I've been saying this for a looooooong time. Mike Hogan with his tea party backers is the second coming of Rick Scott. Of course, certain Hogan proponents have said this is ridiculous.
Guess what's happening Friday afternoon at Hogan Campaign HQ? Hold on to your hats.
A "Special Campaign Get-Together with Gov. Rick Scott."
Isn't that... special?
Support of Toney Sleiman and other developers-Check
Major Campaign Platform is cutting spending and "government waste"-Check
Tight with the Tea Party-Check
Beyond that I don't have a freaking clue what Mike Hogan stands for, thus its hard for me to really know whether or not he is the next Rick Scott.
Its definitely any interesting parallel for Brown and his supporters to use. Any good Scott fearing Jacksonvillian should be very afraid of a Scott clone.
I find it a little ironic that this news comes out today, all things considered (after our discussions last night in the other threads).
Quote from: CityLife on April 13, 2011, 06:16:39 PM
Support of Toney Sleiman and other developers-Check
Major Campaign Platform is cutting spending and "government waste"-Check
Tight with the Tea Party-Check
Beyond that I don't have a freaking clue what Mike Hogan stands for, thus its hard for me to really know whether or not he is the next Rick Scott.
Its definitely any interesting parallel for Brown and his supporters to use. Any good Scott fearing Jacksonvillian should be very afraid of a Scott clone.
This is so true.
Too bad there is one Dem causing a ruckus on MJ, there is no way any other Dem with a brain would support a Rick Scott clone!!!!!
If it becomes obvious - and I think it will - that Mike Hogan is more of the Rick Scott mold of politicians (or vice-versa; chicken-egg), then the contrast will be sufficient that most people who are against Scott's agenda will find themselves at odds with Hogan's and voting for Brown. Or staying home. But hopefully voting for Brown.
Quote from: Jimmy on April 13, 2011, 07:53:17 PM
If it becomes obvious - and I think it will - that Mike Hogan is more of the Rick Scott mold of politicians (or vice-versa; chicken-egg), then the contrast will be sufficient that most people who are against Scott's agenda will find themselves at odds with Hogan's and voting for Brown. Or staying home. But hopefully voting for Brown.
Yeah, I already showed that the 1 % difference favoring McCain in Duval county, only represents 1,500 votes in a mayoral election.
There is enough resentment for Rick Scott to make up for a 1,500 vote difference!!
And no way Mike Hogan will distance himself from the Tea Partier types ;D
It could also be that a thinking and informed Democrat would know that a Scott recall is highly unlikely even if warranted. So where does that put the next mayor and Jacksonville when it comes to Jacksonville having a seat at the political table? Many Republicans are having buyers remorse over Scott, but as you are finding out, getting him out of office will be harder than it was getting him in and if possible would take a very, very long time. So which is the smarter approach? Pretend that he can be taken out of office before his term is over and alienate him to Jacksonville and it's needs, or suck it up and make sure Jacksonville does not remain the unrecognized stepchild? A confrontational approach from a potential mayor is suicide when it comes to keeping Jacksonville the "positive" focus it needs to be in Tally.
Apparently Governor Scott will be in town on Friday in order to take part in the Tea Party anti-tax rally at the Landing.
So this begs the question... is Mike Hogan scheduled to appear at the Tea Party rally? Will he be dumping good Lipton into the Saint Johns, our American Heritage River, on Friday? Considering this group endorsed Hogan, I guess we all know the answer to that.
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 13, 2011, 08:18:06 PM
It could also be that a thinking and informed Democrat would know that a Scott recall is highly unlikely even if warranted. So where does that put the next mayor and Jacksonville when it comes to Jacksonville having a seat at the political table? Many Republicans are having buyers remorse over Scott, but as you are finding out, getting him out of office will be harder than it was getting him in and if possible would take a very, very long time. So which is the smarter approach? Pretend that he can be taken out of office before his term is over and alienate him to Jacksonville and it's needs, or suck it up and make sure Jacksonville does not remain the unrecognized stepchild? A confrontational approach from a potential mayor is suicide when it comes to keeping Jacksonville the "positive" focus it needs to be in Tally.
Yeah, yeah, Diane, roll over and play dead.
No worse, join the extreme Tea Partier crowd.
I am so glad I haven't come across one of those types of Dems among the 150,000 voters that voted for me in 2008.
As I've said before..........if a Dem wants to support a moderate Republican such as Charlie Crist............well, that kinda makes sense sometimes.
But to join forces with an extreme right-wing Republican as a Dem is absolutely ludicrous.
Sorry girl!
Faye, I did not say roll over, not even close. I asked a simple and straightforward question about what direction is the better strategy for Jacksonville to have a seat at the money/political table in Tally?
Rational, calculated thought trumps emotional thinking in politics at this level every time. I did not say not to take action as a voter regarding Scott or anything else you don't like. I am speaking about the best strategy for Jacksonville and a potential mayor. Alienation on behalf of our city is a completely unwise strategy for Jacksonville.
Diane, using that logic, you have been a supporter of John Peyton all of these years. With the Republican lockdown of Tallahassee all through his terms, it would only be logical to support Mayor Peyton since he's in with the local REC and the Republicans in Tallahassee. Right?
No, I didn't think so.
Not at all Jimmy. You are not hearing or understanding what I am saying and I don't mean that as an insult. We are thinking on two completely different wave lengths is all. It's okay.
Believe me, I am not insulted. I'm only trying to understand.
This race is close and not over like hogans camp would have you believe. Hang tight brown supporters. Anything worth having is worth fighting for.
Diane...I'm sure you think that being with Hogan will allow you to influence his policies/views...you might want to ask Paula Dockery how that worked out with Rick Scott and high speed rail!
tufsu1. I would not making such a presumption. What is important to me is that all of us are able to have a dialog about our choices and stand a chance of making a positive difference. :)
Quote from: mfc on April 13, 2011, 09:04:05 PM
This race is close and not over like hogans camp would have you believe. Hang tight brown supporters. Anything worth having is worth fighting for.
Too well I know this, Matt. and some will laugh at me for my convictions ( I wont mention names, it really doesn't matter) You are absolutely right.
Quote from: tufsu1 on April 13, 2011, 09:30:26 PM
Diane...I'm sure you think that being with Hogan will allow you to influence his policies/views...you might want to ask Paula Dockery how that worked out with Rick Scott and high speed rail!
That's a good one tufsu1, as much as I admire Paula ( who is a Republican btw), I just know she feels terribly betrayed with Rick Scott's off the cuff canceling of HSR for Florida :o
I'm sure Hogan is paying Diane and others who will listen lip service, but you cannot change the true nature of the beast........ie no amount of sweet talk is going to soften the extreme Tea Partier type.
Even the moderate Republicans are running scared in the face of these extremists.
Faye, I hate to break it to you, but no one is paying me. I follow my own path. Always have always will.
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 13, 2011, 10:56:27 PM
Faye, I hate to break it to you, but no one is paying me. I follow my own path. Always have always will.
Did I say anyone was paying you?
I'm just saying you're misguided.
Believe me, I've dealt with many extremists as an issue advocate, and there was no way any of them changed course.
Typo - I think Faye meant "playing" you Diane.
Here is what is printed in her post.
I'm sure Hogan is paying Diane Typo? perhaps. LOL
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 13, 2011, 11:13:37 PM
Here is what is printed in her post.
I'm sure Hogan is paying Diane Typo? perhaps. LOL
Wow, reading comprehension wasn't your strong point I gather.............read again.........."paying lip service" is what I'm talking about.
But I like Charles Hunter's interpretation too ;D
Faye, you are wasting your time with insults. I do not measure myself by the type of mindless jabs you are want to offer up. You know you have a choice here. You can act like a respectful grown woman or continue to take pot shots. In preschool they call this bullying in adults it is immature behavior. In any case, you are loosing ground with each negative post. I know you can do better.
No need for the comprehension smack. No one disagrees with Diane's whichever way the wind is blowing stance more than I do. However she seems to be no fool.
Diane, I think you lost ground yourself by abandoning your own principles.
Quote1. A fundamental truth or proposition that serves as the foundation for a system of belief or behavior or for a chain of reasoning.
2. A rule or belief governing one's personal behavior
Not going to engage that conversation Faye. You can still do better or continue to take the low road while chastising someone about principals. If you chose to continue on the low road, enjoy your journey. I won't walk with you. Life is too short for this type of insulting banter. You can do better than angry judgements if you try.
No low road intended. Cavorting with extremists is just not my cup of tea ;)
Enjoy that lonely walk Faye. Your angry judgements will keep you good company.
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 13, 2011, 08:18:06 PM
It could also be that a thinking and informed Democrat would know that a Scott recall is highly unlikely even if warranted. So where does that put the next mayor and Jacksonville when it comes to Jacksonville having a seat at the political table? Many Republicans are having buyers remorse over Scott, but as you are finding out, getting him out of office will be harder than it was getting him in and if possible would take a very, very long time. So which is the smarter approach? Pretend that he can be taken out of office before his term is over and alienate him to Jacksonville and it's needs, or suck it up and make sure Jacksonville does not remain the unrecognized stepchild? A confrontational approach from a potential mayor is suicide when it comes to keeping Jacksonville the "positive" focus it needs to be in Tally.
Diane, I admire your stand and it is your right, but what is really confusing is first, Rick Scott is just another horrible Republican and he will continue to destroy our state. The only good thing about having a mayor on the inside would be to watch his every move so you can stay a step ahead of his ruinous ideas. And I have to take issue with your endorsement of Hogan based on his experience because if Alvin Brown won the office, he would have much more political experience than our governor, who has absolutely NONE. But apparently a slight state majority didn't seem to care. Since the majority of Duval county voted for a man with ZERO experience why not a mayor with less experience than his opponent. I'd rather take my chances with Brown.
I don't care for Rick Scott. I just understand the structure and what we as citizens have to work with for the next few years. I also know that no one goes into the office of Mayor of Jacksonville without people expecting something from them. I also know first hand, have myself seen and heard Mike Hogan welcome support at all levels but clearly state that he will not be influenced by it. Even the top dogs know full well that their support is very much appreciated but it does not give them special privileges. Of course many will roll their eyes at the very suggestion that the big money is not ruling the decisions of Mr. Hogan, but the fact is, they are not.
As to Mr. Browns experience I will say once more that at this serious juncture in Jacksonville's history, we cannot wait for Mr. Brown to learn how this city functions. The learning curve is huge. Anyone can get in a car and drive it during good weather, but driving in bad weather or fixing one that is broken down and then knowing how to rebuild an engine is a completely different story. Peyton came into office with his own crew and the first two years or so things were an absolute mess. He lost and changed members of his administration several times over. Mr. Brown is a charismatic speaker and a quick study when it comes to understanding what is needed to be said to engage peoples attention. He talks quite well about getting all the stake holders to the table, working things out etc. etc. About creating jobs education and the like. The problem is you first have to know who the stake holders are and how this immense city government operates. One has to understand this it is not as simple as sitting down together and talking things through with stakeholders. What works, what doesn't and how the departments all interface is of paramount importance. We have the City, JSO, JFRD, JEA, JTA, JAA in the mix along with our school system with a huge financial crisis in front of us. This is not the time to place a person in the office of Mayor who is a newby to the landscape of city government. No disrespect to Brown, just the reality of where we are.
I wrote the above before reading all the the posts. I have to agree with Faye and I don't think she was trying to insult Diane. But these guys do pay "lip service" knowing they will do what they intend to do. I may need correction, but I read that soon after he took office Rick Scott was asked about High Speed Rail, he said he would not make a decision until he had reviewed both sides, knowing that that was a complete lie. He had all intention of putting a knife in it if he was elected. He will never do ANYTHING except what the other tea party minions who call themselves Republican governors, do. It doesn't matter how negative or wrong for our state. This is not about the welfare of Florida, it's about greed and power. I mostly blame Republicans for our current ills, but Democrats must share the blame because they, in their attempt to be bipartisan and fair, allowed them to take us into the abyss. After Rick Scott lied about Alex Sink and diverted all questions about his criminal behavior during the debates, I was more shocked than ever that anyone would vote for him. And after Jeb Bush financially damaged our state, how could anyone want to vote for a candidate that these two would endorse? So do you think Hogan will do the right thing if it doesn't suit the agenda of his party? So far Rick Scott has been exactly what he was in his ads and in the debates, a snake. That makes me shudder.
avonjax. I have been around the political block several times over and understand exactly how easily people get played. The reality is that in politics as in life you never, ever know exactly what a person will do once they are in office. As in life, there is always the chance of dissapointment. Experience on the playing field gives some advantage but it still comes down to using ones best judgement, their own understanding of our system and some serious insight into who the players are. Then we all must make as sound a choice as we can considering our views and what we have learned about each candidate. That's all any of us can do in life or politics.
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 14, 2011, 01:17:30 AM
I don't care for Rick Scott. I just understand the structure and what we as citizens have to work with for the next few years. I also know that no one goes into the office of Mayor of Jacksonville without people expecting something from them. I also know first hand, have myself seen and heard Mike Hogan welcome support at all levels but clearly state that he will not be influenced by it. Even the top dogs know full well that their support is very much appreciated but it does not give them special privileges. Of course many will roll their eyes at the very suggestion that the big money is not ruling the decisions of Mr. Hogan, but the fact is, they are not.
As to Mr. Browns experience I will say once more that at this serious juncture in Jacksonville's history, we cannot wait for Mr. Brown to learn how this city functions. The learning curve is huge. Anyone can get in a car and drive it during good weather, but driving in bad weather or fixing one that is broken down and then knowing how to rebuild an engine is a completely different story. Peyton came into office with his own crew and the first two years or so things were an absolute mess. He lost and changed members of his administration several times over. Mr. Brown is a charismatic speaker and a quick study when it comes to understanding what is needed to be said to engage peoples attention. He talks quite well about getting all the stake holders to the table, working things out etc. etc. About creating jobs education and the like. The problem is you first have to know who the stake holders are and how this immense city government operates. One has to understand this it is not as simple as sitting down together and talking things through with stakeholders. What works, what doesn't and how the departments all interface is of paramount importance. We have the City, JSO, JFRD, JEA, JTA, JAA in the mix along with our school system with a huge financial crisis in front of us. This is not the time to place a person in the office of Mayor who is a newby to the landscape of city government. No disrespect to Brown, just the reality of where we are.
Then if you are correct, we are in deep, deep trouble. Show me a Republican in recent times that has improved the economic condition we are in? Cutting taxes will not fix anything. It hasn't in the past and it won't in the future. So I think maybe you are right and bleak days are ahead.
Difficult decisions are ahead and we are going to have to decide who can best get us through them. I know we will get through them if everyone works together in a meaningful way. This really is not a Republican or Democrat thing at the city level. Right now the party of the person is not as important as their understanding of our system and budget and how it can be made better.
I just want to puke.
QuoteThen if you are correct, we are in deep, deep trouble. Show me a Republican in recent times that has improved the economic condition we are in? Cutting taxes will not fix anything. It hasn't in the past and it won't in the future. So I think maybe you are right and bleak days are ahead.
It's not Republican or Democrat, it's AMERICANS. Every President in the 20th century added to the debt of the country, every single one of them. Now we have a national debt in the trillions with few options on fixing.
This is not a party issue, it has become a way of life issue. Do we want/need military bases around the world? Do we want/need as many social programs? Can we spend our way out of the Great Recession without future problems? This issue of us versus them is larger than a mayoral race, much larger.
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 14, 2011, 01:17:30 AM
This is not the time to place a person in the office of Mayor who is a newby to the landscape of city government. No disrespect to Brown, just the reality of where we are.
If not now, when? With my upmost respect Diane, the voters here believe in change, a turn in a direction, which in relative terms they see as forward. Your accurate description draws uncanny parallels to the 2008 national election. With that victor portraying uncanny similarities to Alvin
Brown.
Diane, as a mover and shaker in the Duval democratic party i must wonder outloud why this solid example alone doesnt find you supporting the democratic candidate for mayor of Jacksonville. Even more as an example should be the democratic mayors of all the national URBAN cities that we here weekly study (and envy) in those cities move forward into the 21st century.
Quote from: hillary supporter on April 14, 2011, 09:18:24 AM
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 14, 2011, 01:17:30 AM
This is not the time to place a person in the office of Mayor who is a newby to the landscape of city government. No disrespect to Brown, just the reality of where we are.
Even more as an example should be the democratic mayors of all the national URBAN cities that we here weekly study (and envy) in those cities move forward into the 21st century.
Hmmm, interesting. I just came across a Forbes article about:
QuoteHigh-profile Democratic mayors that are pitching the kind of fiscal discipline and aversion to new taxes more typical of their Republican rivals.
http://www.forbes.com/2008/01/10/mayors-taxes-democrats-cz_dw_0110mayors_slide_2.html?thisSpeed=undefined
Alvin Brown with an MBA from JU, would be uniquely qualified to give city government budgets a fresh look,
without being unduly hindered by vested interests.As they say: "a new broom can make a clean sweep"
But some people rather vote for the evil they know. sigh
Quote from: FayeforCure on April 14, 2011, 09:56:15 AM
Quote from: hillary supporter on April 14, 2011, 09:18:24 AM
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 14, 2011, 01:17:30 AM
This is not the time to place a person in the office of Mayor who is a newby to the landscape of city government. No disrespect to Brown, just the reality of where we are.
Even more as an example should be the democratic mayors of all the national URBAN cities that we here weekly study (and envy) in those cities move forward into the 21st century.
Hmmm, interesting. I just came across a Forbes article about:
QuoteHigh-profile Democratic mayors that are pitching the kind of fiscal discipline and aversion to new taxes more typical of their Republican rivals.
http://www.forbes.com/2008/01/10/mayors-taxes-democrats-cz_dw_0110mayors_slide_2.html?thisSpeed=undefined
Alvin Brown with an MBA from JU, would be uniquely qualified to give city government budgets a fresh look, without being unduly hindered by vested interests.
As they say: "a new broom can make a clean sweep"
But some people rather vote for the evil they know. sigh
I think this, Faye, is the real crisis of the Duval Democratic party. Without the ambiguity of Sheltons article.
Quote from: stephendare on April 14, 2011, 09:59:25 AM
I wonder how much Suzie and Hollingsworth had to do with this election?
Seems awfully bizarre that Mullaney would go after Audrey even when it was clear he wasnt going to win.
Fresh off of tea party victories for Rick Scott, they are both advising Mullaney, end up tanking Audrey, and then Mullaney and Suzie's business partner all jump on the same tea party team with Hogan.
Smells a bit like tuna tartare.
And the tuna tartare can go rotten if someone could find the evidence to uncover this whole conspiracy. I have to agree that I do find this interesting, and it seems to be funky from my perspective that there might be an overall goal to achieve by doing little things like this as a strategy in politics.
-Josh
Quote from: stephendare on April 14, 2011, 09:59:25 AM
I wonder how much Suzie and Hollingsworth had to do with this election?
Seems awfully bizarre that Mullaney would go after Audrey even when it was clear he wasnt going to win.
Fresh off of tea party victories for Rick Scott, they are both advising Mullaney, end up tanking Audrey, and then Mullaney and Suzie's business partner all jump on the same tea party team with Hogan.
Smells a bit like tuna tartare.
Wouldn't surprise me one bit. Politics is very machivellian. Don't be surprised if Mullaney get rewarded for his efforts which played right into Hogan's hands.
I have often wondered if Mullaney wasn't looking to get back into his old office at City Hall. Early on, the whispers were that he was in the race in order to ultimately retain (or return to) his job as General Counsel.
Quote from: stephendare on April 13, 2011, 11:55:12 PM
But I feel you there with the abortion clinic bomb jokes from the guy who once tried to save us from the gay agenda by cancelling funding for the Symphony.
Sounds a bit like Stephen Wise's fixation on legislating religion into the public arena. Good thing he is finally term limited!!
Diane,
I believe you to be a sincere person, but how do you know Hogan isn't just telling you what you want to hear? Has he shared more of his 'agenda' with you that gives you that confidence? He hasn't shared much with the public.
Also, even if Hogan supports DT and the issues the typical MJer supports in his heart, don't you think the Tea Party/Unions/Westside crowd will steer him away from that? They ARE the foundation of his support after all.
I realize politics makes strange bedfellows, but you, Glorious and "Tea Party" represent a strange one indeed.
Quote from: vicupstate on April 14, 2011, 10:22:48 AM
Diane,
I believe you to be a sincere person, but how do you know Hogan isn't just telling you what you want to hear? Has he shared more of his 'agenda' with you that gives you that confidence? He hasn't shared much with the public.
Also, even if Hogan supports DT and the issues the typical MJer supports in his heart, don't you think the Tea Party/Unions/Westside crowd will steer him away from that? They ARE the foundation of his support after all.
I realize politics makes strange bedfellows, but you, Glorious and "Tea Party" represent a strange one indeed.
Hogan will abandon the Tea party quickly as many of the experienced tea bag endorsed politicans have (see Mark Rubio and his immigration platform), i do believe he will do good for Jacksonville. I just believe Alvin will do much better things for the future of the city. Alvin is a golden opportunity for jacksonville. His ideas are so "out of the box" that insiders in jax politics(i.e. Diane) cant accept his 21st century vision.
QuoteHis ideas are so "out of the box" .... cant accept his 21st century vision.
Funny, I heard the same thing 8 years ago in Peyton. No thanks.
There is still plenty of love between Rubio and the Tea Party. Rubio does a very good job of manintaining their support while not sounding like Michelle Bachman. I expect him to be a VP or POTUS candidate either next year or four years later.
Hogan was Tea Party before there was a Tea Party, that is not going to change if he wins.
Mtrain, Peyton said the same things 8 years ago that Hogan is saying now.
QuoteMtrain, Peyton said the same things 8 years ago that Hogan is saying now.
I have yet to hear how Mike plans to run the city like a business. When and If he says that, let me know. Or if he says "That $115 will save the future of Jacksonville". You know stupid stuff that gets you quoted for life. Here we are 62 million in the hole and Peyton leaving the next mayor worse off than when he arrived.
Do we really want a guy with no local political experience "learning" on the job like Peyton did 8 years ago? Sure 8 years ago, we had a better economy and no holes in the dam to fill, but now, we have some MAJOR issues with our budget, not the time to call up a rookie from the minor leagues.
When I hear mtrain and Diane spinning the same soundbites, in support of the same candidate I know two things.
1) the end is near, and
2) I'm on the right side of the debate.
QuoteWhen I hear mtrain and Diane spinning the same soundbites, in support of the same candidate I know two things. 1) the end is near
You and the Mayans might be on to something here.....
You may be onto something Jimmy! ;)
Quote from: mtraininjax on April 14, 2011, 01:44:45 PM
QuoteMtrain, Peyton said the same things 8 years ago that Hogan is saying now.
I have yet to hear how Mike plans to run the city like a business. When and If he says that, let me know. Or if he says "That $115 will save the future of Jacksonville". You know stupid stuff that gets you quoted for life. Here we are 62 million in the hole and Peyton leaving the next mayor worse off than when he arrived.
Do we really want a guy with no local political experience "learning" on the job like Peyton did 8 years ago? Sure 8 years ago, we had a better economy and no holes in the dam to fill, but now, we have some MAJOR issues with our budget, not the time to call up a rookie from the minor leagues.
Well you know how it is.........Republicans think it's A-ok to put a Republican without any public service experience in office, time and time again: John Peyton and Rick Scott.
But Democrats are held to a higher standard, even if they have the federal level connections that could land us some major federal grants.
Besides, as an economist myself, I value Alvin Brown's MBA compared to Mike Hogan's bachelors in zoology.
After all, an economy does best:
QuoteNot by government programs alone, but a mix of the private and public sectors.
Quote from: mtraininjax on April 14, 2011, 01:44:45 PM
QuoteMtrain, Peyton said the same things 8 years ago that Hogan is saying now.
I have yet to hear how Mike plans to run the city like a business. When and If he says that, let me know. Or if he says "That $115 will save the future of Jacksonville". You know stupid stuff that gets you quoted for life. Here we are 62 million in the hole and Peyton leaving the next mayor worse off than when he arrived.
Do we really want a guy with no local political experience "learning" on the job like Peyton did 8 years ago? Sure 8 years ago, we had a better economy and no holes in the dam to fill, but now, we have some MAJOR issues with our budget, not the time to call up a rookie from the minor leagues.
Sounds like what we did with Rick Scott... Faye beat me to it : )
Jimmy, I don't know if this helps or not. For me this election is bigger than party labels and has more to do with what is healthy for Jacksonville in the next few years. We are going to tank if we don't get past the party mentality in the current election. Isn't that what Moran kept saying? I agreed with her about that. Supporting a candidate for local office from another party should not make or break support for the qualified and experienced candidate.
I am staying as far away as I can from the discourses about Scott, Tea Party or topics and soundbites and looking mainly at skill set of the candidates and their experience.
Scott is not on the ticket, nor is Al Gore or Bill Clinton all with their own associations who will undoubtedly show up on the political landscape of folks in the same party. They don't mean that much to what happens locally. Not nearly as much as people would hope.
If this is not a national election, why does Hogan keep bringing up national issues (e.g. gun control, abortion, etc.)?
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 14, 2011, 02:11:07 PM
Jimmy, I don't know if this helps or not. For me this election is bigger than party labels and has more to do with what is healthy for Jacksonville in the next few years.
Yeah, and more of the same certainly isn't it!!
If you want to chase out everyone who is not part of the GOB network, you'll continue to get the same.
What was that definition of insanity again?
QuoteInsanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 14, 2011, 02:11:07 PM
I am staying as far away as I can from the discourses about Scott, Tea Party or topics and soundbites and looking mainly at skill set of the candidates and their experience.
Well, now you're just telling stories. You couldn't stay off the Tea Party facebook page while you were promoting Mike Hogan to them. I had to chuckle when they kept referring to you as a "washed up Democrat" as you were on their page, with them, pushing Mike Hogan. And now you want to disavow all connection to the Tea Party. That is a rather self-serving change of tactic!
Faye,can you vote in this election? I think you said you cannot so I take your arguments are largely based on what you would like to see happen to the Democrat party at the state and national level. Since you do not live in Jacksonville I am guessing that you may not really know the ins and outs of the local political landscape. Alvin Brown is currently being supported and groomed by some of the oldest members of the Jacksonville GOB landscape. That is a fact. Brown is looking for money and support from the same old power structure that has influenced local politics here for years. He is more of the same, just packaged differently.
touche Jimmy. I did post my views about the candidate I am supporting, but I have no association with the tea party. ;)
Fair enough. :)
Quote from: Diane Melendez on April 14, 2011, 02:23:58 PM
Faye,can you vote in this election? I think you said you cannot so I take your arguments are largely based on what you would like to see happen to the Democrat party at the state and national level. Since you do not live in Jacksonville I am guessing that you may not really know the ins and outs of the local political landscape.
Well, you know how it is Diane........I do all my shopping in Jacksonville, my children attend college in Jacksonville, I go to the dentist in Jacksonville, heck I even visited Solantic on San Jose (oopsie)
Oh, and might I add that I still use Jacksonville in my address?
I also often walk across the Jullington Creek bridge to Mandarin Park...........that is if I'm not jogging across with one of my four daughters. Still keeping up just fine, if I say so myself.
So yeah, I certainly don't have any local interests except for wanting light rail on San Jose ;D
It's all about that quality of life for us locals!!
BTW, I became plenty aware of the ins and outs of the local political landscape, when Peyton signs were plastered all over my street early 2003. Hey my neighbors even held a fundraiser for him.
Good to know Peyton doesn't like Hogan much, so I may not see any of those signs in my street this year.
Quote from: FayeforCure on April 14, 2011, 02:44:04 PM
It's all about that quality of life for us locals!!
Exactly! This is the 'eureka' reason why I am involved with the local politics. My progressive blindness has forced me off the road into public transit and paratransit services where it suck so bad. I want to help and improve it so bad after visiting few excellent walkable cities with amazing transit system.
-Josh
If he voted AGAINST historic preservation, then I am satisfied with my choice, even if my choice does not favor it.
I love Diane to pieces.. I hope all of you will forgive me for saying, it seems like you are ganging up on her.. I don't like her choices either ,but I'm not going to stop being her friend, for it. Just saying... we all are still going to have to live in this City afterward. some are going to be happy with the election ( I hope ) some will not . Some will not regardless of who wins. God knows I am far from being perfect. That award would go to my "old friend" the M-trainwreck ;)
But Diane is a good soul. So is Glorious. Their choices are theirs .
Thank you Timkin. I appreciate your friendship as well so very much. I have given my opinions about the race for Mayor and what I think is the best course of action. I have said repeatedly, every one must make their own decisions and then vote and I hold no ill feelings toward anyone who backs a different candidate. I have said all I need to say on the subject. Thanks everyone for the opportunity to share a different viewpoint.
Kids..............I think that zero will equal zero! Neither of the two rock me at all ........talk is real real cheap and I want someone to show me something besides lip service!
I really must agree with you CS. Neither are the best choices. They are what is left. Alvin seems to be the lesser of the two... I wont say evils , because I don't think either man is evil, per se.. certainly not like Scott.. That man creeps me out .. he has a cold look in his eyes... HE is the one you need to be worried about.. we will all be cleaning toilets because of HIM. I think Hogan is simply going to follow protocol, as evidenced by his budget-cut agenda. Thus the "Hogan=Scott" theory.
QuoteAlvin seems to be the lesser of the two...
You would vote for someone with less history in Jacksonville than Peyton. Amazing, Brown would spend the first two years trying to figure out how to govern. Get the man some political credibility first, get him on the city council, get him on the JTA, get him somewhere other than telling everyone the same thing Carlucci did 8 years ago, before he flipped flopped to the Dems, " I want to put Jacksonville to work". Yeah, and we already heard the empty suit promises from Peyton of running the city like a business.
Brown has to earn the right to be on the mayoral stage, to me, he has not done that, and therefore is not worthy of my vote.
This history in town, local experience, insider club, GOB argument isn't carrying much weight given how so many feel about the last thirty years of leadership here.
Quote from: mtraininjax on April 15, 2011, 09:05:43 AM
QuoteAlvin seems to be the lesser of the two...
You would vote for someone with less history in Jacksonville than Peyton. Amazing, Brown would spend the first two years trying to figure out how to govern. Get the man some political credibility first, get him on the city council, get him on the JTA, get him somewhere other than telling everyone the same thing Carlucci did 8 years ago, before he flipped flopped to the Dems, " I want to put Jacksonville to work". Yeah, and we already heard the empty suit promises from Peyton of running the city like a business.
Brown has to earn the right to be on the mayoral stage, to me, he has not done that, and therefore is not worthy of my vote.
I do not understand how working on issues that affect New Orleans or New York are supposedly so foreign to us in Jacksonville. It seems like that old "We don't care how you do things where you're from" attitude that makes us look like we are backwards and provincial. I would support good ideas no matter where they came from. Our insular and incestuous leadership has not proven itself to be perfect leaders. We can choose to live in an echo chamber that rejects 'outsiders' and choose to perpetuate a system that has set us on our current course, but I do not buy the excuse that time spent in Jacksonville makes someone omnipotent. Why don't we change the city charter to require that mayoral candidates be born and raised in Jacksonville and that they live in Jacksonville with no breaks in residency. Of course, that would have ruled out the current mayor. But we tend to be selective with whom we give a pass. I believe that there is nothing Alvin Brown can do to impress some skeptics. After all, like I said before, Nat Glover had the Jacksonville connections and actually had leadership experience - yet he did not get elected. I do not understand city politics. Yuk!
Quote from: mtraininjax on April 15, 2011, 09:05:43 AM
QuoteAlvin seems to be the lesser of the two...
You would vote for someone with less history in Jacksonville than Peyton. Amazing, Brown would spend the first two years trying to figure out how to govern. Get the man some political credibility first, get him on the city council, get him on the JTA, get him somewhere other than telling everyone the same thing Carlucci did 8 years ago, before he flipped flopped to the Dems, " I want to put Jacksonville to work". Yeah, and we already heard the empty suit promises from Peyton of running the city like a business.
Brown has to earn the right to be on the mayoral stage, to me, he has not done that, and therefore is not worthy of my vote.
Well then don't vote for him M-train .. anyone holding a gun to your head ,making you vote for him?
Amen, Timkin!
I am voting best candidate regardless of whether he is a made man of the GOB network. I love the 904 that does not mean all worthy and competent people in the USA have been a local 904 political insider.
Quote from: Jaxson on April 15, 2011, 09:37:18 AM
Quote from: mtraininjax on April 15, 2011, 09:05:43 AM
QuoteAlvin seems to be the lesser of the two...
You would vote for someone with less history in Jacksonville than Peyton. Amazing, Brown would spend the first two years trying to figure out how to govern. Get the man some political credibility first, get him on the city council, get him on the JTA, get him somewhere other than telling everyone the same thing Carlucci did 8 years ago, before he flipped flopped to the Dems, " I want to put Jacksonville to work". Yeah, and we already heard the empty suit promises from Peyton of running the city like a business.
Brown has to earn the right to be on the mayoral stage, to me, he has not done that, and therefore is not worthy of my vote.
I do not understand how working on issues that affect New Orleans or New York are supposedly so foreign to us in Jacksonville. It seems like that old "We don't care how you do things where you're from" attitude that makes us look like we are backwards and provincial. I would support good ideas no matter where they came from. Our insular and incestuous leadership has not proven itself to be perfect leaders. We can choose to live in an echo chamber that rejects 'outsiders' and choose to perpetuate a system that has set us on our current course, but I do not buy the excuse that time spent in Jacksonville makes someone omnipotent. Why don't we change the city charter to require that mayoral candidates be born and raised in Jacksonville and that they live in Jacksonville with no breaks in residency. Of course, that would have ruled out the current mayor. But we tend to be selective with whom we give a pass. I believe that there is nothing Alvin Brown can do to impress some skeptics. After all, like I said before, Nat Glover had the Jacksonville connections and actually had leadership experience - yet he did not get elected. I do not understand city politics. Yuk!
It really shouldn't matter that they're from Jacksonville, it should just matter that they are here to move Jacksonville forward and hopefully they have examples of how they did it in the past. He has two examples for two completely different cities. That's all the proof I need. He has a strong passion for Jacksonville and isn't just gonna sit in a chair and just cut funding for no reason. He clearly is the best candidate because he doesn't like wasteful spending but he also wants to get things done. He wants things to happen here and Hogan just doesn't care about this place. All he wants to do is cut taxes, bomb abortion clinics, and sell preservation land. Brown isn't for tax raises either but he wants to progress and turn us from a 20th century into a 21st century city. He cares about this place. It doesn't matter if he's from here because even people from here, born and raised, could care less about Jacksonville.
http://www.pinksliprick.com/
Quote
• 135,000 jobs from moving Medicaid to a state-run program
• 113,065 construction jobs from Scott stalling SunRail contract
• 1,849 in layoffs from Department of Children and Families, as outlined in Scott’s proposed budget
• 20,000 teacher layoffs, per Scott’s budget proposal
• 49,900 job losses for rejecting high-speed rail
• 1,690 jobs cut from state prison system
Totalling around 325,000 jobs lost!!!!
Do we want to extend a similar shrinking tax base for Jacksonville?
We can't lose what we don't have. Those jobs "lost" are only projections of job loss. You'd know better then I on most of them Faye, but the HSR loss is 10% of their estimated jobs.
CSX employs about 32,000 and that's virtually EVERYTHING east of the Mississippi River that doesn't belong to Norfolk Southern. The high speed rail was easy to shoot to hell because of the puffed up, bloated, ridiculous I'd give the HSR line about 300, and another 200 in rail manufacturing, everything else was either temporary or based on what might have been if???
I've been working on a Miami-Tampa HrSR line that's 258 miles from end to end. If the train they killed ever did get up to 180mph it would be beat by about 40 minutes with a conventional train on my reconstructed old railroad going 90. If it flew, we could add Orlando, and if that flew, Orlando-Miami. Once it was rolling, we could go into immediate planning to straighten the only little kink in the whole line which is between West Lake Wales and Sebring. If your interested I'll send you some information as I get it recorded.
OCKLAWAHA
is it true that the state is going to do a FEASIBLE commuter rail study from tampa that connects with sunrail
Quote from: yapp1850 on May 03, 2011, 03:25:41 PM
is it true that the state is going to do a FEASIBLE commuter rail study from tampa that connects with sunrail
I have heard nothing about that...there is talk about a TBARTA study...but that is only for the tracks CSX is interested in selling