My honey has never been on a bus or other means of public transit. So we're planning a downtown datenight using nothing but JTA to get from Avondale to the CBD. If I have this figured out, we'll take the WS2 to near the Landing. Mill around there. Maybe take the Skyway over the river and back. Eat somewhere. Maybe visit the library. And then get back to Avondale via the WS2.
Is there a soul on MetJax who has done something similar and thinks this plan is bound for success... or failure?
Either way, I think that experience would make a fun and informative article, especially if there are pictures.
Why not take the Riverside Trolley to get into to town ? It will drop you right at the Landing in front of Starbucks(Koja Sushi is a great date night location on the water).
And while you're at it, call JTA and tell them evening hours Thursday through Saturday are a need for the neighborhood!!
Getting downtown from Avondale is actually very easy.. just be careful on how late you stay out, that's where the difficulty comes in b/c so many routes are ending earlier nowadays.
If you do it on a Thursday night, hit up NOLA. Otherwise, Jerry at La Cena will feed you well!
You may want to make it a date day or morning. The skyway only operates on the weekends during special events and stops running at 7pm during the work week. The library closes at 8pm on weekdays and earlier on the weekends. So, if you start your date too late, you may end up walking for a while or coming up on a locked public facility.
That's also what I was thinking, lol.
Thanks for those suggestions!
If I'm reading the trolley schedule correctly, for week-day use, that would be an early night. We'll be in a hurry even with the WS2. That doesn't run nearly late enough into the evening to be a practical choice.
The early ending time of the Skyway could create some problems!! I was sure it ran until 8 or 9. Grrrr...
I'll have some cash for cab fare, just in case...
Quote from: thelakelander on April 20, 2011, 02:26:18 PM
You may want to make it a date day or morning...
No kidding, sheesh. These options are depressing.
Looks like we can Skyway to the Southbank and water taxi back. The SS Marine runs after the Skyway stops.
Says a facebook friend of the prospect: "You will probably shanked, stabbed, shot, and propositioned for sex. Not in that specific, of course."
QuoteSays a facebook friend of the prospect: "You will probably shanked, stabbed, shot, and propositioned for sex. Not in that specific, of course."
How pathetically ignorant.
QuoteNo kidding, sheesh. These options are depressing.
Now how do you think it is for downtown office workers that work 3rd shift?
Jimmy, you are the perfect candidate to let JTA know of your desire to have Riverside Trolley service extended until midnight Thursday through Saturday evenings!! Shoot me a PM, please!
Field, I've beaten that drum till my hands hurt, and I can't really blame them.
I don't think that you can use the Field of Dreams analogy here. Have you seen the ridership on the PCTs later in the evening? It's pathetic. It's once, twice a week that I'm the only person on the trolley from the Landing all the way to Park & Dancy. Extending the hours will never happen until they see people on it during the current operating hours.
Maybe a solution would be to run a different route on Thurs - Sat night. Start at the Landing, down Park St & into 5 pts. Oak St or Riverside to Stockton, Stockton to Rosselle, Rosselle to King to Park to Dancy to St. Johns to King and then Reverse it from there. Granted, this only benefits the drinkers and nightlifers, but it wouldn't take much to get the hipster, drinking crowd to start filling the PCTs when they realize they can use them to barhop.
QuoteI don't think that you can use the Field of Dreams analogy here. Have you seen the ridership on the PCTs later in the evening? It's pathetic. It's once, twice a week that I'm the only person on the trolley from the Landing all the way to Park & Dancy. Extending the hours will never happen until they see people on it during the current operating hours.
The ridership when they have offered service downtown on Art Walk nights would tend to make your point null and void. There is certainly demand for evening hours. Parking is becoming a big problem as the three commercial districts grow. Also, the headways b/w 5-7pm and on Saturdays are EXTREMELY inconvenient for choice riders.
I rode the trolley nonstop during the 'R'ides of March promotion and I was amazed at the first time users of the system that either A) didnt know it existed before and B) ALL talked about how convenient evening service would be.
The Beaches Trolley runs until 3AM Thursday-Saturday. To put THAT into perspective, the Riverside Trolley has MORE riders than the Beaches Trolley.
Both the demand and need is ominpresent.
A secondary RT route along Park that terminates at the current FCCJ hub(while the current route down Riverside/St Johns could then terminate in a loop system at Roosevelt Square, thereby linking this route end-to-end with major retail anchors), helped in part by consolidating the SEVEN bus services that currently touch Park throughout the day, would really make the PCT system humming along with evening hours.
I will be more happy to contact JTA with my opinion of the need for increased hours for the Riverside Trolley.
Man do I wish our main library was open later than 7:00 PM during the week.
11:00 PM or even midnight would be so great.
Quote from: KenFSU on April 20, 2011, 03:37:55 PM
Man do I wish our main library was open later than 7:00 PM during the week.
11:00 PM or even midnight would be so great.
That would be nice, although the way things have been going, we're lucky the libraries are open as long as they are!
QuoteThe ridership when they have offered service downtown on Art Walk nights would tend to make your point null and void.
I think it doesn't have any relation to my point:
QuoteHave you seen the ridership on the PCTs later in the evening? It's pathetic. It's once, twice a week that I'm the only person on the trolley from the Landing all the way to Park & Dancy
During 'normal working hours' there is nobody on the bus. I would like to think that the ridership would increase if the service did, but I don't see that happening. I'm on it 3-4 days a week, and as I said, typically I'm the only one, there's never more than another couple. Where are all of the:
Quotefirst time users of the system that either A) didnt know it existed before and B) ALL talked about how convenient evening service would be.
They're still not on the bus.
The ride in from Dancy and St John's on the trolley is great (I live on Riverside near Dancy if anyone wants to trolley over for a drink). Drops right off at Landing and you can walk to library or the semi happening area on Bay St and Burrito Gallery on Adams. I met my wife at library (where she works) one afternoon and it was a nice ride back. A lot of LPS workers going from 5 points to LPS and LPS to Landing area. I too wish they ran trolley later/earlier. I work weird hours sometimes on weekends and would love to have that option. Either way you could always do one route and take home another.
What would be great would be to have the trolley hit the Skyway in the Brooklyn area. Connecting that new hotel being built on Riverside. Then if Skyway went all the way to Everbank you would never need a car. Would also be great when outside visitors come in for a game.
Ridership is at a peak during lunch hours. I have the numbers sitting in front of me.
Ridership was VERY high(standing room only) during 2 of the 3 times they tested it at Art Walk(the last time the weather was FREEZING, myself and the lady friend were the only ones in NOLA that night for a good hour and a half, Art Walk was beyond empty due to weather).
The route is going to have it's peak ridership times, and times when ridership isn't as high. That is no different than any public transit route in the country. During the non-peak times, headways are very inconvenient, to the point that I have to go out of my way to use the service. I once walked from Chamblins to RAM on a Saturday, waited at the trolley stop in front of RAM for 17 minutes... and FINALLY the trolley that was sitting at the Landing when I started my walk picked me up in front of RAM. I could have walked to the Shoppes of Avondale(my final destination) from RAM in about 22 minutes. So I literally could have walked the entire way and SAVED time(and money). You are not going to attract choice riders if it is not convenient. That's Choice Ridership Attraction 101.
Say you had a store that sold women's shoes. Your customers tell you 'you know, it would be really great if you would offer purses as well'. Then you buy three different lots of purses, and they all sell out quickly. Furthermore, the shoe store you have on the other side of town sells purses too and people buy them. THEN, you turn around and say 'you know what, until more people buy more shoes... I ain't selling no purses'
I mean, you don't have to have an MBA to figure that one out.
JTA also refuses to enact a merchant transit program. Retailers have approached JTA about buying bulk RT passes at a discount in order to give to their customers to encourage ridership(and reduce the strain on their limited parking). JTA says no b/c it reduces fare box revenue. Well, in ECON 102(microeconomics) I learned that when you cut a price and revenues increase b/c of it, you still make more profit than you would have b/c of the increased revenue. JTA mucked this up when they essentially turned their back on the beaches merchants Year 2 of the Beaches Trolley service. It is beyond me why they are turning their backs on the Riverside/Avondale/Downtown merchants yet again.
I work near Hemming Plaza so just for the heck of it I decided to see what my options were with mass transit. I need to walk from my house on Dellwood out to Stockton near the Gate station, which is not too unreasonable. Pick up WS6, which drops me off at the bus/skyway station by FSCJ. Then walk 4 blocks to the office. But getting home is not the same. Walk back to the bus/skyway station and catch the R5 which drops me off at Park and King. Walk about 8 blocks to Dellwood. Then east 2 blocks. While not perfect, it is doable. But I don't understand why JTA doesn't have busses or trolleys that run past city hall, the library, the Ed Ball Building, Hemming Plaza, etc..I guess because of the Skyway which as has been pointed out closes early.
oh and by the way, check out JTAs website. They are changing some routes starting May 2.
Yes, evening mass transit service SUCKS. There is no other way to sugarcoat that fact.
I would never expect JTA to behave like a business. I wonder if a private jitney could make a profit on Fri and Sat nights running a circuit past bars in the nothbank, southbank and Riverside?
great idea. just sucks you cant get anything later on the way back. In Detroit we were able to catch a bus outside of a club at 2am back to our hotel.
Well, it's a "school night." So we weren't going to paint the town. Just go out for an experience. Sounds like we're going to at least get that. :)
I work in the ATT building. The Greyhound station can get sketchy, and you will get a few bums, but as long as you know what you are getting into you are going to be OK. I have walked around at all hours, 5PM, midnight, 5 AM, and there isn't much going on downtown to be too worried about. I am not scared necessarily walking downtown, more annoyed late at night or at 5 AM when walking past Greyhound and getting hit up for cash. Personally I feel "safer" in the Landing, Library, Bay St, Burrito Gallery area. Even more so if you are like me with kids and aren't out too late.
Yeah, I worked downtown for years. I know the "hot pockets" of activity, both above board and sketchy.
Quote from: thelakelander on April 20, 2011, 02:26:18 PM
You may want to make it a date day or morning. The skyway only operates on the weekends during special events and stops running at 7pm during the work week. The library closes at 8pm on weekdays and earlier on the weekends. So, if you start your date too late, you may end up walking for a while or coming up on a locked public facility.
Ok now a couple of weekends ago my wife and I definitely saw the Skyway cars running at closer to 8:00 than 7:00. I can't imagine that they were just 'being shuttled' back to the maintenance facility that late.
What gives?
Unless things have recently changed, it officially stops running at 7pm. There have been plenty of times where I've seen empty cars in operation, while station gates are locked.
From jtafla.com
Skyway Hours
QuoteThe Skyway will open for fireworks Sunday, July 4 from 6 p.m. to midnight. It will be closed in observance of Independence Day, Monday, July 5.
Monday-Friday: 6 a.m.to 9 p.m.
Saturday-Sunday: Special Events Only
Obviously, their website hasn't been updated in some time...?
Cool, its nice to see the evening hours have been extended to 9pm. When we moved to our Northbank office last year, we declined to seriously consider skyway related park & ride options due to the earlier cut off time.
QuoteOk now a couple of weekends ago my wife and I definitely saw the Skyway cars running at closer to 8:00 than 7:00. I can't imagine that they were just 'being shuttled' back to the maintenance facility that late.
What gives?
They definately do shuttle them back and forth for maintenance on the weekends. A few weeks ago they shut down one of the tracks for maintenance and were running a lot of the cars on a Saturday for testing/maintenance-related issues.
Lake is right, or at least was right until about 4 weeks ago. Central station's gates were locked at 7:15pm on a Thursday 4 weeks ago when I tried to take it over to the Southbank. Of course, Central station is the worst one they have b/c nothing never seems to work there... but I wound up walking across the Main Street Bridge to get where I needed to go.
I walk downtown at all hours, except for getting hit up for money... there has never been a time where I have been unsafe. My car has gotten broken into in Riverside more(3) than it has ever gotten broken into downtown(0).
Remember when you speak folks, "We don't need streetcars in Jacksonville, we already HAVE trolleys!" Louise DeSpain, as executive director SPAR. DING!
How about we boarded the "faux trolley" or my personal favorite, the potato-chip-truck or "PCT Trolley." Assist us in educating the unwashed masses so they'll know, "WE NEED STREETCARS, and we DON'T have trolleys!"
OCKLAWAHA
Quote from: fieldafm on April 20, 2011, 03:33:45 PM
The ridership when they have offered service downtown on Art Walk nights would tend to make your point null and void. There is certainly demand for evening hours. Parking is becoming a big problem as the three commercial districts grow. Also, the headways b/w 5-7pm and on Saturdays are EXTREMELY inconvenient for choice riders.
I rode the trolley nonstop during the 'R'ides of March promotion and I was amazed at the first time users of the system that either A) didnt know it existed before and B) ALL talked about how convenient evening service would be.
The Beaches Trolley runs until 3AM Thursday-Saturday. To put THAT into perspective, the Riverside Trolley has MORE riders than the Beaches Trolley.
Those times are NOT correct. The final Beaches Trolley stop is actually 12:43 a.m. every night at the South Beach REgional Shopping Center at JTB/A1A.
BTW - the Skyway runs until 9 p.m., not 7 p.m.
That's why I prefaced the statement with the fact that I was at Central Station. That place never has working gates anyway. :)
As far as the Beaches service, you are correct they did change recently. They used to run later, that was my mistake.
Downtown date night got postponed until tonight. I have pics and impressions. But here are the highlights.
Got started around 6:25 from the W2 stop at Challen and Roosevelt. 6:30 was the posted time, bus showed up around 6:42. Pretty crowded. No two seats together until a stop or two past The Landing. We decided to stick it out to Rosa Parks station.
Exit bus at FSCJ/Rosa Parks. Skyway escalator was closed. We thought maybe Lake was right and it wasn't running anymore. Luckily I spotted the stairs were open. Long walk up. Skyway to Central. Transfer to the... other blue line? A dark blue and light blue line? Huh? I must be missing something. But we made it over the bridge.
Exited the Skyway at Riverplace. Walked to the river. Waited forever for the SS Marine outside of the Riverplace Tower stop. She seemed to "put in" for a loooooooong time at The Landing. Gave up and walked over the Main Street Bridge.
The Landing is getting downright shoddy. Lights out, dingy, rundown. No sense of vibrancy at all. Really depressing, after remembering a lot of good times there over the years. It needs some massive work, aside from whatever parking needs they purport to have.
Friendship Fountain's absence is really felt downtown. I don't know how long until it's back, but it's hardly DT Jax without it.
Dinner at The Landing. Looked at each other and decided "taxi" back to the warm embrace of Avondale. Found a taxi driver hanging outside of his cab between The Landing and TU Center. We were his first fare of the night and he'd been on duty for over an hour. $10 later, back where we started.
Transit date night (even on a weeknight) = win. Thanks, everyone, for the thoughts and suggestions.
We'll try out the PCTs next time for sure.
Quote from: Jimmy on April 20, 2011, 02:31:58 PM
Says a facebook friend of the prospect: "You will probably shanked, stabbed, shot, and propositioned for sex. Not in that specific, of course."
Well hell Jimmy, if you manage it in THAT ORDER I want to watch! Have a friend shoot a video or something.OCKLAWAHA
Quote...as I said, typically I'm the only one
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5050/5642368212_ccefd5ed65.jpg)
Sorry about the fuzz, as you know, it's not the smoothest ride.