MAYOR BROWN TO ACT ON COURTHOUSE FURNITURE LEGISLATION
So, lets talk about furniture.
2012-299
ORD Amend Ord 2007-401-E; Approp $750,000 from Duval County Unified Courthouse Prog to Fund & Require Purchase of Furniture for the 7th Floor Hearing Rooms in the New Duval County Courthouse. (Sidman) (Introduced by CM Daniels)
Public Hearing Pursuant to Chapt 166, F.S. & CR 3.601 - 5/22/12
JACKSONVILLE, Fla. May 10, 2012 â€" Mayor Alvin Brown will take action today on Council Bill 2012-299.
WHEN: 1:30 p.m.
WHERE: Mayor’s Office, Fourth Floor
City Hall at St. James
117 West Duval Street -- 32202
WHAT: Announcement Regarding Council Bill 2012-299
They sure have made a big deal about this furniture issue. Judge Moran will not be pleased if he doesn't get his new desks and chairs.
I'm not sure if we've been duped into standing in a line for this press conference or if it's legit. There's a lot of press in the house. Channel 4, wjct, times union and, hey it's that guy. I don't know his name but somehow, whenever I see him I end up leaving with a notebook filled with info about a random non-profit organization.
We're still waiting....
We're in the room. Mic check.
Bill vetoed
"we need to live within our means"
Meeting out.
Thanks for the live blogging! CH4 has posted their story:
http://www.news4jax.com/news/Mayor-vetoes-new-courthouse-furniture/-/475880/13059292/-/e2jdgz/-/index.html
QuoteMayor Alvin Brown on Thursday vetoed the City Council's motion to spend $750,000 to furnish hearing rooms in the new Duval County Courthouse.
The council can override the veto.
Council members had voted 18-to-1 allocating $750,000 on furniture for hearing rooms on the seventh floor of the courthouse set to open at the end of the month.
The dispute over buying new furniture has been a major battle between the mayor, Chief Judge Donald Moran and City Council members.
"This is not about politics. It's about difficult economic times and that we protect taxpayers' dollars," said the mayor's chief of staff, Chris Hand.
Council members said prior to the veto they still have lots of questions about how the mayor plans to save money by using old furniture -- furniture some say members say will contaminate the new courthouse with mold.
Council President Stephen Joost said the old furniture could end up costing the city more.
"You can't be penny wise and pound foolish and say, 'Alright, we are moving the courthouse and now it's not going to be functional,'" Joost said. "How much more money is that going to end up costing the citizens?"
Joost went on to say he would not call this a defeat for the mayor because he said Brown has saved millions by making other cuts at the courthouse.
The city is expected to begin moving into the new courthouse on May 18. It will be open for court business on May 29.
Too bad Brown was not in office when they started building this monstrosity.
Official letter from the mayor's office to City Council.
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/544733_10150880011803979_87755113978_9754297_280231862_n.jpg)
AWESOME!!! I don't necessarily care about less than 1% of the total budget for the courthouse, but I love that he is making a point and standing up to Moran, who personally I'm beginning to not like.
Anyone else feel this way? How does the public remove a judge? He seems to be the epicenter of the GOB network
^ sorry...but its a really bad policy (albeit popular with the people) move to go against a 17-1 vote of City Council...and politically speaking, its likely to hurt some of his bigger priorities (like the DIA).
Quote from: tufsu1 on May 10, 2012, 02:56:40 PM
^ sorry...but its a really bad policy (albeit popular with the people) move to go against a 17-1 vote of City Council...and politically speaking, its likely to hurt some of his bigger priorities (like the DIA).
I don't think it hurts him nearly as much as it would if the council were split over the idea. He knows they'll overturn the veto and their bill will move forward. The majority of the public will see it as him agianst wasteful spending. And he sticks Moran with a public F-U. Mission accomplished.
It seems to be an honest difference of opinion and the Mayor voted his conscience as the council has.
Quote from: downtownjag on May 10, 2012, 02:40:26 PM
AWESOME!!! I don't necessarily care about less than 1% of the total budget for the courthouse, but I love that he is making a point and standing up to Moran, who personally I'm beginning to not like.
Anyone else feel this way? How does the public remove a judge? He seems to be the epicenter of the GOB network
He definitely appears to have a sense of entitlement.
And apparently the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
http://m.jacksonville.com/news/crime/2012-05-09/story/charges-against-judge-morans-son-dropped-after-he-completes-community
Quote from: tufsu1 on May 10, 2012, 02:56:40 PM
^ sorry...but its a really bad policy (albeit popular with the people) move to go against a 17-1 vote of City Council...and politically speaking, its likely to hurt some of his bigger priorities (like the DIA).
I see your point; however, the council hasn't put his DIA in action either. In fact, they said it was poorly constructed. I don't believe it will set back his DIA specifically either because I believe (maybe incorrectly) that most of the council does want legislation like that in place.
Hypothetically, maybe someone can inform me; how are judges elected/removed?
This isn't necessarily Moran specific, I'd just like to know how the process works. Thanks.
So Judge Moran threatened that Mayor Brown was "treading close to obstruction of justice", now this? Kudos Mr. Mayor. But what now? Does everyone expect the city council to override the veto?
I may have missed a post somewhere, but shouldn't the interior design elements already have been chosen and paid for? I mean, every single one of my interior design/architectural clients usually have this stuff hashed out for their clients BEFORE the building is finished and that cost is factored into the total cost of the build. Why wasn't this taken care of earlier?
So Brown has taken a firm stance on the issue of purchasing some furniture.
I would hope he'd take an equally firm stance on the human rights of gay and lesbian citizens.
Quote from: RiversideLoki on May 10, 2012, 03:21:06 PM
Why wasn't this taken care of earlier?
Really, Loki? ;D
Just to be clear, we are talking about the same building that was 80% completed before someone said, "Hey boss, aren't we supposed to have a road here?" ???
See Moran Speak on the topic
http://jacksonville.com/opinion/blog/406107/mike-clark/2012-04-20/chief-judge-moran-no-move-until-furniture-ready
Some background info on this matter from MJC news partner, Channel 4
http://www.news4jax.com/news/Chief-Judge-Moran-fighting-over-courthouse/-/475880/11683436/-/wijugc/-/index.html
With his high approval rating he has so much political capital right now and what is he doing with it? playing Mayberry over furniture. There are so many other things he needs to be focused on. Apparently, the JEDC/DIA legislation was so poorly written they have retracted and are going back to the drawing board.
Quote from: Non-RedNeck Westsider on May 10, 2012, 03:30:08 PM
Quote from: RiversideLoki on May 10, 2012, 03:21:06 PM
Why wasn't this taken care of earlier?
Really, Loki? ;D
Just to be clear, we are talking about the same building that was 80% completed before someone said, "Hey boss, aren't we supposed to have a road here?" ???
I know I'm beating a dead horse with that statement, I know that the whole mess was a bunch of monkeys getting amorous with footballs since the beginning.
Quote from: TheCat on May 10, 2012, 02:30:47 PM
Official letter from the mayor's office to City Council.
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/544733_10150880011803979_87755113978_9754297_280231862_n.jpg)
Why couldn't have he been in when the cost grew from $190 million to $350 million?
I understand his point, but its time to move on. Im a sick of this courthouse. hopefully the council gets enough votes so we can move on. This courthouse has been a mess ever since peyton took office.
^ Agreed. This courthouse thing has gone on long enough and at this point, Brown should just do what it takes to get the damn thing open. If you look at it, though, if he had backed down, it would've made him look like a pushover. I think he really had no choice but to stick to his decision. I don't think he was expecting this kind of controversy. I understand his decision, though. That much money should not have been put into a damn courthouse. That extra $160 million could have been used for other things. I nearby nickname the courthouse "Peyton's Folly".
Oh come on! Why not fight to save 3/4 of a million dollars?
Enough is enough.
I think it's more along the lines of saving some money. $750K is still a lot of money. These types of fights I think should have been used when there was more money being put into this thing a while back. If the COJ had just stuck with the original plans, it would've been open by now.
Did he cave on the bridge for the State Attorney? About $750,000, not including the inevitable cost over-runs or change orders.
Quote from: Anti redneck on May 10, 2012, 08:15:16 PM
^ Agreed. This courthouse thing has gone on long enough and at this point, Brown should just do what it takes to get the damn thing open. If you look at it, though, if he had backed down, it would've made him look like a pushover. I think he really had no choice but to stick to his decision. I don't think he was expecting this kind of controversy. I understand his decision, though. That much money should not have been put into a damn courthouse. That extra $160 million could have been used for other things. I nearby nickname the courthouse "Peyton's Folly".
Quote from: duvaldude08 on May 10, 2012, 05:23:24 PM
I understand his point, but its time to move on. Im a sick of this courthouse. hopefully the council gets enough votes so we can move on. This courthouse has been a mess ever since peyton took office.
Quote from: Anti redneck on May 10, 2012, 04:55:56 PM
Quote from: TheCat on May 10, 2012, 02:30:47 PM
Official letter from the mayor's office to City Council.
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/544733_10150880011803979_87755113978_9754297_280231862_n.jpg)
Why couldn't have he been in when the cost grew from $190 million to $350 million?
It is Delaney's Baby. We had a contest. KBJ won and they said that they could do it for $190 million in the Better Jacksonville Plan. Kick Butt Jacksonville. How much of the $5,000,000 in Private funding of the Equestrian Center been paid back to the city of Jacksonville? The plug was pulled and let the cost over runs occur.
I didn't vote for Mayor Brown. But if he can save any taxpayer dollars on using some of this furniture then super pats on the back to him.
Hey Mayor Brown, If the council sees the light and you are successful and I hope you are why not have a furniture parade. Get everyone to go through the old courthouse and pick one piece of furniture that can be saved and used and taking a cue from councilman Anderson have the bigest F'n (Furniture) movin party in the state of Florida. I'll donate my time and labor.
It Khan Happen!
The city has been cutting positions left and right for some time now. Take, for instance, the Building Dept. Last time I walked those halls the place was a ghost town. Lots of empty chairs and desks.
I recommend Mayor Brown take Judge Moran by the hand and walk him through that department. Ought to be something there that would strike his fancy and save some money.
Then go floor by floor, office by office through all city departments and see if there is more furniture unused and gathering dust. I had the opportunity to visit another office - former city employee W. Geiger. Nice conference room with nice furniture. What a waste. Chairs and conference table that would do very well in our new courthouse.
Quote from: duvaldude08 on May 10, 2012, 05:23:24 PM
I understand his point, but its time to move on. Im a sick of this courthouse. hopefully the council gets enough votes so we can move on. This courthouse has been a mess ever since peyton took office.
Lets get a couple Jackhammers and go fix that mess, Duval Dude ;)
Quotesorry...but its a really bad policy (albeit popular with the people) move to go against a 17-1 vote of City Council...and politically speaking, its likely to hurt some of his bigger priorities (like the DIA).
+1
750k is not even 1% of the city budget and its a one-time purchase. Hey Kudos to the mayor for angering another State Agency (the judges are actually paid by the State, but each county is responsible for having facilities for them to legislate). It will not get easier for him, he has issues at the Public Defender's office as well as Angela Corey and her issues with the new State Attorney location.
So when our great city gets screwed again at the State level, I'll look at this issue as part of the reason. Again, inexperience on the part of a guy who is getting bad advice or none from people in the know. Peyton made his share of mistakes too, but its how you learn and move on from them that matter. You can only show up and Rah Rah at events for so long until people begin to realize the campaigner is not the same as the actual mayor.
Quote from: Ralph W on May 10, 2012, 09:05:52 PM
Did he cave on the bridge for the State Attorney? About $750,000, not including the inevitable cost over-runs or change orders.
I am pretty sure the bridge is a no-go.
They had talked about a street level covered walkway. I'd just give Corey and her team some umbrellas instead.
Quote from: mtraininjax on May 11, 2012, 08:47:55 AM
Quotesorry...but its a really bad policy (albeit popular with the people) move to go against a 17-1 vote of City Council...and politically speaking, its likely to hurt some of his bigger priorities (like the DIA).
+1
750k is not even 1% of the city budget and its a one-time purchase. Hey Kudos to the mayor for angering another State Agency (the judges are actually paid by the State, but each county is responsible for having facilities for them to legislate). It will not get easier for him, he has issues at the Public Defender's office as well as Angela Corey and her issues with the new State Attorney location.
So when our great city gets screwed again at the State level, I'll look at this issue as part of the reason. Again, inexperience on the part of a guy who is getting bad advice or none from people in the know. Peyton made his share of mistakes too, but its how you learn and move on from them that matter. You can only show up and Rah Rah at events for so long until people begin to realize the campaigner is not the same as the actual mayor.
So you saying for politics the Mayor should cave and come out with what a statement that says " there is no possible way that even one chair in the previous courthouse is fit to support one bottom. As mayor I will make sure there is enough new leather smell to fill all six blocks of this mammoth sprawville leviathan in the middle of our downtown".
It may be a little penny wise and pound foolish but finally someone in our city government has taken the stand that at some point we have to stop the bleeding with this project and we all should support that.
Waiting to stop or start spending money on any project until there will be absolutely no gripes is a fools errand.