my current loan payment of a little over $1,800 per month. This allows me to funnel some funds into the project even before I obtain a major loan for it. I informed Greg that I will keep him informed about the schedule, and allow him many months warning about any changes regarding his use of the space.
I am assuming at this point that I can make much more revenue than Greg is able to pay in rent, by opening a restaurant. Besides, a place like Gus’s will not utilize the space in the evenings. We need evening activity in the city core. There is an option to “connect†the current bookstore café, via a four-foot passageway, with the new restaurant. The two buildings are only about three feet apart.
I like the idea of a full restaurant, being able to design it from the start to the ideal, and being able to offer full breakfasts every morning, and lunch and evening meals. My objective would be, by the pressure of extreme quality of ambiance, menu and service, to make impossible the existence of Magnificat and La Cena. ;D But, seriously, it would be good for the area to have a moderate cost restaurant offering full breakfast similar to the Fox and the former Worman’s on Broad.
Thank you for allowing me to think aloud as I plan this thing. Any suggestions before I get too far into the project design? I have some good historical info, if I can find it, on the building to give to Ennis (Lakelander). For example, I think the building’s third floor was built in the twenties. The building was originally built in 1904. And because there is a large window on the north side, it was probably built before the Magnificat building.
Good luck, I wish you much success.
This dude is what I wanna be when I grow up...
I am very interested, please let me know when they are available!
I tried to get some money together for it last year, but we were pretty timid due to all the work that it needed. Our plan was to just reduce the top 2 floors to studs and clean them up to lease as artist space for the time being, with the ultimate goal of residential. The building needs a lot of work, but it is in one of the best locations in the city and has huge potential. Good luck Ron!!!!
Ron,
What are the plans for the outside facade? I am assuming you will be using the Laura Street facade grant. I am assuming just restoring and painting the upper floors, but the street level future restaurant should be bright with maybe some creative use of lighting and good signage.
Thank you for taking this on. I think I will put my Kindle down and go buy an actual book now at Uptown. Keep up the good work!
Also, in the grand scheme of things, 5 or 6 apartmenst may not seem like much, but it is projects like this that we need right now. We don't need billions dumped into some govt study or some pocket park creation or whatever. We need business minded people like Chamblin who see an opportunity and develope their little corner.
^^could not agree more.
Quote from: Dapperdan on May 15, 2012, 08:41:22 AM
Also, in the grand scheme of things, 5 or 6 apartmenst may not seem like much, but it is projects like this that we need right now. We don't need billions dumped into some govt study or some pocket park creation or whatever. We need business minded people like Chamblin who see an opportunity and develope their little corner.
This is absolutely correct.
^I agree with fsujax and jason_contentdg. I also agree with triclops i. I want to have the same type of impact on the urban core that Ron has provided when I grow up.
Quote from: Dapperdan on May 15, 2012, 08:41:22 AM
Also, in the grand scheme of things, 5 or 6 apartmenst may not seem like much, but it is projects like this that we need right now. We don't need billions dumped into some govt study or some pocket park creation or whatever. We need business minded people like Chamblin who see an opportunity and develope their little corner.
Absolutely. Five projects like this can make such an impart on street level vibrancy. People coming and going etc. Thanks very much for this Ron!
Quote from: Dapperdan on May 15, 2012, 08:41:22 AM
Also, in the grand scheme of things, 5 or 6 apartmenst may not seem like much, but it is projects like this that we need right now. We don't need billions dumped into some govt study or some pocket park creation or whatever. We need business minded people like Chamblin who see an opportunity and develope their little corner.
Exactly, a do er not a talker. Ron's description of his experience is nothing short of humbling. These are the people who are, and will revitalize DT. Not just are they business minded, why do they do this? Because they WANT to!
Someone told me there are 4 foot clawfoot tubs in some of those apartments-above-stores along that block. Maybe that's the building. Charming historic apartments above a store. This is awesome.
But what about Gus? Surely we can find a spot for Gus somewhere in there. Restaurants we have, and another one would be great too. But do you know how hard it is to find a good shoe repair shop? Please consider saving a spot for Gus somewhere. That store has been there for as long as I can remember. Just my 2 cents. :-) Love the plans.
Yes, there are several clawfoot tubs in the building. There are two street level retail bays. Ron told me Gus is staying.
Quote from: Dapperdan on May 15, 2012, 08:41:22 AM
Also, in the grand scheme of things, 5 or 6 apartmenst may not seem like much, but it is projects like this that we need right now. We don't need billions dumped into some govt study or some pocket park creation or whatever. We need business minded people like Chamblin who see an opportunity and develope their little corner.
Maybe MJ should do a continuing series on the trials, tribulations, rewards and surprises that come with doing a project like this. A lot of people, myself included, dream of doing this type of thing, but have a fear of the unexpected/unknown. Maybe sharing Ron's experiences will help and encourage others to do the same.
My brother bought a building like this in MI near Ann Arbor. They're not for the faint of heart. Between him and my Dad it took months before it was livable and years before the restoration was done. The end result was pretty stunning though, well worth the wait, and considering how cheap it was plus the new Chicago->Detroit HSR in the works it was a smart project.
I'm hoping someone works some magic with the converted firehouse downtown. Looks like a fantastic living space with a lot of potential for ground-floor retail.
Quote from: vicupstate on May 15, 2012, 02:19:33 PM
Quote from: Dapperdan on May 15, 2012, 08:41:22 AM
Also, in the grand scheme of things, 5 or 6 apartmenst may not seem like much, but it is projects like this that we need right now. We don't need billions dumped into some govt study or some pocket park creation or whatever. We need business minded people like Chamblin who see an opportunity and develope their little corner.
Maybe MJ should do a continuing series on the trials, tribulations, rewards and surprises that come with doing a project like this. A lot of people, myself included, dream of doing this type of thing, but have a fear of the unexpected/unknown. Maybe sharing Ron's experiences will help and encourage others to do the same.
The Florida times union newspaper did several columns following the renovations of old houses in Riversride and Springfield years ago.
Quote from: Dapperdan on May 15, 2012, 08:41:22 AM
Also, in the grand scheme of things, 5 or 6 apartmenst may not seem like much, but it is projects like this that we need right now. We don't need billions dumped into some govt study or some pocket park creation or whatever. We need business minded people like Chamblin who see an opportunity and develope their little corner.
+1
You are all so kind to me, and encouraging. But yes, Dapperdan, I think that the current first floor façade is pretty ugly. I plan to keep the old brick above, add some awnings on the windows, and do something creative with the lower floor, using wrought iron accents, perhaps exposing any brick behind the current stucco ….. My architect and me will come up with something good I’m sure.
And yes Debbie, there are about six of the cast iron clawfoot tubs. I hope to keep those for the apartments. And I talked with Greg, owner of Gus’s recently. I assured him that he will have months to prepare any move to another location. I would like to have Gus stay at that location. However, three things come into play on any decision about Gus.
First, if one is to have an area in the city core which is to contribute to its overall vibrancy, it would be best to have businesses which can open into the night. A restaurant can to this, but evening hours would not be appropriate for Gus’s. Second, there will come a time, within the next year, when the renovation will require a vacant bottom floor. And third, I doubt if the proceeds from renting to Gus’s will approach that of a good restaurant.
But I do agree that Gus’s adds color and traffic to the area. That is why I hope Greg can find a place close by. He already is renting the one space next to the UPS store. I think he had to assume the lease when he bought out the former Shoe repair at that location. However, he seems to hesitate moving there at this time, and I think it is because of its smaller space for his equipment. I am going to mention the idea of a long-term lease at the Elk’s building.
Who knows, there are options still. We have both talked about having him move out for a few weeks so I can renovate his lower floor, and then he can move in again. This taking place will depend on how close Greg can come to paying the market rate for rent. After all, it is much simpler to rent a space out, as compared to the headaches of running a restaurant. And too, Gus’s will always increase the foot traffic wherever it is located.
The current lack of funds to aggressively renovate gives us time, and time usually brings the best decisions. We will see. For the time being, me and one of my employees, the fellow who I hired from Hemming, who had been homeless for three years, will begin to attack structural deficiencies. Then we will prepare the basic structure so that the contractors can proceed with efficiency. Most of the walls, ceilings, plumbing, and electrical will be replaced. New a/c will be installed. A sprinkler system will be installed. Each apartment will have a new stacked washer/dryer. We have not yet determined what kind of an A/C system we will have.
And John P, the trials and tribulations you speak about do exist somewhat, but as with many projects in life, they are less formidable when one is familiar with the territory. Now if I were to engage a project about a rock music band performance, I would be totally overwhelmed, as I am quite ignorant about the making of music, although I love to listen to it.
Because I have been “building†things since being a child in the forties, and since I’ve engaged occasional educations and jobs to varying degrees in the sciences and engineering, I feel comfortable on projects like renovating buildings. Besides, there are great resources in our building code and permitting departments. These fellows have always been quite helpful on projects like the upcoming.
If you approach these fellows with an attitude right from the start, you might have some problems. However, if you engage them as a partner in making things safe and according to the code, these fellows will actually solve problems for you, and will sometimes bend the rules to favor your job completion.
Just as the musician can see a performance via his or her imagination right from the start, one who is familiar with buildings and renovations can not only imagine the finished project, but can imagine the process of getting there. Therefore, confidence is the rule, and one’s knowledge allows for the right decisions on the project.
As for me, because I’ve developed a good working relationship with them, I’ve always used the same general contractor, Breaking Ground, doing a cost plus, and we usually use the same Electrical contractor, Lighthouse Electric, on a cost plus basis. We do get bids on the plumbing, sprinklers, framing, a/c, drywall etc. These cost plus arrangements are the result of trust gained over the years, which can usually be done if nobody is on drugs.
In any case, I feel comfortable doing these renovations for the same reason that one feels comfortable riding a bicycle after a week of riding. There are some benefits to getting older. One is called having experience. The only problem is that having great experience usually means that one is that much closer to dying, so one benefits from it for only a little while. The trick is to get experience as early in life as you can so you can enjoy the benefits of it for a long time, thus allowing you more time to afford more beer and drugs.
Currently I don’t know how I will come up with the money to do this project, it requiring about $600K when it is all over. However, I have confidence about gaining it eventually, as the project is a good thing, and not a wasteful project like buying a big yacht. Those who are able, usually assist with good things, such as when one builds or creates something. And the ongoing book business is looking good, so I can always have some funds to shoot to the renovation. At some point of course, I will have to borrow again. Perhaps when the borrowing time comes, the banks will be ready, and I will be able.
Looks good. Lots of work to do. We will soon have six new apartments on the edge of Hemming, and one can sit and watch the colorful Hemming crowd among the big oaks.
Ron,
Thank you so much for being dedicated to downtown. We need more people like you around. ;D
I hope the oaks are still around by 2014, when this is done.
What if anything is going in Synder these days? Does the city still own it?
^The city still owns it but they aren't doing anything with it.
Ron, Good luck with the project. Sharing your insight throughout the process is a true benefit for anyone attempting to get involved.
I also hope the trees are around in 2014. Picture #2 will capture the before and after. Look at all that shade.
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 06:18:04 AM
^The city still owns it but they aren't doing anything with it.
Snyder does get used for performances during ArtWalk...and I believe will once again be used at Jazz Fest this year
What a great project. Ron, will any of the Laura facade grant money be available for the project?
Quote from: tufsu1 on May 16, 2012, 08:48:42 AM
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 06:18:04 AM
^The city still owns it but they aren't doing anything with it.
Snyder does get used for performances during ArtWalk...and I believe will once again be used at Jazz Fest this year
^So they use it for about three hours 12-15 out of 365 days of the year? In other words, they aren't doing anything with it. It would be nice to see COJ issue an RFP and return it back to the private sector.
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 09:26:49 AM
Quote from: tufsu1 on May 16, 2012, 08:48:42 AM
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 06:18:04 AM
^The city still owns it but they aren't doing anything with it.
Snyder does get used for performances during ArtWalk...and I believe will once again be used at Jazz Fest this year
^So they use it for about three hours 12-15 out of 365 days of the year? In other words, they aren't doing anything with it. It would be nice to see COJ issue an RFP and return it back to the private sector.
That implies there'd be a buyer, or at least a buyer who wouldn't tear it down. The city should be a partner in whatever happens with the building. Currently it gets some use and can be rented out for events (I almost rented it for my wedding). The use can be expanded, but it's unlikely its future would be brighter in private hands.
This is the type of project that builds attractive, livable, and even "great" cities.
Quote from: Tacachale on May 16, 2012, 09:31:32 AM
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 09:26:49 AM
Quote from: tufsu1 on May 16, 2012, 08:48:42 AM
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 06:18:04 AM
^The city still owns it but they aren't doing anything with it.
Snyder does get used for performances during ArtWalk...and I believe will once again be used at Jazz Fest this year
^So they use it for about three hours 12-15 out of 365 days of the year? In other words, they aren't doing anything with it. It would be nice to see COJ issue an RFP and return it back to the private sector.
That implies there'd be a buyer, or at least a buyer who wouldn't tear it down. The city should be a partner in whatever happens with the building. Currently it gets some use and can be rented out for events (I almost rented it for my wedding). The use can be expanded, but it's unlikely its future would be brighter in private hands.
We'll never know if we don't try. If a guy like Ron is willing to take a chance on the two structures across the street, who knows who will possibly step up to the plate if presented the opportunity. Right now, we're assuming something may not materialize resulting in doing absolutely nothing, which causes the building to further decay and the surrounding area/park to have less vibrant activity. Nevertheless, to truly activate Hemming Plaza's outer square, these buildings need to be used for everyday activities. Event rental and opening the doors for a couple hours one evening per month isn't enough.
Tacachale, the city can condition the RFP to ensure that the building is not torn down. It can also write the RFP in ways that will result in a desired use being selected.
And if a legit buyer doesn't meet the conditions of the RFP then the building will just sit vacant like it currently is. There's really nothing to lose. Like Lake said, we'll never know if we don't try.
I have a question for Ron.
If this were an empty lot, would it be feasible for you to put up a new building on this site?
Quote from: vicupstate on May 15, 2012, 02:19:33 PM
Maybe MJ should do a continuing series on the trials, tribulations, rewards and surprises that come with doing a project like this. A lot of people, myself included, dream of doing this type of thing, but have a fear of the unexpected/unknown. Maybe sharing Ron's experiences will help and encourage others to do the same.
This is a great idea. An irregular series with pictures documenting the process would be a popular feature with a lot of the MJ crowd.
Quote from: CityLife on May 16, 2012, 10:20:14 AM
Tacachale, the city can condition the RFP to ensure that the building is not torn down. It can also write the RFP in ways that will result in a desired use being selected.
And if a legit buyer doesn't meet the conditions of the RFP then the building will just sit vacant like it currently is. There's really nothing to lose. Like Lake said, we'll never know if we don't try.
Oh, finehoe, let ME start your excellent idea. One to allow all to see EXACTLY what Ron is getting involved in.
There arn't any legit buyers in the sense that the city sees it. Its not an auction in any sense of the word. The city asserts a value for the building and starts an RFP from there with the condition that the assessed value be met.
I went through this in requesting (and getting) an RFP for 324 N. Broad street, a dilapidated building across from the new courthouse parking lots. We were quoted around $400,000 renovations just to legally open the door. The city had the property accessed at $340,000(!!!). If it costs $400,000 just to open the door, you should give me $60,000 just to take possession of it. I'd be doing YOU a favor. Thousands of dollars of legal fees, renovation quotes later, my bid (which included my wife's impeccable credentials as a WSJ illustrator relocating from NYC) was denied.
The building sits, or i should stay is falling, slowly and surely into the ground across from the new courthouse. Which it complements "gorgeously".
God bless the Mayor, I feel fortunate to have him in city hall. But, in terms of DT "development", The city can go to Hell. Which, in many ways DT, they are!
Id like to note that Ron wouldn't have been able to perform the miracle he did, had he had to go thru the City.
Even the more reason to salute him today!
I say to all here at MetroJax, THIS is the major problem our downtown is as it is today! There IS sufficent demand for residential living in downtown. Many here alone would love to live downtown. But with the real estate controlled by a handful of people who have NO interest in residential growth DT, downtown continues to go down the tubes.
I believe Ron paid a high price for the building he bought. But, again, he did it because he wanted to, to do the right thing for downtown. A profit was last on his mind!
Jerry, sadly your example isn't an isolated incident. The city has similarly dropped the ball on 9th and Main and I'm sure there are others as well.
Snyder can be a major catalyst for revitalization of the Laura St corridor and Hemming Plaza. With that in mind the city could hypothetically sell the property for less than its assessed value IF there was a buyer that would do great things with it like a museum, arts collaborative, live music venue, etc. The property is not currently generating any revenue for the city, it is not generating any property taxes, and is being severely underutilized. So get it in the hands of someone who can do something great with it.
Our city offers a multitude of financial incentives to developments. Snyder is an opportunity to incentivize positive development downtown at no cost to tax payers. In fact it will be a net benefit to tax payers once it gets back on the tax roll. Win win.
Also, the RFP has to have weighted values for specific projects in the event that there are comparable bids. Not positive, but believe they also can condition them so that only certain projects can be approved for a building. So they could write the RFP to only accept winning bids for x types of uses.
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 10:00:44 AM
Quote from: Tacachale on May 16, 2012, 09:31:32 AM
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 09:26:49 AM
Quote from: tufsu1 on May 16, 2012, 08:48:42 AM
Quote from: thelakelander on May 16, 2012, 06:18:04 AM
^The city still owns it but they aren't doing anything with it.
Snyder does get used for performances during ArtWalk...and I believe will once again be used at Jazz Fest this year
^So they use it for about three hours 12-15 out of 365 days of the year? In other words, they aren't doing anything with it. It would be nice to see COJ issue an RFP and return it back to the private sector.
That implies there'd be a buyer, or at least a buyer who wouldn't tear it down. The city should be a partner in whatever happens with the building. Currently it gets some use and can be rented out for events (I almost rented it for my wedding). The use can be expanded, but it's unlikely its future would be brighter in private hands.
We'll never know if we don't try. If a guy like Ron is willing to take a chance on the two structures across the street, who knows who will possibly step up to the plate if presented the opportunity. Right now, we're assuming something may not materialize resulting in doing absolutely nothing, which causes the building to further decay and the surrounding area/park to have less vibrant activity. Nevertheless, to truly activate Hemming Plaza's outer square, these buildings need to be used for everyday activities. Event rental and opening the doors for a couple hours one evening per month isn't enough.
We've tried before, and no serious takers emerged. That's the problem.
This is really a discussion for another thread, but at this point it would be preferable to see the city just make better use of the building. There's no reason they can't lease it out themselves for regular use (again, assuming there are any takers). In fact, as the city doesn't necessarily need to generate a profit, it would likely be even easier for them than for a private entity. Find some other band to take over like before, or otherwise run it as a performance venue. Waiting for Godot here isn't likely to work any better during the recession than it did before it.
I know of one person who was seriously interested, but the price wasn't right.
Also, I can't remember when that happened, but was the new library built yet? Was Chamblins open? Was the Laura St. Streetscaping done? Was Dalton Agency there? Was there Facade Improvement money available? If not, then you can't assume nobody would be interested now given the recent improvements to the area.
Back to Ron's project...thanks for the update. Can't wait to see it. And bless you for hiring a homeless man, who is doubtless extremely grateful for the gainful employment. Hope that works out well for both of you. A real win-win. And Breaking Ground...excellent. Love them.
I really would love to see you continue to blog about the project and post pictures as you go along.
Just an idea for the potential first floor restaurant: go to the Top in Gainesville or the Floridian in St. Augustine...
Quote from: jerry cornwell on May 16, 2012, 11:19:29 AM
Quote from: CityLife on May 16, 2012, 10:20:14 AM
Tacachale, the city can condition the RFP to ensure that the building is not torn down. It can also write the RFP in ways that will result in a desired use being selected.
And if a legit buyer doesn't meet the conditions of the RFP then the building will just sit vacant like it currently is. There's really nothing to lose. Like Lake said, we'll never know if we don't try.
Oh, finehoe, let ME start your excellent idea. One to allow all to see EXACTLY what Ron is getting involved in.
There arn't any legit buyers in the sense that the city sees it. Its not an auction in any sense of the word. The city asserts a value for the building and starts an RFP from there with the condition that the assessed value be met.
I went through this in requesting (and getting) an RFP for 324 N. Broad street, a dilapidated building across from the new courthouse parking lots. We were quoted around $400,000 renovations just to legally open the door. The city had the property accessed at $340,000(!!!). If it costs $400,000 just to open the door, you should give me $60,000 just to take possession of it. I'd be doing YOU a favor. Thousands of dollars of legal fees, renovation quotes later, my bid (which included my wife's impeccable credentials as a WSJ illustrator relocating from NYC) was denied.
The building sits, or i should stay is falling, slowly and surely into the ground across from the new courthouse. Which it complements "gorgeously".
God bless the Mayor, I feel fortunate to have him in city hall. But, in terms of DT "development", The city can go to Hell. Which, in many ways DT, they are!
Id like to note that Ron wouldn't have been able to perform the miracle he did, had he had to go thru the City.
Even the more reason to salute him today!
I say to all here at MetroJax, THIS is the major problem our downtown is as it is today! There IS sufficent demand for residential living in downtown. Many here alone would love to live downtown. But with the real estate controlled by a handful of people who have NO interest in residential growth DT, downtown continues to go down the tubes.
I believe Ron paid a high price for the building he bought. But, again, he did it because he wanted to, to do the right thing for downtown. A profit was last on his mind!
Perhaps if an RFP is submitted as public record we here could start bringing pressure to have a reasonable project move forward. In fact perhaps we should look at all RFPs going forward. Just to make sure the city isn't letting the hope of better get in the way of good as it did in Jerry's situation.
Quote from: climber on May 16, 2012, 01:20:38 PM
Just an idea for the potential first floor restaurant: go to the Top in Gainesville or the Floridian in St. Augustine...
+1000. Those are some of the coolest restaurants in the state and would make a killing in Jacksonville.
Make sure your contractor has his relatively new required lead abatment certifications. Also do an asbestos survey.
Ron, have you considered Crowd Source funding? The 5 Points --> SunRay Theater was successful in getting renovation money. Don't remember what their goal was, but I'm sure it was much less than $600k.
It is a beautiful building.. Easy to see through the decay to the gem it actually is. I cannot wait to see the finished product. Two of my favorite features in the building : The Stair case.. and the claw-foot bathtubs !!!
Good luck Ron! Thank you for saving one of our historic landmarks !!!!
Quote from: Overstreet on May 16, 2012, 04:56:24 PM
Make sure your contractor has his relatively new required lead abatment certifications. Also do an asbestos survey.
When I looked into the building in 2006-7ish I thought the realtor told there was asbestos issues. That being said, Overstreet makes a strong point.
Quote from: CityLife on May 16, 2012, 11:35:34 AM
Snyder can be a major catalyst for revitalization of the Laura St corridor and Hemming Plaza. With that in mind the city could hypothetically sell the property for less than its assessed value IF there was a buyer that would do great things with it like a museum, arts collaborative, live music venue, etc. The property is not currently generating any revenue for the city, it is not generating any property taxes, and is being severely underutilized. So get it in the hands of someone who can do something great with it.
Exactly. My wife and focused along arts collaborative. I can only reason that the city was focusing on the future value of 324 N. Broad st with the completion of the courthouse and looked towards $$$, instead of residential presence.
FWIW, We bought a house on Oak street 3 blocks from 5 points and last spring got in to CoRK as one of the original tenants. So the depressing rejection by the city led to a blessing that went with us to Riverside. It seems after we moved to Riverside, the city seems to be heading in a definitive good direction. At least for us in the artist community.
I went DT last Saturday night, had a late dinner at Chomp,Chomp, and saw the Burro bar jumping. Underbelly's is kicking off Jun 3rd down off Bay street. And it will be a BIG kick. This is the direction that is most definitive for our downtown.
But it is detrimental when one comprehends that, in the spur of the moment , Burro bags could be kicked out in an instant. Such happened last year with Nullspace , an under recognized contemporary art gallery. We need to have a firm establishment of ground roots small business like this, Burro bags in particular, which is directly connected to residential growth (in that many of these owners would like to live at their work). These are young, a bit in experienced individual people, who lack the experience and credentials of Ron Chamblin ( although Ron has the vibrancy of any 20 year old!)
This is not the direction the city and even a majority of Jacksonville sees DT going. They see a huge business moving thousands of workers into our skyscrapers. The results are not going to work within the premise that this website projects, a Metropolitan Jacksonville with a definitive, CULTURAL center in its historical center, downtown.
You would think, after the past, what 30 years, the city would pick up the message. But, as downtown gets worse, they haven't.
As Ive said before, when one looks for examples of urban revitalization the example of a re awakened Greenwich East Village (which our downtown most closely resembles a la 1970s) seems most appropriate than others to look into.
Quote from: Tacachale on May 16, 2012, 03:54:06 PM
Quote from: climber on May 16, 2012, 01:20:38 PM
Just an idea for the potential first floor restaurant: go to the Top in Gainesville or the Floridian in St. Augustine...
+1000. Those are some of the coolest restaurants in the state and would make a killing in Jacksonville.
Thanks I'll going to Gainsville soon, and will ck it out. And St. Aug. is close for the other.
Quote from: Charles Hunter on May 16, 2012, 08:43:53 PM
Ron, have you considered Crowd Source funding? The 5 Points --> SunRay Theater was successful in getting renovation money. Don't remember what their goal was, but I'm sure it was much less than $600k.
Quote from: Tacachale on May 16, 2012, 09:25:36 AM
What a great project. Ron, will any of the Laura facade grant money be available for the project?
That's good advice on the Crowd Source funding. And there are some funds available from the Laura grant. I'm not sure how much at present. Given my lack of ready funds now, I really should take the advice and work through any possibilities. I am lazy on this fund acquisition kind of thing, but it costs me. I must change this habit.
Again, this kind of project is fun, as it provides problems to solve. In the end, the building will become something much better that it has been, and will be one more addition to the city core assets and ambiance. It's completion will add a little weight to the momentum of core revitalization, and will, along with similar projects, eventually allow a threshold to emerge, after which much needed and powerful "natural" forces and pressures inherent in a vibrant city will come into play, giving opportunity where there are now roadblocks, allowing confidence where there is now fear, offering freedom where there is now rigidity and restrictions, ultimately facilitating and allowing others to more easily engage the city core. It will become easier for new businesses to open and survive, and increasingly attractive for new residents to select the core as a good place to live.
You're a good man, Ron. You should do some more investments around downtown.
Hello everyone. I have not posted in years on this site. I wanted to know if the new courthouse will bring with it new development to that part of downtown? I remember a while ago there was talk about some of the buildings in that area were going to be redeveloped.
nothing has happened as of yet.
Quote from: tlemans on May 17, 2012, 12:43:56 PM
Hello everyone. I have not posted in years on this site. I wanted to know if the new courthouse will bring with it new development to that part of downtown? I remember a while ago there was talk about some of the buildings in that area were going to be redeveloped.
Quite a few buildings around the courthouse site with mixed-use potential are for sale, for exorbitant prices. Same story on a .25 acre lot next to 220 Riverside listed for $450,000. At prices like that and with the mixed record with which Jax has pursued downtown revitalization, I'm not surprised at the lack of progress.
Where will the residents park their cars? I know in that part of downtown most stuff is within walking distance, but the rest of the city is spread out the wazoo.
Update:
Gus's Shoe Repair, having moved to his new location on Adams, has allowed the cleaning out of the 225 Laura building. So far, two large loads have gone to the dump near 301 and I-10.
This "bump" on the thread is to ask my MJ friends for some ideas about what to do with the first floor of the building. I know that the upper two floors will have three apartments per level ... all of which have already been spoken for, such is the apparent demand for apartments in the core -- especially overlooking Hemming.
I had planned originally to either operate a restaurant on the first floor, or to lease it out for someone else to operate their own restaurant.
However, I have recently thought of how boring this would be. Another restaurant? I need some help with ideas, and am thinking that some of you might be able to offer constructive ideas as to the use of the first floor. The size is about 2,300 sq. ft.
So far, I've entertained the following:
ONE: A rare book store, having the finer books which I've been storing in my warehouse. These would be the finer books, and a little pricy ... items which we usually sell online. The operation would be by appointment only. Someone working at the existing bookstore would simply open next door for the customer who seems serious about purchasing high end books.
TWO: A science/technology museum/store. This would remind some of Rolabes (Sp.??), which existed in town during the sixties and seventies perhaps. In any case, I would like to have on display certain contraptions/mechanisms/items/models etc, which would show certain fundamental principle of physics and chemistry .... and even mechanics.
The purpose would be to educate the young and the old as to these principles. It would be a place to which school classes could visit to observe interesting science. and mechanics.
Also, the place could offer for sale some of the instruments and tools used in the sciences for measurement and observation.
On reason I look at this possibility is that I am amazed at the number of individuals -- including college graduates -- who are quite ignorant about many fundamental principles in the sciences ...in mechanics...and electricity etc. The displays and experiments would be offered to educate .. .but in an interesting way .... visitors as to these principles. How would I receive payment for this operation ... other than that of selling instruments etc? Don't know yet. Let me say that I am very ignorant of a lot of things, as should be apparent to most. I do not mean to imply that I think otherwise when I suggest the above kind of effort to educate and "show stuff".
THREE: Coffee Roaster / Bakery Combo. This might be a hit downtown if done right. Daily fresh pastries and fresh roasted coffee/espresso products.
FOUR: A Pizza Place. Call it... Core Pizza.
FIVE: ?
Although making money and profit is important, making high profits is not my primary objective. My objective is to contribute to the core something that will add the "most interest, uniqueness, and excitement to the core" -- thus, the biggest draw to the core.
Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.
In other words .... what am I missing ... regarding needs and opportunities?
Okay ... I see the reason for no responses. Instead of the following...
This "bump" on the thread is to ask my MJ friends for some ideas about what to do with the first floor of the building.
.... how about the following:
This "bump" on the thread is to ask my MJ friends, and those who are not my friends, for some ideas about what to do with the first floor of the building.
This change hopefully will increase the number of individuals who might offer ideas.
Ron, what about a business that exists nearby now but is closed nights and weekends that you think provides a synergy with your existing business. Something that would help make your block more of an "oasis in the desert" and therefore more attractive to customers.
It would great, if not practical, to have a good newsstand.
A good Sporting Goods store. There's nothing anywhere near the core or Riverside, Avondale or Ortega for that matter. Not sure about San Marco. They have a 1st Place Sports but that's mainly running.
Combo it with a bike shop.
Then figure out how to sell craft beer there to and you can't lose.
My vote is for Core Pizza.
A flower shop, a premium baby boutique (Jacksonville does not have any), an ethnic food and spice store or a yoga studio.
a haberdashery.
(http://networkingwitches.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/retail-candy-store-web.jpg)
Another option is to utilize it as a pop up/business incubator type of space:
http://blog.thestorefront.com/what-exactly-is-a-pop-up-shop/
Quote from: urbanlibertarian on March 23, 2014, 01:54:06 PM
Ron, what about a business that exists nearby now but is closed nights and weekends that you think provides a synergy with your existing business. Something that would help make your block more of an "oasis in the desert" and therefore more attractive to customers.
Been gone for a spell .... good to see some words.
What or which do you mean? Which specific place?
Quote from: billy on March 23, 2014, 02:13:41 PM
It would great, if not practical, to have a good newsstand.
Print media newsstand? Sounds good, but I doubt if it would go. I don't know if you remember when I opened in 2006. I had a wall of magazines (35' or so). Not enough sold. Some moved out via theft, but somehow that didn't bring any money in. But yes, too bad I could not duplicate something like the Old Five Points stand or the one downtown. These days? I think the time for print newsstands are about over..... surviving only in very high density areas like NY.
Quote from: Apache on March 23, 2014, 03:02:13 PM
A good Sporting Goods store. There's nothing anywhere near the core or Riverside, Avondale or Ortega for that matter. Not sure about San Marco. They have a 1st Place Sports but that's mainly running.
Combo it with a bike shop.
Then figure out how to sell craft beer there to and you can't lose.
Only have 2,300 sq ft. I wonder if there would be enough business to support a sporting goods store. Now ... the bike shop might be possible ..... sorta looking ahead when they might be more popular. But again, there are so many shops around already. That's the problem .... seems like everything I think of is already being taken care of in in the near burbs.
The sports thing might work but... I just wonder if their would be enough business, with the limited foot traffic downtown.
I need to do something unique, to draw people from the outside.
Quote from: I-10east on March 23, 2014, 03:11:29 PM
My vote is for Core Pizza.
Would probably be a moneymaker... and in some ways more interesting than some typical restaurants. Most people "love" pizza. That's probably on the table.
Quote from: JeffreyS on March 23, 2014, 03:37:46 PM
A flower shop, a premium baby boutique (Jacksonville does not have any), an ethnic food and spice store or a yoga studio.
What a collection. But those kind of "different" things is what might draw some to the core. Hmmmm
Quote from: JeffreyS on March 23, 2014, 03:39:19 PM
a haberdashery.
A haberdashery ...... now that would be interesting ..... seeing how much "stuff" could be placed into the place.
Or a candy store? Well .... that actually might be something to be a draw. Most everybody likes some kind of candy. Something to think about.
^Wasn't there a short lived candy store in the Carling a few years back?
Quote from: thelakelander on March 23, 2014, 03:53:22 PM
Another option is to utilize it as a pop up/business incubator type of space:
http://blog.thestorefront.com/what-exactly-is-a-pop-up-shop/
What a concept. I checked out the article. Totally new to me. Something to look further at.
Quote from: thelakelander on March 23, 2014, 04:20:54 PM
^Wasn't there a short lived candy store in the Carling a few years back?
I'm not sure if there was a candy store there. I do remember when I opened in 2006, there was the chocolate shop, run by Suzanne Marino (Sp). She made her own candy. Was great stuff. She moved to Colorado, or a state close to it.
Just some ideas:
Candy store
Ice cream shoppe
Breakfast cafe
Sushi
Smoothies
How about a British Pub similar to Gordon Ramsay's Pub & Grill in Caesar's Palace? You'll have to find the right operator to get the ambiance, service, quality, and price right.
Quote from: Apache on March 23, 2014, 04:31:32 PM
This website is forever being hip and cutting edge.
What we don't have dt is a snooty, exclusive feeling yuppy lawyer bar. Leather, dark wood, make them feel important, sell classic drinks. Cater to the judges and lawyers. They need love to. Plus, you own the joint, then you could curry some favor from your patrons for more important issues. You know, the good ol way.
You're absolutely right. Just what this city needs. ;D
Quote from: thelakelander on March 23, 2014, 03:53:22 PM
Another option is to utilize it as a pop up/business incubator type of space:
http://blog.thestorefront.com/what-exactly-is-a-pop-up-shop/
I think this is a cool idea also.
Of course, another option is to simply build out the 2300 sq. ft. on the bottom, and lease to anyone having an business plan. This would be similar to what the Elk's Building does, but with a little more size. Would have to "prepare" if for a possible restaurant by drain's.. a hood etc... so that a restaurant venture could lease it. Who knows, there are probably some experienced "food" people who could run a fantastic, unique restaurant ..... perhaps even an individual experienced in running a food truck (former panzer driver).
The problem with this is that so many of the "experiments" in the Elk's Building leave after a few months or a couple of years.
So the question remains. What would do well in the spot, and would add "spice" to the area. Some interesting ideas so far, but nothing "smashing" in my mind.
We will see. If anything further comes to anyone's mind... please offer ... as my wish is to find something that would be the best use of the space.
Quote from: southsider1015 on March 23, 2014, 04:28:39 PM
Just some ideas:
Candy store
Ice cream shoppe
Breakfast cafe
Sushi
Smoothies
Oh ... more on the list. Actually, the breakfast cafe was at first my favorite, as there is "much need for it in the core"... especially on the weekends. People always stop me on Laura on Saturday or Sunday morning... wondering where they can find a good breakfast. I think it would be busy during the weekdays also. So ... the breakfast / lunch kind of place is on the table that's for sure. I would like to serve the breakfast throughout the day too. I like to have a breakfast at times, even during the afternoon. I am just looking for other options.
I'm not too sure that an ice cream shop would bring in enough to pay for the space.
Quote from: Apache on March 23, 2014, 04:31:32 PM
This website is forever being hip and cutting edge.
What we don't have dt is a snooty, exclusive feeling yuppy lawyer bar. Leather, dark wood, make them feel important, sell classic drinks. Cater to the judges and lawyers. They need love to. Plus, you own the joint, then you could curry some favor from your patrons for more important issues. You know, the good ol way.
Would be sorta like The Volstead, but with a richer interior, with a more cozy ambiance. It could be like the old jazz bar to some extent. Actually, I can imagine that. Hmmmm. You might have a winner my friend Apache ... whoever you are. I could not bartend of course as, not being on the level of the "rich and sophisticated", I could only visit for the occasional drink. Yes ..... something to think about. And we could have a small selection of books to peruse, or perhaps buy ... a newspaper or two. Could even sell, when and if it becomes legal... the marijuana. And if the hooker becomes legal, as in some cities and states, could have connections with high class of same. But this is getting too complicated. I like, for now, the idea of the bar with rich aspects as above.
Quote from: Juker777 on March 23, 2014, 04:41:19 PM
How about a British Pub similar to Gordon Ramsay's Pub & Grill in Caesar's Palace? You'll have to find the right operator to get the ambiance, service, quality, and price right.
Quote from: southsider1015 on March 23, 2014, 04:42:57 PM
Quote from: Apache on March 23, 2014, 04:31:32 PM
This website is forever being hip and cutting edge.
What we don't have dt is a snooty, exclusive feeling yuppy lawyer bar. Leather, dark wood, make them feel important, sell classic drinks. Cater to the judges and lawyers. They need love to. Plus, you own the joint, then you could curry some favor from your patrons for more important issues. You know, the good ol way.
You're absolutely right. Just what this city needs. ;D
Some additional votes for the rich bar I see. However, the thought just occurred to me that I am one block closer to the First Baptist Church as compared to the Volstead. I suspect that this would not be an issue. Surely, many of the attorneys' who might enjoy the ambiance of the new bar might also be members of the FBC. In any case, I'm sure all would be okay in that regard.
But .. what about a name for the new bar. Perhaps "New Bar". Or.... "The Core". Or .... "Reggies". Or... ...
Got to run for a spell.
With 2300 square feet could you do both the higher end bar on one side and your breakfast cafe on other? Perhaps they could share the kitchen if you wanted to also include high end tapas type items at the bar amd shared restrooms also where an opening from each establishment could be closed when that particular venue is closed since these two establishments would not have the same hours.
I have always thought that the Landing could use a bike shop in the space where Starbucks used to be....but they haven't shown much interest in that idea, so I give it to you instead.
The idea of splitting the space is interesting edjax ..... something to chew upon.
Usually, one first imagines a business and "then" looks for a space. The process has been reversed in this situation. I suppose I could always simply build it out, and leave it empty until somebody comes up with the "best" use for it.
We will see. I have a few weeks of cleaning out, and then some internal demo work. Then, once the architect completes the drawings for the apartments, we can get the general contractor going -- after I borrow more money.
In any case, thanks to all my MJ friends for the input so far. If anyone thinks of something else ... something you think might be a good use of the spot, shoot it to the forum. It will be much appreciated. If anyone wants to visit the site, let me know and I will gladly get the key and show it to you.
Whatever it is, it needs to compliment what is downtown already. So, soft serve ice cream, bikes, clothing: the type of thing that may make people stop and shop during lunch hour or right after work. Do it right and they will come back on the weekend. Are there any phone stores downtown? If not, phone/ computer accessories might work. A place to get a new charger, cord or mouse.
Quote from: ronchamblin on March 23, 2014, 04:56:57 PM
Of course, another option is to simply build out the 2300 sq. ft. on the bottom, and lease to anyone having an business plan. This would be similar to what the Elk's Building does, but with a little more size. Would have to "prepare" if for a possible restaurant by drain's.. a hood etc... so that a restaurant venture could lease it. Who knows, there are probably some experienced "food" people who could run a fantastic, unique restaurant ..... perhaps even an individual experienced in running a food truck (former panzer driver).
The problem with this is that so many of the "experiments" in the Elk's Building leave after a few months or a couple of years.
So the question remains. What would do well in the spot, and would add "spice" to the area. Some interesting ideas so far, but nothing "smashing" in my mind.
We will see. If anything further comes to anyone's mind... please offer ... as my wish is to find something that would be the best use of the space.
Quote from: southsider1015 on March 23, 2014, 04:28:39 PM
Just some ideas:
Candy store
Ice cream shoppe
Breakfast cafe
Sushi
Smoothies
Oh ... more on the list. Actually, the breakfast cafe was at first my favorite, as there is "much need for it in the core"... especially on the weekends. People always stop me on Laura on Saturday or Sunday morning... wondering where they can find a good breakfast. I think it would be busy during the weekdays also. So ... the breakfast / lunch kind of place is on the table that's for sure. I would like to serve the breakfast throughout the day too. I like to have a breakfast at times, even during the afternoon. I am just looking for other options.
I'm not too sure that an ice cream shop would bring in enough to pay for the space.
Quote from: Apache on March 23, 2014, 04:31:32 PM
This website is forever being hip and cutting edge.
What we don't have dt is a snooty, exclusive feeling yuppy lawyer bar. Leather, dark wood, make them feel important, sell classic drinks. Cater to the judges and lawyers. They need love to. Plus, you own the joint, then you could curry some favor from your patrons for more important issues. You know, the good ol way.
Would be sorta like The Volstead, but with a richer interior, with a more cozy ambiance. It could be like the old jazz bar to some extent. Actually, I can imagine that. Hmmmm. You might have a winner my friend Apache ... whoever you are. I could not bartend of course as, not being on the level of the "rich and sophisticated", I could only visit for the occasional drink. Yes ..... something to think about. And we could have a small selection of books to peruse, or perhaps buy ... a newspaper or two. Could even sell, when and if it becomes legal... the marijuana. And if the hooker becomes legal, as in some cities and states, could have connections with high class of same. But this is getting too complicated. I like, for now, the idea of the bar with rich aspects as above.
On Sunday mornings, First Watch on the Westside has an hour wait. Same thing for the breakfast place in Avondale. Go the breakfast place route. FBC could be a huge customer as well on Sunday mornings/afternoons!
First of all, I'd love to see a "bike sharing" station out front (this wouldn't require any sq footage, just some sidewalk space). I recently came back from Columbus, OH and they had them everywhere. I usually ride my bike to the Jags games and use the free bike valet... It would be awesome to see more people biking downtown and be able to have my friends rent a bike when they come over.
I like the speakeasy idea. I go to Volstead occasionally and it'd be nice to have another bar close by to "hop" to.
My favorite idea is the previously mentioned "pop up" shop. There really needs to be something that will draw people downtown and this could be lucrative for start ups and investors... If you got the right kind of backing you could probably get FSCJ, UNF and UF to team up as well to help incubate business ideas for new graduates. Considering all of the vacant space available downtown, you could start some sort of revolution getting more business' to fill office space and ground retail.
The "pop up" shop and the breakfast/lunch operation seem to be on the table in my mind. The "rich" bar, although interesting ... well, it would be utilized only in the evenings -- or would it? Perhaps it would open at noon to provide a "meeting place" for those desiring a place to meet ... listen to soft music, and have a drink.
In any case, the very fact that we've offered four or five viable operations is interesting, as each one represents a possibility for others who might be ready to open in the core. Some of the other ideas, although possible, seem not likely to draw the gross sales needed to survive.
But I agree, the area "does" need a good breakfast place ... not only on the weekends, but on the weekday too -- starting at about 5:30 or 6:00 a.m. Breakfast could be offered all day. Lunch could begin at 11:00 a.m., and run until 3:00 p.m. I suppose that at some point, it could open in the evenings, once a "type" of evening food is agreed upon.
These possibilities makes me wish that we had more places to lease in the core area, offering 1,500 to 3,000 sq. ft. For example, the old Barnett building, on the corner of Adams and Laura, has a ground floor which could be modified to offer several spaces for leasing. Having available the small-to-medium spaces is a major key to beginning a renaissance in the core.
The huge granite and concrete fronts of the mega-buildings seem cold and dead to the street traffic, and of course, cannot contribute to offering small-to-medium lease space for businesses unless the owners were to "open" the street-level floors of some of these larger buildings -- when the time comes. Making available all these street level spaces, and providing reasonable rent, will be a great way to entice new businesses into the core.
Not able to make a decision amongst the possibilities makes me wish I had the energy and resources to open "two" places.
But..... yes.... the breakfast/lunch idea, although boring in some respects, would fill a very practical need on every day of the week, and could be extended to evening hours at a later date. I like the idea of a bakery in the rear, and maybe even a coffee roasting operation.
We will see. Thanks for the input everyone.
Quote from: ronchamblin on March 24, 2014, 01:31:43 AM
The huge granite and concrete fronts of the mega-buildings seem cold and dead to the street traffic, and of course, cannot contribute to offering small-to-medium lease space for businesses unless the owners were to "open" the street-level floors of some of these larger buildings -- when the time comes. Making available all these street level spaces, and providing reasonable rent, will be a great way to entice new businesses into the core.
I'm no expert in urban development, but the concrete facade can't be helping. It feels too cold and industrial walking downtown, and this is coming from a construction guy who loves the smell of asphalt and timber. It needs to feel open, warm and sunny, like Florida.
Anyway, best of luck to your new business, whichever type you choose. Once you get it up and running, I'll pop in and spend some money.
Quote from: jaxjaguar on March 24, 2014, 12:42:45 AM
First of all, I'd love to see a "bike sharing" station out front (this wouldn't require any sq footage, just some sidewalk space). I recently came back from Columbus, OH and they had them everywhere. I usually ride my bike to the Jags games and use the free bike valet... It would be awesome to see more people biking downtown and be able to have my friends rent a bike when they come over.
bike share is in process. It is likely that hemming Plaza (perhaps near the Skyway station) is where a station would be located.
^^so in process. In Jacksonville talk that means in the next few years??
Yes...in the next few years
My votes would be for the following, taking into consideration location, the space, and the size:
1) Bread Pudding place (think fro-yo, but you choose the "bread", toppings, and the syrups that you want). Could do something else specialized like grilled cheese, ramen (educate yourself here before attempting...though Jaxsons probably aren't versed in the many styles like an Asian dominant SF population might be), pho, schwarma, etc etc
2) Shoe shop (sells men's/women's shoes, generally midrange with an emphasis on contemporary styles, and a business that does shoe repair/shoe shine and sells accessories such as cedar planks and shining wax)
3) An excellent soup place that mainly serves to go (I guess maybe mixing it up by specializing in ramen or pho or something not or not commonly found in Jax/DT)
4) A record shop that specializes in something not easily found in NE FL
5) A sundries that specializes in unique cards/gifts and always offers fresh cut flowers (brought in daily or every other day from one of the local flower shops) and nice romance gifts for workers to take home to loved ones
Remember your audience. If you want to be a destination, you need to do something truly unique that you think will be a sell for the market (I'm thinking along the lines of #1). Otherwise you need to cater to downtown workers and the spare resident (who probably also works DT).
Also, who's the operator and do you already own the building? Are you looking to operate as your business, hiring folks who can run what you're looking to run, or are you looking to sign a lease? I still find that there are too many unanswered questions that matter for the "general public" such as ourselves to give you ideas.
Quote from: simms3 on March 24, 2014, 10:34:25 PM
My votes would be for the following, taking into consideration location, the space, and the size:
1) Bread Pudding place (think fro-yo, but you choose the "bread", toppings, and the syrups that you want). Could do something else specialized like grilled cheese, ramen (educate yourself here before attempting...though Jaxsons probably aren't versed in the many styles like an Asian dominant SF population might be), pho, schwarma, etc etc
...
3) An excellent soup place that mainly serves to go (I guess maybe mixing it up by specializing in ramen or pho or something not or not commonly found in Jax/DT)
Yes!! For years I've been pining to open a ramen place in Jax (because of the "be the change you want to see in the city" mentality, not because of any ability or restaurant experience...which I don't have) I really want some good homemade asian noodle restaurant or ramen shop. That and Korean Fried Chicken. I think that would do well here...ramen maybe not so much.
As for pho, there's already lots of pretty good pho places throughout the city, including downtown and the urban core. Vietnamese population is decent here.
Quote from: simms3 on March 24, 2014, 10:34:25 PM
Remember your audience. If you want to be a destination, you need to do something truly unique that you think will be a sell for the market (I'm thinking along the lines of #1). Otherwise you need to cater to downtown workers and the spare resident (who probably also works DT).
Also, who's the operator and do you already own the building? Are you looking to operate as your business, hiring folks who can run what you're looking to run, or are you looking to sign a lease? I still find that there are too many unanswered questions that matter for the "general public" such as ourselves to give you ideas.
To recap a little -- I bought the building about two years ago for $300K .. and currently owe about $200K. Am just now beginning to clean out, and in a few months will begin renovating the three floors, making the two upper floors into apartments, each floor having three apartments. The apartments are already spoken for -- without advertising them. I have one more tenant, just in case somebody doesn't follow through. I will be borrowing about $600K to "do" the renovation.
So.... the ground floor use is my problem. Nothing has come to mind with impact so far; that is, for "me" to operate. I could of course, simply build it out with plumbing etc, for a restaurant, and see who wants to lease it. Although I could operate some kind of business myself in the spot, I am already occupied with my bookstore operation, and therefore am entertaining the idea of leasing to someone with an idea, the knowledge, and the energy to "do" an exciting fit for the area.
As I said before, my primary objective is not necessarily high profit, but it is to discover the best overall draw for the DT core area: especially something to be a draw for as many hours of the day as possible; i. e. ... not a place opening only during lunch.
The ideal would be to open something not existing in the outlying areas of the city, as this would tend to draw people into to DT. For example, my bookstore in DT at times will be the "only" place in northeast Florida which has a particular book title ...and on the rare occasion, the title is not on the Internet. This scenario almost "forces" the customer to drive into the DT core. Therefore, the more the new operation approaches the "unique" ... the better, as it will promote downtown visits...... which brings up the parking issue.
A digression ..... I still encounter the problem of "perception" about the "problem" of parking in the DT. Even today, a customer at my Roosevelt store said ... "Well, I would go to your DT store, but I can't find parking". The "parking problem", whether real or imagined, is in the mind of many these days, and apparently discourages potential business owners to open in the DT, and discourages "outsiders" from entering the DT to shop or visit.
The long-term solution might be the elimination of some of the meters, the establishment of some kind of mass transit to the DT so that people could get to DT "without having to use their autos", and last.... educate the public to the fact that the parking is not that bad, if they would use the various multilevel parking facilities throughout DT.
We might note that once more DT destinations exist, if they ever do, there will be more places to which outsiders might wish to visit, and therefore it would make more sense for them to park for longer periods in DT -- which means that they would be more inclined to use the longer-term multilevel parking facilities. Currently, people usually want to go to only one place or event in the DT during a visit, and therefore they want to park on the street ... which can be risky because of "tickets". Who wants to visit DT if they must fear the "ticket man" every time. Perhaps we should even the playing field, and limit parking times in all parking lots in the county to two hours. Talk about revenue for the city.
I hope the above gives a little insight into my problem of what to do with the ground floor of the 225 Laura St. building. As I've said, some people have a business idea, and search for a place to lease. I have a "space" to operate a business, but do not have a business idea. That's why I entertain leasing the space to anyone who does have an idea, and the experience and energy to push it through.
Fundamentally, the decision as to whether I would do best to lease out the space or to operate my own business there, will depend on how much somebody is willing to pay for rent. If I cannot get much out of the space via rent payments, it might be best for me to operate my own business in the space.
Once "the" idea for the space comes to mind, whether it is something I operate myself, or somebody leases the space to run their own operation, then all will be set for go.
I say gut the interior, make it an exterior space, put in some picnic tables, a couple bathrooms...and park a couple rotating food trucks in there. Or just make it a straight dining area and restroom area for the trucks parked at hemming plaza and lease the space to them or the city.
I completly agree about the "lack of parking DT" mentality. This seems to be one of the biggest problems with bringing suburbanites, including myself, DT. We've been so whipped into paranoia about getting a parking ticket that its so much nicer and less stressful to head to the SJTC, Avenues, or even Regency to avoid DT.
It doesn't matter what the City does to the Landing. Throw money at it to open it up, add some art, make it pretty, whatever. If Southside, Beaches, St Johns, Westside, or North side suburbanites can't park or even think they can't park, they aren't coming. If they don't come to spend money, DT remains stagnant. Period.
Anyway, I applaud you in your efforts. The small business community is an important element of this puzzle. Don't rush it, and don't push it. Assemble the right team or person to do it right. This thread actually had me a bit excited about DT development.
I believe downtown can become a vibrant "neighborhood" and business center without totally catering to suburbanites. I'd argue that a primary reason for its struggles comes from placing more priority on attracting suburbanites for short visits than making a place urbanites prefer to live in.
Quote from: southsider1015 on March 25, 2014, 08:40:46 AM
I completly agree about the "lack of parking DT" mentality. This seems to be one of the biggest problems with bringing suburbanites, including myself, DT. We've been so whipped into paranoia about getting a parking ticket that its so much nicer and less stressful to head to the SJTC, Avenues, or even Regency to avoid DT.
It doesn't matter what the City does to the Landing. Throw money at it to open it up, add some art, make it pretty, whatever. If Southside, Beaches, St Johns, Westside, or North side suburbanites can't park or even think they can't park, they aren't coming. If they don't come to spend money, DT remains stagnant. Period.
Anyway, I applaud you in your efforts. The small business community is an important element of this puzzle. Don't rush it, and don't push it. Assemble the right team or person to do it right. This thread actually had me a bit excited about DT development.
I agree with your idea of not rushing. At some point, a great and solid idea will arrive in somebody's mind. Perhaps they will be kind enough to convey it ...... that the idea will so good, that to pass it by would be almost foolish. The problem is that so many "customer demands" are met by the existing peripheral areas. The trick is to find a unique (as some have said) use, which will be a draw to DT .... something either not available in the suburbs, or something that will have enough DT customer patronage.
Quote from: thelakelander on March 25, 2014, 09:10:07 AM
I believe downtown can become a vibrant "neighborhood" and business center without totally catering to suburbanites. I'd argue that a primary reason for its struggles comes from placing more priority on attracting suburbanites for short visits than making a place urbanites prefer to live in.
Makes too much sense Lake. To hell with the suburbanites. Let's make a place for "us".... those who are in DT, and those who wish to enter. Let's build the DT without focusing on drawing from outside. We might even think about making the DT a gated core. ;D Seriously though, I think you've hit a good point about not focusing on drawing suburbanites.
Must get to work.
Quote from: thelakelander on March 25, 2014, 09:10:07 AM
I'd argue that a primary reason for its struggles comes from placing more priority on attracting suburbanites for short visits than making a place urbanites prefer to live in.
Truth.
I think it's both. There are too few people living in the downtown core for it not to cater to people living outside it, and those people by and large drive. I think everyone agrees the current parking situation can be frustrating regardless of the visitor's mentality. There are certainly ways to improve the current (over)supply of parking to make downtown more user friendly.
On the other hand, there are plenty of people who'll never be satisfied without dedicated parking immediately in front of where they're going. This isn't possible if we want a true urban environment, so there's only so far parking solutions will go. At a point there needs to be an understanding that this is one way an urban environment will differ from a suburban one.
Quote from: thelakelander on March 25, 2014, 09:10:07 AM
I believe downtown can become a vibrant "neighborhood" and business center without totally catering to suburbanites. I'd argue that a primary reason for its struggles comes from placing more priority on attracting suburbanites for short visits than making a place urbanites prefer to live in.
Maybe I'm biased because I am a suburbanite. Fact of the matter is that although they may be TRYING to cater to suburbanites, its frankly not working. What are some of the latest developments in trying to cater to suburbanites?
I just see "us" as those who have money to spend, and we're getting sick of Capital Grill and the rest of SJTC. I believe both urbanites and suburbanites are required for a vibrant DT. Can it start from those who currently live there? I'm no expert.
What about something specific to Jacksonville & it's history - keepsakes that might cater to locals & travelers? Vintage items (old maps, books, the prospect of locally re-purposed (think industrial/steampunk) items, windows, doors, office furniture - all with a local influence exclusively. And obviously, there's no shortage of home grown confections, coffees, BBQ sauce(s), and/or beers as well if you wanted to supplement. I know that on more than one occasion, I've had folks on the hunt for a memento and/or souvenir beyond the obligatory airport taffy with an alligator on the box. Local advertising, street signs, salvaged brick pavers, an Emory bike, a coffee mug from the Fox, Old Swisher cigar boxes, vintage postcards, music, photos, etc. etc.
How do your local books (Images of America / Arcadia Publishing) sell at the front of Chamblin's? I know that I've purchased a few. I presume that there must be some strategy and logic in keeping them by the register.
When not cleaning teeth, my wife dabbles with antiques & vintage items down in Clay County as a hobby - it's always the local stuff that consistently moves as long as it "tells the story". Locally embossed bottles (Coke, etc.), Rhodes furniture souvenir plate(s), JAX Beer advertising......Civic pride still runs rampant in North Florida, IMO.
My 2¢. Good luck & thanks for soliciting feedback. Perhaps you could set up a "Build Your Dream Shop" kiosk during One Spark.
Quote from: ronchamblin on March 25, 2014, 02:02:17 AM
As I said before, my primary objective is not necessarily high profit, but it is to discover the best overall draw for the DT core area: especially something to be a draw for as many hours of the day as possible; i. e. ... not a place opening only during lunch.
The ideal would be to open something not existing in the outlying areas of the city, as this would tend to draw people into to DT. For example, my bookstore in DT at times will be the "only" place in northeast Florida which has a particular book title ...and on the rare occasion, the title is not on the Internet. This scenario almost "forces" the customer to drive into the DT core. Therefore, the more the new operation approaches the "unique" ... the better, as it will promote downtown visits...... which brings up the parking issue.
A digression ..... I still encounter the problem of "perception" about the "problem" of parking in the DT. Even today, a customer at my Roosevelt store said ... "Well, I would go to your DT store, but I can't find parking". The "parking problem", whether real or imagined, is in the mind of many these days, and apparently discourages potential business owners to open in the DT, and discourages "outsiders" from entering the DT to shop or visit.
I still think the downtown worker is a forgotten demographic. We always think about either drawing suburbanites/tourists in or creating/catering to a DT residential base, but for any given downtown in America, Lower Manhattan included, the daytime worker comprises by far the largest population, and this will likely not change. It is a population that needs to be served as well, don't forget about them.
If downtown ever takes off as a downtown, with new residential, new office, etc etc, the Laura St block will be in the heart of the office district moreso than where the bulk of new residential is likely to be built and where people are likely to live. So bear that in mind.
Also, I mentioned record store on my shortlist almost because you operate a book store already and a coffee shop, and I think a record store could be sort of a hands free operation that you yourself can also run.
Quote from: thelakelander on March 25, 2014, 09:10:07 AM
I believe downtown can become a vibrant "neighborhood" and business center without totally catering to suburbanites. I'd argue that a primary reason for its struggles comes from placing more priority on attracting suburbanites for short visits than making a place urbanites prefer to live in.
I agree, and furthermore, 2,300 SF is too small a space to have a wide array of unique/one-of-a-kind destination options that would attract suburbanites in the first place. Also on my list was a bread pudding shop (which is a concept I'm familiar with since there is one near me - was the inspiration for sticking it on the list). It can be run out of that small square footage and possibly be unique and good enough to create a regional draw. But the list of things that could even bring suburbanites into that space is small.
Quote from: Tacachale on March 25, 2014, 10:03:03 AM
I think it's both. There are too few people living in the downtown core for it not to cater to people living outside it, and those people by and large drive. I think everyone agrees the current parking situation can be frustrating regardless of the visitor's mentality. There are certainly ways to improve the current (over)supply of parking to make downtown more user friendly.
On the other hand, there are plenty of people who'll never be satisfied without dedicated parking immediately in front of where they're going. This isn't possible if we want a true urban environment, so there's only so far parking solutions will go. At a point there needs to be an understanding that this is one way an urban environment will differ from a suburban one.
I agree with everything you say here (good quote +1000!). I also think we're forgetting the downtown worker. Nobody gives too much thought as to why companies don't see any compelling reason to be in DT Jax, but we do give plenty of thought as to why people don't care to visit or live there. In my line of work, we do give thought as to why a particular office location is so attractive - and it often has to do with the amenities immediately surrounding the building, and the energy that results. DT Jax seems like a miserable place to work, so maybe thinking of a use that targets the largest demographic that is there isn't such a horrible idea after all.
Quote from: blizz01 on March 25, 2014, 10:17:17 AM
What about something specific to Jacksonville & it's history - keepsakes that might cater to locals & travelers? Vintage items (old maps, books, the prospect of locally re-purposed (think industrial/steampunk) items, windows, doors, office furniture - all with a local influence exclusively. And obviously, there's no shortage of home grown confections, coffees, BBQ sauce(s), and/or beers as well if you wanted to supplement. I know that on more than one occasion, I've had folks on the hunt for a memento and/or souvenir beyond the obligatory airport taffy with an alligator on the box. Local advertising, street signs, salvaged brick pavers, an Emory bike, a coffee mug from the Fox, Old Swisher cigar boxes, vintage postcards, music, photos, etc. etc.
I love this idea.
I have long wanted there to be a store in downtown Jacksonville specializing in antiques and mementos that are specific to the area. The thought crosses my mind every time I see that Whetstonian house in LaVilla.
I found an Independent Life "There Is No Substitute For Life Insurance" thermometer on EBay a few weeks ago. Highlight of tax season.
Quote from: southsider1015 on March 25, 2014, 10:07:10 AM
Quote from: thelakelander on March 25, 2014, 09:10:07 AM
I believe downtown can become a vibrant "neighborhood" and business center without totally catering to suburbanites. I'd argue that a primary reason for its struggles comes from placing more priority on attracting suburbanites for short visits than making a place urbanites prefer to live in.
Maybe I'm biased because I am a suburbanite. Fact of the matter is that although they may be TRYING to cater to suburbanites, its frankly not working. What are some of the latest developments in trying to cater to suburbanites?
I just see "us" as those who have money to spend, and we're getting sick of Capital Grill and the rest of SJTC. I believe both urbanites and suburbanites are required for a vibrant DT. Can it start from those who currently live there? I'm no expert.
Unique vibrant urban environments tend to attract suburbanites as well because they offer an atmosphere that can't be duplicated elsewhere. Most unique vibrant urban environments are what they are initially because they become viable mixed-use neighborhoods first. Focus on enhancing the quality of life for those already in and around downtown and you'll soon discover suburbanites will start trickling in on their own to enjoy the end product.
Quote from: thelakelander on March 25, 2014, 12:45:58 PM
Quote from: southsider1015 on March 25, 2014, 10:07:10 AM
Quote from: thelakelander on March 25, 2014, 09:10:07 AM
I believe downtown can become a vibrant "neighborhood" and business center without totally catering to suburbanites. I'd argue that a primary reason for its struggles comes from placing more priority on attracting suburbanites for short visits than making a place urbanites prefer to live in.
Maybe I'm biased because I am a suburbanite. Fact of the matter is that although they may be TRYING to cater to suburbanites, its frankly not working. What are some of the latest developments in trying to cater to suburbanites?
I just see "us" as those who have money to spend, and we're getting sick of Capital Grill and the rest of SJTC. I believe both urbanites and suburbanites are required for a vibrant DT. Can it start from those who currently live there? I'm no expert.
Unique vibrant urban environments tend to attract suburbanites as well because they offer an atmosphere that can't be duplicated elsewhere. Most unique vibrant urban environments are what they are initially because they become viable mixed-use neighborhoods first. Focus on enhancing the quality of life for those already in and around downtown and you'll soon discover suburbanites will start trickling in on their own to enjoy the end product.
Can't disagree with this. Sounds spot on.
I cannot disagree either. The only problem I see with leaving Jacksonville's suburbia out of the equation is when we start needing money for project x and project y. Most of our taxpayers are out in suburbia and we need to convince them that the money needed for projects x and y benefit them also. I think for these projects requiring tax money... we will need suburbia's buy in...
$.02 8)
The idea of a pop-up sounds super cool.
I also LOVE the idea of the "rich" bar...with classic cocktails, classic style, rich mahogany, etc. Bartenders in a vest and bow tie polishing the glasses...a piano player...velvet couches...yes, yes, yes.
It could also be used during the day as more of a restaurant, keeping in the style of a 1920's deli as far as the menu goes. I saw on this site the menu of an old downtown restaurant and was surprised and how differently we eat now...a nod back to that decade would be fun...but I wouldn't get to expansive with the menu. Maybe just have a couple of staples coupled with seasonal options. The daytime menu would be to keep it as a contributing space during the day, but with a primary focus as it being a "rich lounge" at night?
Great ideas flowing. Thanks for doing something great for downtown!
Quote from: BridgeTroll on March 25, 2014, 03:43:55 PM
I cannot disagree either. The only problem I see with leaving Jacksonville's suburbia out of the equation is when we start needing money for project x and project y. Most of our taxpayers are out in suburbia and we need to convince them that the money needed for projects x and y benefit them also. I think for these projects requiring tax money... we will need suburbia's buy in...
$.02 8)
I'm not really a fan of asking suburbia to immediately fund downtown projects either, unless they are regional in nature (which would apply to similar projects in suburbia as well). Outside of something like an aquarium meant to lure suburbia to DT, what type of projects can't be initially built without local suburbia having to pay higher taxes?
but suburbia's buy in is not necessarily based upon them funding it. To me their buy in is more on who they put in office, either as mayor or their council member. I am a suburbanite that hugely supports downtown and really one of the main reasons, ok who am i kidding actually the only reason why I voted for Brown. I will also support the local council candidate that would be most supportive of downtown.
And yea I realize the support of those for downtown is funding per se, but many candidates say what type of actual funding they will provide for downtown but more in generalities as to they want to focus on downtown. So first at least get the suburbanite to get on board with the focus on downtown and they they will hopefully be more eager to fund it.
Ron, I have your concept: Third space book bar a la Asheville's Battery Park Book Exchange and Champagne Bar (http://www.batteryparkbookexchange.com/).
You may know about it already, but this is a relatively new (2011 in this location) spot in downtown Asheville. As the name implies, it combines a high end used book store with a fancy wine bar. It's located in the beautiful Grove Arcade building in a fairly upscale, touristy part of Asheville, but I think a "Jaxed up" version of the concept could be a big success in our downtown.
Battery Park Book Exchange is about 2000 square feet in the Grove Arcade, with some outdoor seating as well. The main area includes two bars and a lounge surrounded by book shelves. The rest of the shelves wind back into a maze of additional sections similar to both Chamblins stores. The most interesting feature is that the rest of the tables are located throughout the maze, which customers can reserve to read, converse and enjoy a glass of wine among the books. I didn't see table service but in every other way it was like getting a table in Dos Gatos or Bold Bean.
Here are some pictures from their website. The main lounge in the front of the store:
(http://www.batteryparkbookexchange.com/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/dopwgg/uploads/1AsCtZgnAGtObryDrZXOZa2RMkkatqx5HqB8ZN3sWe3XbFOS1AjAjn8n9ASxGmRYQ.jpg)
Befitting Asheville, the bar is serious business. Specialty wines, coffees, and "grazing" items like cheese plates are served, making for a nice change of pace in Beer City USA:
(http://www.batteryparkbookexchange.com/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/dopwgg/uploads/dOqHW4GRdbOg1bA1TEcXLfbDrKFQmaRT81KChcsm1O5eOZfr61SPMEnBk6hM2BGFd.jpg)
The other tables are all tucked away in the different sections of the bookstore. Some are decorated to fit the section they're in:
(http://www.batteryparkbookexchange.com/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/dopwgg/uploads/syXefHssMNWb5Cdy5R857H26SdWkm11a6HLT9RfF6Lw4ydATqgOsRPkHPyTA8fLFp.jpg)
Creating a concept along these lines would allow you to build on something you already do very well, and which you're well known for in the community (books). You mentioned before you were thinking of using the space for your rare and high end books; this would be a perfect fit for the book bar (among other things - the Book Exchange seems to focus on hardcovers and more expensive books). I don't know that a "champagne bar" would be a huge hit in downtown Jacksonville right now, but switch it to "craft beer and wine bar" and you'd find your niche without a doubt. Grab a liquor license and add "rich bar cocktails" and you've got yourself a slam dunk. It would allow you to do something cool and new without having to build up an entirely new inventory. However, you could add all sorts of things like the ones everyone has named here to compliment it - art, coffee, maps, local items, science equipment, haberdashery, you name it.
It would also give you a new revenue stream that hits people up for hours after Chamblin's closes. The Book Exchange is open Monday-Saturday from 11 am to 11 pm (http://www.batteryparkbookexchange.com/location), and Sundays from 11 am to 9 pm. Keeping that kind of schedule lets them capture lunchtime and afternoon meeting business, happy hour seekers, and the night time crowd. If you did something like that you'd create a hotspot open most of the day, even if you cut out (say) Sunday and Monday. You'd miss out on breakfast, but then you wouldn't be competing with your own cafe.
Judging by what I saw last weekend, the Book Exchange is popular despite competition from at least three other book stores in Downtown Asheville. When we were there, one group we saw had scheduled a business meeting over coffee in the stacks, and virtually every table throughout the store was reserved for 5 or 6 o'clock. Other places have done the "book bar" concept, but this was easily the coolest I've ever been to. If anyone can do it one better, it's Ron F***ing Chamblin.
^^That wine and bookstore looks seriously cool! That would be a popular destination.
Yes that looks very nice imo.
I'll have to say that the concept of the book exchange / bar / salon looks quite interesting. Having the tables and chairs (some soft) ... espresso, beer, and wine..... and a much more "open" kind of atmosphere than in my existing stores would produce a unique and interesting ambience. I suspect that the place would be an excellent meeting place, where one could reserve a table or an area, or it could be simply a place where people can read and have conversation.
As I think out loud ..... The place would, to some degree, remind one of the 16th thru the 19th century salons of Europe one reads about. Perhaps, to encourage conversation, there could be no Wi-Fi ... maybe not? The decor could include images of historical figures we've heard of - those who enjoyed the salons in France and elsewhere before, during, and after the Enlightenment era.
The place could be for conversation and thinking on a level not normally found in most peoples working days; that is, unless one is engaged in a university environment. In order to have occasional music, book signings, poetry, or speakers on interesting subjects, we could do the layout so that everything could be moved to the side so as to provide room for chairs/audience, and a podium. The revenue for the operation would come from the sale of drinks, food, and books. The books would be limited to histories, classic and modern literature, biographies, philosophy, the humanities, the sciences, etc. The hours could extend into the evening ... perhaps until 10:00 or 11:00 p.m.
Perhaps too, in the rear, we could have a coffee roaster operation, and a fresh bakery operation, for donuts and pastries.
Something to think about. Thanks Tacachale. And thanks everyone for the ideas. I will read over and digest what you've all been so kind to suggest. :)
BTW, for those interested in the process of "doing" a building, I recently had an asbestos survey on the building ($1,050.00). The report showed a kind of asbestos material under the old carpets (400 sq. ft. or so). This fact causes me to hire a qualified contractor to remove the carpet (Cost??). I presume that I cannot, even with respirators and proper clothing, remove the carpet - surely because I could not be trusted to protect the adjacent environment from residual and possibly airborne asbestos. This makes sense, so I am prepared to pay to have it done.
There is a 7/24 French bakery in Charlotte's NoDa district that does very well and I think is in the same SF range as what you have available. People drive there from all over the city. The NoDA location is the flagship, but they expanded into Uptown and a SC suburb too.
The concept from Asheville is a good one too.
http://www.ameliesfrenchbakery.com/
Here are some pieces on Batter Park Book Exchange from local publications. Both have some nice photos as well.
Mountain Xpress:
http://www.mountainx.com/article/631/Battery-Park-Book-Exchange-opens-in-new-digs
Quote
Battery Park Book Exchange opens in new digs
By Mackensy Lunsford on 02/03/2011 06:17 PM
The new home for the Battery Park Book Exchange is a labyrinthine place, straight out of a scene from the Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam. The floors are covered in oriental carpets, the walls drenched in rich, warm colors. Mazes of tall bookshelves, filled with volumes on every subject, frame tiny lamp-lit coves, perfect for hiding away with a glass of wine and a rare find.
Owner Thomas Wright recently moved his volumes, wine cellar and gorgeous collection of furniture and sophisticated curio and oddities from the Battery Park Apartments to this brightly lit corner of the Grove Arcade after a parking dispute ruffled some feathers.
And the move seems to have served the champagne bar well. Now that the business has set up shop in the space, it's hard to imagine what else could occupy the admittedly odd arrangement so fully and warmly. "It's an odd space," says manager Emily Krainik. "It's very conducive to a bookstore, but not conducive to a lot of other things."
...
Our State (May 2013):
http://www.ourstate.com/battery-park-book-exchange/
Quote
The Battery Park Book Exchange
By Katie Saintsing
Photography by Steven McBride
At this eclectic bookstore in Asheville's Grove Arcade, wine and espresso entice as many customers as the 30,000 gently used books. Here, old and new collide in a rich, decadent decor that resembles the arcade's original purpose: to create an ambiance of extravagance.
...
After a long career in industrial chemical manufacturing and restaurant management, Thomas Wright wanted to do something different. In 2004, he bought a bookstore in Little Switzerland, and in 2009, he started the Battery Park Book Exchange in Asheville's Battery Park Hotel, before moving to the nearby Grove Arcade in 2011. Wright knew that it would take more than books to pay the rent, so he added coffee, wine, and specialty snacks, like cheese and charcuterie, to the store's offerings. The champagne, he says, was inspired by his wife's love of sparkling wines.
Although they started out as a novelty and a financial necessity, the browsing beverages elevate this place. It's not just another used bookstore; it's a sophisticated parlor of a place, with rich, red walls and granite countertops. But the armchairs and ambient lighting make it comfortable, too.
"We try to celebrate literature through hospitality," Wright says. "It's a nice place where books and literature are honored."
And, although he'll tell you it was unintentional, he'll acknowledge that the store honors Asheville. The stately furniture and the old books, the fizzy drinks and the fancy food — they call to mind the old aspirations of a city realized.
...
The Battery Park Book Exchange works so well because of its devotion to the concept and to fitting with the community. Other places have tried a "book bar" concept, but this is hands-down the coolest I've ever seen. Sometimes they're basically just a bar with some books for sale. More often, they're really just book stores that add a bar an as extra revenue stream to support the main focus. The Book Exchange marries both elements perfectly, with the tables scattered through the stacks. Like in Chamblin's, you're never more than a few feet away from books on at least 3 sides, even as you're sipping on your wine or coffee.
Ron, the environment is very much like a salon. It's very well set up for meetings and such. It seems the only reason they do table reservations is because the place gets busy in the evening; during the day there were plenty of tables available. They also host events and readings and people can have special events and parties there. And of course pets are welcome, if not mandatory.
Whatever you decide, it would be cool if you did something to celebrate James Weldon Johnson (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Weldon_Johnson), Jacksonville's #1 man in education and one of the most impressive people this town and state has ever produced. Author of
The Autobiography of an Ex-Colored Man, "Lift Every Voice and Sing", creator of the high school at Stanton - definitely someone I'd like to have a drink with at Chamblin's!
(http://darrow.law.umn.edu/photos/James%20Weldon%20Johnson.jpg)
"Lift ev'ry glass to celebrate local heroes."
As a Filipino, I don't think Downtown is a place for Asian food or markets -- yet. Everyone who's Asian knows to head to Sandalwood/Kernan/Westside (particularly where Naval families settled) for Southeastern Asian staples and restaurants, Baymeadows for Little India, and the Town Center and maybe Riverside/Avondale for some "sushi/nigiri".
Too many Filipinos, one of the largest minority populations, dismiss Downtown as a dangerous place. I wouldn't expect execution of that business plan to result in anything but a negative ROI and dissolution of the business in less than 6 months.
Thanks for the additional info, Tacachale. I continue to think about the bookstore/salon/bar idea. I think it would fit well downtown, and would certainly be the only one of its kind in the area.
FYI, we continue to clean out the building, and will soon have a contractor remove the asbestos/carpet ($1,800 for about 400 sq. ft.). Next step is to perform some light ceiling, floor, wall demo. Then the architect will continue on the drawings he started about a year ago.
Once we get the drawings complete, and the usual approvals, the general contractor can begin work. Somewhere along the line, I will have to obtain a loan to finish all three floors.
But .... yes ..... I like the idea you submitted. Although a restaurant would be an option, your idea seems much more interesting. I intend to add supply and drain plumbing, and electrical, to accommodate a restaurant, just in case someone wants to open one down the road.
There will be evening hours or course, both in the book/bar/salon, and the bookstore. Now if we could get something in the Magnificat space that would open in the evenings, we would have the beginnings of an active "evening" strip on Laura. Jerry's La Cena is already open evenings. And if anything comes of the Snyder across the street, so that it might open in the evenings, we might finally begin to enliven the core on that block. Once this block is started up a little, perhaps some new businesses will open in the Elk's Building.
The Barnett building, which is rumored to be in the works, via the hard work by Steve Atkins (sp?), has great potential on the ground floor. It looks like the entire lower floor can be opened up to lease a few spaces to small businesses, both on Laura and on Adams.
I might attempt to email this Atkins fellow, and let him know that I wish to offer any support and ideas possible from my limited assets, which unfortunately does not include money at this time. I don't know what is going on with the trio and the Barnett building. Perhaps I can at least help him oppose those who oppose him on the project, if there are any. In any case, if he is able to complete the projects, it will provide a big push down the road to revitalizing downtown.
Just a heads up Ron, there will be a salon / mani / pedi place opening on the first floor of City Place next to Avocado's in the coming weeks.
Quote from: jaxjaguar on March 28, 2014, 09:40:38 PM
Just a heads up Ron, there will be a salon / mani / pedi place opening on the first floor of City Place next to Avocado's in the coming weeks.
Different kind. I refer to the salon .... as in a gathering place..... for the express purpose of meeting and talking. And of course, we will have books and tables/chairs..... beer, wine, and espresso/coffee. Can't wait.
Could you also have periodic small events, on an intimate scale, such as readings, lectures and musical performances?
Quote from: billy on March 29, 2014, 09:15:29 AM
Could you also have periodic small events, on an intimate scale, such as readings, lectures and musical performances?
Absolutely. I envision having all types of night gatherings. The layout would be such that we could open up the middle area when the event required a performer (music etc) or lecturer.
But yes..... good musical performances -- solo guitarists etc. Lectures or talks on interesting subjects. Discussions ..... debates ...... Who knows, we might even settle the question, once and for all, as to whether or not any gods actually exist - and if they do, which one is the best.
The place would be designed so as to be an interesting and pleasant third place hangout .... a meeting place .... a place to have a beer or an espresso .... a place to explore books and ideas .... a place to meet and fall in love .... a place to fall out of love.
What of a name? How about "The Core" ? .... no, sounds too .... How about "The North Bank" .... no, doesn't sound right. How about "Meslier's" ? (after Jean Meslier (1664-1729), a French Catholic Priest, who wrote "Testament", which was published after his death. Perhaps pronounced something like MAHLIAY ??
Also, i'm thinking that, in the rear, we could have a micro-brewery on one side, and a coffee roasting operation on the other -- with a bakery setup in the middle. I made my own beer in the sixties, and I will only say that it spoiled me, as I could not enjoy the "store" beer during the years I was brewing.
In any case, I am seriously settling on the idea of the bookstore/bar/salon, which was offered by Tacachale. I don't know who he or she is, but I will offer to him or her some free beer, espresso, and/or pastries for a couple of weeks -- when we open up. If he or she desires to remain "Tacachale the Anonymous", a motorcycle helmet with a smoked shield could be worn inside the place while consuming whatever he or she desires. Or ... a simple paper bag over the head would do.
Although some of the other suggestions seem quite good, I will leave those to any others who might soon open up in the DT core.
How about calling it:
Random Thought
The Dystopian Dugout
Cerebral Pleasures
Thinkin' and Drinkin'
The DT's
The Crucible
Moulin Ron
Arby's
Delirium
The Crucible .....
sounds interesting billy
....
Quote from: ronchamblin on March 30, 2014, 10:33:11 AM
The Crucible .....
sounds interesting billy
....
Remove the"the". Call it Crucible.
Similar to Facebook :)
I'll trade you the naming rights for a pastry to be determined.
The Arthur Miller estate may want one as well.
I agree with southsider1015.
Agreed on the pastry ... and we can throw in a beer to two .... or espresso.
.... Crucible .... the Crucible ..... Crucible Salon ...... Crucible Cafe & Books ..... Crucible Salon & Books ......
I'm thinking of a name that might describe the place .....which might not be necessary of course, once people in the area know what it is.
From the dictionary:
cru·ci·ble noun \ˈkrü-sə-bəl\
: a pot in which metals or other substances are heated to a very high temperature or melted
: a difficult test or challenge
: a place or situation that forces people to change or make difficult decisions
I occasionally compare discussions around a table, with those on a forum such as MJ. Each seem to have advantages and disadvantages. For example, face-to-face discussions can be dominated by someone with a loud voice and a persistent wish to be heard, even if their words seldom make good sense. However, face-to-face allows one to exercise the ability to speak quickly, from the mind of the moment. And the face-to-face discussion allows more accurate communication, as the emotions are conveyed by the countenance, and the movement of the hands.
The forum however, allows more time to think about what one wishes to say...... to avoid outbursts of emotion which might show in a face-to-face.
Lastly .... the face-to-face, as a consequence of having too many present lacking self control, can turn to semi-chaos, and therefore little gain on a subject.
There are more aspects to compare, but I have taxes to do. :'(
Chautauqua?
A customer/friend visited this afternoon. We sat at a table in the cafe. I asked him for feedback about the idea of the cafe/salon/bar/bookstore for the 225 Laura Bldg.
He immediately asked if I had been to Riverside lately .... Park ... King ....Stockton. I said that I've been, and that it was really developing. He said that I should put my energy and assets into that area, because the DT core is simply not the place to be.
I acknowledged that it would be easier to have a business in the expanding area of Riverside/Avondale, but that it would be ...... well, too easy, that we must begin, at some point, the process of growth in the city core.
I acknowledged that it seems difficult in the DT core because of the huge buildings having ground level granite and concrete faces on the sidewalks. How could any small business engage this kind of environment? We need to conserve and have more of the small spaces that are more suited to the small businesses. I suggested that if the Barnett building is ever "opened" on the ground floor, there would be many opportunities for small businesses to open on Laura and Adams.
He immediately offered the problem of parking downtown. I acknowledged the problem, but said that is why we must do something about a better transit system to and from the outlying areas so that people could travel to and from the DT core with convenience .... adding that the project would be expensive, but it would preclude the necessity of having parking lots all over .... and effective mass transit would solve the "parking problem".
When the time is right, as things progress, it might be wise to open the ground floors of selected large buildings to allow spaces for small businesses. Parks, even small, one block in size, add variety and ambience to a DT. Perhaps one or two of the former demolished building locations can be turned into parks. A park would certainly be better than building a multi-level parking garage.
In fact, if we ever develop a decent transit system connecting the DT to the outlying areas, we might consider demolishing one or two of the existing multi-level parking garages, and replacing them with parks. There is nothing uglier than a multi-level parking garage. We might need some DT ..... but we don't need a huge number of these concrete beasts.
Has a post-WWII free-standing parking garage ever been demo'd in Jax? I'm drawing a blank. Would be a nice sight someday. Although there are plenty of surface lots to replace first, at much lower costs.
Ron, we have indeed met, I'll PM you. I'm definitely not anonymous, but I always appreciate free beer any time, any place, especially if it's as cool a place as this is certain to be. I'm glad you like the idea.
Here are my name suggestions:
The James Weldon (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Weldon_Johnson) Salon (& Books)
Salon Chamblin
Café Laudonnière (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&profile=default&search=Ren%C3%A9+Goulaine+de+Laudonni%C3%A8re&fulltext=Search)
Nahiabo Salon (the Timucua word for "knowledge")
The Publick Sphere, a similar concept to the "salon"
Church (so people can say "I'm going to Church" when they pop out for a drink)
Chamblin's Downtown, just to throw people off
I also agree that "Crucible" without "The" is a pretty tight name.
How about The Hemming Way. The drinking and books would be for Ernest Hemingway and the extra 'm' in the name for Hemming Plaza.
Quote from: edjax on April 01, 2014, 05:10:07 PM
How about The Hemming Way. The drinking and books would be for Ernest Hemingway and the extra 'm' in the name for Hemming Plaza.
Creative edjax ... something to think about ..... However, if we were to relate to an individual, I'm thinking of someone associated less with literature, and more with philosophy, or the struggle for human rights, especially someone who has suffered (banishment, prison, burning at the stake, etc.) as a consequence of writing for human rights.
Loving these name suggestions.
Building on Cafe Laudonniere (sort of), I'd love to see someone revive the old Ribault Room name for a gathering space.
The 5 Awesome Apartments article prompted me to dig this up. What's the latest, Ron?
Actually Finehoe, I just wrote the below on another thread (225 N. Laura: Downtown Core Renovation Project). But I just realized that I did not say anything about the first floor use ... which is what I have been trying to decide over the months.
First floor: I've still not decided on the use of it, but I do know that we will at least set it up for a restaurant; that is, plumbing, electrical, grease trap, hood etc., so that in the event that I or someone else want to "do" a restaurant, doing so will require little renovation.
I still consider using the first floor as a bookstore/salon/cafe ... having expresso, wine, beer ... and also several large round tables around which people could gather for meetings to simply discuss things The idea would be to provide a place to meet .. business meetings ... or simply casual meetings for people to chat. Also, we could have presentation or talks by various people about subjects of interest ... having a lectern etc. The tables could be moved so as to position the speaker properly.
The books would be of the fine hardcover type ... mostly non-fiction ... philosophy, sciences, history, humanities, political science etc. Although most books would be hardcover ... and nice sets ... many would be the quality trade paperbacks covering various non-fiction subjects.
I realize that a restaurant would perhaps make more money, but I am thinking that the salon/cafe idea would add a needed cultural plus for the downtown (something different) .. plus fill a need for a place for serious discussions and debates on subjects of interest. I certainly would not be a speaker or moderator, but I know enough capable and interesting individuals who would add great content to any presentation. We would of course, have evening hours at this location.
(The following was today recently put on another thread)
We started demo work in 2013, but I had to pull off the project for a few months to apply money and labor to other things. And too ... I've been paying down debt, restructuring loans, and paying back taxes ... all so that I can gain the confidence of the banks to lend the $600K to $700K or so I'll need to finish the 225 renovations. My credit is A+, but I must get my monthly outlay down so as to have room for more debt ... the American Way.
Even though the architect has already drawn preliminary plans, there has been a little change on the apartment numbers. My original intention was to reduce the number of apartments from the existing five per level (appropriate for the 1920's) to three per level ... giving a total of six on the two upper floors. But someone suggested that there would be an advantage to having only two apartments per level, thereby increasing the apartment size to an average of 1,000 sq. ft. each. But a greater advantage arrives from the fact that instead of having to utilize space for six a/c units, six washer/dryers, six kitchens, six bathrooms etc .. I would contend with only two of these items per level. Also, I would be dealing with only four tenants instead of six -- leaving me with only four people to not pay the rent.
But a new idea came to me yesterday about the roof ... and I talked about it briefly with the architect today. The current roof has a white plastic type "membrane" placed over it. The roof is approximately 30' x 80'. The membrane I suspect was installed because the roof environment is so deteriorated (I haven't yet crawled up in the attic space), that they simply did not want to rebuild it to accommodate a standard roof. Upon looking up into the attic/roof area, I noticed evidence of a former fire ... charred wood etc. So I think that might have something to do with the decision to install the membrane.
But .. back to the new idea. I'm thinking that instead of replacing the membrane in another ten or fifteen years, I would remove the membrane in the early stages of renovation (late 2015/early 2016) ... before we install anything in the building that can be damaged by water ... and rebuild the entire roof structure to accommodate a strong flat "walkable roof", so that I can have tables and chairs n'stuff on the roof. In other words, the residents, and perhaps some cafe customers, could have a rooftop environment from which to gaze upon the sun and the park etc etc. There is no elevator in the building ... a condition that might cause a "code" problem with inviting restaurant customers to the roof.
In any case, it would be great to have a roof-top lounging setup. The view of the park and the surrounding area would be beautiful. And ... the extra cost of the project could be somewhat offset by a slight addendum to the rent ... as some residents might be willing to pay a little extra for having the view available by simply walking up the stairs to the roof.
Also, in anticipation of future severe economic crashes or depressions, the roof lounge would provide an excellent platform or starting point from which anyone could perform a suicide jump to the sidewalk below. This convenience however, might be diminished by the proposed large awning below, similar in size to that of the adjacent bookstore. The awning should be of little concern however, because unless the jumper suffers from immobility, and given that the roof is flat, a good run could prepare one's jump to clear the awning. In any case, besides providing a gate for the jumper ... as the perimeter must be fenced ... we will provide a sign on the east edge of the building, on the gate perhaps, warning any jumpers that they should consider a little extra oomph to clear the awning.
Quotethe roof lounge would provide an excellent platform or starting point from which anyone could perform a suicide jump to the sidewalk below.
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
You are quite welcomed ICP. I try to entertain when in the mood during my midnight insomnia. :) :) :) :) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
I'm glad you're still thinking of the bookstore-salon concept, Ron. That really would be cool. Here's a pic I took last summer at Asheville's Battery Park Book Exchange and Champagne Bar.
(https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10551016_10154436545895203_515442508794261090_n.jpg?oh=7382dcc847254b233b148cee5dc97795&oe=556DBF8E)
This could be us
So is this still a thing?
UNFurbanist ... you must be psychic. We were inside today, making plans for the return to the project ..after a long time recovering from some financial doldrums, and just plain being busy. I will ramble along with the current ideas on the project.
Some might recall that I bought the building in 2012 for $300K ... and almost lost it when I forgot about a $192K balloon note due last June. I scrambled around for months to borrow cash to save the building, and came up with part of the funds myself ... selling drugs on the side ;)... and borrowed the remainder from friends. I needed help, and usual when you are desperate, banks smile and watch you suffer ... they would have let me lose this building in spite of the fact that in 40 years of business, I've paid every penny I've ever borrowed ... on time. i don't want sympathy or anything else, but I've worked seven days per week for most of those years to ensure a strong business, and that all debts are paid. I've takin only three weeks vacation during those 40 years. What kind of history and security do they want? After seeing what some underwriters do .... and the sometimes absurd decisions they make in the "back" offices ...I find myself wanting to see what these intellectual giants look like. Banks have no balls, and little common sense.
In any case, two banks have recently offered to "do" the construction loan ($500K ... $700K ... don't know yet) for the project, one having called me just yesterday to inquire about how things were going. Also, just today, I talked with the general contractor about getting the structural engineer to visit the building to review options on changing the lower floor columns. Me, the engineer, and the general contractor will meet next week.
The architect has completed about the 60% of the drawings, and is waiting for us to let him know which of the upper walls are load bearing.
The Hemming Park group, who were using the lower floor for storage (I think for free), have 98% of their material out of the building. Tomorrow, you will see my truck in the morning, removing boxes of books from the lower floor. And for the next several weeks you will see us removing demo material from the building.
The concept has changed somewhat. I am now going to have a total of four apartments, not six ... two apartments on the 2nd floor, and two on the third floor. Each will be two-bedroom. The largest will be almost 1,200 sq. ft., and the smallest will be around 850 sq. ft. Because the stairway rises in the middle of the building, there will be two apartments facing Laura, and two in the rear. This will allow us to remove the hallways, using the extra space for living.
The lower level is going to be fun. Basically we are going to fit it out for a restaurant, the kitchen being in the rear, to the left. The restrooms in the rear, a little to the right of center. Right in front of the kitchen/restroom area, facing Laura, will be a small stage for live music, poetry, comedy, readings, etc. Also, a prof wants to use it for philosophy group meetings.
There will hardback books on both the north and south walls ... history, philosophy, humanities, biography, psychology, etc .... and a few round tables throughout. Although the books will be for sale, the ambience is the objective. I want to have a soft lighting effect ... giving a warm look to the place. The sound system must be done by a professional.
There will be a bar up front, on the left, spilling onto a patio, next to the sidewalk. Although the entry door will be on the right, the architect and me decided to have the entire front wall either drawn upward, or to the side via the accordion method, so that, when opened, anyone walking on the sidewalk can see the stage and hear the music. (weather permitting) The square footage will allow only 50 people in the place, so the spill out to the sidewalk will be a big plus, especially during art walk etc, or during live music events. I think it will be great to have a scenario wherein people could walk the sidewalk and feel the invite as they walk by.
Some might remember when the $37,000 or so that I applied for as a grant was sorta approved, but was held up until I determined exactly what I was going to do with the lower floor. I guess I had better get with them to see if I can provide them with enough firm details so they can let loose the money. I really don't need it at this point however. The need will come later this year.
So .... if anyone has any ideas for the lower floor, let me know. I would like to set upon a good name for the place. Also, I have not yet set upon a type of food for the restaurant. Don't want subs... hot dogs ... chicken .. pizza .. How about comfort food ... simple food. I don't know. The bookstore/cafe already does vegan etc. People like that, but we must arrive at something proper and different for the new place. Of course, there is the option to simply lease out the restaurant space to someone who knows what they are doing.
The hours? I think that, given how much easier it will be to operate the new place, as compared to the bookstore/cafe, we can open longer hours, perhaps every night until nine or so. The restaurant part could serve breakfast and lunch at least. And then, depending on what happens, perhaps dinner down the road. The afternoons and evenings would be for people to visit and do Internet ... talk ...read .... have meetings .... listen to good music etc. Beer, wine, espresso/coffee and snacks will be available always, as in the evening when the restaurant part is closed.
We must place some sound barrier material between the first and second floors because of the live music on occasion. Or ... we could simply have 2nd floor tenants who are almost deaf.
In any case, I think the place will be a great addition to the core. It will provide several good jobs for the core too ... and paying spots for musicians. And it should be there a while, as I will own the building, and not have to worry about a landlord raising the rent .... pushing me out.
I just reviewed the earlier posts and see where some possible names and menu's have been offered. Thanks you all for your ideas. I will read back over and absorb what I can from the earlier posts.
Cajun inspired Tapas . . . and beer!
Ya' know the urban core could use a good empanada place, just sayin'...
If you opened a Cajun place, awwwwwwww shiiiiiiit I would like that.
Meatloaf, Mac and Cheese, Lasagna, all those good comfort type foods.
There is a definitely an abundance of "southern comfort" food places. So whatever it is make sure it has the draw to pull in people from around the core.
I like the tapas idea due to my envisioning of the space: A place to hang out and socialize opposed to a place to sit down and dine.
Personally, I would make like to see north African themed menu, Magrebh (sic) I believe. Such a wide range of flavors are possible in your mouth-hole when you start mashing up mediterranean and arab cuisines.
Quote from: Non-RedNeck Westsider on February 25, 2016, 12:00:27 PM
I like the tapas idea due to my envisioning of the space: A place to hang out and socialize opposed to a place to sit down and dine.
Personally, I would make like to see north African themed menu, Magrebh (sic) I believe. Such a wide range of flavors are possible in your mouth-hole when you start mashing up mediterranean and arab cuisines.
Maghreb. And yeah, that would be a great idea, places like that are quite popular around here, especially if you did it really well.
Since we are in Florida after all, I think something along the lines of a family / Mongolian style crab-seafood boil would be awesome. Put the chef in the center of the room, with gumbo's, fresh local seafood and a crab boil, and customer's come up to order directly from the chef. Put long family size tables around, so people can dine with a variety of folks, not just the one's you came with.
A Tapas bar would be awesome! Then you can really mix and match and be as creative or simple as you want! Cajun or African flavors would be very welcome in the core I think. I'll have to think of a name. So glad things are finally moving forward :)
Any new updates Ron?
Thanks for asking Urb.
Well .... been busy ... out of cash ... and have been waiting for my best worker to be freed up so that he can demo and provide needed info so the architect can complete the dwgs. We have to verify the load bearing walls. There are so many. We will remove most so as to configure the best apartment layouts. My worker is scheduled to start .. with a helper ... in two weeks ... three at the most.
The one fellow who was going to help has, as of about a week ago, been put in jail for 13 months. I was at the court session. After the public defender (useless fellow) and the judge (incompetent) maneuvered everything so as to ensure that this fellow did go to jail, they huddled and smiled at each other, apparently happy that they sent another poor black fellow to jail. This fellow did not deserve to go to jail for 13 months, as there was no intent to do harm to anyone. But ... that's another story.
Also, I am maneuvering my finances so as to get a construction loan when it's time to get the contractor involved, which by the way is "Breaking Ground" .... a wonderful company to work with. Mary Tappouni has done one new-build addition for me, and one renovation ... which was the Laura Street bookstore cafe.
So ... yes, we haven't lost interest, lost sight, nor forgotten. It's a matter time and energy, and a matter of money. But ... we are finally getting ready to proceed. Soon you will see my dump trailer out front, being filled with stuff.
And unless someone is the city has become angered with me, I am still due to get the $37,000 grant from the city ... for the first floor work. All I must do is provide a solid business plan for the first floor.
But ... yes, I am getting impatient ... and must get going on this thing. The delay has been necessary for the most part, but I tire of it.
I understand how these things go sometimes. Just keep at it and I'm sure it will turn out to be a great space! Have you decided on the downstairs concept? Tapas, reading and music perhaps? Best of luck!
Any new updates to report on, Ron?
Quote from: Jax96 on January 03, 2017, 12:46:38 AM
Any new updates to report on, Ron?
Tnx for asking Jax96 ... I am meeting with a structural engineer and general contractor this morning to discuss the solution to the weakened main east/west wooden 80 foot beam on the lower floor. All is stable, but I want to ensure that the beam issue is resolved. We will probably replace the wooden beam with steel, which will allow us to reduce the five wooden columns (some weakened too) to only two of steel ... with new footings. I'll update in general after the meeting, perhaps in the morning.
Met with the contractor and engineer Jax96 yesterday. Looks like we will use three 26 foot long steel I-beams between the first and second floor -- running east to west with only two steel columns instead of five wooden; thereby giving more room for tables, and providing greater visibility for people to see the stage at the rear ... upon which we will occasionally have old fashioned burlesque shows late into the night. Currently we have six deteriorated 13 foot wooden beams, each made up of five 2" x 10", sandwiched together.
BTW, the primary reason for the beam and joist deterioration is that fact that over the many decades since its construction in 1904, the owners allowed plumbing leaks to soak the various wood pieces, thus allowing the rotting of some beams and joists. For example, about 80 percent of one section of beam has rotted (termites perhaps) completely away.
We are removing 100% of the old plumbing, which supplied a total of 10 small apartments on floors two and three. We will also remove 100% of the electrical.
Behind the current bookstore building is a 28 foot by 60 foot courtyard. We are going to remove an old furnace chimney on the outside, at the rear corner of the bookstore building, thereby providing easy access to the courtyard from the 225 building. We will clear the alley between the bookstore building and the 225 building so that anyone can easily visit the courtyard.
The courtyard will have a stage at the south end, and tables for fifty ...with canopies and umbrellas. The courtyard can be used for music, poetry readings, college lectures, author signings, parties etc. Profound and important individuals such as Chris Hedges, Ralph Nader, Richard D. Wolff, Noam Chomsky, Mohammad, Jesus, and Trump could use either the 225 bldg or the courtyard space for speeches or discussions. Would have been nice to have Malcolm X, .... M. L. King, or Robert or Jack Kennedy to give a speech, but unfortunately all of these radicals have passed away of natural causes.
The brick on the south wall is beautiful. We will sand blast it to improve the contrast. In any case, we are finally moving along, and will soon have completed drawing set, and a bank loan so that the contractor can proceed.
Quote from: ronchamblin on January 04, 2017, 08:02:37 AM
Would have been nice to have Malcolm X, .... M. L. King, or Robert or Jack Kennedy to give a speech, but unfortunately all of these radicals have passed away of natural causes.
Don't let a little thing like death hold you back here.
Michael Jackson and Tupac both hit the stage within the last few years. Hell, you could actually make it quite the event with with a holographic 'Dead Lecture' Circuit.
^ Sounds like it will be an amazing space both inside and out.
Hello Hello MJ friend persons.
The project is moving along. We have eight or nine clawfoot cast iron tubs in the way ... all have been move to the lower floor. I am selling them for varying prices, depending on condition, and how wealthy you are ... from $150 to $300. Anyone interested can phone me at 477-9416 to set up a review of them. We can help move to your vehicle.
Quote from: ronchamblin on June 19, 2017, 11:17:41 AM
Hello Hello MJ friend persons.
The project is moving along. We have eight or nine clawfoot cast iron tubs in the way ... all have been move to the lower floor. I am selling them for varying prices, depending on condition, and how wealthy you are ... from $150 to $300. Anyone interested can phone me at 477-9416 to set up a review of them. We can help move to your vehicle.
(https://i.warosu.org/data/tg/img/0327/11/1402499455184.jpg)
Hmmmm . . .
The courtyard will have a stage at the south end, and tables for fifty ...with canopies and umbrellas. The courtyard can be used for music, poetry readings, college lectures, author signings, parties etc.
We may have to figure out a way to bring some of the creative kids from Florida A&M over for an interesting soirée.
Quote from: ronchamblin on June 19, 2017, 11:17:41 AM
Hello Hello MJ friend persons.
The project is moving along. We have eight or nine clawfoot cast iron tubs in the way ... all have been move to the lower floor. I am selling them for varying prices, depending on condition, and how wealthy you are ... from $150 to $300. Anyone interested can phone me at 477-9416 to set up a review of them. We can help move to your vehicle.
(https://www.minnpost.com/sites/default/files/asset/y/ytvfim/ytvfim.jpg)
Any update Ron? Have you decided on what might go downstairs yet?