Just had a birthday the last weekend on November. My tag renewal slipped my mind but I renewed online on the 1st. I work in a bland, cookie cutter office park that doesn't see much through traffic. I leave work to head out for lunch and notice one of those bright green envelopes flapping on my windshield, enclosed is a traffic citation for an expired tag.
Albiet it's a legit ticket, the extent the city is going through to fine violators just seems ridiclious. I'm parked in a double row parking lot, with another vehicile parked behind me. They REALLY had to be looking hard for this.
Turns out this has happened to several other coworkers and it hasn't been limited to expired tags either. They've issued citations for other minor non moving violations as well.
I'm just saying, I prefer the old fashion method of an officer pulling me over and issuing a ticket face to face, scouring your city's denizens' work parking lots to issue them tickets seems to be a bit over the top. Is the city THAT broke?
I'm not sure, but it's a dick move eitherway. At least the ticket nazi's have extended their reach beyond downtown, it's no longer an urban core issue. Southside's in their crosshair's too!
If you renewed online before this, they should've found that out by looking it up! First time I ever got pulled over was for this reason, but the decal just hadn't come in yet, so it was only a warning since he found out the registration was "good".
Really makes you feel welcome.
I know someone else who had the same thing happen a few months ago. First time I'd heard of it.
The propety manager at that office park has probably worked some deal with them. Otherwise I don't think they could patrol private property like that?
I got a ticket for the same thing when I was in an Office Depot a few years back. I was literally inside for 20-30 minutes. I assume some cops go out of their way to find these for some easy money.
Same thing at my lovely office park. Had the renewal sticker and updated registration sitting in plain view on the passenger seat. My fault for not just putting it on the plate when I got it, but still.
Parking Department's ticket van was in 5 Points just a little bit ago. It is one of the vans that has the cameras on both sides that scan license plates as the van drives by and compares then to a database of stolen cars, unpaid tickets and expired registrations.
They ticketed at least three cars.
I am sure that they just drive through the office parks doing the same thing. Much faster than doing it manually. $$$$$
Cops in general are being a lot more aggressive here in general I've noticed. Budget issues I guess?? Who knows, but I've seen a lot more sitting hidden around where I live out in the burbs during the last couple months than I have the entire 4 years we've lived here.
Regardless, this seems pretty unfair to be stalking an office parking lot looking for expired tags. Just another way the middle class gets the cost pushed onto them (as if owning a car wasn't expensive enough). Good thing we have a choice & can take good public transit or safely bike to where we want to go.....Oh wait.
They could have a field day if they patrolled the parking lots on game days or any of the other events that draw people to the downtown areas.
Pay 10 bucks to park your car and come back later to find you might owe another $250 clams for some infraction.
Heck, they could even afford to buy a few more camera vans and park at the final approach to all the bridges. Kachiiiiiiing! Think BIG, Jacksonville. There's gold in them there plates.
Quote from: Ralph W on December 08, 2011, 04:16:48 PM
They could have a field day if they patrolled the parking lots on game days or any of the other events that draw people to the downtown areas.
Pay 10 bucks to park your car and come back later to find you might owe another $250 clams for some infraction.
Heck, they could even afford to buy a few more camera vans and park at the final approach to all the bridges. Kachiiiiiiing! Think BIG, Jacksonville. There's gold in them there plates.
I would not be surprised if they go through the parking lots at the mall during the holidays and do this too. The garage at the Avenues could be a goldmine.
If you had read a past issue of the Weekly there is a new appointed Paking Enforcement Operations Supervisor. She has lauch a Jhiad to generate potainal revenue for her department, Parking Enforcement is supposed to be enforcing PARKING LAWS. tHE KEY WORD IS" PARKING" What does and expired tag have to due with parking ?
They have always done license plate checks while doing parking enforcement. The new technology just makes it a lot easier.
I got a ticket (rightfully so) for putting a license plate holder on my car that covered the registration sticker while parked beside the Main library. My carelessness cost me $25.
I wonder how many stolen cars they have recovered with the new vans?
Just renew it early or on time and you won't have the problem.
They just ticketed our poor printer repair guy for having an expired tag. Same story as me - only a a week or two past his birthday. COJ's parking enforcement is BRUTAL!
(Although it's kind of funny when it happens to someone else)
QuoteI wonder how many stolen cars they have recovered with the new vans?
Got my own answer. Ran into the parking van guys walking into Publix last week and asked them if they ever came across stolen cars with their plate checks. They said yes, but that never reported them to JSO because the cars would be gone by the time JSO arrived and they didn't want to spend the time involved.
This strikes me as wrong. Enforcing parking more important than recovering stolen cars?!!! Maybe we should talk to Jack Shad, who is the new head of Parking for the City and get the priorities reexamined.
+1
If the parking lot has a gate or a sign stating that it is private property (and therefore not for the general public use like a Walmart parking lot) the Florida Attorney General's office has determined that these types of infractions are not enforcable.
QuoteNumber: AGO 96-53
Date: July 12, 1996
Subject: Police enforcement of ordinances on private property
Mr. Michael S. Davis
St. Petersburg City Attorney
Post Office Box 2842
St. Petersburg, Florida 33731
RE: MUNICIPALITIES--ORDINANCES--LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS--PRIVATE PROPERTY--enforcement of municipal ordinances on private residential property by municipal law enforcement officers. ss. 316.006, 316.008, Fla. Stat.
Dear Mr. Davis:
You have asked for my opinion on substantially the following question:
Does Chapter 316, Florida Statutes, authorize a municipal police officer or parking enforcement specialist to issue a traffic citation for vehicles parked on private residential property (including, but not limited to, a private residential lawn) in violation of municipal ordinance?
In sum:
A municipal police officer or parking enforcement specialist does not have the authority under Chapter 316, Florida Statutes, to issue a traffic citation for vehicles parked on private residential property in violation of municipal ordinance since such property is not a thoroughfare or street upon which the public has a right to travel by motor vehicle. However, vehicles improperly parked on private residential property which has been posted may be towed from that property at the property owner's or lessee's request pursuant to section 715.07, Florida Statutes, and a lien imposed for towing and storage under section 713.78, Florida Statutes. Unauthorized vehicles may be towed from single-family residential property at the owner's request and the property need not be posted pursuant to section 715.07, Florida Statutes.
According to your letter, the City of St. Petersburg is experiencing problems with people parking on residential lawns in violation of a city ordinance. This is a particular problem for single-family residential property owners and has prompted your opinion request.
The Florida Uniform Traffic Control Law, Chapter 316, Florida Statutes, was enacted "to make uniform traffic laws to apply throughout the state and its several counties and uniform traffic ordinances to apply in all municipalities."[1] In order to ensure that the provisions of Chapter 316, Florida Statutes, are given uniform application throughout the state, section 316.002, Florida Statutes, provides that "t is unlawful for any local authority to pass or to attempt to enforce any ordinance in conflict with the provisions of this chapter."[2]
However, section 316.002, Florida Statutes, expressly states:
"The Legislature recognizes that there are conditions which require municipalities to pass certain other traffic ordinances in regulation of municipal traffic that are not required to regulate the movement of traffic outside of such municipalities. Section 316.008 enumerates the area within which municipalities may control certain traffic movement or parking in their respective jurisdictions."
Thus, section 316.008(1), Florida Statutes, recognizes that the provisions of Chapter 316 do not prevent local authorities from "[r]egulating or prohibiting stopping, standing, or parking" on streets and highways under their jurisdiction.
This office has stated that the provisions in Chapter 316, Florida Statutes, are enforceable on private property only if the public may travel by motor vehicle on such property.[3] This conclusion is based on section 316.640, Florida Statutes, which provides, in part, that municipalities must enforce state traffic laws on all municipal streets and highways "wherever the public has the right to travel by motor vehicle."
It is the availability of the area or place for travel and the right of general and common use which makes certain private property subject to public control pursuant to Chapter 316, Florida Statutes. Thus, this office has determined that municipalities have enforcement authority with respect to traffic violations and accidents occurring in shopping centers and parking lots which are considered to be "streets and highways" upon which the public has the right to travel by motor vehicle.[4] However, no authority to enforce Chapter 316, Florida Statutes, exists on private residential property which may not be used by the public for motor vehicle traffic.[5]
You have specifically cited section 316.1945(3), Florida Statutes, as authority for your assertion that a municipal police officer may enforce an ordinance prohibiting vehicle parking on private residential property such as lawns. The statute provides that:
"A law enforcement officer or parking enforcement specialist who discovers a vehicle parked in violation of this section or a municipal or county ordinance may:
(a) Issue a ticket form as may be used by a political subdivision or municipality to the driver; or (b) If the vehicle is unattended, attach such ticket to the vehicle in a conspicuous place, except that the uniform traffic citation prepared by the department pursuant to s. 316.650 may not be issued by being attached to an unattended vehicle."
The statute also provides that "[t]he uniform traffic citation prepared by the department pursuant to s. 316.650 may not be issued for violation of a municipal or county parking ordinance." The statutory section specifically prohibits stopping, standing, or parking in particular places such as on a crosswalk or in an intersection.[6]
Thus, to the extent that a municipality or county has adopted an ordinance regulating parking on a publicly traveled street or highway, a municipal police officer may ticket a vehicle not in compliance with the local regulation. Such was the case in Attorney General's Opinion 83-86 in which this office concluded that a municipality was authorized to enact an ordinance allowing pest control vehicles exceeding 10,000 pounds which could not enter residential driveways without damaging the driveways to make temporary stops on city streets for purposes of performing pest control services on the adjacent residential properties from such vehicle. As was noted in that opinion, section 316.008(1), Florida Statutes, authorizes a municipality, within the reasonable exercise of the police power, to regulate or prohibit "stopping, standing, or parking" on streets and highways under its jurisdiction.[7] It is these local regulations which section 316.1945(3), Florida Statutes, authorizes a police officer or parking enforcement specialist to enforce.
Therefore, it is my opinion that a municipal police officer or parking enforcement specialist does not have the authority under Chapter 316, Florida Statutes, to issue a traffic citation for vehicles parked on private residential property in violation of municipal ordinance unless the public has a right to travel by motor vehicle on such property.
However, I would note that section 715.07, Florida Statutes, authorizes the owners of private property upon which vehicles have been parked without permission to have these vehicles towed from their property. Section 713.78, Florida Statutes, recognizes that a lien for towing and storage services may be imposed against the vehicle by the towing company for these services.
Section 715.07, Florida Statutes, authorizes
"[t]he owner or lessee of real property . . . [to] cause any vehicle parked on such property without his permission to be removed by a person regularly engaged in the business of towing vehicles, without liability for the costs of removal, transportation, or storage or damages caused by such removal, transportation, or storage[.]"[8]
The statute imposes certain requirements on the towing companies responding to such a request for removal.[9] Thus, the towed vehicle must be stored at a site within a certain distance of the property on which it was parked and the person or firm towing or removing the vehicle must, within 30 minutes of completion of the removal, notify the appropriate law enforcement agency of the location of the vehicle and provide a description of the vehicle.
Section 715.07, Florida Statutes, requires that a notice that unauthorized vehicles will be towed must be posted on certain private property but "property appurtenant to and obviously a part of a single-family residence" is exempt from this requirement.[10] Thus, the owner or lessee of a single-family residence[11] is not required to post his or her property in order to have unauthorized vehicles which have been parked there towed or removed at the vehicle owner's expense.
Sincerely,
Robert A. Butterworth
Attorney General
RAB/tgk
http://myfloridalegal.com/ago.nsf/printview/23BC2799DEA7F16E85256368006356E4
Quote from: Dog Walker on January 10, 2012, 04:07:47 PM
QuoteI wonder how many stolen cars they have recovered with the new vans?
Got my own answer. Ran into the parking van guys walking into Publix last week and asked them if they ever came across stolen cars with their plate checks. They said yes, but that never reported them to JSO because the cars would be gone by the time JSO arrived and they didn't want to spend the time involved.
This strikes me as wrong. Enforcing parking more important than recovering stolen cars?!!! Maybe we should talk to Jack Shad, who is the new head of Parking for the City and get the priorities reexamined.
Is that really that shocking? Agencies these days seem like they're more interested in maintaining themselves & running a business than doing anything that really helps citizens. We all pay so they can simply exist, whether we really need them or not.
Take a look at the drug laws & the amount of "criminals" we have in the prison system in this country. Same shit.
Lots of money to be made around the edges of law enforcement. Many of the badged, sworn officers I know make a distinction between being "peace officers" and "law enforcement officers" and proudly claim to be the former.
Just put a boot on the stolen vehicle. It won't get away!!!!
Quote from: mbwright on January 12, 2012, 10:12:49 AM
Just put a boot on the stolen vehicle. It won't get away!!!!
You and I have thought of that, but they don't seem to have done so. ::) ::)
That brings up another question, do they put boots on vehicles with parking violations outside of downtown? I've never seen a car booted out in the 'burbs.
Good idea on booting a stolen vehicles though, that makes sense. But they're probably out to there to generate as much revenue as possible off of parking violations.
Amazing, Dog Walker. How do they know the car would be gone before JSO could arrive? Do they find stolen cars so often that taking that time to call JSO would seriously interrupt their work?
Debbie, you would have to ask them. By the time I got my dropped jaw back in place they were gone and I couldn't ask any follow-up questions.
COJ parking enforcement strikes again!
I've never seen a boot on a car in a suburban parking lot.
(http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/418366_10150715948231410_763981409_11315171_356116323_n.jpg)
They slapped a fat nasty fine on this guy's driver's side window too. 425 bucks to get the boot removed.
They're not playing.
He must have had a LOT of unpaid fines! Maybe they are going into those private, suburban parking lots to find scofflaws not to enforce parking regulations in them.
Glad you posted this. It reminded me of a pic I took a few days ago....
(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7201/6798299358_37a311a435_z.jpg)
Where was parking enforcement when this DB decided to double park?
And you wonder why there's limited parking in Avondale during lunch. ::)
Quote from: Non-RedNeck Westsider on March 07, 2012, 01:07:02 PM
Glad you posted this. It reminded me of a pic I took a few days ago....
(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7201/6798299358_37a311a435_z.jpg)
Where was parking enforcement when this DB decided to double park?
And you wonder why there's limited parking in Avondale during lunch. ::)
Who's double parked?
The city vehicle, of course, or I wouldn't have taken the pic. I'm the car in front, and had about 1" between his front bumper and my rear to keep me in the lines. The lines on the road are vague, but they're there, and when would you ever park in the middle of two spots? Only if you know you're not getting ticketed.
I was secretly hoping someone would park really tight behind him/her.
Quote from: Non-RedNeck Westsider on March 07, 2012, 01:18:15 PM
The city vehicle, of course, or I wouldn't have taken the pic. I'm the car in front, and had about 1" between his front bumper and my rear to keep me in the lines. The lines on the road are vague, but they're there, and when would you ever park in the middle of two spots? Only if you know you're not getting ticketed.
I was secretly hoping someone would park really tight behind him/her.
Interesting. I don't see any lines there. Looks like you are blocking the driveway.
I guess it does. :(
No worries. The drive was free and clear.
QuoteThat brings up another question, do they put boots on vehicles with parking violations outside of downtown? I've never seen a car booted out in the 'burbs.
Good idea on booting a stolen vehicles though, that makes sense. But they're probably out to there to generate as much revenue as possible off of parking violations.
The revenue police have the right to come onto your property and ticket your vehicle, even if it is covered, if the tags are expired. I had a friend this happened to in Avondale, of course it was a few years ago when the city was more bloated with people who did not need to be in the city, but they can and will write a ticket if they see an infraction, even on private property.
NRW - I know where you are parked, that is in front of Talbot and St. Johns Avenue,there are a few signs along there, stating No Parking on Grass, but really nothing stating people cannot park on the curb. Signs along the right or way might help people on where they can and cannot park, because no one will pay attention to the pavement, especially at night.