Tijuana Flats will be replacing it.
Thanks for the heads up. Unfortunately, I don't care for Tijuana Flats. Eh, you know what they say though: any business is good business. I'll take them over an empty storefront any day.
QuoteTijuana Flats Burrito Co. plans to open a 1,645-square-foot, 90-seat restaurant at Riverside Market Square by late summer.
The planned restaurant’s address is 2025 Riverside Ave., #204 â€" the current home to Sushi Café, one of the original tenants of the retail center anchored by Publix that opened in a decade ago.
Tijuana Flats marketing manager Brandy Blackwell confirmed the Central Florida-based chain’s plans for the space, writing in an email that she expects build-out of the restaurant to begin in June to allow for an opening in August or September.
Full article: http://jacksonville.com/opinion/blog/423471/gary-mills/2012-03-21/tijuana-flats-plans-restaurant-jacksonvilles-riverside
There are so many empty storefronts in town, why do these two restaurants have to fight over this one?? I like Tijuana Flats, but I like Sushi Cafe far more.
I'm guessing higher rent was the culprit for the tenant change.
TJ's was looking at downtown... this is the location they are doing instead(can't blame them).
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 21, 2012, 02:27:55 PM
There are so many empty storefronts in town, why do these two restaurants have to fight over this one?? I like Tijuana Flats, but I like Sushi Cafe far more.
I'm guessing higher rent was the culprit for the tenant change.
Many memories from Sushi Cafe. I say it had nothing to do with rent and all to do with mixing up the tenant roster, getting somebody new for the neighborhood, creating a little buzz, and pulling in a tenant that has some credit and 70 locations. Sushi Cafe probably could have paid any sort of market rent there, but haven't they worn their welcome thin by now? How many sushi restaurants are there anyway? Also, if the landlord ever expects to sell that place they are going to need more credit tenants. A sushi place with one location and questionable managers (albeit good sushi) occupying the most visible endcap is not going to look good to any potential buyers. A fresh Tijuana Flats lease will look much better.
Here's the link to the TU piece: http://jacksonville.com/opinion/blog/423471/gary-mills/2012-03-21/tijuana-flats-plans-restaurant-jacksonvilles-riverside
I wonder if Sushi Cafe is moving. I hope so. I enjoy their food and I know many others who do, as well.
Interesting a place like Sushi Cafe would just "move" like this...like simms said, I can't imagine them not being able to match rent. What I disagree with simms about is a landlord wanting to "mix it up" and "keep it fresh." Money is money, can't see them caring one way or the other. After all, sushi cafe was popular as hell.
For all you sushi cafe fans: what's good here? Only been once or twice, my experiences were just OK. Maybe I was ordering the wrong thing. Would like to go back soon while it's still around!
I LOVE Sushi Cafe...hate to see them go :(
Sushi Cafe is one of my favs. I hope they re open somewhere else.
Quote from: Marley Weinstein on March 21, 2012, 03:13:19 PM
I LOVE Sushi Cafe...hate to see them go :(
What do you get there?
Quote from: jcjohnpaint on March 21, 2012, 03:31:32 PM
Sushi Cafe is one of my favs. I hope they re open somewhere else.
And you?
Quote from: ben says on March 21, 2012, 03:06:45 PM
Interesting a place like Sushi Cafe would just "move" like this...like simms said, I can't imagine them not being able to match rent. What I disagree with simms about is a landlord wanting to "mix it up" and "keep it fresh." Money is money, can't see them caring one way or the other. After all, sushi cafe was popular as hell.
For all you sushi cafe fans: what's good here? Only been once or twice, my experiences were just OK. Maybe I was ordering the wrong thing. Would like to go back soon while it's still around!
Money is not just money. In the event of a sale of this center, which is likely given that I can't imagine the current landlord holding it forever - I'm sure their loan matures sooner rather than later, an outside buyer is going to value cash flows from Tijuana Flats much more than they would value the same cash flows from Sushi Cafe.
Not only that, a little extra buzz and publicity and a new tenant lineup can increase foot traffic to the center, thereby increasing tenant sales, which will also be viewed favorably by a potential buyer and will result in increased sales proceeds in some way shape or form for the current landlord.
On top of that, centers with more national/regional and credit tenants have lowered bad debt expenses, thereby increasing forecast project level cash flow (which is good for the seller because he can sell it for more and good for the buyer because he collects more money and suffers from less slippage).
On top of that centers with more national/regional and credit tenants have lower vacancies, higher rents, and better rent growth during cycles. Market leasing assumptions can be increased, thereby increasing cash flows over a 10-year hold, thereby helping the current landlord in a sale scenario and potentially also helping the next landlord.
Sorry, I do this for a living and I too often hear someone say a tenant left because of rent when that is hardly ever the case. Obviously whatever happened is so much more complicated than what is being discussed here, but it's perpetually lazy for people to just assume that rent must have gotten too high -Retail Rents across 100% of markets in this country are still falling and are not what they were 1, 2, 3, and certainly not 4 years ago. If rents are rising in Riverside submarket, they are probably going from $20 to $21 psf, on a simplified basis. They aren't like Fifth Ave rents above 50th, which are going from $1,000 to $5,000 psf in one year (again, simplified example).
Quote from: simms3 on March 21, 2012, 03:53:39 PM
Quote from: ben says on March 21, 2012, 03:06:45 PM
Interesting a place like Sushi Cafe would just "move" like this...like simms said, I can't imagine them not being able to match rent. What I disagree with simms about is a landlord wanting to "mix it up" and "keep it fresh." Money is money, can't see them caring one way or the other. After all, sushi cafe was popular as hell.
For all you sushi cafe fans: what's good here? Only been once or twice, my experiences were just OK. Maybe I was ordering the wrong thing. Would like to go back soon while it's still around!
Money is not just money. In the event of a sale of this center, which is likely given that I can't imagine the current landlord holding it forever - I'm sure their loan matures sooner rather than later, an outside buyer is going to value cash flows from Tijuana Flats much more than they would value the same cash flows from Sushi Cafe.
Not only that, a little extra buzz and publicity and a new tenant lineup can increase foot traffic to the center, thereby increasing tenant sales, which will also be viewed favorably by a potential buyer and will result in increased sales proceeds in some way shape or form for the current landlord.
On top of that, centers with more national/regional and credit tenants have lowered bad debt expenses, thereby increasing forecast project level cash flow (which is good for the seller because he can sell it for more and good for the buyer because he collects more money and suffers from less slippage).
On top of that centers with more national/regional and credit tenants have lower vacancies, higher rents, and better rent growth during cycles. Market leasing assumptions can be increased, thereby increasing cash flows over a 10-year hold, thereby helping the current landlord in a sale scenario and potentially also helping the next landlord.
Sorry, I do this for a living and I too often hear someone say a tenant left because of rent when that is hardly ever the case. Obviously whatever happened is so much more complicated than what is being discussed here, but it's perpetually lazy for people to just assume that rent must have gotten too high -Retail Rents across 100% of markets in this country are still falling and are not what they were 1, 2, 3, and certainly not 4 years ago. If rents are rising in Riverside submarket, they are probably going from $20 to $21 psf, on a simplified basis. They aren't like Fifth Ave rents above 50th, which are going from $1,000 to $5,000 psf in one year (again, simplified example).
I didn't assume it was a rent issue, I assumed it was a lazy "as long as the tenants are paying" type of landlord (which I know plenty of). That being said, what you say makes sense. Thanks for the info
Quote
Sorry, I do this for a living and I too often hear someone say a tenant left because of rent when that is hardly ever the case. Obviously whatever happened is so much more complicated than what is being discussed here, but it's perpetually lazy for people to just assume that rent must have gotten too high -Retail Rents across 100% of markets in this country are still falling and are not what they were 1, 2, 3, and certainly not 4 years ago. If rents are rising in Riverside submarket, they are probably going from $20 to $21 psf, on a simplified basis. They aren't like Fifth Ave rents above 50th, which are going from $1,000 to $5,000 psf in one year (again, simplified example).
You're right. After further thought, I agree that Sushi Cafe would be able to pay any rent for that space because they are killing it most nights of the week. It would be better to see a regional chain on a rent roll. Sorry, after hearing Ron Chamblin's account of what happened to Magnificat, I just have rent increases on the brain.
There are 1 or 2 open storefronts in that center. What I would love to see is Quizno's move out of their space and into one of the middle spaces and have Sushi Cafe take over their space. Quizno's has a huge patio that never gets utilized. It's not likely that the tenants will all shuffle around, but I can dream can't I? Given that Sushi Cafe has been so successful, I do hope they move to another location nearby.
I can't remember who the landlord is - I once knew - and if I remember correctly it is a national owner, perhaps a REIT. The developers are pretty big - Sembler, and the current owners aren't your typical Jacksonville unwashed landlord who can't think past simplified and watered down basic concepts of real estate. It's someone who keeps a good model on this center and has a good asset management team, that much I remember.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 21, 2012, 04:29:25 PM
Quote
Sorry, I do this for a living and I too often hear someone say a tenant left because of rent when that is hardly ever the case. Obviously whatever happened is so much more complicated than what is being discussed here, but it's perpetually lazy for people to just assume that rent must have gotten too high -Retail Rents across 100% of markets in this country are still falling and are not what they were 1, 2, 3, and certainly not 4 years ago. If rents are rising in Riverside submarket, they are probably going from $20 to $21 psf, on a simplified basis. They aren't like Fifth Ave rents above 50th, which are going from $1,000 to $5,000 psf in one year (again, simplified example).
You're right. After further thought, I agree that Sushi Cafe would be able to pay any rent for that space because they are killing it most nights of the week. It would be better to see a regional chain on a rent roll. Sorry, after hearing Ron Chamblin's account of what happened to Magnificat, I just have rent increases on the brain.
There are 1 or 2 open storefronts in that center. What I would love to see is Quizno's move out of their space and into one of the middle spaces and have Sushi Cafe take over their space. Quizno's has a huge patio that never gets utilized. It's not likely that the tenants will all shuffle around, but I can dream can't I? Given that Sushi Cafe has been so successful, I do hope they move to another location nearby.
NP I'm just having a slow day at work - my first in over half a year! :)
Quizno's may not last much longer as a company, period. They are an example of a national tenant that no landlord really wants right now.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 21, 2012, 04:29:25 PM
Quote
Sorry, I do this for a living and I too often hear someone say a tenant left because of rent when that is hardly ever the case. Obviously whatever happened is so much more complicated than what is being discussed here, but it's perpetually lazy for people to just assume that rent must have gotten too high -Retail Rents across 100% of markets in this country are still falling and are not what they were 1, 2, 3, and certainly not 4 years ago. If rents are rising in Riverside submarket, they are probably going from $20 to $21 psf, on a simplified basis. They aren't like Fifth Ave rents above 50th, which are going from $1,000 to $5,000 psf in one year (again, simplified example).
You're right. After further thought, I agree that Sushi Cafe would be able to pay any rent for that space because they are killing it most nights of the week. It would be better to see a regional chain on a rent roll. Sorry, after hearing Ron Chamblin's account of what happened to Magnificat, I just have rent increases on the brain.
There are 1 or 2 open storefronts in that center. What I would love to see is Quizno's move out of their space and into one of the middle spaces and have Sushi Cafe take over their space. Quizno's has a huge patio that never gets utilized. It's not likely that the tenants will all shuffle around, but I can dream can't I? Given that Sushi Cafe has been so successful, I do hope they move to another location nearby.
Quizno's sucks, and you're right, someone needs to utilize that patio.
Quote from: simms3 on March 21, 2012, 04:34:08 PM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 21, 2012, 04:29:25 PM
Quote
Sorry, I do this for a living and I too often hear someone say a tenant left because of rent when that is hardly ever the case. Obviously whatever happened is so much more complicated than what is being discussed here, but it's perpetually lazy for people to just assume that rent must have gotten too high -Retail Rents across 100% of markets in this country are still falling and are not what they were 1, 2, 3, and certainly not 4 years ago. If rents are rising in Riverside submarket, they are probably going from $20 to $21 psf, on a simplified basis. They aren't like Fifth Ave rents above 50th, which are going from $1,000 to $5,000 psf in one year (again, simplified example).
You're right. After further thought, I agree that Sushi Cafe would be able to pay any rent for that space because they are killing it most nights of the week. It would be better to see a regional chain on a rent roll. Sorry, after hearing Ron Chamblin's account of what happened to Magnificat, I just have rent increases on the brain.
There are 1 or 2 open storefronts in that center. What I would love to see is Quizno's move out of their space and into one of the middle spaces and have Sushi Cafe take over their space. Quizno's has a huge patio that never gets utilized. It's not likely that the tenants will all shuffle around, but I can dream can't I? Given that Sushi Cafe has been so successful, I do hope they move to another location nearby.
NP I'm just having a slow day at work - my first in over half a year! :)
Quizno's may not last much longer as a company, period. They are an example of a national tenant that no landlord really wants right now.
I hear the same thing about Quizno's right now. Not only do landlords not want them, but I've heard franchisees are turning on their own parent company. Bar none one of the worst franchises to own.
Simms you may not be privy to this as an out-of-towner, but that strip at JTB and Philips is hilarious. Jimmy Johns opened next door to a Quiznos and has basically turned Quiznos into a ghost town. The owner/managers of that quiznos stunk anyway. If they aren't closed yet, they will be soon
Yep, that Quizno's is closed. Jimmy Johns killed them. The Jimmy Johns that is coming to Park St might be the last straw for the riverside Quiznos.
Pretty sure the Quizno's there will be closing within the next 2-3 weeks. An employee is a friend of mine, and they have been told they are not getting scheduled more than 1 week out.
Jimmy John's is still a relatively new concept to Jax. I don't know anything about their financials or much about the company, but I have eaten JJ a few times. The food is totally mediocre, but it's the delivery that sets them apart. JJ does well in dense areas where they can easily deliver without having to drive a million miles to their destinations. In the Midtown Atlanta area there are a few JJ (probably like 1 per 20,000 residents and 40,000 office workers), and they are walkup stores. Nobody actually eats *in* the JJ. They have a policy whereby they must deliver in some sort of fast time or else...Don't try to win a sidewalk shoulder rub with a Jimmy Johns delivery guy - he will mow you over no matter how skinny and frail he looks.
JJ will do well in Riverside for sure.
The Jimmy Johns on Phillips will deliver free to any of the work places in the baymeadows area. Love the model.
Quote from: simms3 on March 21, 2012, 07:18:17 PM
Jimmy John's is still a relatively new concept to Jax. I don't know anything about their financials or much about the company, but I have eaten JJ a few times. The food is totally mediocre, but it's the delivery that sets them apart. JJ does well in dense areas where they can easily deliver without having to drive a million miles to their destinations. In the Midtown Atlanta area there are a few JJ (probably like 1 per 20,000 residents and 40,000 office workers), and they are walkup stores. Nobody actually eats *in* the JJ. They have a policy whereby they must deliver in some sort of fast time or else...Don't try to win a sidewalk shoulder rub with a Jimmy Johns delivery guy - he will mow you over no matter how skinny and frail he looks.
JJ will do well in Riverside for sure.
Agree that they're mediocre, and the main plus is fast delivery. My step-father has worked in the franchising/food industry over the past 35 years, and I can tell you: JJ's financials are insanely good. Mediocrity + popularity = $$. Less on ingredients, overhead, and rent, more noise coming from the cash register (again, if you can maintain popularity).
We drove on by Sushi Cafe after Publix last week after work, hoping to eat there, and it looked like it was already closed. I assumed it was, and that's a shame, because we like it too. I hope they do re-open elsewhere, although if the owner was shipped back to China, then probably not.
Oh, and when we eat there, we order sushi rolls. My son orders sushimi (sp?) a/k/a raw fish on top of sticky rice. Usually the sampler with salmon, whitefish and eel. I order tempura or a roll of something steamed or cooked because I don't care for the temperature or texture of cold, raw fish.
Tijuana Flats should be a good fit there. They have fun trivia nights too so I can see the patio filled! I can't remember the last time I even thought about Quizno's overpriced burnt sandwiches. Same for Jimmy John's...too expensive. My favorite subs have always come from Publix Deli and Firehouse.
Now if we could just get a good old nasty Weinershnitzel in town, that would be awesome!
Quote from: simms3 on March 21, 2012, 02:43:08 PM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 21, 2012, 02:27:55 PM
There are so many empty storefronts in town, why do these two restaurants have to fight over this one?? I like Tijuana Flats, but I like Sushi Cafe far more.
I'm guessing higher rent was the culprit for the tenant change.
Many memories from Sushi Cafe. I say it had nothing to do with rent and all to do with mixing up the tenant roster, getting somebody new for the neighborhood, creating a little buzz, and pulling in a tenant that has some credit and 70 locations. Sushi Cafe probably could have paid any sort of market rent there, but haven't they worn their welcome thin by now? How many sushi restaurants are there anyway? Also, if the landlord ever expects to sell that place they are going to need more credit tenants. A sushi place with one location and questionable managers (albeit good sushi) occupying the most visible endcap is not going to look good to any potential buyers. A fresh Tijuana Flats lease will look much better.
Wait a minute, are you saying that if I own a piece of property and get some of the top chefs in Florida to locate there, I would be at a disadvantage in selling that lot because they each only own one restaurant? If I wanted to really sell that lot, I would have to kick them up and fill that property with mediocre but famous chain restaurants?
Quote from: cayohueso on March 21, 2012, 10:45:47 PM
Tijuana Flats should be a good fit there. They have fun trivia nights too so I can see the patio filled! I can't remember the last time I even thought about Quizno's overpriced burnt sandwiches. Same for Jimmy John's...too expensive. My favorite subs have always come from Publix Deli and Firehouse.
Now if we could just get a good old nasty Weinershnitzel in town, that would be awesome!
Jimmy John's...too expensive? That'd probably be my last complaint.
Quote from: cityimrov on March 22, 2012, 12:43:15 AM
Quote from: simms3 on March 21, 2012, 02:43:08 PM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 21, 2012, 02:27:55 PM
There are so many empty storefronts in town, why do these two restaurants have to fight over this one?? I like Tijuana Flats, but I like Sushi Cafe far more.
I'm guessing higher rent was the culprit for the tenant change.
Many memories from Sushi Cafe. I say it had nothing to do with rent and all to do with mixing up the tenant roster, getting somebody new for the neighborhood, creating a little buzz, and pulling in a tenant that has some credit and 70 locations. Sushi Cafe probably could have paid any sort of market rent there, but haven't they worn their welcome thin by now? How many sushi restaurants are there anyway? Also, if the landlord ever expects to sell that place they are going to need more credit tenants. A sushi place with one location and questionable managers (albeit good sushi) occupying the most visible endcap is not going to look good to any potential buyers. A fresh Tijuana Flats lease will look much better.
Wait a minute, are you saying that if I own a piece of property and get some of the top chefs in Florida to locate there, I would be at a disadvantage in selling that lot because they each only own one restaurant? If I wanted to really sell that lot, I would have to kick them up and fill that property with mediocre but famous chain restaurants?
We're talking shopping centers here, not anything else. I could really get into how destination/chef-driven dining works, but that's for another discussion.
Your question is an example of the oversimplification of real estate in Jacksonville. Obiously each situation is highly unique (well most situations are somewhat similar in Jax, which leads to that simplification). When Jacksonville gets anything high end and starts getting on some radar screens, then we can have that discussion. When there are places to shop that aren't suburban in nature and aren't made of stucco, then we can talk.
I refused to eat Quiznos after they had that series of commercials with the dead talking rat or whatever it was. Not very appetizing.
I ate at Sushi Cafe last night, it was as crowded as ever. They even had a 'hiring' sign up on the door.
Quote
Wait a minute, are you saying that if I own a piece of property and get some of the top chefs in Florida to locate there, I would be at a disadvantage in selling that lot because they each only own one restaurant? If I wanted to really sell that lot, I would have to kick them up and fill that property with mediocre but famous chain restaurants?
You're really making yourself look bad here. Obviously if it was a great chef and a regionally known restaurant, that would be very different. Sushi Cafe is tasty and cheap, but otherwise unremarkable. It doesn't compare to something like Aix or Orsay. Also, if you were just trying to make Simms look bad, you better bring your A game. He is the most knowledgeable real estate person on the forum.
Quote from: The Compound on March 22, 2012, 08:41:08 AM
I refused to eat Quiznos after they had that series of commercials with the dead talking rat or whatever it was. Not very appetizing.
How about Oven-Innuendo? Does that make you hungry?
http://www.youtube.com/v/7LQpRQh2KSQ
It's just a shame we can't support a local business instead of a big chain.
Quote from: Non-RedNeck Westsider on March 22, 2012, 09:07:37 AM
Quote from: The Compound on March 22, 2012, 08:41:08 AM
I refused to eat Quiznos after they had that series of commercials with the dead talking rat or whatever it was. Not very appetizing.
How about Oven-Innuendo? Does that make you hungry?
http://www.youtube.com/v/7LQpRQh2KSQ
Makes me want a hot dog real bad.
Quote from: cayohueso on March 21, 2012, 10:45:47 PM
Now if we could just get a good old nasty Weinershnitzel in town, that would be awesome!
Is the Schnitzel House on Bowden still open?
it's closed.
Quote from: MandolinGirl on March 22, 2012, 09:25:31 AM
It's just a shame we can't support a local business instead of a big chain.
I agree with you. Chain stores and chain restaurants get more credibility because they provide a packaged product in upscale surroundings that make their customers feel safe.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 22, 2012, 08:56:12 AM
I ate at Sushi Cafe last night, it was as crowded as ever. They even had a 'hiring' sign up on the door.
Quote
Wait a minute, are you saying that if I own a piece of property and get some of the top chefs in Florida to locate there, I would be at a disadvantage in selling that lot because they each only own one restaurant? If I wanted to really sell that lot, I would have to kick them up and fill that property with mediocre but famous chain restaurants?
You're really making yourself look bad here. Obviously if it was a great chef and a regionally known restaurant, that would be very different. Sushi Cafe is tasty and cheap, but otherwise unremarkable. It doesn't compare to something like Aix or Orsay. Also, if you were just trying to make Simms look bad, you better bring your A game. He is the most knowledgeable real estate person on the forum.
I'm not wondering about simms. I'm wondering about the people who buy these properties. How exactly do people buy properties these days on a national level? If the people who own this shopping plaza wants to sell to a national buyer, what do they have to do to do it? Would a national buyer even care about Aix or Orsay?
Quote from: cityimrov on March 22, 2012, 01:45:13 PM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 22, 2012, 08:56:12 AM
I ate at Sushi Cafe last night, it was as crowded as ever. They even had a 'hiring' sign up on the door.
Quote
Wait a minute, are you saying that if I own a piece of property and get some of the top chefs in Florida to locate there, I would be at a disadvantage in selling that lot because they each only own one restaurant? If I wanted to really sell that lot, I would have to kick them up and fill that property with mediocre but famous chain restaurants?
You're really making yourself look bad here. Obviously if it was a great chef and a regionally known restaurant, that would be very different. Sushi Cafe is tasty and cheap, but otherwise unremarkable. It doesn't compare to something like Aix or Orsay. Also, if you were just trying to make Simms look bad, you better bring your A game. He is the most knowledgeable real estate person on the forum.
I'm not wondering about simms. I'm wondering about the people who buy these properties. How exactly do people buy properties these days on a national level? If the people who own this shopping plaza wants to sell to a national buyer, what do they have to do to do it? Would a national buyer even care about Aix or Orsay?
"Credit tenant" is probably all that Simms needed to say, instead of blasting someone who isn't in the industry. That's the significant advantage Tijuana Flats has over Sushi Cafe in this issue
Lenders will give whomever is purchasing the center better rates/terms if he has credit tenants in the center that is being purchased. So, it would make sense for them to boot this place in favor of Tiuana Flatts if they are looking to sell the center in the future.
Large buyers or Reits who have dozens or hundreds of properties mainly care about cash flows, and more importantly even and forecast-able cash flows. When marketing a property, usually current, 1 year pro forma, and 5 year pro forma numbers are given. Those numbers carry more weight if the tenants are national brands or at least strong regional brands.
However, I wouldn't call T-Flats a chain just yet. They do have 70 locations, but they started in Orlando, each store is unique and tailored to its surroundings, and staffed by friendly and fun young people. They are more comparable to a Loop than a McDonald's.
AWESOME, I will be at the Flats! Love it that its coming to my side, the Bestside!
Sushi shop in Avondale supposed to open this week. Turn all the shops in Avondale into restaurants, I'd love it!
Sushi Shop in Avondale?? Between which stores?
Its next to the Dog Grooming and then Casbah. Coldwell Banker is the largest tenant in that string of buildings, then go west from there, toward Casbah, you can't miss it.
The new Avondale sushi place is called Ginjo. www.ginjosushi.com
Thanks, all! One more option, I hope they have outside seating.
Outside seating will be tough, in front at least. They may be able to provide something in cooperation with Casbah's space, but the sidewalk is barely wide enough for 2 people side by side, let alone a cafe table. But hey, this is Avondale, there are plenty of benches and other places to take your Sushi, and Boone Park is nice and shady as well, just a few steps away.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 22, 2012, 03:27:53 PM
Large buyers or Reits who have dozens or hundreds of properties mainly care about cash flows, and more importantly even and forecast-able cash flows. When marketing a property, usually current, 1 year pro forma, and 5 year pro forma numbers are given. Those numbers carry more weight if the tenants are national brands or at least strong regional brands.
However, I wouldn't call T-Flats a chain just yet. They do have 70 locations, but they started in Orlando, each store is unique and tailored to its surroundings, and staffed by friendly and fun young people. They are more comparable to a Loop than a McDonald's.
Is that part of the reason why the St Johns Town Center is filled to the brim with chain restaurants? Ok, let's say instead of a Tijuana, there was a choice between an Orsay or a TGIF for that location. Which one would be more attractive to a large buyer?
These are all really good questions. I would think the following, but this is just my thought process and may be completely different from the landlords':
The SJTC target demographic is less about who and more about reason. SJTC shoppers are looking for brand names they know about. They don't want to walk the mile long strip and not know what the stores and restaurants are. Half the shoppers there arrive with their stores and/or restaurants already in mind. The other half are keeping their eye peeled for stores/restaurants they recognize as they stroll. Also, SJTC targets everyone and their mom, as well as regional visitors and tourists, which means nationals are what will work. Your average suburbanite and your visitors and your tourists will have no clue what Orsay is, but Cheesecake Factory is universal.
Avondale shoppers are a little different. The appeal is totally different. Avondale is catered to and serves a more sophisticated local resident (i.e. intown, went to college, higher income level, probably lived somewhere else at one point), and these residents have more personal relations with the store owners/restaurant managers/chefs, and they know each other a whole lot more so reputation goes much further and stays within the local community/neighborhood.
Of course Avondale also attracts lots of outsiders and tourists who are curious, and they are not here to find their favorite identifiable brands. They are here to explore and try new things and live vicariously through their upper end and/or urban brethren in the surrounding neighbs. Totally different experience.
We've already touched on Wall St, investors and lenders, each of whom take Fitch Ratings very seriously. Gone are the days of securitizing commercial loans and doing whatever you wanted. Of course many landlords have a new problem to juggle - high vacancy and a lack of available and expanding credit tenants. Nobody likes to see vacancy, especially with maturities looming and no options to extend or ability to refinance, but nobody likes a landlord who just crams a bunch of crappy tenants who will undoubtedly fail into their centers. It's a tight rope act, which is the reason rents are still falling and vacancies are still rising and no new retail is in the pipeline (whereas other sectors are seeing almost healthy comebacks).
Lastly I just want to say many restauranteurs are complete divas - like the biggest divas in tenant world. You really have to think long and hard before entering into a deal with a big chef or restauranteur. They can be impossible to deal with. Often times that is why you see these restaurants as the sole tenant or in a building owned by the chef/manager himself. There is a whole strategy that must be employed on larger projects where top chefs are tenants. And sometimes they don't want to be near each other. We have an old meatpacking plant with several uber high end shops and several top top top restaurants - including a restaurant run by arguably the best chef in that particlar region of the US. Across a courtyard is another really good restaurant run by a chef who frequently appears on Food Network, and they don't get along at all. The uber high end chef thinks the Top Chef/Food Network chef is too mainstream, and we have to now contend with bickering and the possibility that one may relocate (to another one of our warehouses we are currently gutting). The only reason we probably have the best restaurant portfolio in the country is that one of the firm's MDs sits on the board of the James Beard Foundation, and we have creative teams in place. It's a private equity firm with not just an acquisitions team and an asset management team, but also a legal division, a property management division, a green consulting division, a leasing division (we have the best leasing team in the country - I'm fairly confident), a tax division, an accounting division, I mean we do so many more things in-house that most PE firms must hire 3rd party for, and we do this with less than 200 people (multibillion dollar portfolio). Our in-house capabilities means we can better handle these diva tenants, and our portfolio has palenty! A chef who gets publicity and becomes somewhat of a celebrity has an attitude like any 15-minutes of fame reality TV star.
Just wanted to commend this really interesting discussion. Thanks for all the subject matter experts who have taken the time to contribute and help put some of these local decisions in a broader context so we can make better sense of them.
Since this thread, I guess ultimately, is about sushi...anyone tried the new place in Avondale?
Quote from: gsb on March 23, 2012, 11:20:22 AM
Just wanted to commend this really interesting discussion. Thanks for all the subject matter experts who have taken the time to contribute and help put some of these local decisions in a broader context so we can make better sense of them.
+1
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 21, 2012, 04:29:25 PM
Quote
Sorry, I do this for a living and I too often hear someone say a tenant left because of rent when that is hardly ever the case. Obviously whatever happened is so much more complicated than what is being discussed here, but it's perpetually lazy for people to just assume that rent must have gotten too high -Retail Rents across 100% of markets in this country are still falling and are not what they were 1, 2, 3, and certainly not 4 years ago. If rents are rising in Riverside submarket, they are probably going from $20 to $21 psf, on a simplified basis. They aren't like Fifth Ave rents above 50th, which are going from $1,000 to $5,000 psf in one year (again, simplified example).
You're right. After further thought, I agree that Sushi Cafe would be able to pay any rent for that space because they are killing it most nights of the week. It would be better to see a regional chain on a rent roll. Sorry, after hearing Ron Chamblin's account of what happened to Magnificat, I just have rent increases on the brain.
There are 1 or 2 open storefronts in that center. What I would love to see is Quizno's move out of their space and into one of the middle spaces and have Sushi Cafe take over their space. Quizno's has a huge patio that never gets utilized. It's not likely that the tenants will all shuffle around, but I can dream can't I? Given that Sushi Cafe has been so successful, I do hope they move to another location nearby.
I walked by this evening on the way to Publix and they were ripping out the interior of Quiznos. When I asked, they confirmed that Sushi Cafe is moving over.
Am I reading this correctly? Sushi Cafe is taking over the old Quizno's?
Yes, sorry. Didn't notice that my response posted within the quote. I'll go fix that.
They also told me that they would be utilizing the outside deck area.
Thanks for the update.
This is great to hear! I love Sushi Cafe and was sad with the thought they would be closing.
Quote from: ben says on March 23, 2012, 11:28:10 AM
Since this thread, I guess ultimately, is about sushi...anyone tried the new place in Avondale?
It's just like every other sushi place in Jax. Same menu and concept as Sake House, Sushi Cafe and all the rest.
^ I don't know why, but I get the feeling Ginjo is owned by the same people who own Sake House. Maybe it's the identical dumplings, fish, ginger dressing, and Chinese that make me think that?
Sushi Cafe, in the former Quizno's location is now open. It was packed when I drove by last night. It looks like construction is fully underway in the old location to make ready for Tijuana Flats. Anyone have a time line on it?
Quote from: ben says on April 23, 2012, 01:50:34 PM
^ I don't know why, but I get the feeling Ginjo is owned by the same people who own Sake House. Maybe it's the identical dumplings, fish, ginger dressing, and Chinese that make me think that?
That's correct. Sake House in San Marco, Sake House in Five Points, and Ginjo all have the same Chinese owner.
Quote from: goldy21 on July 18, 2012, 08:56:19 AM
Quote from: ben says on April 23, 2012, 01:50:34 PM
^ I don't know why, but I get the feeling Ginjo is owned by the same people who own Sake House. Maybe it's the identical dumplings, fish, ginger dressing, and Chinese that make me think that?
That's correct. Sake House in San Marco, Sake House in Five Points, and Ginjo all have the same Chinese owner.
I knew something was up there.
I just want my Japanese food made by Japanese people. Is that too much to ask? Are there really NO Japanese in Jacksonville?