San Marco Station Project Takes Shape
(http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/photos/1582837837_5DnC3DT-M.jpg)
Anchored by Panera Bread, Ashco, Inc.'s San Marco Train Station may be Jacksonville's latest infill development that was positively impacted by the developer and community working together.
Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2011-nov-san-marco-station-project-takes-shape
Now this partnership will raise the dough of all involved. Great project. Nice article Doug.
Hopefully this does well. It would be great to see this project as a catalyst for the reviatalization of that area of Hendricks.
Just curious. But being next to the railroad tracks what is the potential that an additional track can serve as a future Amtrack Bike car. Motorcycle car, parking area?
If the plan is a railroad museum. Kim Delaney who gave a presentation at the Prime Osborn center and the benefits of booking conventions with Amtrack and the opportunity for people to travel long distances and bring their bikes or cycles and all Amtrack has to do is add that Railroad car. Has this been part of any of the discussions?
Hats off to Doug Skiles for saving the building AND for working on a solution that keeps the pedestrian context of the street intact.
There are quite a bit of adaptive reuse buildings on that block now(Burdette, Basil, Tropical Smoothie, the residential lofts), it would have been ashame to destroy one of the few remaining city of south jax buildings.
Man it'd be great to have Panera back in San Marco.
Gorgeous building.
This will be one of those projects that makes all of the brochures and advertisements for Jacksonville for many years to come. Our city will see that when smart planning and the end user are kept in mind, you can create a space that truly enriches the community around it. A huge congratulations to Doug Skiles and everyone involved.
Also, I have heard that Aardwolf Brewery will be going in across the street at the other brick building south of the railroad tracks. PeeJayEss may be able to shed more light on that matter. The brewery already has financing and has done much of the design work for the space.
^Nice!
Please say you're keeping the old spiral staircase!
This should be a fantastic addition to the corridor.
A wonderful example of what can happen when the community becomes involved in creating their own future. Congratulations!
Let me add my congratulations to the chorus. Very excited and will spend some money at that Panera.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on November 14, 2011, 09:18:43 AM
Also, I have heard that Aardwolf Brewery will be going in across the street at the other brick building south of the railroad tracks. PeeJayEss may be able to shed more light on that matter. The brewery already has financing and has done much of the design work for the space.
I heard that too. Keeping my fingers crossed.
Once this is all finished and about six months to a year after that, there should be a followup article (hopefully a success story) to encourage this type of development to occur all over JAX and to abandon the typical carcentric crap that we're currently plagued with.
Excellent work, Doug. You do amazing work for our neighborhood.
Quote from: dougskiles on November 14, 2011, 10:33:43 AM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on November 14, 2011, 09:18:43 AM
Also, I have heard that Aardwolf Brewery will be going in across the street at the other brick building south of the railroad tracks. PeeJayEss may be able to shed more light on that matter. The brewery already has financing and has done much of the design work for the space.
I heard that too. Keeping my fingers crossed.
Keep 'em crossed, y'all...
They have a website... (sort of)
http://aardwolfbeer.com/
Well done!
That building would be the perfect size & location for a Trader Joe's.
Quote from: mbstout on November 15, 2011, 12:41:33 PM
That building would be the perfect size & location for a Trader Joe's.
I wish....
well they are finally expanding into Florida
With Naples being their first Florida location, I expect they must be planning a massive statewide expansion. I was about to say they would need a Florida distribution center but since they are owned by Aldi, perhaps not.
Knowing how they run their backroom operations, it would be hard to imagine them using the Haines City distribution center as part of a statewide expansion strategy. They typically have their own Joe-specific DCs. I have a feeling they will be trucking down from the Suwanee location in the short term and then open a Florida-specific DC when more stores are looking to be brought online.
They are more secret than even WalMart about their scout teams, but I haven't heard even one wild rumor that they have done any serious homework on Jax.
-Signed, Trader Joes' largest fan in Florida
*I just filled up half a suitcase of TJ products last week incidentally
Not sure he would have any real info...but my cashier at the Sandy Springs TJs in Atlanta told me he heard about a Jax location within 18 months. He didn't have any more detail than that.
How much space does a Trader Joe's need? Anyone have a copy of their site selection criteria?
Trader Joe's would be PERFECT in this location...typical store sizes are 10,000-15,000 sq ft.
I, too, come back from places like Charlotte with bagloads of their amazing food/beverages.
Go for it, Doug!!!
Unless they would be willing to occupy a second floor for some of that 10,000 this site wouldn't work. The footprint of the existing utility building is just shy of 5,000 sf with at most about 2,000 sf of small additions to the north and west.
The building across the street would have plenty of space.
I'll support WHATEVER business goes into that space. Anyone who contributes to the restoration/reuse of historic properties will get my business. I used to think Panera was okay, but no big deal. I give them points for signing on at this project and will probably go there more than I did in the old location.
Need to be clear - Panera won't be going into the old restored building. They will be in a new building between the two existing ones (old utility bldg and SJCH).
Now that the Naples store is up and running, Trader Joes is also opening in a 17k sq ft location in Sarasota along S. Tamiami Trail.
What exactly would it take to get a Trader Joe's here?
Quote from: ben says on February 16, 2012, 08:13:31 AM
What exactly would it take to get a Trader Joe's here?
Lets find out and get Shad Khan on it!
Quote from: copperfiend on February 16, 2012, 08:15:38 AM
Quote from: ben says on February 16, 2012, 08:13:31 AM
What exactly would it take to get a Trader Joe's here?
Lets find out and get Shad Khan on it!
;D
That, or firebomb their corporate inbox with requests...
Picking the city up and physically moving it to South Florida, Atlanta, or Charlotte.
Quote from: thelakelander on February 16, 2012, 08:17:53 AM
Picking the city up and physically moving it to South Florida, Atlanta, or Charlotte.
Pretty much.
A Trader Joes makes more sense than a Whole Foods for Jacksonville.
If one were opened anywhere in town it would do record sales, I bet.
While I love my Grassroots guys, I'd love to see them across the street from LPS and Fidelity on the Riverside corridor.
This thread hasn't been on topic for about 2 pages. Any updates on the actual project??
Quote from: Captain Zissou on February 16, 2012, 09:18:48 AM
This thread hasn't been on topic for about 2 pages. Any updates on the actual project??
Yes, the third building has been demoed. Project is well under way.
This project is taking the form of a PUD (Planned Unit Development) and can be tracked by the Public in the LUZAP System as it makes its way through the Planning Commision and City Council hearings in the following months.
The LUZAP (Land Use and Zoning Portal) System can be accessed here: http://maps.coj.net/luzap/
It doesn't have an Ordinance # yet, but it can be found by locating it on the map or searching for Tracking # 92.
Quote from: ben says on February 16, 2012, 08:16:52 AM
Quote from: copperfiend on February 16, 2012, 08:15:38 AM
Quote from: ben says on February 16, 2012, 08:13:31 AM
What exactly would it take to get a Trader Joe's here?
Lets find out and get Shad Khan on it!
;D
That, or firebomb their corporate inbox with requests...
FYI Ben, I have "friends" high in the Andes of Colombia that could probably arrange whatever you have in mind. ;D
OCK
Quote from: dougskiles on November 19, 2011, 12:37:46 PM
Need to be clear - Panera won't be going into the old restored building. They will be in a new building between the two existing ones (old utility bldg and SJCH).
Doug, do we have a rendering of Panera or is the restaurant in the article the same as Panera? Wouldn't it be cool to create a Panera in a reproduction streetcar barn sort of like The Spaghetti Factory does in several cities. Since South Jacksonville had it's own Muni, it would be/would have been a nice salute. Then we actually buy the blue trolley and set up an office.
I'd strike out for a "streetcar-interurban-railroad" museum and if you'd like I'll volunteer to get some nice attractive displays of quality LOCAL memorabilia.
Sorry that I've been AWOL on this thread for a while. I was out in Salt Lake City enjoying their excellent transit system (and doing a little skiing in between...)
Yes, the PUD has been submitted. The developer and SMPS agreed on a final site plan last week. Of course it still has to get City Council approval, but having SMPS support will help to get the District Council support (Lori Boyer) which usually means pretty smooth sailling. Although, I don't want to get ahead of myself and assume anything.
Sorry to say, Ock, that they won't be going with a themed building facade. It will be the prototype Panera, that we felt was compatible with the neighorhood. The old main utility building will be relatively untouched with the exception of a few entrance features that match the existing style.
Here is a photo I took today after the demolition of the small utility buildings where Panera's new building will go.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/9h4bqx.jpg)
Here is a sample elevation of Panera's prototype (there will NOT be a drive-thru, however):
(http://i41.tinypic.com/35cpett.jpg)
Quote from: Ocklawaha on February 16, 2012, 03:34:39 PM
Quote from: ben says on February 16, 2012, 08:16:52 AM
Quote from: copperfiend on February 16, 2012, 08:15:38 AM
Quote from: ben says on February 16, 2012, 08:13:31 AM
What exactly would it take to get a Trader Joe's here?
Lets find out and get Shad Khan on it!
;D
That, or firebomb their corporate inbox with requests...
FYI Ben, I have "friends" high in the Andes of Colombia that could probably arrange whatever you have in mind. ;D
OCK
Are your friends "high" in the Andes? Or hiiiiigh in the Andres? Either way, let's get them on it.
I was told directly by a higher up person at Trader Joe's that they are opening a Gainesville, Fl store. They will expand to Jax eventually I'm sure.
http://jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=537267
QuoteSan Marco Train Station gearing up for construction
08/16/2012
by Karen Brune Mathis, Managing Editor
It might not be long before Panera Bread rises again in San Marco.
Pending permits outline a building shell that would be renovated to accommodate a 4,061-square-foot Panera Bread Bakery at the San Marco Train Station project at 1440 Hendricks Ave.
Last week, developer Ed Ash invited providers of brick, stucco, roofing and concrete services to contact him for work on the project, which includes renovation of an existing 5,000-square-foot building. That structure is an old city waterworks and electric building.
Ash also plans to develop the new building for Panera Bread.
The site fronts Hendricks Avenue and is bordered by Cedar Street, Naldo Avenue and train tracks.
Ashco Inc. is the developer and its www.ashcoinc.net website defines the location as “Jacksonville’s newest upscale hotspot.†Panera operated nearby but closed about year-end 2009.
The rendering of the new Panera site looks rather "Blah," just a box. Hopefully they do some detail that complements the two existing structures.
QuoteThe rendering of the new Panera site looks rather "Blah," just a box. Hopefully they do some detail that complements the two existing structures.
Forget the looks, where do you park?
Quote from: mtraininjax on August 17, 2012, 10:24:19 AM
QuoteThe rendering of the new Panera site looks rather "Blah," just a box. Hopefully they do some detail that complements the two existing structures.
Forget the looks, where do you park?
In the large
shared parking lot in the back.
Riverside and Avondale can learn a lot from all the new development (especially in how SMPS and the Councilperson works
with developers) in San Marco. ;)
Quote from: mtraininjax on August 17, 2012, 10:24:19 AM
QuoteThe rendering of the new Panera site looks rather "Blah," just a box. Hopefully they do some detail that complements the two existing structures.
Forget the looks, where do you park?
I park in my driveway, I'll just ride my bike there.
QuoteIn the large shared parking lot in the back.
Riverside and Avondale can learn a lot from all the new development (especially in how SMPS and the Councilperson works with developers) in San Marco.
Oh, I get it, use the EXISTING parking lot and EMPTY field as parking. Gotcha.
How exactly will Riverside/Avondale learn from this? Do we have empty parking lots now and fields we can tap into? Just curious....for parking reasons, of course. By the way, nothing is stopping restaurants under 150 seats from opening in our area, in fact a new one is coming to Avondale.
Quote from: mtraininjax on August 17, 2012, 10:46:34 AM
QuoteIn the large shared parking lot in the back.
Riverside and Avondale can learn a lot from all the new development (especially in how SMPS and the Councilperson works with developers) in San Marco.
Oh, I get it, use the EXISTING parking lot and EMPTY field as parking. Gotcha.
How exactly will Riverside/Avondale learn from this? Do we have empty parking lots now and fields we can tap into? Just curious....for parking reasons, of course. By the way, nothing is stopping restaurants under 150 seats from opening in our area, in fact a new one is coming to Avondale.
Parking supply outweighs demand in the district, despite what certain people will lead you to believe. The amount of hidden supply is truly eye opening. Allowing for shared parking agreements b/w complementary uses is one (of several) tried and true solutions to better parking management.
Please refer to my posts in the Kickbacks and Mellow Mushroom threads.
It's also refreshing to see how SMPS and Councilwoman Boyer strive for workable solutions based on common sense approaches, as opposed to...
QuoteBy the way, nothing is stopping restaurants under 150 seats from opening in our area, in fact a new one is coming to Avondale.
In what space? I also agree with fieldafm. The existing parking supply in Avondale is underutilized....especially the alleys.
Boyer has done a great job since she was elected. I wish the other Council members would take notice and learn from her.
The alleys are definitely underutilized. I drove through there on the south side of St Johns on a Sunday at abou 1 and there were two dozen spots at least, but they all had tow away signs up. They should open those spaces up to relieve some of the parking problems on St Johns. They are anti-competition and apparently anti-customer too.
SMPS also understands the importance of alternative modes of transit and planning for the future, not just how things are currently. The rest of the city could learn a lot from them.
I am most excited about the outdoor seating plaza between the existing building, new buildings and Hendricks Avenue. Getting the parking behind the development took some convincing at first, but now Mr. Ash appears to be very pleased with how the design took shape. That layout will be complimented by the Aardwolf Brewery across the street.
About a year ago, one of the local papers did an article about how dead the Hendricks Avenue corridor had become. It hasn't taken long to completely turn it around. The stretch between Lasalle and the RR tracks is becoming one of best spots in the neighborhood.
The closer the retail development grows to the Kings Avenue garage, the more that facility will be seen as a parking resource for the area and we can encourage even more density. It isn't a very far walk from the garage to the new Panera (less than 1/4 mile) - but because of the empty commercial stretch, it feels like it is too far to walk.
QuoteI am most excited about the outdoor seating plaza between the existing building, new buildings and Hendricks Avenue. Getting the parking behind the development took some convincing at first, but now Mr. Ash appears to be very pleased with how the design took shape. That layout will be complimented by the Aardwolf Brewery across the street.
QuoteThe closer the retail development grows to the Kings Avenue garage, the more that facility will be seen as a parking resource for the area and we can encourage even more density. It isn't a very far walk from the garage to the new Panera (less than 1/4 mile) - but because of the empty commercial stretch, it feels like it is too far to walk.
Exactly the kind of forward thinking I was talking about.
We need more Doug Skiles' in this town! When people get discouraged about certain things in Jacksonville, just look to the kinds of exciting things happening b/c of people like him.. I know I do, and it motivates me even more.
Quote from: fieldafm on August 17, 2012, 03:39:00 PM
QuoteI am most excited about the outdoor seating plaza between the existing building, new buildings and Hendricks Avenue. Getting the parking behind the development took some convincing at first, but now Mr. Ash appears to be very pleased with how the design took shape. That layout will be complimented by the Aardwolf Brewery across the street.
QuoteThe closer the retail development grows to the Kings Avenue garage, the more that facility will be seen as a parking resource for the area and we can encourage even more density. It isn't a very far walk from the garage to the new Panera (less than 1/4 mile) - but because of the empty commercial stretch, it feels like it is too far to walk.
Exactly the kind of forward thinking I was talking about.
We need more Doug Skiles' in this town! When people get discouraged about certain things in Jacksonville, just look to the kinds of exciting things happening b/c of people like him.. I know I do, and it motivates me even more.
+1.
^No need for a PR team when I have you guys. Thanks for the vote of confidence.
^There's no better PR than doing a great job. I'd say you have that all covered already.
QuoteAbout a year ago, one of the local papers did an article about how dead the Hendricks Avenue corridor had become. It hasn't taken long to completely turn it around. The stretch between Lasalle and the RR tracks is becoming one of best spots in the neighborhood.
It is amazing what can happen when the road is fixed! The debacle of removing the old rails under Hendricks almost killed the retail traffic along the street, but now finished, it is nice to see the area taking off, because people are now coming down and travelling the area. San Marco square will too come back, but they need to finish the road construction!
QuoteIn what space? I also agree with fieldafm. The existing parking supply in Avondale is underutilized....especially the alleys.
What alleys are you talking about? The one-way alleys, the dead-end alley behind the Brick? Why would anyone park in an Alley to be boxed in? They could be used, I guess. Why not ask Steve, owner of the Brick to set the example and ask all his employees to park in the alley behind John Valentino's garage (AKA MM)? See what response you get.
Quote from: mtraininjax on August 17, 2012, 10:46:34 AM
How exactly will Riverside/Avondale learn from this? Do we have empty parking lots now and fields we can tap into? Just curious....for parking reasons, of course. By the way, nothing is stopping restaurants under 150 seats from opening in our area, in fact a new one is coming to Avondale.
These arguments are odd, I went by Avondale village several weekday's around 5-7 pm and consistently counted over 50 vacant parking spaces, none of which were outside the bounds of the shops area.
Quoteseveral weekday's around 5-7 pm
Its not the weekdays that are the issue, go there tonight between the same time to get a dose of what is an issue. It was a thick issue last night, cars parked past Edgewood along St. Johns....
What is going on with this project? Dead?
As far as I know, it is still very much alive.
Thanks for the update. It just seems for a fairly small project and all the hype about it early on that taking this long to simply break ground is not a good sign.
Construction has begun on the site. Foundation was poured last week for Panera and a third building is in the plans. Work on the brick building is being held in abeyance until the tenant has been decided on.
Thanks for the update, Nicole and welcome to Metro Jacksonville! We're all looking forward to seeing this exciting project rise.
No problem! I'm excited to be involved!
I was over by there yesterday and they're definitely turning dirt now. Do we have an estimated completion date?
Hey, permit for a new building on the site! Or was that the original plan?
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=539843
^part of the original plan.
Panera is back in San Marco! ;D
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=541349