http://jacksonville.com/2011-04-25/story/former-jacksonville-jewish-center-flames
Wow that sucks. Is the building currently occupied? It looked pretty vacant and run down last time I went by. When was it built?
Oh, how surprising. Another fire in Springfield...
That sucks. I guess we'll be looking at another vacant lot in Springfield.
Gee... I wonder how that started? Let's see, the building's vacant, boarded up, and supposedly secure... How far behind was the owner on payments? "Hello, State Farm? I need to file a claim..."
Nice. It was bound to happen. I know it is not PC but my dad used to use the term, Jewish Lightning.
yep...I saw the smoke this morning....this is very sad.
danno...I have no idea what Jewish Lightning is...can you please explain?
75 firefighters on site, since 7 AM. Channel 12 claims its vacant, no one hurt, but fearing the building could collapse.
Anyone see a mythical figure playing fiddle onsite?
There is a very determined serial arsonist in Springfield. He (or she) has burned house after house in Springfield, mostly on the east side. To say these are unrelated incidents started by homeless is not logical. The homeless do not want to draw attention to themselves or where they live. It is not cold, so this fire was not started to keep warm.
No doubt this fire was started for either profit or attention or kicks.
Like the others.
Quote from: tufsu1 on April 25, 2011, 07:56:02 AM
yep...I saw the smoke this morning....this is very sad.
danno...I have no idea what Jewish Lightning is...can you please explain?
Arson to recoup insurance money.
Maybe River Region should have been allowed to use the building.
Better that someone put it to beneficial use than the homeless, vagrants, or Hiondies destroy it with fire.
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=44237
Jimmy...
Agreed.
The building is owned by the federal government. Very sad to see it burning.
Is Dusty still in prison? Anyone know the latest with her?
Quote from: sheclown on April 25, 2011, 08:00:15 AM
No doubt this fire was started for either profit or attention or kicks.
do you know something?
The building is not owned by the government. It was auctioned off several years ago.
Quote from: fsujax on April 25, 2011, 08:22:16 AM
The building is owned by the federal government. Very sad to see it burning.
Not anymore. It was sold to a company called 205 W THIRD ST LLC in 2007.
2275 Atlantic Bv, Neptune Beach.
ooops my bad!
I know we have a serial arsonist who is setting fires in Springfield. And this isn't the first.
2003 or 2004? Dusty was arrested and charged with a bunch of fires in Springfield. Anyone remember the details? How was she caught?
I believe she was setting them for money and b/c she enjoyed watching them burn.
Perhaps we ought to look at this neighborhood's previous history with arsonists to try to help figure out what is going on here.
I agree Sheclown. I live near 3rd and Ionia and it is very disturbing.
Wow, weren't the residents trying to turn this building into a school?? This is pretty terrible. That building was amazing.
If I remember correctly, she was setting the fires because SPAR and "all those white people" were scaring off her clientele, odd because she was white herself. I thought she was actually caught trying to set another fire and tried to run away from the scene but I could be wrong. I remember people talking at the time and that the feeling was that she was trying to either set fire to houses with spar signage or vacant ones nearby.
Quote
Not anymore. It was sold to a company called 205 W THIRD ST LLC in 2007.
2275 Atlantic Bv, Neptune Beach.
which is owned by "Mr. Blight" himself:
HIONIDES, CHRIS
2275 ATLANTIC BLVD SUITE 100
NEPTUNE BEACH FL 32266
I wonder if anyone who lived around there caught anything on a CCTV that they might have had? I know several houses have security cameras, maybe there are some that happen to catch a part of the building.
Quote from: stephendare on April 25, 2011, 09:07:11 AM
Quote from: Bridges on April 25, 2011, 09:02:48 AM
I wonder if anyone who lived around there caught anything on a CCTV that they might have had? I know several houses have security cameras, maybe there are some that happen to catch a part of the building.
I personally think this needs to move right up to the fore of priorities for Springfield. Between SPAR and Arson, there isnt going to be anything left.
If this keeps up, it would have been kinder to leave the neighborhood as a ghetto. At least the buildings were kept standing.
I know a number of buildings have been burned on Ionia. And there was the one that I remember on 8th.
Now the old Jewish Center.
Has a detective been assigned to the arsons or are they treating them as separate crimes?
Are they investigating this at all?
True. It seems like Springfield is sorta caught in the middle right now. All the big money left before it got a chance to really break through that final barrier. So now you still got a lot of the fabric that needs fixed, but a lot of the bad elements remain as well. All in a city who's leaders obviously don't care either way & would just assume to let it slip back into a full fledged ghetto that's half restored, half falling down/empty lots.
Something needs to be done.
What Springfield needs is strong, cohesive leadership, there are too many factions within the neighborhood. Springfield needs to follow the RAP model.
Quote from: stephendare on April 25, 2011, 08:49:49 AM
SheClown or Nicole.
Do we have a catalogue of photos of all the buildings that have been burned by arson?
Perhaps we could get a comparison of what they all have in common.
Perhaps common tenants, owners, property managers or contractors.
Well 3 or 4 of Craig Van Horn's all burned down 'accidentally' but now that he's run out of places to torch for insurance money (hypothetically of course), I suppose that threat is probably nullified.
Quote from: fsujax on April 25, 2011, 09:37:21 AM
What Springfield needs is strong, cohesive leadership, there are too many factions within the neighborhood. Springfield needs to follow the RAP model.
There is exactly 1 too many factions in the neighborhood. It starts with "S" and ends with "PAR"...lol
Quote from: stephendare on April 25, 2011, 09:56:05 AM
But seriously. Do we have a listing of all the burned properties in the neighborhood?
Maybe JFRD has that kind of info.
Wow, that's some wild speculation. Has anyone checked her attic for the Lindbergh baby?!
Quote from: fsujax on April 25, 2011, 09:37:21 AM
What Springfield needs is strong, cohesive leadership, there are too many factions within the neighborhood. Springfield needs to follow the RAP model.
That stopped working when the SPAR leadership started testifying before HPC asking them to allow the demolition of historic homes and structures. That's when the "factions" started among those who didn't think a preservation group should be involved in the destruction of our historic fabric. I wish that were not true. I really do.
Well, you know me. I'm quite dumb. Your post read to me like you were accusing Mrs. DeSpain of arson.
This was posted in this thread (http://www.myspringfield.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=1296 (http://www.myspringfield.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=1296)) over on myspringfield.org
When I walked past the building last night (10:30pm? not sure about the time) I did see a couple come out from behind it. They told me they just cut through the lot as a shortcut. In the past, vagrants kept breaking into the building, and I suspect they have recently as there was steady new trash around the place.
I meant merely that Dusty's conviction was based on DeSpain's word.
"Despite more than 100 arrests and 83 criminal convictions in Jacksonville dating back 30 years, career prostitute Dusty Simmons has never been to prison."
But since the arsons have continued unabated, I think its reasonable to assume that when they convicted Dusty for basically being a pain in the ass, (at least in the press accounts) that they didnt get the actual serial arsonist.
''its reasonable to assume''
Wow Stephen, do you really believe this to be the case?
What is the state of the building now? I assume the fire is out by now.
Fire under control at former Jacksonville Jewish Center in Springfield
Posted: April 25, 2011 - 7:03am
Abel Harding/The Times-Union
Firefighters battle flames at the old Jacksonville Jewish Center in Springfield
(http://jacksonville.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/lead_photo_wide/042511jewishfire990-2.jpg)
205 W. Third St., Jacksonville, Florida Video from the scene at 7:00 a.m.
Video of a firefighter in a second floor window, moments before fire broke through the roof
History of the Jacksonville Jewish Center
The synagogue portion of the property was built in 1929 and an educational building was added about 50 years ago. The Jewish Center closed early in 1976 when a new Jewish Center was built in Mandarin.
The Labor Department bought the property for $400,000 and opened it in 1979 as the Jacksonville Job Corps Center to train and educate 150 high school dropouts. The Job Corps moved to a new home in 2005 and the federal government declared the property to be surplus.
Advertisement
By Abel Harding, David Hunt, Timothy J. Gibbons
Update (9 a.m.) - Francis has given official word that the fire is under control. The state fire marshal is being called in to investigate.
Update (8:18 a.m.) - All photos from the fire are now in a photo gallery
Update (8:18 a.m.) - Floors in the building have collapsed. According to the fire department, 15 minutes before the floors collapsed, several dozen firefighters were pulled out of the building. Most damage was to the second floor, officials said, and they still fear the building could collapse.
Update (8:18 a.m.) - Flames no longer coming out of the roof, building seems to be coming under control.
Update (8:05 a.m.) - Fire department spokesperson Tom Francis says there is no threat to surrounding homes, and no surrounding homes have been evacuated.
Update (8:00 a.m.) - Fire trucks have pulled away from Silver Street side of the building to concentrate on the building's second and third stories. The fire department says the main focus now is to keep walls from collapsing.
Update (7:54 a.m.) - Firefighters report the roof has collapsed. Also, see a picture of the building before the fire and brief history about the center.
Update (7:05 a.m.) - The fire department sounded an alarm to get all interior crews out of the building, saying the fire had become too dangerous to be that close to.
Firefighters are battling a fire at the old Jacksonville Jewish Center and Job Corps building at Third and Pearl streets in Springfield.
About 75 firefighters and 10 fire trucks are on the scene. The first call came at 6:45 a.m., according to the Jacksonville Fire and Rescue Department
The fire appears to have started on the third floor of the abandoned building at 205 W. Third St., but the cause has yet to be determined. No mandatory evacuations have been issued but nearby residents are advised to stay away. No injuries have been reported.
Fire department spokesperson Tom Francis said no other structures are in danger, but there is concern that floors may collapse as 24,000 pounds of water per minute have been used to try to contain the blaze. Water cascaded out the front doors, down the steps as hoses blasted the flames and hot spots.
Francis said the fire breached the attics area and shot a huge, glowing fire ball through the roof.
Residents said vagrants have occasionally been a problem in the area.
Denise Hunt said the fire woke her up before the sirens began to sound. The sounds of breaking glass and falling debris were too much to sleep through. She compared the noise to fireworks.
"It looked like an inferno," Hunt said. "It looked like nothing I've ever seen in my life. I thought we were going to lose this entire block if someone didn't get here soon," Hunt said.
Hunt, a UNF nursing student, said she was nervous about her nearby home and her family. When she first went outside, the intensity of the fire was impossible to ignore.
"You could feel the heat. I could feel my skin burning," she said.
Claude Moulton, president of the Springfield Preservation and Restoration Council, said the building is a noticeable loss for one of Jacksonvilles most distinctive neighborhoods.
"It is a terrible shame they were never able to do something productive with it," he said as he watched firefighters gather their gear at Monday's fire scene. "It's a shame to see a historic building destroyed."
Moulton said many locals had hope of a developer converting the three-story building into residences and shops but the economy has been too rocky in recent years.
This story is developing, we will add more information as it becomes available.
Read more at Jacksonville.com: http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/2011-04-25/story/fire-under-control-former-jacksonville-jewish-center-springfield#ixzz1KY7KxeGn (http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/2011-04-25/story/fire-under-control-former-jacksonville-jewish-center-springfield#ixzz1KY7KxeGn)
Hmmmmmmmmm, this looks like the work of the evil KKK.
UPDATE: Just got word that the building is collapsing and is about to be demolished.
Quote from: Jimmy on April 25, 2011, 10:25:55 AM
Well, you know me. I'm quite dumb. Your post read to me like you were accusing Mrs. DeSpain of arson.
If DeSpain had been an arsonist, instead of what she actually was, there'd be a lot more of Springfield left standing.
Quote from: Lunican on April 25, 2011, 01:03:36 PM
UPDATE: Just got word that the building is collapsing and is about to be demolished.
Please someone take pictures.
100 years of history, gone in an instant.
Quote from: Lunican on April 25, 2011, 01:03:36 PM
UPDATE: Just got word that the building is collapsing and is about to be demolished.
Yeah, I saw an ariel shot on Dan's facebook wall. The two lengthwise walls are buckling.
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150167059488855&set=a.493546643854.263974.576333854&type=1
QuoteJust got word that the building is collapsing and is about to be demolished
This is incredibly sad and a great loss to a national historic district! The city MUST stop these fires - it is unsafe and highly suspicious for this area to have sooooo many fires - its like 1/month! What I think is even more suspicious is that no one is ever really injured - not that I want someone injured - but what are the odds that fires occur so frequently in 1 square mile and no one gets hurt!? The whole thing is suspicious and the city needs to get to the bottom of this. As a resident of Springfield I am outraged that the city continues to let this go on.
Springfield will be nothing but ashes if this continues! What other city allows so many fires to continue to happen in 1 square mile so frequently!!???
Demolition would, more than likely, destroy any evidence as to the real cause of this fire.
When was the last time an arson in Springfield was solved? Was 2003 the last arrest?
Another Jacksonville tragedy. I loved that building and had hoped it would be something great one day. My pessimism is kicking in again, but we are allowing Jacksonville to rot and or burn down. I will probably not live long enough to see what will surely become a weed infested lot come back to life. We take 1 step forward and 100 back with our historic structures. It's almost too late to care.
Quote from: avs on April 25, 2011, 01:15:47 PM
QuoteJust got word that the building is collapsing and is about to be demolished
This is incredibly sad and a great loss to a national historic district! The city MUST stop these fires - it is unsafe and highly suspicious for this area to have sooooo many fires - its like 1/month! What I think is even more suspicious is that no one is ever really injured - not that I want someone injured - but what are the odds that fires occur so frequently in 1 square mile and no one gets hurt!? The whole thing is suspicious and the city needs to get to the bottom of this. As a resident of Springfield I am outraged that the city continues to let this go on.
Springfield will be nothing but ashes if this continues! What other city allows so many fires to continue to happen in 1 square mile so frequently!!???
+10000
This is truly depressing.
Quote from: avs on April 25, 2011, 01:15:47 PM
QuoteJust got word that the building is collapsing and is about to be demolished
As a resident of Springfield I am outraged that the city continues to let this go on.
Springfield will be nothing but ashes if this continues! What other city allows so many fires to continue to happen in 1 square mile so frequently!!???
Oh come on..lets get real here. Its the citys fault there are so many arsons??
Puh-leese. Do you have any idea what it takes to catch an arsonist? Any idea at all? This isn't some 60 minute cop show on tv. The arsonist isn't standing out there waving a sign saying "here I am." Jacksonville can be faulted for many reasons but they haven't caught an arsonist, if there actually is one and its there fault?
Quote from: Jimmy on April 25, 2011, 01:05:27 PM
Quote from: Lunican on April 25, 2011, 01:03:36 PM
UPDATE: Just got word that the building is collapsing and is about to be demolished.
Yeah, I saw an ariel shot on Dan's facebook wall. The two lengthwise walls are buckling.
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150167059488855&set=a.493546643854.263974.576333854&type=1
Can you copy and post it here? I can't see that facebook page.
It's also on jacksonville.com. When I saw that shot I knew nothing good would come of it. The weight of all that water on the remaining interiors looks like it just pulled the middle inward on both sides. And it's visible looking at the side now too.
WJXT website
http://www.news4jax.com/slideshow/news/27658032/detail.html
@springfield chicken: are there any shots from the side to show the buckling now?
(http://content.screencast.com/users/GeekLawyer/folders/Jing/media/2896ac6d-f066-4ec2-9a33-93861405ae91/00000085.png)
Image thanks to Joel Weaner, pilot.
Sad. another beautiful example gone. M-train will be delighted .
wow. very sad.
Quote from: sheclown on April 25, 2011, 01:38:20 PM
Quote from: avs on April 25, 2011, 01:15:47 PM
QuoteJust got word that the building is collapsing and is about to be demolished
This is incredibly sad and a great loss to a national historic district! The city MUST stop these fires - it is unsafe and highly suspicious for this area to have sooooo many fires - its like 1/month! What I think is even more suspicious is that no one is ever really injured - not that I want someone injured - but what are the odds that fires occur so frequently in 1 square mile and no one gets hurt!? The whole thing is suspicious and the city needs to get to the bottom of this. As a resident of Springfield I am outraged that the city continues to let this go on.
Springfield will be nothing but ashes if this continues! What other city allows so many fires to continue to happen in 1 square mile so frequently!!???
+10000
It is no doubt buckling and very highly (now ) dangerous as it stands.. Don't think there is any saving that one. It is too bad that nothing of the architecture or any pieces can be spared.
And I fully agree.. the number of residential fires and commercial spaces that are going up are more than a passing coincidence.
At least its close to the park. Maybe they can incorporate the soon-to-be vacant land into it somehow?
I spoke to a nearby homeowner about this property a few weeks back. He said he was an engineer, working with/for the owner doing consulting on a nearby eyesore.
As he told it, this was part of a group of properties purchased for approximately 1.5M.
The owner was lloking for 4M, despite the recent decline in values across the board. I wonder what amount the property was insured for...
Quote from: peestandingup on April 25, 2011, 03:04:47 PM
At least its close to the park. Maybe they can incorporate the soon-to-be vacant land into it somehow?
I would almost like to see the granite walls left as they fell, sort of a post-modern Acropolis. Or at least a testament to what happens when you don't protect your history.
Yeah, that thing is coming down.
Trying again...photos of old Job Corps building
(http://i1137.photobucket.com/albums/n510/johnnyroadglide/4-25-2011002.jpg)
(http://i1137.photobucket.com/albums/n510/johnnyroadglide/04-25-11040.jpg)
(http://i1137.photobucket.com/albums/n510/johnnyroadglide/04-25-11036.jpg)
(http://i1137.photobucket.com/albums/n510/johnnyroadglide/04-25-11035.jpg)
(http://i1137.photobucket.com/albums/n510/johnnyroadglide/tmp10.jpg)
It is coming down now - i just heard there is a crane over there.
wish they could leave the front facade standing, like they did with the old Heard National Bank building.
That's a real shame. Along with the Karpeles, this was one of my favorite two Springfield buildings.
:( so sad . :(
Quote from: fsujax on April 25, 2011, 04:21:34 PM
wish they could leave the front facade standing, like they did with the old Heard National Bank building.
That Heard National Bank thing was an accident. ;) This isn't Savannah or Charleston.
(http://postandcourier.media.clients.ellingtoncms.com/img/photos/2010/08/22/rice-mill_t600.JPG?4326734cdb8e39baa3579048ef63ad7b451e7676)
Bennett Rice Mill in Charleston(http://margaretmoen.com/images/margaret%20moen%20photos_3.jpg)
Silky O'Sullivan's bar and restaurant on Beale Street in Memphis, Tennessee. Formerly the Gallina Building, the structure is about 100 years old.You do know this is Jax right?
The Claude Nolan building will be next. I have either called JSO on flagged an officer down on several instances because I have seen people going in on the Orange St side doors near the front.
Just drove by, crane is there but no action yet. Plenty of news crews though so it will be videoed.
Quote from: stephendare on April 25, 2011, 08:49:49 AM
SheClown or Nicole.
Do we have a catalogue of photos of all the buildings that have been burned by arson?
Perhaps we could get a comparison of what they all have in common.
Perhaps common tenants, owners, property managers or contractors.
Yes. Photos and addresses, but I'll need a day or two. 3 fires on Ionia were owned by the same person, there is an urban legend about the reason for the fires. Some love triangle.
Quote from: danno on April 25, 2011, 04:40:07 PM
The Claude Nolan building will be next. I have either called JSO on flagged an officer down on several instances because I have seen people going in on the Orange St side doors near the front.
Are these homeless people you are seeing?
I've been in the building twice with one of the leasing agents for the site and that is the usual the point of entry. They have had quite a bit of interest in that building, so it could just be potential users/business people.
i could almost cry. i love this building.
Quote from: iloveionia on April 25, 2011, 04:57:43 PM
Quote from: stephendare on April 25, 2011, 08:49:49 AM
SheClown or Nicole.
Do we have a catalogue of photos of all the buildings that have been burned by arson?
Perhaps we could get a comparison of what they all have in common.
Perhaps common tenants, owners, property managers or contractors.
Yes. Photos and addresses, but I'll need a day or two. 3 fires on Ionia were owned by the same person, there is an urban legend about the reason for the fires. Some love triangle.
There are also rumors about a local arsonist and we all know it. Living on the eastside.
^ She is correct.
I have contacted the fire chief. He did respond but didn't give much substance, just "rest assured we are aware and actively looking into it." I contacted him again today along with Gaffney's office.
Quote from: CityLife on April 25, 2011, 05:07:56 PM
Quote from: danno on April 25, 2011, 04:40:07 PM
The Claude Nolan building will be next. I have either called JSO on flagged an officer down on several instances because I have seen people going in on the Orange St side doors near the front.
Are these homeless people you are seeing?
I've been in the building twice with one of the leasing agents for the site and that is the usual the point of entry. They have had quite a bit of interest in that building, so it could just be potential users/business people.
Not unles the potential users/business people had shopping carts and were riding BMX bikes after dark. The did seem to be of the Urban Outdoorsman variety.
With all these fires, and more and more vacant lots, it seems like SPR is moving backward instead of forward.......
Since the asbestos removal people have been in the Park View, I've driven by twice and saw people jumping the fences to get inside. I've seen carts parked around the side of Claude Nolan as well.
Personally I think it's a mix of things. I do think that a lot of the fires are arson for insurance money or just to demolish the property but it's possible that some of them are caused by accident. Back in the 80's the abandoned house next to us burned down but that's because several crackheads occupied it and one of them even admitted that his camp stove started it. As for Dusty? I'm not losing any sleep. Sorry. Actually, I'm not sorry.
The loss of this structure is huge. It dominated that entire area. It may have been boarded up but it was still a beautiful structure.....now it will just be another overgrown lot......so sad....
Quote from: danno on April 25, 2011, 06:12:28 PM
Quote from: CityLife on April 25, 2011, 05:07:56 PM
Quote from: danno on April 25, 2011, 04:40:07 PM
The Claude Nolan building will be next. I have either called JSO on flagged an officer down on several instances because I have seen people going in on the Orange St side doors near the front.
Are these homeless people you are seeing?
I've been in the building twice with one of the leasing agents for the site and that is the usual the point of entry. They have had quite a bit of interest in that building, so it could just be potential users/business people.
Not unles the potential users/business people had shopping carts and were riding BMX bikes after dark. The did seem to be of the Urban Outdoorsman variety.
That sucks to hear. Have you made any attempts to contact the owners of the building? That building is a real gem and I'd hate to see anything happen to it.
Talked to a higher up on the scene and this is the story I was told. - The AC units were seen stripped a few weeks ago on the roof. People have been seen inside recently. The story goes was that they were stripping all of the copper wires from EVERYWHERE inside and starting small fires inside to burn all the plastic jackets away. They would then put out the fire with fire extinguishers on hand (that were seen in the building) Apparently the fire extinguisher ran out early before dawn and the fire got away from the idiots who were doing this. Maybe a body will be found under the rubble when all is said and done.
Blow torch and fire proof gloves.
Not if you're trying to strip an "entire" 3 story building of ALL of its copper.
Just typing what I heard.
Blow torch, fire extinguishers.
:D :D :D
"speculative"
:D :D :D
Quote from: stephendare on April 25, 2011, 07:42:41 PMMost of the copper thieves simply cut the rubber. Its very easy. Burning it would make the rubber stick to the wires after it melted. This seems like a weird explanation.
Have you ever tried to strip a 4 foot tall pile of tangled wire? I have a friend who works for a large electrical contractor and they take the old wire put it in a big pile and burn off of the insulation. The rubber all burns off, and the recyclers will take it that way.
I think they even fingerprint.
Regardless... another Landmark goes down. I certainly must say given the extent of the damage to the building, there was no shoring it up or saving it, sadly.
It is just a shame. I wonder how many more will follow it :(
I have been bummed all day about this.
yeah me too Danno. this sucks. I guess it could not have been prevented.
It's like hearing about the death of a distant friend.
Jogged by after the fire was put out this afternoon to say goodbye to one of my favorite landmarks in Springfield. More untapped potential gone forever.
Im sure M-train will come on to gloat and bug me for not saving the building.. set your clocks by it. its a certainty.
They're tearing it down right now. Got some video:
http://vimeo.com/22871245
Ive seen it after drinking a half a bottle of pepto bismol
sure did not waste any time getting it down. No attempt at all to save any features.
* sigh
No, they are bringing this down in the middle of the night.....no salvaging going on here......
excuse me? about me? No it is not about me, Stephen.
I'm not sure what could've been safely salvaged, those aerial pics were devastating, with those walls buckling inward like that, I'm thinking the whole thing was very unsafe to be around after the fire. I'm sure the investigators probably would've liked a closer look at the building as well. It's a shame.
sure is.. guess we will never know why it burned down.
Quote from: Timkin on April 25, 2011, 11:43:55 PM
sure is.. guess we will never know why it burned down.
....just like the others.
QuoteIt is just a shame. I wonder how many more will follow it
Every vacant building is a target, and getting worse with 47% of Jacksonville citizens under water with their mortgages. If this city does not see some significant job growth this year and soon, we will see a lot more empty buildings and thieves stripping what they can where they can.
Anyone want to hazard a guess as to what that demolition cost the city of Jacksonville? The dollar cost. Not the historical cost.
half a million?
More like <$100k.
A building about 1/3 of this one's size was <$20k to demolish about 4 years ago, when the market for construction/labor was still inflated. It will probably be cheaper now, cost-wise, and on top of that this building had a major fire which significantly reduces the amount of tonnage that needs to be disposed of. Given this one is 3-4X the size, you can figure probably around $80k-$100k.
unsafe though it may've been, there was still a lot ov sturdiness there. went by there last night, and they were having a hell ov a time with it.
Great guess Chris. I have it on good authority its 100 grand. Now the city will try and get that back by placing a lien on the property, but its doubtful they will ever get the full 100k.
That parcel seems to include a goodly bit of property aside from that building though, although i'm not sure what condition the other buildings are in..
They might as well tear down the annex or whatever it was to the west, the original building that burned was the core of the property. Without the original 1920's building there's not much of interest left.
Also, what's the story with the prairie style apartment building on W2nd street with condemned stickers all over the front door. That's a cool building.
Quote from: johnnyroadglide on April 26, 2011, 10:50:57 AM
Great guess Chris. I have it on good authority its 100 grand. Now the city will try and get that back by placing a lien on the property, but its doubtful they will ever get the full 100k.
Yeah they won't get that for the lot, that's for sure.
Thanks in varying parts to SPAR, COJ Code Enforcement, and SRG (in that order), somewhere between 1/3'rd and half of Springfield is vacant lots now. There are hundreds of them, you can't give 'em away.
This whole thing is so sad.
Totally agree Chris.. Springfield is looking more like LaVilla all the time. It makes no sense and it needs to stop.
What makes me particularly sad is , yet another Historic piece falls. and it is not likely that it set itself on fire. :(
Quotesomewhere between 1/3'rd and half of Springfield is vacant lots now. There are hundreds of them, you can't give 'em away.
This whole thing is so sad.
so true
Demolish to make safe or clear the lot makes a difference. Make safe would be cheaper. Less floor and foundations to remove.
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on April 26, 2011, 12:13:25 PM
Quote from: johnnyroadglide on April 26, 2011, 10:50:57 AM
Great guess Chris. I have it on good authority its 100 grand. Now the city will try and get that back by placing a lien on the property, but its doubtful they will ever get the full 100k.
Yeah they won't get that for the lot, that's for sure.
Thanks in varying parts to SPAR, COJ Code Enforcement, and SRG (in that order), somewhere between 1/3'rd and half of Springfield is vacant lots now. There are hundreds of them, you can't give 'em away.
This whole thing is so sad.
Thats exactly what this city needs to start doing. Give them to the adjacent property owners (if they want them & promise to take care of them), or hold auctions for them (with NO developers or investors allowed to participate). Blighted homes, same thing. That's what New Orleans is doing & they've been very successful with this approach. http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2011/04/brisk_sales_of_abandoned_prope.html Plenty of other cities are doing similar things to get properties & land lots in the hands of real people.
Give normal everyday people a chance to come in & remake the neighborhood who otherwise wouldn't have the opportunity. Let the "Georgetown dream" go. Those days are over.
Quote from: stephendare on April 25, 2011, 06:47:56 PM
Quote from: tpot on April 25, 2011, 06:30:40 PM
With all these fires, and more and more vacant lots, it seems like SPR is moving backward instead of forward.......
no kidding tpot. When Ock and I were out there today, we realized that this will rob that entire end of the park.
Keep in mind that the Jewish Center is right next door to the iconic Springfield Castle, which has been fast tracked for demolition as well.
That end of the park is going to be ravaged.
It will. But that park doesn't get maintained like it should either. Planting trees & stuff is great, but I think there's a reason why I never see people in it or any kids playing in it...damn dirty fire ants.
Seriously, I know this is the south & they're just part of life down here, but Jesus. You can't walk a couple feet without stepping in a big pile of them. They're everywhere. EVERYWHERE. I've never seen a park in all of Jacksonville where they were nearly this bad. It makes the park completely unusable. And forget letting your kids play in that.
Quote from: peestandingup on April 26, 2011, 02:08:03 PM
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on April 26, 2011, 12:13:25 PM
Quote from: johnnyroadglide on April 26, 2011, 10:50:57 AM
Great guess Chris. I have it on good authority its 100 grand. Now the city will try and get that back by placing a lien on the property, but its doubtful they will ever get the full 100k.
Yeah they won't get that for the lot, that's for sure.
Thanks in varying parts to SPAR, COJ Code Enforcement, and SRG (in that order), somewhere between 1/3'rd and half of Springfield is vacant lots now. There are hundreds of them, you can't give 'em away.
This whole thing is so sad.
Thats exactly what this city needs to start doing. Give them to the adjacent property owners (if they want them & promise to take care of them), or hold auctions for them (with NO developers or investors allowed to participate). Blighted homes, same thing. That's what New Orleans is doing & they've been very successful with this approach. http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2011/04/brisk_sales_of_abandoned_prope.html Plenty of other cities are doing similar things to get properties & land lots in the hands of real people.
Give normal everyday people a chance to come in & remake the neighborhood who otherwise wouldn't have the opportunity. Let the "Georgetown dream" go. Those days are over.
+1000
Why a guy like me who barely know Springfield, doesn't live there, nor truly understands the epidemic situation there, but
he is, by gosh darn, in love with Springfield. Is that really a bad thing?
-Josh