Is this good legislation? I'd say no.
A one mile ban of any transient vendor.
This may soon become law in the largest city in the country landwise with the only exception being Downtown Jacksonville.
What? Banned from where?
Bill Type and Number: Ordinance 2010-856
Introducer/Sponsor(s): Council President Webb
Date of Introduction: November 9, 2010
Committee(s) of Reference: R, RCD
Date of Analysis: November 11, 2010
Type of Action: Ordinance Code amendment
Bill Summary: The bill amends Ordinance Code Chapter 250 â€" Miscellaneous Business Regulations â€" to prohibit transient merchants from locating within 1 mile of a permanent established business that sells the same types of products or services and to prohibit transient merchants from selling products not permitted in the zoning district where the transient merchant is located. The new regulations do not apply to permitted downtown sidewalk vendors who are regulated by another Ordinance Code section.
Background Information: The preamble to the bill states that transient merchants provide unfair competition to established, fixed merchants because they do not bear property ownership or lease costs (property taxes, insurance and maintenance) or utility expenses and that this competition is detrimental to the City’s economy.
Policy Impact Area: Transient merchant regulation
Fiscal Impact: Undetermined
Analyst: Clements
This seems to not affect the hot dog vendors downtown, but what about a trailered BBQ stand at football games, or the obvious fell of the back of the truck tshirts and hats vendors at Jags games...
This would affect the guys with carts anywhere outside of downtown. This means the guys with carts in places like Five Points, San Marco and Home Depot parking lots would not be allowed to continue to operate. Personally, I'm not a fan of this ordinance. Sometimes it feels like Jax is the biggest small city around.
What about Christmas Tree stands? Farmers who sell their goods out of the back of their trucks?
This will be interesting.
I'm having a hard time understanding the logic behind something like this. Unfortunately, I work in an office park on the southside,on a 30 minute lunch break there's a shopping center with every fast food chain in it, however each one will have about 20 to 30 cars in line. There's a hot dog cart a block away from my building that has usually no wait. It seeems to me all this does is protect these national food chains, which would be the majority in the area that will be affected. Another great idea from our city leaders.
Not a fan, either.
I understand the frustration, especially in this economy, of small business owners. It is the "within a mile" statement that bothers me. A hot dog cart won't be able to be within a mile of a Gate gas station (which sells hot dogs as an after thought), but does this mean it can be near a McDonalds which does not sell hot dogs?
Christmas Tree stands can't be within a mile of a Lowes?
A farmers stand can only be set up if he is selling fruit in season --
Quote: "The preamble to the bill states that transient merchants provide unfair competition to established, fixed merchants because they do not bear property ownership or lease costs (property taxes, insurance and maintenance) or utility expenses and that this competition is detrimental to the City’s economy."
I've heard that the cost of operating one of these transient, especially food, businesses is NOT cheap. They have to jump through a bunch of hoops to just open. They have to buy their business property (cart, etc.), are subject to inspections from the food police, pay a fee to the city for their business license(s), pay maintenance on their equipment, pay liability insurance, collect and remit sales tax, pay for the fuel to keep the food at the proper temperature while on site and to prepare off site, pay income and self-employment taxes and stand out in the weather hoping to make a sale every day at a location deemed appropriate by the folks who have probably never (he, he) eaten at anyplace less than Ruth's Chris Steak House
Next up for the tops dogs will be the banning of garage or yard sales because there might be a conflict with nearby fixed merchants. And, we all know that not one business license or sales tax dollar is collected, not one extra dollar of insurance is paid and there certainly is no maintenance cost for a tarp and a few card tables.
And this is yet another senseless ordinance that Webb wants to push through, hurting the vendors. Are you telling me that there's nothing of a serious matter that our council members should be spending their time working on? It's things like this that hurt our city, not help.
Again is anyone on this forum participating in the recent JCCI study Recession, Recovery, and Beyond?
Defer the legislation until the study is complete.
What is the position of the Chamber on this?
Another created city council and mayoral campaign issue.
"Lets get to Work." Just not in Jacksonville.
I'll be asking my councilman to attach an amendment that would allow for the extention of the exemption to include the Promised 680'Promised Downtown Public Pier AKA Bay St. Pier Park so that it could have the ability to have a Hot Dog Cart (Food Container) for the people of Jacksonville.
It wouldbe very tricky if you were operating an ice cream truck.. Every covienence store in town sells ice cream!
I think this legislation is stupid. If a taco truck beats out your Mexican restaurant, you're doing something wrong. Same thing for hot dog carts. No restaurateur should feel threatened by a street vendor if they believe in their product.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on November 28, 2010, 06:21:08 PM
I think this legislation is stupid. If a taco truck beats out your Mexican restaurant, you're doing something wrong. Same thing for hot dog carts. No restaurateur should feel threatened by a street vendor if they believe in their product.
Agreed. No body goes 'out to dinner' only to hit up the closest hot dog cart.
The only business that I see this affecting is A&W, and I go there for the root beer on tap anyhow.
Food Trucks - tacos, cupcakes, coffee, etc - are hot in every hip city (New York, Austin, even little old Asheville North Carolina) in America.
Of course Jacksonville would put a stop to such nonsense, bending over backwards to make certain our complete lack of hipness continues into the next decade!
Where are all the capitalists arguing against this proposed legislation? Seriously, why restrict competition?
Next they'll be banning street performers on St George street in St Augustine because some shop keeper thinks the people came to see them and the performers are keeping them from coming in the store and buying something. ...............they really didn't come to see or buy anyway.
Oh....wait.....they already did that.
I suspect the issue may have something to do with tax revenues. At a Gate you pay a sales tax on that hot dog, and that money goes to the people behind this act. As for the hot dog vendor, do you think he declares every sale? Doubtful.
Follow the money.
Quote from: BigGuy219 on November 29, 2010, 12:17:53 AM
I suspect the issue may have something to do with tax revenues. At a Gate you pay a sales tax on that hot dog, and that money goes to the people behind this act. As for the hot dog vendor, do you think he declares every sale? Doubtful.
Follow the money.
Prevent a crime before its happened? Slippery slope...
Quote from: JC on November 29, 2010, 01:26:59 AM
Quote from: BigGuy219 on November 29, 2010, 12:17:53 AM
I suspect the issue may have something to do with tax revenues. At a Gate you pay a sales tax on that hot dog, and that money goes to the people behind this act. As for the hot dog vendor, do you think he declares every sale? Doubtful.
Follow the money.
Prevent a crime before its happened? Slippery slope...
I'm not saying it has to do with crime prevention. It has to do with them enacting policy that favor businesses that strictly pay sales taxes to increase tax revenue.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on November 28, 2010, 06:21:08 PM
I think this legislation is stupid. If a taco truck beats out your Mexican restaurant, you're doing something wrong. Same thing for hot dog carts. No restaurateur should feel threatened by a street vendor if they believe in their product.
How true! maybe these threatened people should instead tell the Sysco truck driver to unload all the dinner in 5 gallon buckets in back,instead of in front.it sends a message to a LOT of us about what you serve.
The street vendors still pay "rent" in some form or another. They still pay operating expenses. They are still as accountable for things like sales tax as any other cash based business. Are their expenses lower than the fixed based operators' are? Probably, but then as a society are we going to pass laws that penalize every other business person who finds a way to save a buck over their competition?
Restaurants, whether they be fast food or sit down require a commitment. Street vendors can be impulse buying. In fact, I suspect a large percentage of their sales are impulse. It doesn't matter if they are selling hot dogs or jeans actually. So it doesn't seem like they ultimately hurt the fixed based operators much in reality. However, the fixed based operators are afraid the street vendors have taken their business when in fact, it is the economy. Or the fixed based vendors poor marketing or products. But we must always have someone else to blame and here we are.
Quote from: BigGuy219 on November 29, 2010, 03:26:48 AM
Quote from: JC on November 29, 2010, 01:26:59 AM
Quote from: BigGuy219 on November 29, 2010, 12:17:53 AM
I suspect the issue may have something to do with tax revenues. At a Gate you pay a sales tax on that hot dog, and that money goes to the people behind this act. As for the hot dog vendor, do you think he declares every sale? Doubtful.
Follow the money.
Prevent a crime before its happened? Slippery slope...
I'm not saying it has to do with crime prevention. It has to do with them enacting policy that favor businesses that strictly pay sales taxes to increase tax revenue.
So you are assuming that street vendor does not pay sales tax and a brick and mortar store does? I would say any small business that does and dollar of cash business is likely hiding some from the IRS. I think that brick and mortar store owners have more opportunity to put political pressure on the necessary people to enact such bogus legislation.
If anything these street vendors help attract more people simply because they are additional human beings on the street! At least they are not trying to molest you or take your groceries or whatever.
Many economists refer to this (established businesses seeking to eliminate competition by getting the government to create regulations that stifle it) as "rent seeking".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rent_seeking (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rent_seeking)
I think it also qualifies as "crony capitalism".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crony_capitalism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crony_capitalism)
+1 Urban, you beat me to it.
Beauty salons have been trying for years to get hair braiders put out of business by requiring them to have cosmetology licenses. Current holders of alcohol sales licenses fight like crazy to keep any more licenses being issued. Taxi medallions are limited in number for the same reasons.
Prop 19, the legalization of marijuana in California, was defeated by millions of dollars worth of advertising from two groups; the liquor industry, and the medical marijuana outlets. Really high moral ground there! (Pun intended)
Only in Jacksonville. Home to ass backwards legislation and the good ol' boy network.
I was in NYC a couple weeks ago and had better food from the street vendors than from any sit-down joint we ate at.
My first trip to NYC I made sure I stopped by one of the hot dog vendors. I mean you see it all the time in the movies right Couldnt leave the Big Apple with out doing that right? Here in Jax I guess you better find a Sonic.
Roberts Eatery on 8th and Ionia, Weds to Fri from 8 to 4ish has just that! Anyone who utters the phrase "CS Foltz said to stop" gets a free meal! Typical street vendor fare and we need more business persons willing to make the effort! Noone your on the list!
Quote from: JC on November 28, 2010, 11:00:58 PM
Where are all the capitalists arguing against this proposed legislation? Seriously, why restrict competition?
JC, so called capitalists believe in the free market only so long as they do not have competition. Then they do their best to enlist government power to prevent any new competitors from entering their market. Trade associations are formed for the same purposes for the trades.
A lot of "consumer protection" laws are for the purposes of limiting entrants into markets more than they are for protecting the consumer.
+1.75! Too true Dog Walker.............competion my left ham hock! Protecting their monoplies plain and simple!
hippies and commies and whatnot are somewhat famous for insisting that capitalism has failed. they're not entirely correct, though; it hasn't failed, it's continually and spectacularly failing, like an old hose springing new leaks every year. unfortunately, i don't believe anyöne's come up with a better system.
Quote from: KuroiKetsunoHana on November 29, 2010, 03:45:46 PM
hippies and commies and whatnot are somewhat famous for insisting that capitalism has failed. they're not entirely correct, though; it hasn't failed, it's continually and spectacularly failing, like an old hose springing new leaks every year. unfortunately, i don't believe anyöne's come up with a better system.
Sure, look at France and Germany, and a lot of Europe for that matter.
Capitalism and predatory business tactics are two different things. Europe figured out way before we did that you have to enact restraints to protect the public, if you simply give businesses whatever they want they wreck not only the society in which they operate, but also wreck their own interests, because what appears wise for one company is not wise when they all behave the same way at the same time.
American corporations, especially the entire financial industry, have become very much like rabid dogs that don't realize they should stop eating and save some for tomorrow. They'll eat until they vomit, then eat the vomit along with the rest of the food, not caring who starves because of their conduct, and ultimately not realizing they are screwing themselves in the long run, along with everyone else.
Somehow we have been sold this destructive and defective version of capitalism without sensible restraint, which winds up being more like a free-for-all where corporations buy whatever legislation they need, and the free markets we're told to believe in are rigged such that competition is mostly illusory.
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on November 29, 2010, 03:53:19 PM
Quote from: KuroiKetsunoHana on November 29, 2010, 03:45:46 PM
hippies and commies and whatnot are somewhat famous for insisting that capitalism has failed. they're not entirely correct, though; it hasn't failed, it's continually and spectacularly failing, like an old hose springing new leaks every year. unfortunately, i don't believe anyöne's come up with a better system.
Sure, look at France and Germany, and a lot of Europe for that matter.
Capitalism and predatory business tactics are two different things. Europe figured out way before we did that you have to enact restraints to protect the public, if you simply give businesses whatever they want they wreck not only the society in which they operate, but also wreck their own interests, because what appears wise for one company is not wise when they all behave the same way at the same time.
American corporations, especially the entire financial industry, have become very much like rabid dogs that don't realize they should stop eating and save some for tomorrow. They'll eat until they vomit, then eat the vomit along with the rest of the food, not caring who starves because of their conduct, and ultimately not realizing they are screwing themselves in the long run, along with everyone else.
Somehow we have been sold this destructive and defective version of capitalism without sensible restraint, which winds up being more like a free-for-all where corporations buy whatever legislation they need, and the free markets we're told to believe in are rigged such that competition is mostly illusory.
This is called 'Corporatism' and we're not that far off...
Quote from: Shwaz on November 29, 2010, 03:55:02 PM
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on November 29, 2010, 03:53:19 PM
Quote from: KuroiKetsunoHana on November 29, 2010, 03:45:46 PM
hippies and commies and whatnot are somewhat famous for insisting that capitalism has failed. they're not entirely correct, though; it hasn't failed, it's continually and spectacularly failing, like an old hose springing new leaks every year. unfortunately, i don't believe anyöne's come up with a better system.
Sure, look at France and Germany, and a lot of Europe for that matter.
Capitalism and predatory business tactics are two different things. Europe figured out way before we did that you have to enact restraints to protect the public, if you simply give businesses whatever they want they wreck not only the society in which they operate, but also wreck their own interests, because what appears wise for one company is not wise when they all behave the same way at the same time.
American corporations, especially the entire financial industry, have become very much like rabid dogs that don't realize they should stop eating and save some for tomorrow. They'll eat until they vomit, then eat the vomit along with the rest of the food, not caring who starves because of their conduct, and ultimately not realizing they are screwing themselves in the long run, along with everyone else.
Somehow we have been sold this destructive and defective version of capitalism without sensible restraint, which winds up being more like a free-for-all where corporations buy whatever legislation they need, and the free markets we're told to believe in are rigged such that competition is mostly illusory.
This is called 'Corporatism' and we're not that far off...
Well, speaking technically, the US presently represents crony capitalism, and is moving towards fascist corporatism.
"The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascismâ€"ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power." -Franklin D. Roosevelt
Quote from: Keith-N-Jax on November 29, 2010, 12:42:27 PM
My first trip to NYC I made sure I stopped by one of the hot dog vendors. I mean you see it all the time in the movies right Couldnt leave the Big Apple with out doing that right? Here in Jax I guess you better find a Sonic.
One time in NYC (probably two years ago) I was late to meet people at MOMA without having eaten so I eyed a hot dog cart as I rushed by. The guy told me 3 bucks...so I passed...he said 2...and I was still in a hurry so no...when he knocked it down to a buck that got me to stop walking.
Hope he didn't give me the ones from the dirty water...
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on November 29, 2010, 04:03:12 PM
Quote from: Shwaz on November 29, 2010, 03:55:02 PM
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on November 29, 2010, 03:53:19 PM
Quote from: KuroiKetsunoHana on November 29, 2010, 03:45:46 PM
hippies and commies and whatnot are somewhat famous for insisting that capitalism has failed. they're not entirely correct, though; it hasn't failed, it's continually and spectacularly failing, like an old hose springing new leaks every year. unfortunately, i don't believe anyöne's come up with a better system.
Sure, look at France and Germany, and a lot of Europe for that matter.
Capitalism and predatory business tactics are two different things. Europe figured out way before we did that you have to enact restraints to protect the public, if you simply give businesses whatever they want they wreck not only the society in which they operate, but also wreck their own interests, because what appears wise for one company is not wise when they all behave the same way at the same time.
American corporations, especially the entire financial industry, have become very much like rabid dogs that don't realize they should stop eating and save some for tomorrow. They'll eat until they vomit, then eat the vomit along with the rest of the food, not caring who starves because of their conduct, and ultimately not realizing they are screwing themselves in the long run, along with everyone else.
Somehow we have been sold this destructive and defective version of capitalism without sensible restraint, which winds up being more like a free-for-all where corporations buy whatever legislation they need, and the free markets we're told to believe in are rigged such that competition is mostly illusory.
This is called 'Corporatism' and we're not that far off...
Well, speaking technically, the US presently represents crony capitalism, and is moving towards fascist corporatism.
"The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascismâ€"ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power." -Franklin D. Roosevelt
You could argue that we currently reside in social corporatism - where major companies take huge risks and keep record profits but when their poor decisions fail we funnel tax dollars and print more money to bail them out.
In this case... when local restaurants can't make a better hotdog than a dirty frank sold from a cart... the local government shuts the little guy down.
If I had a hot dog cart, I'd put a sign out at 3pm for "power hour dogs", $1. You'd have half of whatever building you're standing in front of down there everyday...esp if it's a city/fed bldg...lol...$1 soda and you're making money.
Quote from: strider on November 29, 2010, 08:30:25 AM
The street vendors still pay "rent" in some form or another. They still pay operating expenses. They are still as accountable for things like sales tax as any other cash based business. Are their expenses lower than the fixed based operators' are? Probably, but then as a society are we going to pass laws that penalize every other business person who finds a way to save a buck over their competition?
Restaurants, whether they be fast food or sit down require a commitment. Street vendors can be impulse buying. In fact, I suspect a large percentage of their sales are impulse. It doesn't matter if they are selling hot dogs or jeans actually. So it doesn't seem like they ultimately hurt the fixed based operators much in reality. However, the fixed based operators are afraid the street vendors have taken their business when in fact, it is the economy. Or the fixed based vendors poor marketing or products. But we must always have someone else to blame and here we are.
That I agree with.
Also hot dog vendors don't really make all that much. Unless you are making less of course. How many really successful fixed operators really make it on hot dog/sausage sales alone? Most places the "dog" is sent to the bottom corner of the menu. I have heard it said though that the bikini clad Hot dog vendors of the late 80 s are missed.
...and the sausage dogs outside of Lowes are so bloomin' good.
I am surprised that there are people who consider the hot dog stands to be such a threat. The clientele, I presume, would be different for hot dog stands than they would be for traditional brick-and-mortar eateries. Folks who are on the go and want a quick stand-up bite to eat are more prone to drop a couple of dollars at a hot dog cart. I don't think that someone leaves to go on their lunch break and deliberately shuns a restaurant to grab a hot dog. Either you want to sit down for a meal or you don't. Besides, the hot dog carts serve a decent purpose for those who are a couple of days away from pay day but don't feel like brown bagging it again...
So this is a blanket "Non-Compete" issue. I thought this smelled of the GOBN crying to Daddy.
I agree with you JC...the Vendors are exposed to everyone and everything...they don't have the luxury of throwing someone out of their establishment.
My Mexican American friend said to me last year."You watch...it's gonna get like Mexico around here with everyone trying to find their angle or second income..just to pay bills"
Quote from: Ernest Street on November 29, 2010, 06:53:54 PM
So this is a blanket "Non-Compete" issue. I thought this smelled of the GOB club crying to Daddy.
I agree with you JC...the Vendors are exposed to everyone and everything...they don't have the luxury of throwing someone out of their establishment.
My Mexican American friend said to me last year."You watch...it's gonna get like Mexico around here with everyone trying to find their angle or second income..just to pay bills")
Your friend makes an excellent point and this is already evident in impoverished areas like around Edgewood and Avenue B or Broward Rd near Clark and Interstate Center. People are braiding hair, running unregulated day care centers, selling goods yard sale style, shade tree mechanics, roadside BBQs and so forth. This will get more common as things get worse.
Quote from: JC on November 29, 2010, 07:09:37 PM
People are braiding hair, running unregulated day care centers, selling goods yard sale style, shade tree mechanics, roadside BBQs and so forth. This will get more common as things get worse.
Isn't this kind of "grassroots" entrepreneurship just what we need? I say this not merely economically, but also culturally, as these type of establishments put people's focus back in the community. If I knew a woman here that could cut my hair for $20 I wouldn't go to a salon and pay $35. I find the "ma & pa" shops offer higher quality and lower prices when putting food on the table is riding on that customer's word of mouth and eventual return. Isn't it these initial steps that lead to larger "small" businesses?
Quote from: CS Foltz on November 29, 2010, 02:08:31 PM
Roberts Eatery on 8th and Ionia, Weds to Fri from 8 to 4ish has just that! Anyone who utters the phrase "CS Foltz said to stop" gets a free meal! Typical street vendor fare and we need more business persons willing to make the effort! Noone your on the list!
CS, I hope Robert is still there. What families aren't having a hard time with trying to maintain the household. 3 new taxes. Property tax increases. A city with out of control spending that is bankrupting us.
How is that $400,000 study to move the fair coming?
A man is trying a new venture and is trying to comply with all the required requirements. And there are a bunch. Allow everyone to compete.
At the last council meeting there was a resolution in a jbill that will create an "Urban Transition Area" in Riverside. A Special Drinking Zone. Now a 1 mile ban on a hot dog cart.
This will be in Rules and RCD
Councilman Redman spoke at the council meeting during a public hearing. I hope he opposes it.
Would the current hot dog stands we grandfathered in? If they were legal when they opened, would they still be legal regardless of the change in the law?
QuoteAt the last council meeting there was a resolution in a jbill that will create an "Urban Transition Area" in Riverside. A Special Drinking Zone.
I actually see that as a good thing for the neighborhood. North Riverside is in need of some help in order to thrive as it once did. The Urban Transition Area has special allowances to spur commercial businesses that can create vibrancy.... much like the businesses that have made King Street a destination again.
But I think this particular bill(2010-856) really targets the transient 'vendors' that sell rugs, paintings, agricultural products, nursuries, etc on the side of the road. 'Hot Dog Cart Bill' is kind of a misleading title... unless Im not understanding the bill correctly?
"But I think this particular bill(2010-856) really targets the transient 'vendors' that sell rugs, paintings, agricultural products, nursuries, etc on the side of the road. 'Hot Dog Cart Bill' is kind of a misleading title... unless Im not understanding the bill correctly?"
Whether it's food or products, the law would limit consumer's choices. Competition improves the economy whether it's perceived as "fair" or not.
QuoteWhether it's food or products, the law would limit consumer's choices. Competition improves the economy whether it's perceived as "fair" or not.
Labeling this the 'Hot Dog Cart' bill implies it targets hot dog cart owners only. Thats simply not an accurate representation of the bill, is my point.
And really, this bill(
not sure if Im for or against it at this point) is the same economic argument as my justification for making the hundred or so gambling parlors(aka sweepstakes stores)
that the city council didn't have the backbone to stand up to deemed illegal(as they are IMO). There are barriers of entry to any particular business, if you don't comply with the same rules everyone else plays by, you shouldnt be allowed to enter the game.
Do you want your children to be watched by unlicensed, unregulated, and uninsured 'day care centers'?
Or how bout the axles on your car snapping while your driving down the highway b/c you unbeknowingly bought counterfit axles?
Quote from: fieldafm on November 29, 2010, 09:38:28 PM
QuoteAt the last council meeting there was a resolution in a jbill that will create an "Urban Transition Area" in Riverside. A Special Drinking Zone.
I actually see that as a good thing for the neighborhood. North Riverside is in need of some help in order to thrive as it once did. The Urban Transition Area has special allowances to spur commercial businesses that can create vibrancy.... much like the businesses that have made King Street a destination again.
But I think this particular bill(2010-856) really targets the transient 'vendors' that sell rugs, paintings, agricultural products, nursuries, etc on the side of the road. 'Hot Dog Cart Bill' is kind of a misleading title... unless Im not understanding the bill correctly?
"Urban Transition Area" in Riverside I still say its legislative protectionism. Any other bar in the city that wants it allow them the opportunity to do it as well.
You are absolutely right about 2010-856. Its not just a hot dog cart. In fact the scope of what constitutes a transient service is more widespread and diverse in its interpretation. Why is this being pushed NOW?
There is a JCCI study going on right now RECESSION, RECOVERY, and BEYOND. This ordinance should be part of the study. Is anyone on this forum participating in this study?
I've done two and it was horrible. Just a stab in the back to the people of Jacksonville that legislation that could have an impact on a study was acted on or introduced right in the middle of the study. This sounds exactly what is happening again. How wrong.
These studies do guide policy.
QuoteLabeling this the 'Hot Dog Cart' bill implies it targets hot dog cart owners only. Thats simply not an accurate representation of the bill, is my point.
And really, this bill(not sure if Im for or against it at this point) is the same economic argument as my justification for making the hundred or so gambling parlors(aka sweepstakes stores) that the city council didn't have the backbone to stand up to deemed illegal(as they are IMO). There are barriers of entry to any particular business, if you don't comply with the same rules everyone else plays by, you shouldnt be allowed to enter the game.
Do you want your children to be watched by unlicensed, unregulated, and uninsured 'day care centers'?
Or how bout the axles on your car snapping while your driving down the highway b/c you unbeknowingly bought counterfit axles?
This law, whether by intention or unintended consequence, will greatly affect the hot dog stand. Existing ones being grandfathered or not is a good question that I have not seen the answer to yet.
As far as fears of illegal business, that is just that, fear that has no basis here. The laws that prevent the illegal transient businesses are already in place and already enforced. If you feel they are not being enforced properly, then you get them enforced, not write a new law. Perhaps this is a case where the current law is not strong enough to prevent illegal businesses from operating, but this law does not seem to address that so is not needed for anything but the unfair limiting of businesses to protect what are perhaps badly run or unneeded businesses.
I know that a hot dog stand actually has more hoops to jump through than the Gate Station that sells a few hot dogs (not very good ones at that). I also have issues with the word "barriers" as no government should be putting up barriers in front of someone wanting to open a business, but regulating that business to insure that it protects the public safety and is obeying the appropriate laws. There is a big difference between the two. Unfortunately, the COJ often does present unnecessary financial barriers and probably will produce more as time goes by.
I"m more opposed to the permanent yard sales that have popped up in neighborhoods everywhere. Nothing like a good hotdog and i do support the idea that if your food is good enough don't worry about it.
Quote from: Garden guy on November 30, 2010, 08:44:14 PM
I"m more opposed to the permanent yard sales that have popped up in neighborhoods everywhere. Nothing like a good hotdog and i do support the idea that if your food is good enough don't worry about it.
Maybe you are opposed because you are not desperate??
Come on, JC! Don't immediately jump to disparaging someone's motives. Take the chip off.
"Garden, maybe the people who are holding yard sales every weekend are out of work and struggling to make a little money to live on. These are tough times for a lot of people. Cut them a little slack." - JC
Your point gets across without making everybody defensive. You have interesting points of view and frequently one that the rest of us have not considered so add a lot of value to our discussions. Just don't start off angry with us, please.
There is an article in this morning's Florida Times Union / Jacksonville.com about the Cavin brothers' new food truck, which features menu items from their restaurants Mossfire Grill and O' Brothers. Wonder how this proposed ordinance will effect them?
Quote from: Dog Walker on December 01, 2010, 08:47:15 AM
Come on, JC! Don't immediately jump to disparaging someone's motives. Take the chip off.
"Garden, maybe the people who are holding yard sales every weekend are out of work and struggling to make a little money to live on. These are tough times for a lot of people. Cut them a little slack." - JC
Your point gets across without making everybody defensive. You have interesting points of view and frequently one that the rest of us have not considered so add a lot of value to our discussions. Just don't start off angry with us, please.
ok
8)
What would this bill do to the organized events using temporary vendors, such as craft fairs and school festivals? What about the Riverside Arts Market? Many of these affairs are within a mile of numerous businesses. Who would police what products or services are offered within a mile of a business? Just curious.
Quote from: Miss Fixit on December 01, 2010, 08:57:47 AM
There is an article in this morning's Florida Times Union / Jacksonville.com about the Cavin brothers' new food truck, which features menu items from their restaurants Mossfire Grill and O' Brothers. Wonder how this proposed ordinance will effect them?
On their website...yes the truck has it's own..it is advertised as a catering truck for "events"...now I don't know how this would effect them downtown, obviously within a mile of a lot of venues that serve food.
An impressive leap of faith in this economy..that bus wasn't cheap, and to outfit it for catering... :o
www.businyourchops.com
Quote from: strider on November 30, 2010, 06:31:55 PM
QuoteLabeling this the 'Hot Dog Cart' bill implies it targets hot dog cart owners only. Thats simply not an accurate representation of the bill, is my point.
And really, this bill(not sure if Im for or against it at this point) is the same economic argument as my justification for making the hundred or so gambling parlors(aka sweepstakes stores) that the city council didn't have the backbone to stand up to deemed illegal(as they are IMO). There are barriers of entry to any particular business, if you don't comply with the same rules everyone else plays by, you shouldnt be allowed to enter the game.
Do you want your children to be watched by unlicensed, unregulated, and uninsured 'day care centers'?
Or how bout the axles on your car snapping while your driving down the highway b/c you unbeknowingly bought counterfit axles?
This law, whether by intention or unintended consequence, will greatly affect the hot dog stand. Existing ones being grandfathered or not is a good question that I have not seen the answer to yet.
As far as fears of illegal business, that is just that, fear that has no basis here. The laws that prevent the illegal transient businesses are already in place and already enforced. If you feel they are not being enforced properly, then you get them enforced, not write a new law. Perhaps this is a case where the current law is not strong enough to prevent illegal businesses from operating, but this law does not seem to address that so is not needed for anything but the unfair limiting of businesses to protect what are perhaps badly run or unneeded businesses.
I know that a hot dog stand actually has more hoops to jump through than the Gate Station that sells a few hot dogs (not very good ones at that). I also have issues with the word "barriers" as no government should be putting up barriers in front of someone wanting to open a business, but regulating that business to insure that it protects the public safety and is obeying the appropriate laws. There is a big difference between the two. Unfortunately, the COJ often does present unnecessary financial barriers and probably will produce more as time goes by.
I am the very last person on this board that wants government entangled in private business affairs than is absolutely necessary... but I think you're taking the word 'barriers' too literally. Paying income tax, having a valid business license, valid permits, paying sales taxes, paying social security taxes for your workers, being subject to inspections.... basically following the law, that's an economic barrier of entry that certain transient businesses simply skirt around.
Im still not for or against this bill yet... but to play devils advocate, in my thread about the illegal gambling institutions that the council didnt have the backbone to stand up to, this exact same economic argument was well received by many on this board.
Quote from: Old Jim on December 01, 2010, 07:51:20 PM
What would this bill do to the organized events using temporary vendors, such as craft fairs and school festivals? What about the Riverside Arts Market? Many of these affairs are within a mile of numerous businesses. Who would police what products or services are offered within a mile of a business? Just curious.
Old Jim, Welcome to the forum. This legislation is scheduled for two committees. Rules and RCD.
The legislation exempts Downtown. What is the boundry of Downtown? The Downtown Vision boundry? or would it be 2003-627 which is our Downtown Jacksonville Overlay Zoning District?
Will all 501-c be exempt? This would exempt the Riverside Arts Market.
Again we are in the middle of a JCCI study Recession, Recovery, and Beyond. Also a new city council and mayoral campaign that will have new leadership in 4 months. Is this legislation an emergency. No.
Defer the bill. Has there been one story on the news or print media about this legislation. I haven't seen it. Be concerned.
Quote from: Noone on November 28, 2010, 05:11:25 PM
Again is anyone on this forum participating in the recent JCCI study Recession, Recovery, and Beyond?
Yes, I've attended most of the regional studies (I missed Nassau and St. Johns counties).
Good.
Is there anything you can share? Do other counties have a transient vender ban? On Friday stopped by a number of transient venders and there was real concern.
This will be in Rules Monday.
Drive down Beach from the Intercoastal to St Nicholas.
You have your choice of Boiled Peanuts, Fruit, (either watermelons or peaches) Veggies, hot dogs, numerous parkings of cars for sale from individuals, newspaper salesmen on the left turn parkway, firewood, occasionally furniture out of the truck.
It's probably more about aesthetics and tax revenue.
Yes, they provide economic competition, but they also take sales out of tax paying businesses.
St. Nicholas.
That reminds me of the guy that sets up across from the Mudville Grill and is in the Salvation Army Thrift store parking lot. Had some of his food a while back. He's been there a long time.
Councilman Redman will need to drive by and tell him that if 2010-856 passes your butt is gone.
The sad part is this won't affect the truly irritating 'vendors' like the Times-Union guys who jump in front of your car at stoplights. I am always worried I'm going to hit one accidentally. It will just run off the guys serving pretty damned good hot dogs. It also won't do anything about all the cars for sale on the sides of the road, we already have ordinances preventing that and they all just do it anyway. This is going to hurt the good vendors and do nothing to stop the annoying ones, this bill needs to be scrapped.
City just wants their cut of the potential pie! Doesn't matter who is affected, they just want some money up front! Got to fill that $58 Million Dollar hole somehow and this will fill the gap...........right?
Monday at Rules 2010-856 was deferred. The legislation will also go to LUZ.
Chairwoman Lee when bill numbers were presented recognized and read into the record the person or persons and if they were for or against that piece of legislation. Public comment wasn't taken just the YES or NO. Although at other times speakers comments were read into the record.
Obviously an inconsistent pattern. Still needs tweaking.
At the end of the meeting chairwoman Lee did allow for Public Comment. Pats on the back for making citizen participation better than what it has been in the past.
Still not being addressed. What is the boundary of Downtown? Will every 501-c be exempt?
There will be a noticed meeting TBA.
I did some research in Jacksonville.com archives. It appears that the City Council tried to change these limits in 2005 and ultimately the bill was withdrawn after nearly 5 months of amendments, revisions, and meetings. The original bill was 2005-91 and was focused on raw seafood vendors, but also attempted to set a 1,000 foot limit for all transient vendors. The new proposal would set a limit over 5 times greater than what they failed to pass in 2005. Does anyone on this board recall why that one was ultimately squashed?
I also found a Times Union article from August 2005 where a representative from Jacksonville Consumer Affairs indicated there were 75 licensed downtown transient merchants and 173 outside downtown. I wonder what the current number of licensed transient merchants is 5 years later.
Good catch YBR.
This is an election year. The legislation is horrible. Ask the mayoral candidates what is their position.
We are in the middle of a JCCI study Recession, Recovery, and Beyond. As a participant in two previous ones Skip Kramer executive director of JCCI and Elaine Brown former Jacksonville city council member and acting moderator or chair of the current study need to be immediately aware of this pending legislation and councilman Webb or Joost can make themselves available to the study group so as to help them in their future recommendations to the city. This legislation is being slipped in. Be concerned.
Has anyone heard when the noticed meeting on this legislation is to take place?
Also in 2005 another piece of legislation was passed.
2005-1283
It needs to be withdrawn now or you can just say that we want less economic opportunity in Jacksonville.
Our new slogan.
Lets get to work- Just not in Jacksonville
After speaking at length with one such vendor(one that operates not only a transient but several businesses with fixed locations in the city) earlier today about this bill.... I can now say I am 100% against 2010-856.
Mr Jim Bailey was on this board a few weeks ago talking about the need to 'get out of our own way' and to 'make it easier for small businesses to operate'. I think this particular bill perfectly illustrates those ideals.
What's really mind boggling is that the city doesnt enforce the current law on the books.
And I say that with all due respect to Chris Trad who is very vocal in his support of this legislation. I steer away from the roadside nursuries and always shop at Trad's (or Hall's if they have a decent coupon in Money Magazine).
IMO, this bill represents a crowding out scenario that isn't in line with a functioning free market. I firmly believe we need to create an Entrepreneurial Economy in this city. 2010-856 would not help advance such an ideal.
Quote from: spuwho on December 06, 2010, 01:49:22 AM
Drive down Beach from the Intercoastal to St Nicholas.
You have your choice of Boiled Peanuts, Fruit, (either watermelons or peaches) Veggies, hot dogs, numerous parkings of cars for sale from individuals, newspaper salesmen on the left turn parkway, firewood, occasionally furniture out of the truck.
It's probably more about aesthetics and tax revenue.
Yes, they provide economic competition, but they also take sales out of tax paying businesses.
Why the need to buck every effort on the part of free citizens? Think about it, we have identified something uniquely Jacksonvilleish, if it's about aesthetics, corridor it, and make it more popular... Besides the hot dogs at Gate suck and forget finding boiled peanuts. Welcome to Jacksonville's old fashioned vendor market...OCKLAWAHA
Ock, since our town is so big and "Diversified" a lot of folks stay on their respective sides of town and don't understand the different lifestyles and way of life some residents choose.
The original Cracker lifestyle is not on the radar of those whom frequent SJTC and the ugly south side/beach suburban sprawl. They seem content with stucco coated Pressboard "Mc Mansions" in some run down subdivision. (this is Argyle and OP also)
This is not an attack..it's just what some want.
Just because you chose to live on the Westside or Northside doesn't instantly make you a Redneck.
Why do open air sales make so many uptight people so mad?...It's like TV..if you don't like the program change the channel.
Drive on by and don't Buy!
Don't Baptists or city council members still believe in the Christian philosophy of "Live and let live?
Sure they do Earnest. My thinking is IF YOU MUST bump them around then identify area's where they seem to cluster and give these some boundaries (and I don't mean curb setbacks) such as between "San Pablo and the Intercoastal" or "within the described bounds of a historic district", hell we could set them up in every one of the towns M/L 6-7 geographic areas.
A great example of one that will be flamed by this rule that is truly needed is the little - and ever expanding - cart at the VA clinic. Since Shand's put up the "Shand's Curtain" to keep the veterans and dogs off their lawn there is no way to get ANYTHING to eat or drink without a 3 block hike. Try that after losing your legs in a Hummer/IED incident in some God forsaken desert... Makes you REAL PROUD to be an all American Veteran.
OCKLAWAHA
What happened to the Rug Vendors? I'm still looking for my Velvet rug with Elvis and Jesus holding hands and walking across water.
Although I would be placated with one of those Original "Dog Poker Game" rugs. ;D
Today is the St. Johns River Alliance Board meeting in Palatka. John Delaney is the chair, 34 Board members. Hope there is an opportunity for Public comment. Want to ask if the other 12 counties that comprise our American Heritage River have a 1 mile ban on water related transient vendors?
In Chicago. You cant unwrap or alter food once it is placed on a truck.
from http://reason.com/blog/2010/12/13/chicago-cupcake-crackdown (http://reason.com/blog/2010/12/13/chicago-cupcake-crackdown)
QuoteIn today's WSJ, a tale of back alley cupcake sales in the Windy City: Slammed with a $275 dollar ticket for selling cupcakes out of a van, one food entrepreneur is on the lam.
Ms. Kurtz, a 41-year-old entrepreneur who quit her corporate marketing job recently to launch Flirty Cupcakes, told her fans to meet her in the alley. "It was like a drug deal," she says. "I said, 'Just take them and run."'
Unlike other cities, where chefs are free to actually cook inside their trucks, Chicago chefs can't unwrap or alter the food in any way once it's on a truck. And food trucks aren't allowed to park within 200 feet of a restaurant. Such roadblocks have kept all but a few chefs from taking to the streetsâ€"even as the food trucks fight to change the rules.
Take note of the sentence in bold. In many cities where food trucks and flourishingâ€"including Washington, D.C.â€" restauranters are siding against the mobile vendors, and using law enforcement to eliminate the competition:
The City Council is currently considering some changes in food-truck laws. Brick-and-mortar restaurants are fighting the mobile insurgency, chasing trucks from their street fronts, calling police and snapping photos of the vendors in hopes of catching them illegally parked.
Holly Sjo, owner of The Cupcake Counter, a year-old downtown shop, called the cops when she spotted Ms. Kurtz parked near her business in a spot she believed to be illegal.
"She seems to only park next to other people's cupcake shops," Ms. Sjo says.
Ms. Kurtz denies the accusation. "I would never want to do that to another cupcake business," she says.
Food truck operator Matt Maroni has the right idea:
"Just step up your game," he says. "McDonald's doesn't ask Burger King if they can open up across the street."
Chicago cupcakes arrests? Please don't give these idiots ideas!
QUESTION: If we had a Jacksonville Shipyards retail/hotel complex with a waterfront pier and market wouldn't it be illegal to buy crabs off the boats? This is pure tori merdae!
Time to do a photo essay with these guys with interviews maybe?
OCKLAWAHA
Today at the St. Johns River Alliance meeting there is discussion of a Paddling Trail of the St. Johns River Blueway. I took the opportunity to make the other 12 counties aware of 2010-856 and the transient ban and asked if other counties have a ban if a transient kayak trailer showed up. The Duval county representative made the members aware of Duval counties pending legislation.
After the meeting other county members were shaking there heads.
Lisa Rinaman showed up after the presentation and I told her that I mentioned 2010-856. She asked me if I spoke with councilman Webb and Redman. On the way back from Palatka I called and left a message for both Webb and Redman. I'll let everyone know if I get a response back. Be concerned.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 years later. An item on the agenda for the 11/13/13 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was number III Blue Way Designation Request of St. Johns River Alliance. Terra Meeks, Chief of Waterfront Management Programming.
I'll post more later but it just reinforces the total crushing of the Public Trust in Jacksonville. Paul Astleford the new guy with Visit Jacksonville is a super hero. The new guy with DIA Aundra Wallace (None of this can be pinned on you) Councilwoman Lori Boyer District 5 is just AWESOME! Duval county should be in total absolute shock. RICO guys, snap out of it.
You've got to love it when the CRA consultants use a Public comment period to tell the DIA Board members to tighten up because people go to jail. I believe this was before Aundra Wallace.
2013-384- Councilwoman Daniels are you going to attach an amendment now?
Of coarse this is all positive.
More on Chicago's battle
http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/2828400-418/trucks-restaurants-mobile-restaurant-field.html (http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/2828400-418/trucks-restaurants-mobile-restaurant-field.html)
Restaurants choke on food trucks proposal
QuoteChicago restaurant owners are mobilizing to block City Hall from creating an “unlevel playing field†for their brick-and-mortar businesses â€" by legalizing mobile food trucks with cooking on the premises.
Five months after Ald. Scott Waguespack (32nd) championed the idea, restaurant owners are trying to bury it.
“We spent almost $9 million on two restaurants. It’s unfair to people who invested so much to allow someone who has a minimal investment in a truck . . . to pull up 200 feet from our door,†said Glenn Keefer, managing partner of Keefer’s Restaurant.
“They can barely get enough people out to inspect brick-and-mortar places. I don’t understand how they’ll be able to supervise and enforce sanitation on these trucks and where they trade.â€
Dan Rosenthal, owner of Trattoria No. 10 and Sopraffina Marketcaffe Restaurants, argued that Waguespack’s ordinance creates an “unlevel playing field†for brick-and-mortar restaurants.
“The reason I’ve located where I have is there’s a very dense population close to my locations. Why should somebody be allowed to take advantage of that for less than one-tenth of the expense?†he said.
“Every dollar I lose in sales to a food truck down the street costs me 50-cents in profit. It doesn’t take a lot of decline in sales for restaurants to go out of business, particularly in this economy.â€
Rosenthal further argued that legalizing mobile food trucks will not create the “warm, fuzzy, boutique-type of food service†that proponents envision.
“People think you’ll get all these hot, young chefs who don’t have access to capital creating all these great, exotic dishes. But, there’s nothing preventing Corner Bakery from doing food trucks,†he said.
“People had better be careful what they wish for. They could end up with food trucks serving standard fare, rather than unique street food.â€
Matt Maroni is the chef and owner of Gaztro-Wagon, a mobile food truck and storefront that specializes in modern street fare. He helped write the ordinance that Waguespack introduced in July.
Maroni was not moved by the argument about an unlevel playing field for restaurants.
“It’s a capitalist society. If they’re worried about competition, maybe they need to look at their concept,†he said.
“It opens a street-food culture to the city. Chicago is such a great food town. This just adds to it.â€
Mobile food trucks are currently permitted in Chicago, but they can only sell pre-packaged foods.
Waguespack’s ordinance would legalize cooking on the premises and establish strict operating conditions to ensure sanitation and avoid unfair competition with stationary restaurants.
Mobile food trucks would be required to have at least three sinks, but prohibited from having tables or benches.
They would have to follow designated routes so the city would know where they are to conduct random inspections. They would have to be located at least 200 feet away from a restaurant and 100 feet from any retail store that sells food.
The annual license would range from $660 to $1,100, depending on the size of the truck.
Despite the opposition, Waguespack said he’s hoping to get a City Council hearing on the ordinance sometime next month.
“We have some of the biggest chefs chomping at the bit to open a food truck. They see it as beneficial to their business. Other restaurants don’t see it as a good thing. It boils down to what you want to do,†Maroni said.
Quote“It’s a capitalist society. If they’re worried about competition, maybe they need to look at their concept,†he said.
+1
Exactly.
It's already not the easiest thing in the world for say a food truck to operate in this city now. You have to pay for a biz/food permit and all the normal stuff, PLUS a permit for every location. That permit per location is a killer. Think about the great food truck culture in Southern California. A Kogi BBQ truck that tweets they're location(which may change 2-4 times a day) just wouldn't be feasible having to constantly comply with the rules already on the books now... why make it THAT much harder with even more ridiculous rules?
The internet makes it hard on local retail stores, should we ban the internet too?
In 8 days there will be a special committee meeting of RULES, RCD, and LUZ at city hall on this legislation. Ask the mayoral candidates and city council candidates their position. Sweeping legislation
The joint committee meeting is posted for Wednesday January 5th, 11 AM, Council Chambers. Joint meeting of Rules, Land Use & Zoning, and Recreation & Community Development Committees to discuss this bill.
I was thinking about this bill as I drove past several Christmas Tree vendors this year. If this bill passes, I think nearly all of them would be shut down; I can think of very few of those locations that are more than 1 mile from the nearest retailers, big box store, or grocery store already selling trees. Growing up, I remembered many of those vendors being Lions Clubs or other exempt charitable organizations, but I wonder what the ratio of profit to non-profit vendors is for the Christmas Tree tent sales nowadays. We'll see the same effect on 4th of July "fireworks" sales too.
Wonderful. No Xmas trees, no fireworks, thanks COJ. Brilliant idea!
Agreed. No body goes 'out to dinner' only to hit up the closest hot dog cart.
The only business that I see this affecting is A&W, and I go there for the root beer on tap anyhow.
[/quote]
A&W? Wow, I haven't seen one of those in 20 years.
None left here in JAX..... closest one is Daytona. Last one I remember was out on Beach near San Pablo.
I thought there was still an A&W/KFC on Normandy near Fouracre.
A&W TacoBell @ Westberry and SanJose.
Gone?
back to thread
Noone and Yellow bluff!
Jan 5th 11am
thanks for the alert!
Does anyone know how fair vendors are licensed? Is there a master license for the fair itself (similar to how the flea markets get licensed)? If not, and the vendors all have individual licenses (similar to most art and crafts shows), they might have some challenges with the food vendors if they did relocate the fair out of downtown. I know there's not that much out near the equestrian center, but surely there are some stores within a mile of that venue that sell food, or maybe even stuffed animals that the fair merchants would then be "unfairly" competing with under the proposed ordinance? Yes, pun was intended - I couldn't resist. ;D
Quote from: Noone on December 28, 2010, 06:03:25 AM
In 8 days there will be a special committee meeting of RULES, RCD, and LUZ at city hall on this legislation. Ask the mayoral candidates and city council candidates their position. Sweeping legislation
tell us more!
I see your comments everywhere but I know so little.
I see the importance in turning up the volume but I dont feel the fever from the readers.
this is huge.
permanent impact.
we have to make sure our "leaders" get this right.
pull us back from the tipping point and give Jactionville a fighting chance again.
Having now been enlightened by Robert's incredible sausage dogs (thanks for the trip - Mr. Noone!) I hope that this bill is withdrawn. I haven't seen much or anything from the TU editorial writers on this one. I wonder why?
So what would happen to the Southside Unitied Methodist Church pumpkin lot and the Hendricks Avenue Patrols christmas tree lot if the Gate on Hendricks decides to sell pumpkins and christmas trees?
Also, it seems to me that if the city wants to 'level the playing field' would it not be more appropriate to do so with the tax rate than to eliminate the competition altogether?
Quote from: Seraphs on December 28, 2010, 09:53:56 PM
Agreed. No body goes 'out to dinner' only to hit up the closest hot dog cart.
That is a great point.
A&W? Wow, I haven't seen one of those in 20 years.
[/quote]
Just got back from the Polar plunge at Jacksonville Beach and had the opportunity to share it with councilman Joost and his family. Just happened to see him. He was there with his wife and children.
It was the first time that I participated in this activity and its been on my bucket list of things to do in this city.
We very briefly talked about 2010-856 that will be in a special committee in 4 days at city hall. We just shared an activity in the ocean. All I said was that if we can exempt Downtown we should also exempt the Waterways. Everyone had smiles on their faces. To bring in a new year and share an experience that even if I don't do it again will forever bring back that memory that I participated in the Polar Plunge at Jacksonville Beach.
Happy New Year to everyone.
In 26 hours a special committee meeting on a jobs killer for Jacksonville.
What is the position of the Chamber?
Has this issue been brought to the attention of Skip Cramer and Elaine Brown? As they are in the middle of a JCCI study RECESSION, RECOVERY, and BEYOND.
Will Downtown still be exempt?
Will the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River be exempt especially if we are seeking a statewide recognition of a paddling trail?
What is the position of the Mayoral candidates and city council candidates?
Is this legislation an emergency?
Will our new slogan be
Lets get to Work - Just not in Jacksonville
In less than 4 hours at city hall a special committee on a 1 mile transient vendor ban that will stifle economic opportunity from a permanent business that is providing the same service.
Will anyone attach an amendment that will exempt the St. Johns River our American Heritage River?
The committee meeting was cancelled.
Amazing how that always seems to happen once they realize people aren't fond of an item on the agenda.
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on January 05, 2011, 03:03:36 PM
Amazing how that always seems to happen once they realize people aren't fond of an item on the agenda.
that does at least mean they aren't goïng to go through with this nonsense, right?
Not at all. What a disaster yesterday. At 10:50 I'm entering city hall and happened to see and said hello to Mayor Peyton as he was exiting city hall. Once inside there was a group around the locked entrance to the council chambers and a note on the door saying that the meeting was cancelled.
I mentioned to the group so that this trip wouldn't be a total waste of my time I headed to the elevator and had the opportunity to ride the elevator up to the 4th floor with Kelly Boree the director of the Parks Dept. We both exited on the 4th floor and I went to the city council offices to the right and she exited and headed to the Mayors office to the left.
I walked in and was heading to see any councilmember that would listen. I was stopped at the entrance and was told that no one was there. I left and met councilman Crescimbeni in the lobby. Met councilman Brown outside. Spoke with Scott and he said Don was at the Barber shop. He said he got the notice at 10:30 OK.
Huge Issue.
Will every 501-c be exempt.
What is the boundry of Downtown?
What is the position of the Chamber?
Is this now part of the process in the JCCI study Recession, Recovery and Beyond?
Are the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River exempt from this transient vendor ban in light of the recent announcement of a potential Paddling Blueway of the entire 310 miles of the St. Johns River?
boil this down for me.
how do I, one man, help?
Its easy - email and call your district councilman and express your opinion. If you have done some research on the issue and have a reasonable argument in opposition (or support), most will listen. I have found from experience that the more research you do on the issue and the more educated you appear, the more likely that they will listen. Do your homework. I've learned the hard way what happens when you aren't as well versed on an issue as you could be.
Quote from: ricker on January 09, 2011, 08:26:04 AM
boil this down for me.
how do I, one man, help?
Ricker, Go to a city council meeting. You have posted about doing something on the westside under the Roosevelt bridge. Sounds great. So would you be a permanent structure or a transient vendor? Either way everyone should be allowed to participate.
Who is your councilman? You may live in different part of the city but want to participate under the bridge. Call 630-1377 that is the number for city council. Start there. We are 90 days out and the legislation is still out there so ask the Mayoral candidates and city council candidates.
There is a waterways Commission meeting Wend the 12th at 9am. Go to the meeting. Open to the Public.
The next meeting of FIND Florida Inland Navigation District is Friday the 14th at the Marriot in St. Johns County at 8:30. Open to the Public.
If the transient vendor ban is extended to the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River then you certainly won't want to
VISIT JACKSONVILLE!
Quote from: ricker on January 09, 2011, 08:26:04 AM
boil this down for me.
how do I, one man, help?
Ricker, How did the phone call go? Who did you try and contact? Are you a permanent business or a transient vendor as it relates to the future potential blueway trail on the westside?
Well the Jan. 12, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was very short. Just two items on the agenda. At the meeting was Neil Armingeon the St. Johns Riverkeeper, Dave Siebold with the city, Joe Wilhelm with the Daily Record, Ron Littlepage with the Times Union and there was another one or two but that was about it.
On the agenda was Mark Middlebrook the Executive Director of the St. Johns River Alliance. Mark was the key person during the Delaney administration that oversaw the Preservation Park land acquisitions during the early years of the St. Johns River Alliance which was a 5 year federal program and Anne Keller with the EPA was our designated River Navigator. After Anne we had Mindy Mathews. As of now we haven't had anyone in that position.
The River Summit of which I participated was in my opinion a huge success. It is so exciting to hear what is happening outside of Duval county. Out of the Summit was a caucus that was lead by Senator Thrasher to come up with ideas for future funding. One suggestion that everyone wants to embrace is an additional tax on bottled water. What can the Jacksonville Waterways due to help? Sponsor a resolution that we want this to happen. If the legislation moves forward. What was the River Accord?
Questions from Waterway Commission members were few. One question from Lane Burnett commission member was. What is the position of the St. Johns River Alliance on the Georgia Pacific discharge pipe? Basically he said we are not taking a position we are more interested in focusing on bringing people together and leave that one to the Riverkeeper. OK
During Public comment I highlighted the future jobs killer 2010-856 transient vendor ban as it would relate to a kayak vendor and potentially not being able to participate. Another lob pitch for my city councilman Don Redman who was there but didn't ask one question. Noone else did either about the future Paddling Trail of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River. Be concerned. Keep score.
So that brings us to this morning and the meeting in St. Johns county of the Florida Inland Navigation District and the commissioners appointed by the Governor and representing the East Coast of the state of Florida.
What an awesome and inspiring group of professionals. There will be a follow up and their are concerns and the District will be looking into it.
The bottom line is that if Downtown is exempt from 2010-856 then the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River needs to be included too.
Be concerned. There are 67 counties in Florida. Duval county needs to get it right.
Today at Rules 2010-856 will now have that special committee meeting with Rules/RCD/LUZ on this bill tomorrow in council chambers at 3pm. Super short notice.
So in 20 hours the people of Jacksonville will know if an amendment will be attached to exempt the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
In 10 hours the people of Jacksonville will know if they will or will not have economic opportunity and access to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Keep score and be concerned.
Is anyone concerned or is it just me and every other county outside of Duval county. This is really happening.
The special committee meeting on 2010-856 took place today in council chambers. Councilwoman Lee chaired the meeting. The sponsor CP Webb was not there as well as co sponsors Joost and Fussell. Holt a co-sponsor was there.
Also present were councilmembers Cresimbeni, Bishop,Brown,Redman,Johnson, saw Gaffney outside but he wasn't there for the meeting.
There was Public comment and at various times people were leaving and there wasn't a quorum so what happened at the end is that there will be 3 subcommittees with one from each I believe Bishop for Rules, Crescimbeni for LUZ and Redman for RCD.
There was one speaker in the beginning that was seeking an amendment to have fireworks exempted from the ordinance.OK
That is basically all I was asking when it was my turn.
Will one of you have the vision to offer an amendment that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Before the meeting I was sharing with councilman Redman if he would offer an amendment to exempt the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River in light of the fact that they are seeking to apply for a state designation of a Blueway Paddling trail for the entire 310 mile length of the River. I told him about the 1/9/11 TU lead editorial TOURISM-A Good Plan and the article is on the USS Adams.
Tourism....Don't we want to promote it? Do we want to promote our River?
I'm in District 4 and All Wet Sports is on Beach Blvd and its a permanent structure. They rent kayaks. Don told me that if I wanted to participate go and find a waterfront lot a mile away and then you'll be OK. Are you serious? He is.
Well I volunteered as well as 3 or 4 others and I will be reporting back to the 3 committee chairs as well as the other members.
I mentioned that there were concerns from counties outside of Duval county with the Alliance. I also mentioned during Public comment that the commissioners of FIND had concerns. I have been going to there meetings for two years and they are appointed by the Governor. Heck with a pocket pier lets just allow for economic opportunity.
If this issue is allowed to stand you definitely don't want to VISIT JACKSONVILLE.
I finally got a chance to read the meeting minutes and watch the video from the joint subcommittee meeting earlier this week
(minutes: http://citycirc.coj.net/coj/CurrentYear/LandUse/97-January-19-2011-Joint-Rules-RCD-LUZ-Minutes.htm (http://citycirc.coj.net/coj/CurrentYear/LandUse/97-January-19-2011-Joint-Rules-RCD-LUZ-Minutes.htm),
video: http://media.coj.net/City_Council/Rules_RCD_LUZ_1-19-11.wmv (http://media.coj.net/City_Council/Rules_RCD_LUZ_1-19-11.wmv). Unfortunately the video cuts off before the public comment phase is complete and doesn't record the Councilmembers stating their opinions).
If you're interested, don't just read the minutes. Listen to the speakers. Michelle Baldwin's comments and responses to questions were very useful as well. Watching reinforced my opinion that before they go changing this ordinance to increase the distance, they should make sure the current vendors are appropriately permitted and compliant with existing ordinance. Fine and punish those who are not. Changing the law to increase the distance will have minimal impact on those who don't care to follow the existing laws, and a material impact to those who do follow the existing laws. Enforce the existing law for 4 months and let's see what the revenue offset is.
Also interesting was Councilman Crescimbeni's information that his research indicated 21 licensed transient merchants now. A 2005 Times-Union article had the count at 173 licensed outside downtown. Either they're a) not being licensed properly by the city, b) tracked differently than they were in 2005, c) we've got lots who are skipping the licensing requirements - and should be addressed by enforcing what's already on the books, or d) all of the above. My bet's on d.
My bet is on "E"; That we've witnessed a historic near-total collapse of our downtown in the 6 years since those 2005 statistics came out, and with that being the case most of the vendors probably left along with the restaurants, barber shops, corporate offices, and workers.
YBR, Great post and information. I was the last speaker for Public comment and my presentation wasn't there. The key in my opinion is what councilwoman Lee says in the beginning to councilman Brown. And that is simply the legislation is in place. Will we entertain an amendment to the legislation. If one can be shown.
I'm in District 4. FOUR!!! We better duck. I'm serious when I say that right before the meeting I asked my elected legislative representative if he will offer an amendment to exempt the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River and he said "No" OK. For the people Downtown I'd be scared to death. As well as all the people of Duval county.
The Public Trust has been crushed in this community. Has any mayoral candidate commented on our Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier?
Does any candidate support more restrictions for economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River?
On a lighter note. Who's next. The weather should be breaking and next week the tides should be a little better for the sportier trip on McCoys Creek under the Times Union. There is an earey calm about entering this manmade cavern and the proverbial light at the end of the tunnel. A morning radiation of light when exiting and the shadows that are cast during this time of the day while your surroundings are awakening to a new day have that warm feeling inside of you that you have captured time by placing yourself in this position to welcome and focus on any little activity.
Lets open this trip up to the members of this forum because everyone else will be focusing on attaching the amendment to 856 that will exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
How about a shout out to DW, Field, North Miami, Ricker, YBR, Dougskiles, It wouldn't surprise me a bit if team Skiles has already done this. He makes it happen. So Who wants to make a scene Downtown on the water?
Lake has experienced this activity. Should it be a part of our Downtown? I'd say Yes.
Regulations that limit competition hurt consumers. The existing law should repealed not strengthened.
QuoteWatching reinforced my opinion that before they go changing this ordinance to increase the distance, they should make sure the current vendors are appropriately permitted and compliant with existing ordinance. Fine and punish those who are not. Changing the law to increase the distance will have minimal impact on those who don't care to follow the existing laws, and a material impact to those who do follow the existing laws. Enforce the existing law for 4 months and let's see what the revenue offset is.
x1000.
Noone, don't know about McCoys, but after walking Hogans from the shipyards basin all the way to Klutho on Satuday... I might be interested in a Hogans run/cleanup if anyone else can lend a hand.
Field, Thats Super. My vehicle is down and I'm going to play some catch up. Also key meetings coming up. We'll do Hogans.
I hope that everyone right now should be lobbying every candidate for office about attaching an amendment to 856 that would exempt the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River. It needs to happen. If it doesn't happen we'll be saying "Don't Visit Jacksonville."
This weekend John?
Field, This weekend sounds great. Looking forward to meeting you and a whole bunch of other super people.
As to 2010-856 I addressed the city council last night and asked and I still hope that someone will attach an amendment that will exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Be concerned. 67 counties in Florida and in my opinion if you think for one second that we are getting more access and economic opportunity we are going to be getting less. Has anyone running for office mentioned the Shipyards/Landmar Pier? Any candidate mention a pocket pier (floating dock at a waterfront Public Access street end?)
Be concerned.
Yesterday I had the opportunity to address the Board of Downtown Vision before the start of their meeting. Terry Lorrince is always so accommodating and gracious to make me feel welcome and any other invited guest or speaker. I'm also starting to feel like family just recognizing the other members when I see them in other functions and events. Angela Corey our state attorney was there and you could see that they also had a full agenda. Councilman Redman was there and basically the only real opportunity I had for talking with him was during introductions just going around the room.
My speech to the board was actually a request that the Board of Downtown Vision support a resolution that could be attached to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River. Just recognize that Downtown is exempt. The Waterways need to be exempt too.
I shared with the Board about TOURISM and the USS Adams coming to Downtown. Tourism and that the SJRA is seeking a statewide designation of a paddling trail. There are 67 counties in Florida and as this Paddling trail is created do we want to be the only county that would ban a transient outfitter from participating?
There were no questions or any motions. But it is out there. And that is important. The ord. is local. Its still active. Has anyone on this forum contacted any council member about this pending piece of legislation?
I stayed for Angela Corey's presentation and Q&A then left and made it back to my vehicle before the meter expired. Whew! Doesn't take much to make my day.
On my way back to work I put a call in and was fortunate to catch Scott Wilson who is Don Redman's assistant and just told him that I just saw Don at the Board meeting for Downtown Vision and wanted to share with Scott that I just saw on the news and in the paper where Don called the police on people feeding the homeless. And I basically said Scott this dovetails exactly with the transient vendor ban. Again I'll use All Wet Sports but there are examples everywhere. Ricker I can't wait to meet you and how this could impact the JMM. But anyway I said Scott you were there at the special committee meeting of Rules, LUZ and RCD. Don basically said to me go find your own waterfront access point a mile away and then you can participate. I'm not making it up. The point is and I said to Scott if Don can call the police for this church group feeding the homeless then Don can call the police if I show up or anyone else for that matter that is a transient vendor outfitter that may want to participate in the future of what could be a state wide paddling trail. Scott said that I had a point.
There are more meetings moving forward. It is still a local issue. I have been asking, asking, asking, asking, asking, my city councilman to offer an amendment to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River. It doesn't seem to be happening. If he chooses to do nothing that is OK.
The issue is still a Duval county issue. If nothing happens it immediately sends a message. DON'T VISIT JACKSONVILLE.
and of coarse our new slogan.
Lets get to work- Just not in Jacksonville.
Committee meetings today. Has anyone even attempted to contact their council person to ask for an amendment to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River?
I know its not happening in District 4.
HUGE city council and mayoral campaign issue. Rules meeting in 30 minutes. RCD at 4. Councilman Redman is the subcommittee chair and I've given him so much information and he hasn't taken any action.
Be concerned.
My council rep knows of my overall concerns with the bill(which I believe is bad for our city as it does not serve to embrace an entrepreneural economy that our city desperately needs) as well as the potential for a modified bill that would exempt the waterways, as downtown is exempted.
Today at Rules 856 was deferred. Council woman Lee did allow for Public comment at the end of the meeting. I again expressed my concern that an amendment needs to be attached to 856 that will exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
I illustrated the #1 example of this destruction of the Public Trust by showing the bill 2010-675 the USS Adams and then the one, one, one, just one amendment. And it was a Finance Amendment and the last sentence. Its a potential taxpayer bailout for a future city council and Mayor. The biggest crushing blow about this legislation 2010-675 is that it did NOT go before the Jacksonville Waterways Commission.
At this meeting I again shared with them the potential creation of a statewide designation of a Blueway Paddling Trail for the entire 310 miles of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River. I expressed my concern that out of 67 counties in Florida will Duval county be the only county within this paddling Blueway that may restrict transient kayak outfitter vendors from participating in this economic opportunity.
Ricker, if your out there I'd love to know how the JMM Jacksonville Marina Mile group feel about this legislation.
There is still a pending yet TBA meeting of the special committee of Rules, LUZ, and RCD on this legislation.
I'm having a little bit of trouble following people here. I didn't want to watch the 1:48:00 video of whatever that meeting was, but I'm trying to recap what you guys are so concerned about.
From what I can gather from these somewhat hazy posts (no offense), the city has enacted a local bill that would ban travelling vendors from setting up anywhere but downtown and within one mile of downtown. I'm trying to connect the dots on how this relates to our river and waterways, and how it relates to a private group bringing the Adams downtown to be moored as a museum.
I think I am against a bill like this for the easy reason that one of the biggest new fads is meals on wheels. Cities like Chicago, New York, Atlanta, and DC now have some of the best food prepared in trucks driving throughout the metros and pleasing many people. I guess these guys would not survive in Jax with this bill and I guess I'll never see JagDog again near Ortega. Aside from this, I am just a little confused on why this bill is such a big deal. People feeding the homeless in Hemming? Yes...big deal! The feeders should be arrested for that!
Simms3, Lets go kayaking one of these days and I'll try and explain all these hazy posts and there is no offense taken. In my opinion the Public Trust in this community has just been totally crushed and it can only be restored back through legislation. There was a reason that the Charter Revision Commission as one of their recommendations was to restore the original Code of Ethics that was in our charter in 1968 and removed 4 years later.
2010-856 and why an amendment needs to be attached to exempt the waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. And this is for anybody. Go to Castaway Island, Go to Dutton Island, Tiger Betz is closed and will open soon I think that's the name of the one on the northside. But anyway go and look at the signage. Use Castaway for example. These are Preservation Parks. Look at the bottom and the language in Partnership with the Public Trust, City of Jacksonville and Kayak Amelia. Now don't get me wrong this is not a slam on Kayak Amelia but my first thought is who died and made them the vendors of the Waterways. Was there an RFP? What was the ord. number for the new signage? When was this before the Waterways Commission? Was there a news story in the TU? Folio? Was there news coverage from any local television station? I want to say Congratulations to Kayak Amelia!
So in December the St. Johns River Alliance is now looking for a state designation of a Greenway/Blueway paddling trail the entire 310 miles of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. Sounds good. Sign me up. I was at the meeting in Palatka. I asked is there any other county that has pending legislation that could shut out an outfitter from participating in this activity with a transient vendor ban of 1 mile that Duval county is considering?
The OGC is looking into this and I believe will offer an interpretation and I hope that it will be one that would support an amendment that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. Does a concession agreement constitute a permanent business status?
Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting in 4 hours at city hall. Will be asking for a resolution from the commission that could be taken back to the city council that could be attached to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. This is an active piece of legislation.
Also will be expressing a continuing concern about our Promised 680' Promised Downtown Public Pier. AKA Bay St. Pier Park. It can happen now. The Public Trust on this issue has been crushed in this community. So how has the Civic council looked at this past promise?
Be concerned and keep score.
At the February 9, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting I had the pleasure of meeting Tera Meeks our new Division Chief of Waterfront Management & Programming for the City of Jacksonville. And I asked her if she would like to go kayaking on Hogans Creek and the sportier McCoys Creek under the TU. She said "yes." I'm one happy papoose.
Prior to meeting Miss Meeks it was a light meeting. Crescimbeni, Bishop and Redman were there from the city council. At one point Crescimbeni asked commission member Scott Shine about an update on the possibility of opening up alligator hunting in Duval county and he said that it could move forward. It would require legislation and for a council member to move the request forward. Crescimbeni in response to Shine alluded to a possible councilmember that has Sportsman in the name of his business that might want to do something. To be honest Don said something but I don't know if it was a yes or no.
During Public Comment I ran through my Christmas list that I would hope that even ones gets filled before Dec. The Christmas list is an inside joke that Crescimbeni made at a previous Waterways Commission meeting. I like Crescimbeni. Instead of FIX IT NOW lets HAVE IT NOW.
1. 2 years later and still seeking a sponsor for a pocket pier (floating dock) at a waterfront public access street end that I could take back to the Commissioners of FIND.
2. Still seeking legislation that would keep Bay St. Pier Park separate from the other 44 acres that was Shipyards/Landmar. What is the position of the Civic Council on this one? Everyone has had weak knees on this issue.
3. Does a concession agreement constitute a permanent business in the context of 2010-856 transient vendor ban as this community moves forward and utilizes our Preservation Parks?
After the meeting I had the opportunity to share some of these concerns with Tera. Kelley Boree who is usually at the meetings wasn't there. Neither was Jody McDaniel with a FIND update. Hope Jody is OK.
We are 39 days out from electing a new Mayor and city council. I welcomed Tera to Jacksonville but she is brand new and the learning curve is HUGE. My gut is telling me that we will be getting less access and economic opportunity not more unless legislation is introduced and passed. The OGC is aware of the issue.
Dan O'Byrne our new Director for Visit Jacksonville.
It will pain me if I will have to tell people Don't Visit Jacksonville. I want to be proud, confident, excited, motivated, supportive, charged, exuberant, in promoting our city and its Waterways.
I want to say VISIT JACKSONVILLE! VISIT OUR DOWNTOWN!
The highlight of the meeting was meeting Tera Meeks. She wasn't on the agenda. She happened to be there.
A Waterways meeting. Our Waterways. Our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Did anyone attend the Board meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance in Putnam county today?
To the special sub committee that was created by Denise Lee and the three chairs Bishop, Redman, and Crescimbeni and as a citizen volunteer appointed by Chairwoman Lee I can assure you that I am working hard and the information that is forthcoming expands outside the boundries of Duval county especially when it relates to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Will the Promised 680' Bay St. Pier Park be exempt as it relates to Waterway avtivities especially outside the control of an Independant Authority or will it be another vesion of SHIPYARDS III?
This needs to be a topic of discussion at the Political hobnob in less than 4 hours at the Hyatt in our vibrant Downtown. Everybody look out the window and ask how will access to our St. Johns River occur and for who?
This is a monstrous piece of legislation that will have major ramifications as it relates to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. Will councilwoman Lee, Redman, Crescimbeni, Bishop, offer an amendment at the next Rules committee meeting that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
The administration through Lisa Rinaman representing Duval county is working with the St. Johns River Alliance and the other counties of the 310 miles of our river to promote access and economic opportunity and not to restrict it.
Be concerned.
Who's next to paddle Hogans Creek within our Downtown Jacksonville Overlay Zoning District (2003-627). Call me 904-434-0839. We'll make it happen.
Who running in the May elections especially the At-Large races and want their campaign yard sign hanging on Robert's tent that 2010-856 will crush his dream for economic opportunity. Call him 904-485-0273. This is an active piece of legislation.
Today at Rules 2010-856 was deferred. The Public Trust continues to be absolutely crushed in this community.
9 days Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting. 9am council chambers open to the PUBLIC.
To the Honorable Don Redman, (Gaffney - Where is Springfield?)
Please introduce legislation that will keep the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier AKA Bay St. Pier Park, AKA Jacksonville's Front Porch.....Southern style separate from the other 40 plus acres that was Shipyards/Landmar.
Thank you.
To the Honorable Don Redman, (Gaffney- Where is Springfield?)
In 9 days at the Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting please address the concern about a one mile ban of a transient vendor ban for outfitters who want to participate in a possible, yet to be approved 310 mile state designation for a blueway paddling trail of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. The St. Johns River Alliance representing 12 other counties and the 34 Board members are concerned about this restrictive legislation. They are meeting the next day and Lisa Rinamon will be in a position to deliver a message to the SJRA.
Thank you.
Palms Creek Fish Camp.
The state of Florida is watching.
City council meeting tonight.
Will anything happen?
Jacksonville Waterway Commission meeting in 2 1/2 hours. Huge meeting. A direction of future River Issues.
Yesterday at Waterways it was a pleasure to see Doug Skiles and huge pats on the back for his comments at the end of the meeting during Public Comment.
It was a good meeting and continues to reinforce to me why the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier needs to be open and used now and an amendment needs to be attached to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
First up on the agenda was our St. Johns Riverkeeper Neil Armingeon and it was St. Johns River Issues. Before the meeting I asked him if he could mention the pier as an issue. It didn't happen.
He had 3 issues for the commission
1. Nutrient standards and the varied cost.
2. Georgia Pacific and the pipeline
3. Algae blooms-healthy river and how they will continue to work with agencies.
Next on the agenda was the real eye opener for me.
Moncrief Creek Dredging. Mike Swain president of the North Shore Neighborhood Association made a request for assistance for dredging in his neighborhood for waterfront residents. Over the years and seeing people go through the motions of the legislative process you can't help but sit in the audience and when the chair calls his name to come up to the podium and share your concern that you already know what the answer will be. Prior to the meeting I met Mike and I asked him how did you get on the agenda. He said that he had contacted John Crescimbeni and he put him on it. I like Crescimbeni.
Councilman Redman, Put me on the agenda. Better yet introduce legislation 2010-604 (Pier),2010-856.Please. Do something.
It was obvious that Mike had done his homework and contacted FIND and spoke with Mike Messiano the Duval county representative. A public access component wasn't close by so that limitted the opportunity for participation from FIND.
After his presentation one by one commission members shared with Mr. Swain that basically we can't do anything for you. Kristina Nelson with OGC mentioned 2010-725 and maybe you want to do a special assessment.
I've seen this repeated in previous meetings over the years. It reinforces that when you look at access issues how the most well intended and obvious requests can be crushed. So will this be the end for the North Shore Neighborhood Association? Pocket Parks-Pocket Piers?
During Public Comment I took a 3 issue approach like Neil
1. 2010-675 the USS Adams and a taxpayer bailout amendment. Tourism-A Good Idea
2. St. Johns River Alliance -They promote access and Preservation Parks in Duval county. Riverkeeper- Water quality.
3. 2010-856- Exempt the Waterways from a one mile ban. Shipyards III the pier needs to be separate. Use the River-Tourism a Good Idea.
Doug filled out a speaker card and shared his recent experiences Downtown on the River. Right before Doug there was another speaker that was also awesome and spoke about kayaking and access.
After the meeting I spoke with Don and Scott and all I can say is that I'm just in shock especially with the issue on the pier.
Palms Creek Fish Camp.
The state of Florida is watching.
QuoteI like Crescimbeni.
I second that.
QuoteAfter the meeting I spoke with Don and Scott
Did you try and schedule a meeting as we were promised?
Right now its a broken promise on the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier and the blame right now goes directly on the shoulder with a sling Redman sorry to hear that he had another cycling accident. He told me that at Waterways and Gaffney and the entire population of Dist.7.
The Public Trust just totally crushed in this community.
Quote from: Noone on April 14, 2011, 11:47:44 PM
Yesterday at Waterways it was a pleasure to see Doug Skiles and huge pats on the back for his comments at the end of the meeting during Public Comment.
It was a good meeting and continues to reinforce to me why the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier needs to be open and used now and an amendment needs to be attached to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
First up on the agenda was our St. Johns Riverkeeper Neil Armingeon and it was St. Johns River Issues. Before the meeting I asked him if he could mention the pier as an issue. It didn't happen.
He had 3 issues for the commission
1. Nutrient standards and the varied cost.
2. Georgia Pacific and the pipeline
3. Algae blooms-healthy river and how they will continue to work with agencies.
Next on the agenda was the real eye opener for me.
Moncrief Creek Dredging. Mike Swain president of the North Shore Neighborhood Association made a request for assistance for dredging in his neighborhood for waterfront residents. Over the years and seeing people go through the motions of the legislative process you can't help but sit in the audience and when the chair calls his name to come up to the podium and share your concern that you already know what the answer will be. Prior to the meeting I met Mike and I asked him how did you get on the agenda. He said that he had contacted John Crescimbeni and he put him on it. I like Crescimbeni.
Councilman Redman, Put me on the agenda. Better yet introduce legislation 2010-604 (Pier),2010-856.Please. Do something.
It was obvious that Mike had done his homework and contacted FIND and spoke with Mike Messiano the Duval county representative. A public access component wasn't close by so that limitted the opportunity for participation from FIND.
After his presentation one by one commission members shared with Mr. Swain that basically we can't do anything for you. Kristina Nelson with OGC mentioned 2010-725 and maybe you want to do a special assessment.
I've seen this repeated in previous meetings over the years. It reinforces that when you look at access issues how the most well intended and obvious requests can be crushed. So will this be the end for the North Shore Neighborhood Association? Pocket Parks-Pocket Piers?
During Public Comment I took a 3 issue approach like Neil
1. 2010-675 the USS Adams and a taxpayer bailout amendment. Tourism-A Good Idea
2. St. Johns River Alliance -They promote access and Preservation Parks in Duval county. Riverkeeper- Water quality.
3. 2010-856- Exempt the Waterways from a one mile ban. Shipyards III the pier needs to be separate. Use the River-Tourism a Good Idea.
Doug filled out a speaker card and shared his recent experiences Downtown on the River. Right before Doug there was another speaker that was also awesome and spoke about kayaking and access.
After the meeting I spoke with Don and Scott and all I can say is that I'm just in shock especially with the issue on the pier.
Palms Creek Fish Camp.
The state of Florida is watching.
Doug, I've got tremendous respect for you. And if its kayaking, I know I need to bring my A game. Can you share with everyone any thoughts on your first Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting?
16 days ago was the Board meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance representing 12 counties and the entire 310 miles of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. In 11 days will be the next meeting of our Jacksonville Waterways Commission.
The April meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance was sparsley attended. When I arrived Ebeneezer with the City of Jacksonville was giving the River Accord report to those in attendence. It was a fast presentation and before he left I was able to ask him about a status report about 2010-856 and how the transient vendor will impact outfitters especially in Duval county if the ban is extended to one mile in light of a potential state designation of a Blueway Paddling Trail. His response back was alarming and reinforces to me that if the people of Jacksonville think for one second we are getting more access and economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River we will be getting less.
Councilman Redman, Do something.
Councilman Gaffney, Do something.
The state of Florida is watching.
I'm doing something. I'm voting for Hogan.
Quote from: Noone on April 30, 2011, 06:40:45 AM
16 days ago was the Board meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance representing 12 counties and the entire 310 miles of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. In 11 days will be the next meeting of our Jacksonville Waterways Commission.
The April meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance was sparsley attended. When I arrived Ebeneezer with the City of Jacksonville was giving the River Accord report to those in attendence. It was a fast presentation and before he left I was able to ask him about a status report about 2010-856 and how the transient vendor will impact outfitters especially in Duval county if the ban is extended to one mile in light of a potential state designation of a Blueway Paddling Trail. His response back was alarming and reinforces to me that if the people of Jacksonville think for one second we are getting more access and economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River we will be getting less.
Councilman Redman, Do something.
Councilman Gaffney, Do something.
The state of Florida is watching.
I'm doing something. I'm voting for Hogan.
Redman and Gaffney don't even know the boundaries of their own districts. And Hogan makes both of them look like progressive geniuses. I'm sorry, but you're voting against yourself. I can't in good conscience continue to pay any attention to your posts on waterway access etc. anymore, when you're voting for the guy whose entire platform is eliminating public funding for the same programs you're on here supporting.
You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. You don't get to go all teabagger while still expecting public funding for things you personally enjoy, when the two are diametrically opposed to one another.
My comments here swerve off thread -I was intending to delete,however the discourse may expand on the entities and the growing sense of futility referenced Re: 2010 856.
I so admire Noone and note that he has singularly recently ushered many on to our Downtown waters.A visit on the water with Noone has become a campaign item 'must do' for some.
I have tended not to place much interest in Vendor 2010 856 but upon reviewing various meeting minutes regarding such-even FIND,I see that at the very least 856 could be part of the 'puzzle' Noone references in private conversation.
In all things Environmental Policy and Politics I have learned that a fellow preferred politician can and will disappoint.
We can never do one thing.
The likes of the Alliance and Waterways Commission can prove obtuse-like getting stuck waist deep in muck....and tide coming in.
It is rare but OK to share that unanticipated drowning feeling............
The outlook and advocacy of the Alliance is simply reflective of the member local governments so often 'joined at the hip' with ardent development interests and political pressures that have in fact contributed to River system stress.In this regard,the Alliance is "safe", not 'extremist','radical'.Creating or empowering anything more would not have been tolerated.
For example,the Alliance has been politically bound against restoration of the major tributary of the St Johns River,the Ocklawaha River,which would entail the removal of Rodman Dam.
Ocklawaha restoration will spurn diverse recreation rather than the image of 'destroying' the Rodman Pool as narrow interest Rodman advocates so successfully argue.
Euphoric references to "Everglades Style" St Johns River restoration without acknowledgement and empowerment of comprehensive "systems" approach to a major tributary ring hollow.Right on cue with our own collective furious Water Wars focus on evil central Florida's overgrowth without recognition of our own growth boosterism and accommodation,the details embedded within a curiously obscure narrative,the committed impacts simply currently unseen.
This is what we do best.
Quote from: stephendare on April 30, 2011, 01:43:30 PM
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on April 30, 2011, 09:02:43 AM
Quote from: Noone on April 30, 2011, 06:40:45 AM
16 days ago was the Board meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance representing 12 counties and the entire 310 miles of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. In 11 days will be the next meeting of our Jacksonville Waterways Commission.
The April meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance was sparsley attended. When I arrived Ebeneezer with the City of Jacksonville was giving the River Accord report to those in attendence. It was a fast presentation and before he left I was able to ask him about a status report about 2010-856 and how the transient vendor will impact outfitters especially in Duval county if the ban is extended to one mile in light of a potential state designation of a Blueway Paddling Trail. His response back was alarming and reinforces to me that if the people of Jacksonville think for one second we are getting more access and economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River we will be getting less.
Councilman Redman, Do something.
Councilman Gaffney, Do something.
The state of Florida is watching.
I'm doing something. I'm voting for Hogan.
Redman and Gaffney don't even know the boundaries of their own districts. And Hogan makes both of them look like progressive geniuses. I'm sorry, but you're voting against yourself. I can't in good conscience continue to pay any attention to your posts on waterway access etc. anymore, when you're voting for the guy whose entire platform is eliminating public funding for the same programs you're on here supporting.
You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. You don't get to go all teabagger while still expecting public funding for things you personally enjoy, when the two are diametrically opposed to one another.
+1
-1
Stephen, lets kayak Hogans Creek on Mon. or Tues. morning. I remember the invitation that you had at Boomtown and I went and you were very gracious. I extend the same to you.
I'm not looking to have my cake and eat it too. But rather where does everyone have a seat at the table. Its a big table and I want to make sure that Chris has a seat. Whats wrong with that?
Today at Rules and RCD 2010-856 was deferred. Saw Lori Boyer at both meetings and she is interested in seeing Hogan Creek. She is getting ready to lead in Dist.5
Noone, I'm genuinely curious - why are you voting for Hogan?
I'm asking because I haven't made a decision yet - neither candidate excites me, and I've heard the pro-Brown side from everyone else on the MetroJacksonville boards.
What do you think Hogan will do for the river, and for the public pier?
Bativac, Lets paddle Hogans Creek and I'll share my concerns. I just noticed two new pieces of legislation and I'm asking why aren't these in Waterways. 2011-239, 2011-240.
In 8 days is the next meeting of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission.
Look at my post of the last Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting 21 days ago. We now have 2011-234.
I'll expand on Hogan and the pier on another thread. Bativac, Have you ever been to a Waterways meeting?
Quote from: Bativac on May 03, 2011, 10:39:58 AM
Noone, I'm genuinely curious - why are you voting for Hogan?
I'm asking because I haven't made a decision yet - neither candidate excites me, and I've heard the pro-Brown side from everyone else on the MetroJacksonville boards.
What do you think Hogan will do for the river, and for the public pier?
Maybe he's figuring Hogan + Hogan's Creek? Lol...
Quote from: Noone on May 03, 2011, 01:50:44 PM
Bativac, Lets paddle Hogans Creek and I'll share my concerns. I just noticed two new pieces of legislation and I'm asking why aren't these in Waterways. 2011-239, 2011-240.
In 8 days is the next meeting of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission.
Look at my post of the last Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting 21 days ago. We now have 2011-234.
I'll expand on Hogan and the pier on another thread. Bativac, Have you ever been to a Waterways meeting?
I'd love to paddle the creek. My company handles disaster claims and with the recent storms in the Southeast, we're on permanent overtime. So I don't have time to paddle the creek anytime soon, nor have I had time to attend Waterways meetings (or local neighborhood watch meetings, city council meetings, etc - 60+ hour workweeks don't leave much spare time). But as soon as it lets up I'll shoot you an email.
Right now, though, I'd really like to hear about the positive effect that Mike Hogan could potentially have on the river, and on public access to the river via the public pier. Maybe it'll help me make a decision.
Bativac, I haven't ignored you. I'll share some posts on other threads that have made my decision of why I'm voting for Hogan.
They are incremental pieces of legislation that are making the decision for me as well as what is being said and whats not being said in key commission and committee meetings and also the slant on a report or study that has been done recently or in the past which is making the decision clear for me.
Bativac, More importantly I can't wait to meet you and paddle Hogan and Hogan creek. For the people an urban Waterway in Historic Springfield Dist.7 that leads to our St. Johns River an American Heritage River within our Downtown Jacksonville Overlay Zoning District. 2003-627.
Quote from: Noone on April 14, 2011, 11:47:44 PM
Yesterday at Waterways it was a pleasure to see Doug Skiles and huge pats on the back for his comments at the end of the meeting during Public Comment.
It was a good meeting and continues to reinforce to me why the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier needs to be open and used now and an amendment needs to be attached to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
First up on the agenda was our St. Johns Riverkeeper Neil Armingeon and it was St. Johns River Issues. Before the meeting I asked him if he could mention the pier as an issue. It didn't happen.
He had 3 issues for the commission
1. Nutrient standards and the varied cost.
2. Georgia Pacific and the pipeline
3. Algae blooms-healthy river and how they will continue to work with agencies.
Next on the agenda was the real eye opener for me.
Moncrief Creek Dredging. Mike Swain president of the North Shore Neighborhood Association made a request for assistance for dredging in his neighborhood for waterfront residents. Over the years and seeing people go through the motions of the legislative process you can't help but sit in the audience and when the chair calls his name to come up to the podium and share your concern that you already know what the answer will be. Prior to the meeting I met Mike and I asked him how did you get on the agenda. He said that he had contacted John Crescimbeni and he put him on it. I like Crescimbeni.
Councilman Redman, Put me on the agenda. Better yet introduce legislation 2010-604 (Pier),2010-856.Please. Do something.
It was obvious that Mike had done his homework and contacted FIND and spoke with Mike Messiano the Duval county representative. A public access component wasn't close by so that limitted the opportunity for participation from FIND.
After his presentation one by one commission members shared with Mr. Swain that basically we can't do anything for you. Councilman Redman did not speak at all. Kristina Nelson with OGC mentioned 2010-725 and maybe you want to do a special assessment.
I've seen this repeated in previous meetings over the years. It reinforces that when you look at access issues how the most well intended and obvious requests can be crushed. So will this be the end for the North Shore Neighborhood Association? Pocket Parks-Pocket Piers?
During Public Comment I took a 3 issue approach like Neil
1. 2010-675 the USS Adams and a taxpayer bailout amendment. Tourism-A Good Idea
2. St. Johns River Alliance -They promote access and Preservation Parks in Duval county. Riverkeeper- Water quality.
3. 2010-856- Exempt the Waterways from a one mile ban. Shipyards III the pier needs to be separate. Use the River-Tourism a Good Idea.
Doug filled out a speaker card and shared his recent experiences Downtown on the River. Right before Doug there was another speaker that was also awesome and spoke about kayaking and access.
After the meeting I spoke with Don and Scott and all I can say is that I'm just in shock especially with the issue on the pier.
Palms Creek Fish Camp.
The state of Florida is watching.
Bativac this is another reason why I'm voting for Mike Hogan for Mayor.
City council meeting in less than 24 hours. Anyone going?
Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting Wed. at 9 council chambers. Anyone going?
Two pieces of legislation were introduced April 26 and have been fast tracked in 14 days and can be voted on and approved by council in between a Jacksonville Waterways Commission cycle. What a joke.
2011-239-Ready for council
2011-240-ready for council
Back to back pieces of legislation. But they didn't come before Waterways. Look them up. The Public Trust has just been totally crushed and destroyed in this community.
Palms Creek Fish Camp- Who gets the promotion?
Who gets fired?
Bativac, more reasons why I'm voting Mike Hogan for Mayor.
The state of Florida is watching.
Be concerned and keep score.
So Noone;
http://www.youtube.com/v/PkfluJDVThk
Why don't you explain to me what crackpipe you're smoking? Your pet project is conservation of our urban waterways and the creation of the public pier, all of which are Downtown, and yet you're voting for the same guy who just released the above video explaining in detail how he won't spend a dime on anything Downtown. WTF?
Seriously, how about a rational explanation here?
By voting for Hogan, you're doing as much as anyone to ensure the ongoing decline and destruction by neglect of McCoys and Hogans Creeks, and you've just screwed yourself, and the rest of us, out of the public pier. So unless you are able to produce some rational explanation for your complete and total self-destructive contradictions, there is no reason why anyone on this site should pay one iota of attention to your pleas for assistance on the urban waterways or the pier issue. If you're going to vote for the guy whose entire platform is not spending a dime on any of this stuff, then you're participating in causing the very problem you complain of.
Chris, Take a deep breath. Relax. Legislation is the dialogue of the community. Did you look up 2011-239 and 240? Will they be pulled in two hours befor the city council meeting? I hope they are. Introduced April 26 and ready for council vote in 2 hours.
2010-856 and a transient vendor ban of 1 mile.
2010-675 and one finance amendment.
Chris would you like to go kayaking on Hogans Creek? We'll make it happen.
Quote from: Noone on May 09, 2011, 11:33:59 PM
Quote from: Noone on April 14, 2011, 11:47:44 PM
Yesterday at Waterways it was a pleasure to see Doug Skiles and huge pats on the back for his comments at the end of the meeting during Public Comment.
It was a good meeting and continues to reinforce to me why the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier needs to be open and used now and an amendment needs to be attached to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
First up on the agenda was our St. Johns Riverkeeper Neil Armingeon and it was St. Johns River Issues. Before the meeting I asked him if he could mention the pier as an issue. It didn't happen.
He had 3 issues for the commission
1. Nutrient standards and the varied cost.
2. Georgia Pacific and the pipeline
3. Algae blooms-healthy river and how they will continue to work with agencies.
Next on the agenda was the real eye opener for me.
Moncrief Creek Dredging. Mike Swain president of the North Shore Neighborhood Association made a request for assistance for dredging in his neighborhood for waterfront residents. Over the years and seeing people go through the motions of the legislative process you can't help but sit in the audience and when the chair calls his name to come up to the podium and share your concern that you already know what the answer will be. Prior to the meeting I met Mike and I asked him how did you get on the agenda. He said that he had contacted John Crescimbeni and he put him on it. I like Crescimbeni.
Councilman Redman, Put me on the agenda. Better yet introduce legislation 2010-604 (Pier),2010-856.Please. Do something.
It was obvious that Mike had done his homework and contacted FIND and spoke with Mike Messiano the Duval county representative. A public access component wasn't close by so that limitted the opportunity for participation from FIND.
After his presentation one by one commission members shared with Mr. Swain that basically we can't do anything for you. Councilman Redman did not speak at all. Kristina Nelson with OGC mentioned 2010-725 and maybe you want to do a special assessment.
I've seen this repeated in previous meetings over the years. It reinforces that when you look at access issues how the most well intended and obvious requests can be crushed. So will this be the end for the North Shore Neighborhood Association? Pocket Parks-Pocket Piers?
During Public Comment I took a 3 issue approach like Neil
1. 2010-675 the USS Adams and a taxpayer bailout amendment. Tourism-A Good Idea
2. St. Johns River Alliance -They promote access and Preservation Parks in Duval county. Riverkeeper- Water quality.
3. 2010-856- Exempt the Waterways from a one mile ban. Shipyards III the pier needs to be separate. Use the River-Tourism a Good Idea.
Doug filled out a speaker card and shared his recent experiences Downtown on the River. Right before Doug there was another speaker that was also awesome and spoke about kayaking and access.
After the meeting I spoke with Don and Scott and all I can say is that I'm just in shock especially with the issue on the pier.
Palms Creek Fish Camp.
The state of Florida is watching.
Bativac this is another reason why I'm voting for Mike Hogan for Mayor.
City council meeting in less than 24 hours. Anyone going?
Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting Wed. at 9 council chambers. Anyone going?
Two pieces of legislation were introduced April 26 and have been fast tracked in 14 days and can be voted on and approved by council in between a Jacksonville Waterways Commission cycle. What a joke.
2011-239-Ready for council
2011-240-ready for council
Back to back pieces of legislation. But they didn't come before Waterways. Look them up. The Public Trust has just been totally crushed and destroyed in this community.
Palms Creek Fish Camp- Who gets the promotion?
Who gets fired?
Bativac, more reasons why I'm voting Mike Hogan for Mayor.
The state of Florida is watching.
Be concerned and keep score.
Yesterday, the meeting of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission was HUGE.
2011-239
2011-240
2011-241
2011-242
2011-243
2011-244
2011-245
Bativac, and any other voters that are reading this and haven't voted yet these are more reasons why I'm voting for Mike Hogan as the next Mayor of Jacksonville.
The state of Florida is watching.
Be concerned and keep score.
Who's next? Anyone want to kayak Hogans Creek an urban Waterway destination in the heart of our vibrant Downtown?
noone: how much clearer can we make this? hogan has made no bones about his disinterest in spending a dime downtown.
(edited to remove the bit about the creek, because this isn't the thread about the creek--oops)
John Nooney has done more for the waterways of Jacksonville in the last decade outside anyone with a last name of Orthe or Armingeon.
He is at every waterways commission meeting and virtually every city council meeting. He has brought an impressive collection of city leaders(regardless of party position) out paddling on Hogans Creek. He has been a tireless promoter of public access to our waterways, which is an unimaginabely thankless task. His engagement with anyone standing in his path about waterway access is beyond reproach. If you don't agree with his choice for mayor, so be it.
But to tell a man that devotes untold hours to waterway issues that you aren't taking him seriously simply means you are squarely part of the problem, not the solution.
I am not a supporter of either person for mayor in this election. I want to emphasize that to the tenth degree. But to be fair, Mike Hogan has mentioned public access to waterways several times to sportsman groups over the course of this election. I haven't heard Alvin Brown say that. Perhaps he has and I just haven't heard it. If he has, perhaps someone can post that up. I did personally ask him once, and he said that we have to take a 'holistic approach' to downtown development... which didn't answer my question. We do in fact have something(Downtown Master Plan) and it specifically addresses the Hogans Greenbelt and public river access.
QuoteBut to be fair, Mike Hogan has mentioned public access to waterways several times to sportsman groups over the course of this election.
Perhaps you could specifiy what exactly he said regarding public access to waterways aside from just mentioning it.
He has made it quite clear in this election that he does not give a damn about downtown. I take that to include the tributiaries that run through it.
Quote from: fieldafm on May 12, 2011, 11:59:59 AM
John Nooney has done more for the waterways of Jacksonville in the last decade outside anyone with a last name of Orthe or Armingeon.
He is at every waterways commission meeting and virtually every city council meeting. He has brought an impressive collection of city leaders(regardless of party position) out paddling on Hogans Creek. He has been a tireless promoter of public access to our waterways, which is an unimaginabely thankless task. His engagement with anyone standing in his path about waterway access is beyond reproach. If you don't agree with his choice for mayor, so be it.
But to tell a man that devotes untold hours to waterway issues that you aren't taking him seriously simply means you are squarely part of the problem, not the solution.
I am not a supporter of either person for mayor in this election. I want to emphasize that to the tenth degree. But to be fair, Mike Hogan has mentioned public access to waterways several times to sportsman groups over the course of this election. I haven't heard Alvin Brown say that. Perhaps he has and I just haven't heard it. If he has, perhaps someone can post that up. I did personally ask him once, and he said that we have to take a 'holistic approach' to downtown development... which didn't answer my question. We do in fact have something(Downtown Master Plan) and it specifically addresses the Hogans Greenbelt and public river access.
Yes, the same downtown master plan Hogan slammed in his latest commercial, you mean?
Awesome! Makes total sense.
As for Noone, his voting philosophies do as much to harm his own cause as anything. Going to waterways meetings for public input sessions that are almost universally ignored is, while laudable on the basis of principal, hardly enough to make up for knowingly electing the candidate who plainly admitted he won't spend a dime on this stuff.
We need a political version of this;
QuoteNeed help? In the U.S., call 1-800-273-8255
National Suicide Prevention Lifeline
He has said one of his priorities would be more public access to waterways. He was on a sportsman radio show recently where he mentioned that if budget realities allowed, that more boat ramps and navigable dredging of tributaries leading to boat ramps(the Cedar River was mentioned) would be ideal. Families need more public access to enjoy the river, was a specific quote. He also mentioned the need for easier/better freshwater and saltwater fishing opportunities.
Again, not supporting Hogans efforts... nor Browns. Just telling you what I have heard him say. My opinion is that to hear Hogan say anything specific, at least makes your ears perk up b/c he wouldn't just mention something publicly without it actually be something that would be in his administration's purview.
I do not agree with Hogan's stance on downtown(well 70% of it anyway), in the interest of full disclosure.
QuoteGoing to waterways meetings for public input sessions that are almost universally ignored is, while laudable on the basis of principal, hardly enough to make up for knowingly electing the candidate who plainly admitted he won't spend a dime on this stuff.
How many city leaders have you engaged on the issue? How many city employees have you taken out for a tour of the urban waterways? How many times have you spoke to media people and gotten them to publish stories on waterway access? How many state leaders have you engaged on the issue?
Doing nothing but sitting back and complaining is not a solution.
Field, thanks for shedding a little light on why Noone seems to be blindly steadfast (does that make sense?) in his support of Mike Hogan. Noone I'd love to take you up on paddling Hogans Creek as soon as work lets up on the leash a little.
I think I agree with you, Field, in that I am not supporting either candidate at this point. I feel like my vote will be "against" one of the two versus "for" either guy, and I still haven't made up my mind. You've at least given me something else to consider.
Quote from: fieldafm on May 12, 2011, 12:18:11 PM
QuoteGoing to waterways meetings for public input sessions that are almost universally ignored is, while laudable on the basis of principal, hardly enough to make up for knowingly electing the candidate who plainly admitted he won't spend a dime on this stuff.
How many city leaders have you engaged on the issue? How many city employees have you taken out for a tour of the urban waterways? How many times have you spoke to media people and gotten them to publish stories on waterway access? How many state leaders have you engaged on the issue?
Doing nothing but sitting back and complaining is not a solution.
How many have you?
I'm not sitting back and complaining. I'm voting for Brown, specifically because Hogan stated he won't spend a dime on anything downtown, which would necessarily include the urban waterways Noone supports. This whole thing is silly.
QuoteAs for Noone, his voting philosophies do as much to harm his own cause as anything. Going to waterways meetings for public input sessions that are almost universally ignored is, while laudable on the basis of principal, hardly enough to make up for knowingly electing the candidate who plainly admitted he won't spend a dime on this stuff.
+1
Real change begins when we stop voting in the wrong people and voting in the right ones. We have an opportunity to do that this month. Hogan represents complacency and potential regression for our City. Is that what we want?
The May 11, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was another eye opener and how will it be reported to the people of Jacksonville.
Lets start with the April 13, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting minutes and my hats off to John J. Jackson with the Council Research Division that does an excellant job in capturing the minutes so we will be in compliance with the Sunshine in Florida.
At the meeting was John Crescimbeni,Bill Bishop,Don Redman all city council members. Commissioners included Gary Anderson, Lane Burnet, Caryn Carreiro, Edward Fleming, Scott Shine, Stephen Swann, OGC Kristina Nelson,Dr. Quinton White and Dr. Gerard Pinto with JU, Captain James Suber Waterways Coordinator, David Kaufman, Jaxport, Derek Busby,Geoffrey Sample with SJRWD, Gary Weise,, Dana Morton, Vince Seibold with Environmental Compliance Department, Neil Armingeon St. Johns Riverkeeper, Michael Swain, Susan Stewart, Ralph Hodges, Rob Winslow, W.T. Mauldin,JSO, Genevieve Fletcher, Doug Skiles, John Nooney, Tom Ingram, Joe Wilhelm with FNDR, Ron Littlepage with TU.
First up on the agenda was Edward Lukacovic PWS,Senior Environmental Planner, Planning & Development Department. He gave presentations on Land Use Amendments on
2011-242-
2011-243
2011-244
2011-245
2011-246
He did an excellant job and who is not going to vote no when it comes to Conservation.
As Mr. Lukacovic and other people that were with him were getting ready to leave Mr. Crescimbeni informed the Commission that a piece of legislation that was up for a Public hearing at the previous nights city council meeting was directed by council President Webb to be taken up the next day in Waterways and to councilman Crescimbeni's credit that is what he did. So a shout out to Mr. Lukacovic still in the audience brought him back up to the podium and the fireworks began.
The legislation is 2011-239 and they also took up 2011-240 which was not directed by council president Webb but being that it was just luck (or was it) and coincidence that you had the Planning Dept with their recommendations on these Land Use Amendments standing there.
I don't want to spoon feed everyone on these pieces of legislation but some of these pieces of legislation are abutting the National Parks, State Parks, Preservation Parks, Tera Meeks was there and spoke to some of the concerns that Commission members are now asking and scratching their heads. And that is a good thing. Remember Tera is brand new. Kelley Boree was absent as was Jody McDaniel are they retiring?
Palms Creek Fish Camp- Who deserves the promotion?
Who deserves to be fired? This is a disater and needs to be resolved before Hogan or Brown takes office. This wasn't discussed at Waterways but I'm throwing it out there.
But back to the thread 2010-856 and a one mile ban of a transient vendor. I'm a volunteer citizen on a committee reporting back to councilmembers Lee, Bishop, and my elected legislative representative Don Redman and the purpose of the committee is to seek amendments that will ultimately be attached to this still active piece of legislation.
Field, Thanks for the kind words. NM- Onward. That word just makes me think of Howard Solomon.
Looking forward to kayaking with you guys.
But just ask where will you be allowed to participate.
Ricker you still out there? The Jacksonville Marina Mile.
The next meeting of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission will be very interesting. We will have new leadership.
I pleaded with the Commission members to introduce legislation that would keep the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier separate. Shipyards III
I also reached out and invited each commisioner to paddle Hogans Creek.
The state of Florida is watching.
Be concerned and keep score.
Quote from: Bativac on May 12, 2011, 12:51:39 PM
Field, thanks for shedding a little light on why Noone seems to be blindly steadfast (does that make sense?) in his support of Mike Hogan. Noone I'd love to take you up on paddling Hogans Creek as soon as work lets up on the leash a little.
I think I agree with you, Field, in that I am not supporting either candidate at this point. I feel like my vote will be "against" one of the two versus "for" either guy, and I still haven't made up my mind. You've at least given me something else to consider.
Bativac, Give me a call 904-434-0839 and I'll share some more concerns that I have and why I'm supporting Hogan. Can't wait to take you on the water and you can tell me if we will be saying Visit Jacksonville!
I just wanted to take this time and finish the agenda of the May 11, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting. After the Land Use Amendments next on the agenda was Georgia-Pacific Pipeline Issues.
The Representative with the Florida Dept. of Environmental Protection had to cancel. Our St. Johns Riverkeeper Neil Armingeon was there and it was tabled. Neil during Public comment spoke about the recent approval of the permit that would allow JEA to draw down water from the aquifer. He mentioned that former Commission member Ed Grey would ask JEA to address the commission on certain issues and this would definitely have qualified.
Dr. Pinto indicated that they had seen 95 manatees in our local waters. That's cool.
The highlight of the meeting for me was the guest appearance by Vivian Harrell with Keep Jacksonville Beautiful. She gave a presentation about the March 19 city wide cleanup and mentioned Hogans Creek. A special shout out goes to Capt. Zissou, Peejayess, Mueller, Field, Keith Myers, Doug and Jacob Skiles, Lucas JJ. I feel like I'm missing someone. You guys really made it happen.
Congratulations to Mayor elect Alvin Brown.
City council meeting in 11 hours. Attended Ethics commission meeting yesterday and everyone should be concerned about two pieces of legislation making its way through council 2011- 167 and 2011-197. The federal conviction of Tony Nelson was mentioned at the meeting. Thats a plus. Restore the Public Trust. Its been destroyed.
2010-856 is still active and the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River needs to be exempt from this legislation.
DIA, DDA, DEA will it be DOA?
Tonight at council be concerned about
2011-239
2011-240
2011-241
2011-242
2011-243
2011-244
2011-245
2011-246
The state of Florida is watching.
At the May 24th Jacksonville city council meeting I had the opportunity to meet Mayor elect Alvin Brown and ask him if he would like to kayak Hogans Creek in the future. We were walking out of council chambers and he was heading to the elevators. He said to check with David Roman who was walking with him.
I hope it happens.
Quote from: Noone on May 29, 2011, 06:24:02 AM
At the May 24th Jacksonville city council meeting I had the opportunity to meet Mayor elect Alvin Brown and ask him if he would like to kayak Hogans Creek in the future. We were walking out of council chambers and he was heading to the elevators. He said to check with David Roman who was walking with him.
I hope it happens.
This is a great aspect of MJ,recounts of events,hallway conversations.
Noone you will likely make it happen.
please remind us of the names of those you have recently introduced to Hogans Creek;Council
members,candidates,Downtown boosters,even someone from Orlando I recall?
Make it happen?
I'm still waiting on my explanation of how Noone can with a straight face continue to expect anybody to take this seriously, given his teabagger political leanings and strong support of Mike Hogan, especially given what Hogan's buddy and endorser Rick Scott just managed to accomplish this week, namely vetoing the hard-fought $10mm that the legislature appropriated for the Saint Johns River restoration;
http://jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=533685
QuoteHe slashed $12 million in funding for the National Veteran’s Homeless Support Group, $10 million for the restoration of the St. Johns River and $6 million in economic aid for the Panhandle in the wake of the Deepwater Horizon oil disaster.
Meanwhile, Noone is on here daily crying about the River, while he runs around drumming up support for the causes of the same problems he complains of. When someone isn't willing to act with the courage of their own convictions, including on voting day, then I have no sympathy for their complaints after the fact. Stephen Dare and I have repeatedly pointed this out and asked him to rethink his position, which he ignored.
Thankfully, despite Noone's best efforts, Brown won the local election anyway. So, ironically, Noone might actually get some of the things he wants, despite himself. Unfortunately, that was too late to prevent his party screwing him, and the rest of us, out of the St. Johns River cleanup funds. Moving forward, I would again ask for a reasoned explanation of his political support for the same people causing the very problems he is asking the rest of us to participate in addressing, and/or a rethinking of his political position.
And, before Field and the rest of the silly "What have YOU done?" peanut gallery show up to claim that going on kayak rides while drumming up votes for the cause of the problem is somehow an effective solution, I should point out that this issue impacts me personally. I live directly on the St. Johns, and often wake up to a 2' high pile of rancid crap and bacterial foam built up on my seawall, plus whatever happens to get blown into my yard that I pick up. I've picked up more disgusting crap from the River than the rest of you silly weekend-warriors combined. It's disgusting;
(http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk137/chriswufgator/82c2b5cf.jpg)
And it's not like the rest of us have exactly kept silent about what was going to happen, have we?
So one more time; How can you support the cause of this ongoing problem, and then expect anyone to care about these calls to action that you post on MJ? I still cannot come close to understanding this contradiction.
For decades study after certified study identified Citizen concern and interest in The River and Environment.
And here we are!
What done happened??
Anybody going to the unveiling of the most recent JCCI study in 12 days? Its called Recession, Recovery, and Beyond. How will the river be addressed?
Stephen went by to see you yesterday on 8Th st. to talk to you about the demolition of the duplex next to Hogans Creek and the recent issue of a gator permit at the Maxwell House Plant, the trolley street car pole. Is it or isn't it. anyway, I hope the move is because you have already grown out of that space and need more.
Chris, Lets go kayaking on Hogans Creek. 904-721-3321 that's my home number, lets Make it Happen. I'm serious.
Our country is broke, our state is broke, our city is broke. Chris, I'll always remember sitting in a meeting and politicians throwing out numbers for various groups and just the magnitude and non chalont expectation that every group will get more of our taxpayer dollars and that the real work and effort that needs to happen. Won't.
The $10,000,000 for the river. I'll be honest I'm not exactly sure what the exact breakdown was for that. If you do and want to share it I'd like to know more. I keep coming back to the local issues. Want to put that $10,000,000 back for restoration? Start with Shipyards. Just our county alone got ripped off $36,500,000. That's taxpayer dollars gone and that was right on our river. We don't have to rip Scott lets rip ourselves for that one. Our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. And I'm not going to let it go. The taxpayers of Jacksonville got ripped off.
We don't have a funding crisis we have a spending crisis.
There are so many examples. The Public Trust has just been totally crushed in this community.
Chris, Help me with this one. Have you been to Hogans Creek? On May 13Th a demolition permit was issued for 627 Washington St. B11437138. The demolition to this 1959 concrete two story duplex with 1400 sq' and a $35,587 assessed value was totally gone. Perfectly legal and for what ever reason the owner decided to do it now. His money-His decision.
Lets now contrast that with Palms Creek Fish camp. I'm just generalizing right now but basically the city took this place over from someone. In a previous administration with people in different leadership roles and some private entity took it over and just recently the city shut them down. So what we now have is a situation where we will have a lawsuit. The city will pay the owners, OK WAG's can be made. I'm going to go with over a million bucks of taxpayer money and ultimately some 501-c will come in and save the day. Who deserves the promotion? Who deserves to be fired?
Remember this. 2010-856 is still an active piece of legislation and councilwoman Denise Lee is still seeking amendments that can be attached to 2010-856. One amendment should be to exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. Remember there is a public boat ramp component to this next door permanent structure.
2010-856 will be back in Rules in 4 hours. Should an amendment be attached that will exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River. Yes. Palms Creek Fish Camp.
Be concerned.
Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting in 4 hours. Will Don Redman do anything? With him there is a shopping list of legislative action that he has immediate control over but instead is ignoring and thus leading the conspiracy to defraud the people of Jacksonville to economic opportunity to our St. Johns River out American Heritage River.
I'm concerned.
The June 16, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was another reality presentation on why we may be telling the world "Don't Visit Jacksonville!"
2010-604-Shipyards/Landmar-Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier/Jacksonville's Downtown Tradeport Pier/ Bay St. Pier Park. Councilman Redman do something!
Going straight from the minutes of the May 11, 2011 minutes that are compiled by John Jackson with the council research Division who does an awesome job. In attendance John Crescimbeni (Chair) Bill Bishop (Vice Chair) Don Redman council members. Commissioners Gary Anderson, Lane Burnett, Caryn Carreiro, Scott Shine, Stephen Swann, Penny Thompson; State Representative Lake Ray; Asst General counsel Kristina Nelson; Dr. Quinton White, Dr.Gerard Pinto, JU; Capt. Jim Suber, Waterways Coordinator;Vince Siebold,Vivian Harrell, Environmental and Compliance Department; David Kaufman,Jaxport; Neil Armingeon, St. Johns Riverkeeper; Geoffrey Sample, STRWMD; Capt. Mike Getchell, Jacksonville Marine Transportation Exchange; Joe Wilhelm, Financial News & Daily Record; Ed Lukacovic, Gary Kresel, Planning&Development; Sharonda Davis, Jessica Stephens, Legislative Services Division.
1st on the agenda was the Georgia - Pacific Pipeline Issues.
2ND on the agenda and what the people of Jacksonville should be outraged about was another cherry picked piece of legislation that had a Waterways component and its just dumb luck that it was now before Waterways and another election cycle that every 4 years allows for the opportunity to just crush the Public Trust.
The ordinance is 2011-239. Ord closing&Abandoning Heritage River Rd. at request of Riverfront Associates,LLC upon dedication by Plat to city of a two lane access road bet Heckscher Dr. & Sisters Creek Joe Carlucci Boat Ramp & Park; waive sec 122.422 (Sale of property thru real estate div. investigation of need. council action)of chapter122 (Public property) ord. code Dist.11 Holt; Hodges,OGC (Req of Mayor) (CPAC letter of opposition on file)
Mike Saylor and Carl Salafrio, were there representing Riverfront Associates LLC
Also there at the meeting from start to finish of the almost 3 hour meeting was Edward Lukacovic with the COJ Planning and Development Department. He was never asked to come up to the podium to comment on the ordinance.
For the record I didn't see Tera Meeks or Kelley Boree. Jody McDaniel was there with a FIND update.
Speakers who filled out a speaker card were allowed to speak to the legislation. Chairman Crescimbeni gets props for allowing that.
At the previous Waterways meeting it was Mr. Lukacovic's testimony that was the primary reason why a follow up meeting was necessary. That's why I was surprised that he wasn't asked to come back up.
David Kaufman with Jaxport was called up to the podium.
The possibility that a potential Public Access component of this legislation could be lost for the people of Jacksonville was the primary reason that the Commission members voted against approval. It was going to TEU and I have no idea what happened at that meeting. Does Anyone?
During Public comment I again made my plea about the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier that was part of Shipyards/Landmar. I also commented on another cherry picked piece of legislation that was not before Waterways (WHY?) 2011-364 RAM and the 10 year lease for a buck a year. Mr. Crescimbeni asked me if I knew about the termination clause of 2011-364 and I said yes. Either party can terminate this agreement with 30 day notice.
So What? I didn't ask but wanted to say what about Palms Fish Camp. What about legislation for a 30 day notice with that disaster. Who is getting the promotion? Who will get fired for that $1,000,000 taxpayer bailout.
Remember 2010-675 the USS Adams didn't go before Waterways. (WHY?) One amendment.
It is my opinion that if you think for one second that we will be getting more Public Access and economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River we will be getting less.
Who's next?
Who wants to kayak Hogans Creek or go under the Times Union which is McCoys Creek, kayak under the Hyatt parking lot?
Special shout out to any news media outlet outside of Jacksonville.
Any commission members of FIND.
Anyone on the Jacksonville Waterways Commission.
Paul Anderson
Daniel O'Byrne
Stephen Joost
Tera Meeks
Governor Scott
Mayor elect Alvin Brown
Ron Littlepage
Roxy Tyler
Karen Brune Mathis
Steve Patterson
Joe Wilhelm
Richard Nunn we can wave to the camera when WJCT pans the river in the AM. If you can be at the beach you can be on the river. Lets Make it Happen.
Anyone want to start a 501-c?
2010-856 is still an active piece of legislation. Councilman Redman, Please offer an amendment that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Be concerned. I'm scared to death.
THis bill NEEDS an amendment. OR to be squashed, crushed and shredded.
HOW do bills related to our waterways...rephrase- WATERWAYS NEEDS BIGGER REACH!
300' is where the limit stands now?
I say reduce it to 125' certainly do not extend it to 1000'!
We neeed to live in a walkable world as consumers.
maybe oneday.
This bill is crappy legislation.
Seems designed to eliminate the economic potential for any of us small business minded entrepreneurial folks.
We ALL need free public access to our waterways.
Once upon a time, these were our thoroughfares.
Noone is NOT a smoke blower, folks!
He is genuinely concerned because he may know more than you do.
thiink about it. \zoom out/
Who wins if this goes through?
If you want to open a kayak rental business and you operate out of a van/trailer?
Does this bill affect mobile food trucks?
Everything?
hot dog carts?
I need to learn more fill out my 3minute speaker card!
Shortly we will be telling the world
Visit Jacksonville or
Don't Visit Jacksonville
I support Downtown.
I support economic opportunity for everyone.
I oppose legislative oppression.
There are 66 other counties in Florida.
It is painful to tell the commissioners of FIND that you are not allowed to participate especially when talking about our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Councilman Redman offer an amendment to exempt the Waterways.
Food Truck Craze
Kayak Craze
Cycling Craze
Bring it on for Downtown and around the city.
Lets Get to Work.
Tea Party or Environmentalists should take note that if this trash continues to effect our river, walking on water will not be a miracle in Jacksonville!
OCKLAWAHA
Any news if this was addressed in committee meetings?
Be concerned.
Counties outside of Duval county are shaking their head.
Quote from: Noone on May 13, 2011, 07:06:51 AM
The May 11, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was another eye opener and how will it be reported to the people of Jacksonville.
Lets start with the April 13, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting minutes and my hats off to John J. Jackson with the Council Research Division that does an ex cellant job in capturing the minutes so we will be in compliance with the Sunshine in Florida.
At the meeting was John Crescimbeni,Bill Bishop,Don Redman all city council members. Commissioners included Gary Anderson, Lane Burnet, Caryn Carreiro, Edward Fleming, Scott Shine, Stephen Swann, OGC Kristina Nelson,Dr. Quinton White and Dr. Gerard Pinto with JU, Captain James Suber Waterways Coordinator, David Kaufman, Jaxport, Derek Busby,Geoffrey Sample with SJRWD, Gary Weise,, Dana Morton, Vince Seibold with Environmental Compliance Department, Neil Armingeon St. Johns Riverkeeper, Michael Swain, Susan Stewart, Ralph Hodges, Rob Winslow, W.T. Mauldin,JSO, Genevieve Fletcher, Doug Skiles, John Nooney, Tom Ingram, Joe Wilhelm with FNDR, Ron Littlepage with TU.
First up on the agenda was Edward Lukacovic PWS,Senior Environmental Planner, Planning & Development Department. He gave presentations on Land Use Amendments on
2011-242-
2011-243
2011-244
2011-245
2011-246
He did an ex cellant job and who is not going to vote no when it comes to Conservation.
As Mr. Lukacovic and other people that were with him were getting ready to leave Mr. Crescimbeni informed the Commission that a piece of legislation that was up for a Public hearing at the previous nights city council meeting was directed by council President Webb to be taken up the next day in Waterways and to councilman Crescimbeni's credit that is what he did. So a shout out to Mr. Lukacovic still in the audience brought him back up to the podium and the fireworks began.
The legislation is 2011-239 and they also took up 2011-240 which was not directed by council president Webb but being that it was just luck (or was it) and coincidence that you had the Planning Dept with their recommendations on these Land Use Amendments standing there.
I don't want to spoon feed everyone on these pieces of legislation but some of these pieces of legislation are abutting the National Parks, State Parks, Preservation Parks, Tera Meeks was there and spoke to some of the concerns that Commission members are now asking and scratching their heads. And that is a good thing. Remember Tera is brand new. Kelley Boree was absent as was Jody McDaniel are they retiring?
Palms Creek Fish Camp- Who deserves the promotion?
Who deserves to be fired? This is a disater and needs to be resolved before Hogan or Brown takes office. This wasn't discussed at Waterways but I'm throwing it out there.
But back to the thread 2010-856 and a one mile ban of a transient vendor. I'm a volunteer citizen on a committee reporting back to councilmembers Lee, Bishop, and my elected legislative representative Don Redman and the purpose of the committee is to seek amendments that will ultimately be attached to this still active piece of legislation.
Field, Thanks for the kind words. NM- Onward. That word just makes me think of Howard Solomon.
Looking forward to kayaking with you guys.
But just ask where will you be allowed to participate.
Ricker you still out there? The Jacksonville Marina Mile.
The next meeting of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission will be very interesting. We will have new leadership.
I pleaded with the Commission members to introduce legislation that would keep the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier separate. Shipyards III
I also reached out and invited each commissioner to paddle Hogans Creek.
The state of Florida is watching.
Be concerned and keep score.
Just saw on the COJ website that 2010-856 is ready for council. I've tried to contact my city councilman Don Redman numerous times who is single handidly in my opinion leading the conspiracy to deny the people of Jacksonville and the state of Florida to Public Access and Economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
The total destruction of the Public Trust under the new eyes and ears of the new administration and city council will be gut wrenching to watch.
2010-856 was never before Waterways. There wasn't a Waterways meeting in July. I did attend and spoke with some of the commissioners of FIND last week and shared with them an update how the Public Trust is being just destroyed in Jacksonville. Do the counties of the St. Johns River Alliance have a transient 1 mile vendor ban for their waterways of an American Heritage River?
Councilwoman Lee when she was chair of Rules was looking for amendments to attach to 2010-856. Was an amendment to exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River attached to this legislation? Councilman Redman has totally ignored my emails.
Councilman Redman is the new chair of Waterways. Next meeting is August 10, 9:30 council chambers. New council members should be absolutely outraged as well as Mayor Brown if an amendment to exempt the Waterways isn't attached. Council President Joost should send it to Waterways he has the power and authority to do so.
Palms Fish Camp, Palms Fish Camp, Palms Fish Camp,
SHIPYARDS,SHIPYARDS,SHIPYARDS
LANDMAR,LANDMAR,LANDMAR,
JAXUSA,JAXUSA,JAXUSA
JCCI-Recession, Recovery, and Beyond
VISIT JACKSONVILLE?
or
Don't VISIT JACKSONVILLE?
The entire state of FLORIDA is watching
Be concerned.
City council meeting tonight. Waterways meeting Wend. at 9:30 council chambers. Just heard 3 days ago on the radio of a watercraft ban for Simpsons Creek. Has this been in Waterways? Does anybody care? Where was this on the radar?
Quote from: Noone on June 22, 2011, 01:34:22 AM
The June 16, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was another reality presentation on why we may be telling the world "Don't Visit Jacksonville!"
2010-604-Shipyards/Landmar-Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier/Jacksonville's Downtown Tradeport Pier/ Bay St. Pier Park. Councilman Redman do something!
Going straight from the minutes of the May 11, 2011 minutes that are compiled by John Jackson with the council research Division who does an awesome job. In attendance John Crescimbeni (Chair) Bill Bishop (Vice Chair) Don Redman council members. Commissioners Gary Anderson, Lane Burnett, Caryn Carreiro, Scott Shine, Stephen Swann, Penny Thompson; State Representative Lake Ray; Asst General counsel Kristina Nelson; Dr. Quinton White, Dr.Gerard Pinto, JU; Capt. Jim Suber, Waterways Coordinator;Vince Siebold,Vivian Harrell, Environmental and Compliance Department; David Kaufman,Jaxport; Neil Armingeon, St. Johns Riverkeeper; Geoffrey Sample, STRWMD; Capt. Mike Getchell, Jacksonville Marine Transportation Exchange; Joe Wilhelm, Financial News & Daily Record; Ed Lukacovic, Gary Kresel, Planning&Development; Sharonda Davis, Jessica Stephens, Legislative Services Division.
1st on the agenda was the Georgia - Pacific Pipeline Issues.
2ND on the agenda and what the people of Jacksonville should be outraged about was another cherry picked piece of legislation that had a Waterways component and its just dumb luck that it was now before Waterways and another election cycle that every 4 years allows for the opportunity to just crush the Public Trust.
The ordinance is 2011-239. Ord closing&Abandoning Heritage River Rd. at request of Riverfront Associates,LLC upon dedication by Plat to city of a two lane access road bet Heckscher Dr. & Sisters Creek Joe Carlucci Boat Ramp & Park; waive sec 122.422 (Sale of property thru real estate div. investigation of need. council action)of chapter122 (Public property) ord. code Dist.11 Holt; Hodges,OGC (Req of Mayor) (CPAC letter of opposition on file)
Mike Saylor and Carl Salafrio, were there representing Riverfront Associates LLC
Also there at the meeting from start to finish of the almost 3 hour meeting was Edward Lukacovic with the COJ Planning and Development Department. He was never asked to come up to the podium to comment on the ordinance.
For the record I didn't see Tera Meeks or Kelley Boree. Jody McDaniel was there with a FIND update.
Speakers who filled out a speaker card were allowed to speak to the legislation. Chairman Crescimbeni gets props for allowing that.
At the previous Waterways meeting it was Mr. Lukacovic's testimony that was the primary reason why a follow up meeting was necessary. That's why I was surprised that he wasn't asked to come back up.
David Kaufman with Jaxport was called up to the podium.
The possibility that a potential Public Access component of this legislation could be lost for the people of Jacksonville was the primary reason that the Commission members voted against approval. It was going to TEU and I have no idea what happened at that meeting. Does Anyone?
During Public comment I again made my plea about the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier that was part of Shipyards/Landmar. I also commented on another cherry picked piece of legislation that was not before Waterways (WHY?) 2011-364 RAM and the 10 year lease for a buck a year. Mr. Crescimbeni asked me if I knew about the termination clause of 2011-364 and I said yes. Either party can terminate this agreement with 30 day notice.
So What? I didn't ask but wanted to say what about Palms Fish Camp. What about legislation for a 30 day notice with that disaster. Who is getting the promotion? Who will get fired for that $1,000,000 taxpayer bailout.
Remember 2010-675 the USS Adams didn't go before Waterways. (WHY?) One amendment.
It is my opinion that if you think for one second that we will be getting more Public Access and economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River we will be getting less.
Who's next?
Who wants to kayak Hogans Creek or go under the Times Union which is McCoys Creek, kayak under the Hyatt parking lot?
Special shout out to any news media outlet outside of Jacksonville.
Any commission members of FIND.
Anyone on the Jacksonville Waterways Commission.
Paul Anderson
Daniel O'Byrne
Stephen Joost
Tera Meeks
Governor Scott
Mayor elect Alvin Brown
Ron Littlepage
Roxy Tyler
Karen Brune Mathis
Steve Patterson
Joe Wilhelm
Richard Nunn we can wave to the camera when WJCT pans the river in the AM. If you can be at the beach you can be on the river. Lets Make it Happen.
Anyone want to start a 501-c?
2010-856 is still an active piece of legislation. Councilman Redman, Please offer an amendment that would exempt the Waterways of our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Be concerned. I'm scared to death.
The August 10, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting will have us all telling our Regional Partners.......Don't Visit Jacksonville!
Why wasn't there a Waterways Commission meeting in July? So cherry picked pieces of legislation could then be voted on by our city council and passed and then would not have to make it through another JWC cycle. Just destroy the Public Trust.
I'll have more on the meeting.
Shipyards III is happening.
Quote from: Noone on August 09, 2011, 07:14:10 AM
City council meeting tonight. Waterways meeting Wend. at 9:30 council chambers. Just heard 3 days ago on the radio of a watercraft ban for Simpsons Creek. Has this been in Waterways? Does anybody care? Where was this on the radar?
My understanding is that there is an effort underway to designate Simpsons Creek as a 'no wake zone.' I have no details or info, this is just what I've heard.
18 days ago was the August 10, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting and if you were there and heard the concerns and testimony of the commission members then being a resident of Duval County and a citizen of the United States in the state of Florida you would be left with two thoughts.
1. DON'T VISIT JACKSONVILLE!
2. WTF...... Wheres The Freedom?
Going straight from the minutes of the June 15, 2011 JWC meeting. In attendance Council members John Crescimbeni Chair; Bill Bishop Vice chair; Don Redman; Commission members Lane T Burnett; Gary Anderson; Caryn Carreiro; Edward Fleming Jr.; Raymond Pringle; Scott Shine; Stephen Swann; Commissioner Penny Thomson was excused. Kristina Nelson OGC; Dr. Quinton White and Dr. Gerard Pinto Jacksonville University; Capt. Jim Suber Waterways Coordinator; Jessica Stephens Legislative Assistant; John J. Jackson Research Assistant; Dana Morton; Vince Seibold; Patricia Gee-Jones Environmental & Compliance Department; John Jones Public Works Dept; Jody McDaniel Planning and Development Dept; Geoffrey Sample SJRWMD; David Kaufman Jaxport; Joe Wilhelm; Financial News & Dailey Record; Ron Littlepage, Steve Patterson Florida Times Union; Capt. Michael Getchell Jacksonville Marine Transportation Exchange; Lad Daniels First Coast Manufactures Assoc; Neil Armingeon St Johns Riverkeeper; Traylor Champion; Mike Curtis Georgia Pacific; Michael Saylor; Carl Salafrio; Rick Haskew Riverfront Assoc.; John Nooney; Browne C Altmen; Fran Beach; Janet Pringle; Don Moore; Marc Hardesty; Kim Kendall; Joseph Moore.
So after 60 days there was only one item on the agenda. Remember there wasn't a Waterways meeting in July. The one item on the agenda was 2011-447 which was funding from FIND for an upcoming cleanup.
The true fireworks began with New Business. It started with Commissioner Scott Shine saying that he had a citizen concern, complaint, inquiry as to the status of commission member Fred Engness who has missed 9 meetings in a row. Other members were also concerned and the Commission voted unanimously to have him removed from Waterways and so there is an opening on Waterways.
Commissioner Lane Burnett was next under new business and he shared with everyone that he also had a citizen concern, inquiry, complaint as to why nobody can use the new Floating dock at RAM. Discussion between members and Capt Jim Suber Waterways Coordinator ultimately revealed that it can be only used when RAM was opened and no other time. WOW!
Another citizen concern, complaint, inquiry was brought to the concern of the commission and in fact he had filled out a speaker card and even though it wasn't on the agenda was asked to come up to the podium by new chair Don Redman. It was a decision of the chair and I can understand being new and wanting the guest to be welcome and sympathetic to a concern of a citizen.
So now its time for Comments from the Public. As my name is called and before I even get to the podium is the concern of the new chair Don Redman to make sure the 3 minute clock is on and working before I arrive to the podium. My entire presentation on what I had wanted to share with the commission members has changed especially after listening to citizen innitiated concerns.
Why have mine been ignored?
Anyway I mention to Mr. Burnett That 2011-364 RAM is an active piece of legislation and this commission can ask that they are seeking a 30 year deal for a buck a year and that you would not be out of line at all to request that this piece of legislation should be brought to your attention. You were blown off before so maybe now someone will make it right.
Another piece of cherry picked legislation 2011-239 and I just read right from the minutes of the last meeting that you guys all had concerns and you voted 9-0 to deny. Well you know what. The council voted and the legislation passed so in your face that it never came back before this commission to know if your concerns have been addressed. My understanding is that they have 5 years and given that time period every council member will be out of office and who knows who will be the new players. Remember there wasn't a July JWC meeting.
I finally get to my concern about the former Shipyards/Landmar and the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier and this citizen concern, inquiry, complaint and then an exhuberant with one of the biggest smiles on his face was chairman Redman telling me that my time was up. Stop. Don't say anything else. Your time is up.
If our own members of The Jacksonville Waterways Commission can be kept in the total dark to back door legislative pieces of legislation you can only continue to appreciate the magnitude of how Public Access and Economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River will not happen in Jacksonville.
Be concerned. I'm scared to death.
Who's next?
Who wants to kayak Downtown and experience unique Urban Waterway Destinations?
At least three minute allotment is plenty of time to establish legal standing if needed and that is about the only cause for attending,although I see from the attendance list many must attend out of habit.
Thank you Noone for your efforts and sharing here.
You would make a great Waterways Commission member.
What was the vision,enabling legislation that created the Waterways Commission?
What are the accomplishments,challenges ?
Fairly recently there were discussions of the need to expand the role,'power' of the Commission.What's up with that?
How much longer would have the chronic absentee member situation gone on had it not been for citizen inquiry?
Does the Commission presence enhance State FIND support?? Effective River Advocacy?
Noone,please share with us the gist of your conversations,interaction with State FIND persons.
Thanks NM,
I can't wait for our next trip. Especially the menu.
Quote from: Noone on August 28, 2011, 05:20:14 AM
Thanks NM,
I can't wait for our next trip. Especially the menu.
JUWSL
Jacksonville Urban Waterway Shore Lunch
In the great Guide Shore Lunch tradition!
(note: NM 4:10 am post above has been expanded)
The Board meeting of Downtown Vision on Wend. 8/24 was off the charts. Today's FIND subcommittee meeting was AWESOME! Anyone want to kayak Downtown? Anyone want to join me for an ACA American Canoe Association class on 9/17, 9/18? PM me we'll Make it happen
a blurb that I copied from FB today....
QuoteThe Bearded Pig
another fun fact..we are working on BBQ food carts in downtown Boston and throughout Cambridge. Also a food truck is in the works. Are hoping to use the truck in and around town and at events like, The Thing in the Spring and *broke: The Affordable Arts Fair!
I wonder if I'll ever get these from a LOCAL place?
Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting in 5 1/2 hours. Huge announcements coming. Will bring up 2011-560 Shipyards/Landmar $23,250,000 as a FIND funding source.
Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting in 8 1/2 hours in council chambers. Don Redman is the chair of Waterways and my elected legislative representative and I'll be asking and writing on the speaker card that the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier that was Shipyards/Landmar 2010-604, 2011-560 be a FIND project that can attach a kayak or canoe launch on the pier. Safety would be the number one reason next to access.
Be concerned. The Public Trust is being totally crushed in this community.
Quote from: Noone on May 13, 2011, 07:06:51 AM
The May 11, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was another eye opener and how will it be reported to the people of Jacksonville.
Lets start with the April 13, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting minutes and my hats off to John J. Jackson with the Council Research Division that does an excellent job in capturing the minutes so we will be in compliance with the Sunshine in Florida.
At the meeting was John Crescimbeni,Bill Bishop,Don Redman all city council members. Commissioners included Gary Anderson, Lane Burnet, Caryn Carreiro, Edward Fleming, Scott Shine, Stephen Swann, OGC Kristina Nelson,Dr. Quinton White and Dr. Gerard Pinto with JU, Captain James Suber Waterways Coordinator, David Kaufman, Jaxport, Derek Busby,Geoffrey Sample with SJRWD, Gary Weise,, Dana Morton, Vince Seibold with Environmental Compliance Department, Neil Armingeon St. Johns Riverkeeper, Michael Swain, Susan Stewart, Ralph Hodges, Rob Winslow, W.T. Mauldin,JSO, Genevieve Fletcher, Doug Skiles, John Nooney, Tom Ingram, Joe Wilhelm with FNDR, Ron Littlepage with TU.
First up on the agenda was Edward Lukacovic PWS,Senior Environmental Planner, Planning & Development Department. He gave presentations on Land Use Amendments on
2011-242-
2011-243
2011-244
2011-245
2011-246
He did an excellent job and who is not going to vote no when it comes to Conservation.
As Mr. Lukacovic and other people that were with him were getting ready to leave Mr. Crescimbeni informed the Commission that a piece of legislation that was up for a Public hearing at the previous nights city council meeting was directed by council President Webb to be taken up the next day in Waterways and to councilman Crescimbeni's credit that is what he did. So a shout out to Mr. Lukacovic still in the audience brought him back up to the podium and the fireworks began.
The legislation is 2011-239 and they also took up 2011-240 which was not directed by council president Webb but being that it was just luck (or was it) and coincidence that you had the Planning Dept with their recommendations on these Land Use Amendments standing there.
I don't want to spoon feed everyone on these pieces of legislation but some of these pieces of legislation are abutting the National Parks, State Parks, Preservation Parks, Tera Meeks was there and spoke to some of the concerns that Commission members are now asking and scratching their heads. And that is a good thing. Remember Tera is brand new. Kelley Boree was absent as was Jody McDaniel are they retiring?
Palms Creek Fish Camp- Who deserves the promotion?
Who deserves to be fired? This is a disater and needs to be resolved before Hogan or Brown takes office. This wasn't discussed at Waterways but I'm throwing it out there.
But back to the thread 2010-856 and a one mile ban of a transient vendor. I'm a volunteer citizen on a committee reporting back to councilmembers Lee, Bishop, and my elected legislative representative Don Redman and the purpose of the committee is to seek amendments that will ultimately be attached to this still active piece of legislation.
Field, Thanks for the kind words. NM- Onward. That word just makes me think of Howard Solomon.
Looking forward to kayaking with you guys.
But just ask where will you be allowed to participate.
Ricker you still out there? The Jacksonville Marina Mile.
The next meeting of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission will be very interesting. We will have new leadership.
I pleaded with the Commission members to introduce legislation that would keep the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier separate. Shipyards III
I also reached out and invited each commissioner to paddle Hogans Creek.
The state of Florida is watching.
Be concerned and keep score.
Ock, Lake, Doug, Field, Ricker, North Miami and anyone else that is interested in Public Access and Economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River a Federal Initiative this is the meeting that 2011-246 Goodby's Creek was put into Conversation. Again some pieces of legislation was cherry picked.
Councilwoman Boyer Dist.5 can open an account and when the match is met by private funds then you can approach FIND for the other match. Any council member can do this.
Redman Dist.4 can do this with the SHIPYARDS III PIER. Holmesdale Ave. or Palmer Terrace Park.
Councilman Love Dist.14 can also do something immediately for the Jacksonville Marina Mile.
Palms Fish Camp??? Anyone.
Quote from: Noone on December 13, 2010, 08:58:43 PM
Today at the St. Johns River Alliance meeting there is discussion of a Paddling Trail of the St. Johns River Blueway. I took the opportunity to make the other 12 counties aware of 2010-856 and the transient ban and asked if other counties have a ban if a transient kayak trailer showed up. The Duval county representative made the members aware of Duval counties pending legislation.
After the meeting other county members were shaking there heads.
Lisa Rinamen showed up after the presentation and I told her that I mentioned 2010-856. She asked me if I spoke with councilman Webb and Redman. On the way back from Palatka I called and left a message for both Webb and Redman. I'll let everyone know if I get a response back. Be concerned.
Who is the new representative that will represent Jacksonville at the Nov. 17 Board meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance in Taverres Florida from 1-3. If anyone wants to go I'll pay for the gas and treat you to Robert's Eatery. If the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier is not legislatively addressed at city council with redistricting tonight 2011-554 or it is not included in the FIND list that will be considered at the Nov. 9, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission then I hope everyone will consider writing and supporting a resolution to address the Pier in Jacksonville so we can all promote and celebrate our St. Johns River our American Heritage River a Federal Initiative.
Be concerned
Quote from: Noone on August 28, 2011, 03:43:08 AM
18 days ago was the August 10, 2011 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting and if you were there and heard the concerns and testimony of the commission members then being a resident of Duval County and a citizen of the United States in the state of Florida you would be left with two thoughts.
1. DON'T VISIT JACKSONVILLE!
2. WTF...... Wheres The Freedom?
Going straight from the minutes of the June 15, 2011 JWC meeting. In attendance Council members John Crescimbeni Chair; Bill Bishop Vice chair; Don Redman; Commission members Lane T Burnett; Gary Anderson; Caryn Carreiro; Edward Fleming Jr.; Raymond Pringle; Scott Shine; Stephen Swann; Commissioner Penny Thomson was excused. Kristina Nelson OGC; Dr. Quinton White and Dr. Gerard Pinto Jacksonville University; Capt. Jim Suber Waterways Coordinator; Jessica Stephens Legislative Assistant; John J. Jackson Research Assistant; Dana Morton; Vince Seibold; Patricia Gee-Jones Environmental & Compliance Department; John Jones Public Works Dept; Jody McDaniel Planning and Development Dept; Geoffrey Sample SJRWMD; David Kaufman Jaxport; Joe Wilhelm; Financial News & Dailey Record; Ron Littlepage, Steve Patterson Florida Times Union; Capt. Michael Getchell Jacksonville Marine Transportation Exchange; Lad Daniels First Coast Manufactures Assoc; Neil Armingeon St Johns Riverkeeper; Traylor Champion; Mike Curtis Georgia Pacific; Michael Saylor; Carl Salafrio; Rick Haskew Riverfront Assoc.; John Nooney; Browne C Altmen; Fran Beach; Janet Pringle; Don Moore; Marc Hardesty; Kim Kendall; Joseph Moore.
So after 60 days there was only one item on the agenda. Remember there wasn't a Waterways meeting in July. The one item on the agenda was 2011-447 which was funding from FIND for an upcoming cleanup.
The true fireworks began with New Business. It started with Commissioner Scott Shine saying that he had a citizen concern, complaint, inquiry as to the status of commission member Fred Engness who has missed 9 meetings in a row. Other members were also concerned and the Commission voted unanimously to have him removed from Waterways and so there is an opening on Waterways.
Commissioner Lane Burnett was next under new business and he shared with everyone that he also had a citizen concern, inquiry, complaint as to why nobody can use the new Floating dock at RAM. Discussion between members and Capt Jim Suber Waterways Coordinator ultimately revealed that it can be only used when RAM was opened and no other time. WOW!
Another citizen concern, complaint, inquiry was brought to the concern of the commission and in fact he had filled out a speaker card and even though it wasn't on the agenda was asked to come up to the podium by new chair Don Redman. It was a decision of the chair and I can understand being new and wanting the guest to be welcome and sympathetic to a concern of a citizen.
So now its time for Comments from the Public. As my name is called and before I even get to the podium is the concern of the new chair Don Redman to make sure the 3 minute clock is on and working before I arrive to the podium. My entire presentation on what I had wanted to share with the commission members has changed especially after listening to citizen innitiated concerns.
Why have mine been ignored?
Anyway I mention to Mr. Burnett That 2011-364 RAM is an active piece of legislation and this commission can ask that they are seeking a 30 year deal for a buck a year and that you would not be out of line at all to request that this piece of legislation should be brought to your attention. You were blown off before so maybe now someone will make it right.
Another piece of cherry picked legislation 2011-239 and I just read right from the minutes of the last meeting that you guys all had concerns and you voted 9-0 to deny. Well you know what. The council voted and the legislation passed so in your face that it never came back before this commission to know if your concerns have been addressed. My understanding is that they have 5 years and given that time period every council member will be out of office and who knows who will be the new players. Remember there wasn't a July JWC meeting.
I finally get to my concern about the former Shipyards/Landmar and the Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier and this citizen concern, inquiry, complaint and then an exuberant with one of the biggest smiles on his face was chairman Redman telling me that my time was up. Stop. Don't say anything else. Your time is up.
If our own members of The Jacksonville Waterways Commission can be kept in the total dark to back door legislative pieces of legislation you can only continue to appreciate the magnitude of how Public Access and Economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River will not happen in Jacksonville.
Be concerned. I'm scared to death.
Who's next?
Who wants to kayak Downtown and experience unique Urban Waterway Destinations?
2010-856 was part of the discussion at last years St. Johns River Alliance Board meeting. The legislation was withdrawn. watch it come back. Next meeting of the St. Johns River Alliance Nov. 17 1-3pm Taverres, Florida.
The Promised 680' Downtown Public Pier needs to be outside the control of a yet to be created Downtown Independent Authority and after the last Jacksonville Waterways committee meeting the decision for this to happen according to my city councilman Don Redman will be permission from Suzanne Jenkins and Ginny Myrick. Pocket Parks-Pocket Piers.
Don't think for a second that this is going away.
Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting in 1 1/2 hours. Will the overhead monitor be fixed?
Be concerned.
Keep score.
Quote from: fieldafm on January 31, 2011, 11:03:23 AM
My council rep knows of my overall concerns with the bill(which I believe is bad for our city as it does not serve to embrace an entrepreneural economy that our city desperately needs) as well as the potential for a modified bill that would exempt the waterways, as downtown is exempted.
A year ago and so very true today.
The reorg needs to immeditely address through legislation this opportunity for economic opportunity to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River a Federal Initiative.
Anybody want to go fishing under the brand new no fishing signs or paddle by the concrete debris field in Hogans Creek?
None of this before Waterways!
I am Downtown. and we Khan Make It Happen!
Quote from: Noone on November 28, 2010, 08:38:05 AM
Is this good legislation? I'd say no.
A one mile ban of any transient vendor.
This may soon become law in the largest city in the country landwise with the only exception being Downtown Jacksonville.
Food Trucks banned in the new Downtown Authority boundries? This is where the Jacksonville city council needs to offer an amendment to keep the pier separate and outside the control of the new Authority and allow Field to be the event planner as this city moves forward with the expanded Entertainment district.
Don't be afraid of this.
We are all Downtown!
Quote from: Noone on March 30, 2012, 05:53:05 AM
Quote from: Noone on November 28, 2010, 08:38:05 AM
Is this good legislation? I'd say no.
A one mile ban of any transient vendor.
This may soon become law in the largest city in the country landwise with the only exception being Downtown Jacksonville.
Food Trucks banned in the new Downtown Authority boundries? This is where the Jacksonville city council needs to offer an amendment to keep the pier separate and outside the control of the new Authority and allow Field to be the event planner as this city moves forward with the expanded Entertainment district.
Don't be afraid of this.
We are all Downtown!
Wanted to bump this.
First Mike congrats with the Food trucks.
Had 6 kayaks stolen from my residence and they are all sit ins. Let's catch whoever did it.
I'll be offering a $100 dollar reward.
If anyone sees a yellow, orange, blue kayak at a garage sale, flea market, pawn shop, send me a pm and I will check it out immediately. I'll run down every lead.
Mike if you can just think about compiling a list of our kayak trips that will help in making an arrest. The posting of the pics isn't as important as having the pic when confronting a lead.
Quote from: Noone on January 04, 2011, 08:46:23 AM
In 26 hours a special committee meeting on a jobs killer for Jacksonville.
What is the position of the Chamber?
Has this issue been brought to the attention of Skip Cramer and Elaine Brown? As they are in the middle of a JCCI study RECESSION, RECOVERY, and BEYOND.
Will Downtown still be exempt?
Will the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River be exempt especially if we are seeking a statewide recognition of a paddling trail?
What is the position of the Mayoral candidates and city council candidates?
Is this legislation an emergency?
Will our new slogan be
Lets get to Work - Just not in Jacksonville
Quote from: Noone on January 05, 2011, 12:24:02 PM
The committee meeting was cancelled.
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on January 05, 2011, 03:03:36 PM
Amazing how that always seems to happen once they realize people aren't fond of an item on the agenda.
Wanted to bump this thread and how it relates to today's subcommittee meeting on Hemming Plaza. Hopefully councilwoman Lee is OK and wonder what the reason was for the no show.
10 months later the legislation was withdrawn.
We now have a new DIA.
I've participated on other committee or sub committee meetings that I had concerns with.
2012-202 Free Parking for council members. Withdrawn. Placed in the budget. That passes.
2012-402 - FIND - Public grant application process for citizens of Jacksonville, circumvented.
Stay vigilant on Hemming Plaza as this issue moves forward.
2012-732? Tues. at city council.
Does anyone see a conspiracy and pattern of abuse here?
Perry Mason!
Matlock!
Get Smart!
Secret FIND list to be announced in two days.
Missed it by that much!
Anyone going?
Quote from: Noone on March 05, 2011, 07:21:34 AM
To the special sub committee that was created by Denise Lee and the three chairs Bishop, Redman, and Crescimbeni and as a citizen volunteer appointed by Chairwoman Lee I can assure you that I am working hard and the information that is forthcoming expands outside the boundaries of Duval county especially when it relates to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Will the Promised 680' Bay St. Pier Park be exempt as it relates to Waterway activities especially outside the control of an Independant Authority or will it be another version of SHIPYARDS III?
Two years later.
The mobility fee of the Waterways.
2009-442-Is there just one person in our region that would write a check for a buck to the Artificial Reef Trust Fund and I will deliver it personally on your behalf to the Jacksonville Waterways Commission, The Jacksonville city council, or our new DIA-Downtown Investment Authority.
2013-51- The total misrepresentation by OGC on the Jim Love, Kevin Kuzel Berkman floating dock compromise next to Shipyards III during the 2013 FIND grant application process. Palms Fish Camp.
In less then 10 hours Ethics Commission meeting on the right of Public to speak at noticed meetings. Vote yes.
Another issue that was brought up at the 3/1/13 Ethics subcommittee meeting was that the city intends to consolidate phone service so there will be no RFP.
Sprint has no capacity to retain text messages.
IT would cost us the people of Jacksonville $200,000 to retain text messages. This needs to happen. The PUBLIC TRUST.
Our leaders are dropping city devices and are using their own.
2013-9 Visit Jacksonville- Where our child molesters get pensions too with Board approval.
Quote from: Ralph W on November 28, 2010, 11:11:41 AM
Bill Type and Number: Ordinance 2010-856
Introducer/Sponsor(s): Council President Webb
Date of Introduction: November 9, 2010
Committee(s) of Reference: R, RCD
Date of Analysis: November 11, 2010
Type of Action: Ordinance Code amendment
Bill Summary: The bill amends Ordinance Code Chapter 250 â€" Miscellaneous Business Regulations â€" to prohibit transient merchants from locating within 1 mile of a permanent established business that sells the same types of products or services and to prohibit transient merchants from selling products not permitted in the zoning district where the transient merchant is located. The new regulations do not apply to permitted downtown sidewalk vendors who are regulated by another Ordinance Code section.
Background Information: The preamble to the bill states that transient merchants provide unfair competition to established, fixed merchants because they do not bear property ownership or lease costs (property taxes, insurance and maintenance) or utility expenses and that this competition is detrimental to the City’s economy.
Policy Impact Area: Transient merchant regulation
Fiscal Impact: Undetermined
Analyst: Clements
2013-373 Brand new legislation. Create an obligation?
What is the position of the Chamber?
What about the new guy at DIA Aundra Wallace?
Is the new DIA zone exempt?
Why is Councilman Brown pushing this?
Will an amendment be attached that will exempt the St. Johns River our American Heritage River a FEDERAL Initiative in our highly restricted DIA zone?
A new Authority
Embrace it
Or
It will Embrace us
Two days out and this will be in committees. ACTION can be taken by JSO. Will this subject HOA associations liable? Is the new DIA zone exempt? So no longer there is a boundary requirement. includes food trucks? What is the obligation we are looking to create?
The new guy Aundra Wallace isn't even here yet.
A new Authority
Embrace it
Or
It will Embrace us
Quote from: Noone on December 13, 2010, 08:58:43 PM
Today at the St. Johns River Alliance meeting there is discussion of a Paddling Trail of the St. Johns River Blueway. I took the opportunity to make the other 12 counties aware of 2010-856 and the transient ban and asked if other counties have a ban if a transient kayak trailer showed up. The Duval county representative made the members aware of Duval counties pending legislation.
After the meeting other county members were shaking there heads.
Lisa Rinaman showed up after the presentation and I told her that I mentioned 2010-856. She asked me if I spoke with councilman Webb and Redman. On the way back from Palatka I called and left a message for both Webb and Redman. I'll let everyone know if I get a response back. Be concerned.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 years later. An item on the agenda for the 11/13/13 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was number III Blue Way Designation Request of St. Johns River Alliance. Terra Meeks, Chief of Waterfront Management Programming.
I'll post more later but it just reinforces the total crushing of the Public Trust in Jacksonville. Paul Astleford the new guy with Visit Jacksonville is a super hero. The new guy with DIA Aundra Wallace (None of this can be pinned on you) Councilwoman Lori Boyer District 5 is just AWESOME! Duval county should be in total absolute shock. RICO guys, snap out of it.
You've got to love it when the CRA consultants use a Public comment period to tell the DIA Board members to tighten up because people go to jail. I believe this was before Aundra Wallace.
2013-384- Councilwoman Daniels are you going to attach an amendment now?
Of coarse this is all positive.
Just reposting this. I hit the wrong button. On a side note never had an email back from Redman. Also 3 months in a row and there is not a FIND update on the agenda. We are so LOST.
Anybody, Seriously contact Redman and ask him what the heck is going on with FIND. it's his project. Total Backroom deals. What are we trying to transform again?
Governor Scott, Please help.
The 11/13/13 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting should have been one big RESOLUTION telling the world DON'T VISIT JACKSONVILLE.
On the agenda
I. Approval of JWC minutes for10/9/13
II. Presentation on the St. Johns River Nassau River Aquatic Preserve. - Andrea Small, Fl. Dept. of Environmental Protection
III. Blue Way Designation Request of St. Johns River Alliance- Tera Meeks, Chief of Waterfront Management programming.
IV. Presentation on Land Use Amendment involving Waterways and associated Wetlands. - Ed Lukacovic, Senior Environmental Planner, Planning and Development Department.
V. St. Johns River Status Report, Water Quality and Manatee- Dr. Quinton White, Jacksonville University; Dr. Gerard Pinto, JU
VI. St. Johns River Issues Update- Lisa Rinaman, St. Johns Riverkeeper
VII. Old Business
basin Management Action Plan?- Commissioner Gary Anderson
VIII. New Business
IX. Public Comment
NO FIND UPDATE on the AGENDA- WE are so LOST?
RESOLUTIONS won the award for this meeting.
1. An emergency resolution for Lions Club Boat Ramp that wasn't on the agenda.
2. No Action for a resolution on the gillnet ban issue that was a front page TU story.
3. This was the big winner and congrats to councilwoman Lori Boyer, Scott Shine, Ralph Hodges. The Blueway Designation Request of the St. Johns River Alliance had 11 resolutions from adjoining counties but Duval county didn't participate. In fact the ED was a NO SHOW. So this was completely kept away from not only Waterways but the entire Jacksonville city council. This has to be positive. Visit Jacksonville!
Councilwoman Daniels are you now going to add an amendment to 2013-384 for 24/7 Public Access to Hogans Creek?
LPS- Let People Succeed!
Palms Fish Camp, Palms Fish Camp- A million bucks and you never even open the door.
My favorite- I had nothing to do with it. It wasn't my idea. Its Brilliant. The Jim Love, Kevin Kuzel 26' Berkman Floating dock compromise misrepresented by OGC to the Jacksonville Waterways Commission during the 2013 FIND grant application process. pats on the back to councilwoman Boyer on this one to.
DIA- What's going on with the RFI, RFP on Shipyards?
So many more examples. ADD YOUR OWN.
Still have an open contest on the new signage that was never before Waterways. I'll treat you to Chopstick Charley's and we will use Uber. It is next to the water in our newly created and highly restricted DIA zone.
DIA Board meeting 11/20/13 at 5pm 1St. Floor city Hall
A new Authority
Embrace It
Or
It will Embrace Us
Only 1 item on the 12/11/13 Jacksonville Waterways Commission agenda in addition to the regulars. The time of the meetings have been moved up to 9am in council chambers.
The point is that Councilman Redman the Chair of Waterways can ask council president Guilliford to have 2013-384 sent the next day to Waterways unless the full city council decides to add an amendment to 2013-384 that would allow for 24/7 Public Access to Hogans Creek a tributary that leads to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River a FEDERAL! Federal! Federal! initiative in our new highly restricted DIA zone.
Has anyone seen or received an agenda for the HUGE DIA meeting that is just hours away at 4pm 1st floor in the Ed Ball building. I haven't. Not good.
Councilman Redman has totally ignored the issue. Just one person call him and ask him about this. 630-1394 and Scott Wilson doesn't count. He is the chair of Waterways.
Just announced the Super Duper Secret 2014 FIND subcommittee meeting of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission will be in 6 days then the next day is the full meeting of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission at 9 am in council chambers and the full meeting of the DIA Board later in the day. Our property tax money. Does anybody care?
2010-856 and a 1 mile ban of a vendor.
At a recent DIA Board meeting Board member Mike Saylor alerted fellow Board members that our DIA Authority will now control (dictate) over 3 miles of Riverfront.
RAM dock is only opened when RAM is open. Not good. 4 years later.
CRA/DIA in the USA being formulated right now.
Vision 2025
Southbank Riverwalk project and the floating dock. Somebody contact Redman.
Shipyards III
Civic Council
JaxChamber
The case could be made that a 1 mile ban has been extended to a 3 mile ban.
Wanted to bump this in light of the new Food Truck legislation.
Heard back from DIA CEO Aundra Wallace and he is out of town till 2/26/14.
Jacksonville city council meeting tonight.
DIA meeting 2/26/14 at 10 1st floor city hall and DVI Board meeting at 12 in the Suntrust Building and Scott Wilson suggested I go to that one. All open to the Public.
Are we getting more access and economic opportunity to our Waterways Downtown?
Visit Jacksonville- Yeah Right!
Let's get to work- Just not in Jacksonville.
Public, Private, Partnership?
Councilman Redman are you going to amend 2007-451?
Planning a RICO paddle.
We can also fish under the brand new No Fishing signs that was never before Waterways.
The most positive project in Jacksonville, the state, the country, the world is the USS Charles F. Adams.
I am Downtown and why you aren't.
Who's next?
First Coast Connect this morning and Food Trucks. After this legislation will 2007-451 be amended too as it relates to our super duper restricted Waterways in our DIA zone?
Wanted to bump this.
Quote from: Noone on December 13, 2010, 08:58:43 PM
Today at the St. Johns River Alliance meeting there is discussion of a Paddling Trail of the St. Johns River Blueway. I took the opportunity to make the other 12 counties aware of 2010-856 and the transient ban and asked if other counties have a ban if a transient kayak trailer showed up. The Duval county representative made the members aware of Duval counties pending legislation.
After the meeting other county members were shaking there heads.
Lisa Rinaman showed up after the presentation and I told her that I mentioned 2010-856. She asked me if I spoke with councilman Webb and Redman. On the way back from Palatka I called and left a message for both Webb and Redman. I'll let everyone know if I get a response back. Be concerned.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 years later. An item on the agenda for the 11/13/13 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was number III Blue Way Designation Request of St. Johns River Alliance. Terra Meeks, Chief of Waterfront Management Programming.
I'll post more later but it just reinforces the total crushing of the Public Trust in Jacksonville. Paul Astleford the new guy with Visit Jacksonville is a super hero. The new guy with DIA Aundra Wallace (None of this can be pinned on you) Councilwoman Lori Boyer District 5 is just AWESOME! Duval county should be in total absolute shock. RICO guys, snap out of it.
You've got to love it when the CRA consultants use a Public comment period to tell the DIA Board members to tighten up because people go to jail. I believe this was before Aundra Wallace.
2013-384- Councilwoman Daniels are you going to attach an amendment now?
Of coarse this is all positive.
The 4/2/14 Noticed meeting on New Docking Rules by Dist. 14 Jacksonville city councilman Jim Love in response to a citizen concern of a constituent led to this meeting in District 4 and Downtown.
Huge concerns and issues were raised for a big vessel and where they were allowed and not allowed to engage the Public in their ability to conduct commerce on our St. Johns River an American Heritage River a FEDERAL Initiative in our new super duper highly restricted ( Food Truck, Kayak) DIA zone.
Councilman Love is not even in my District but this meeting in the Sunshine should lead to legislation being created and a positive outcome for providing an additional spark to a company that will cultivate on organic cluster of vibrancy in the urban core. Congratulations to councilman Love.
At the same time councilman Don Redman District 4 the Chair of the Jacksonville Waterways Commission and who's District includes Downtown became aware and has been aware of other disturbing revalations that will just CRUSH and DESTROY other opportunities from our Waterways Downtown that will tell the world. DON'T VISIT JACKSONVILLE! Scott, feel free to jump in here at any time.
Jacksonville city concil meeting tomorrow. Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting 4/9/14 at 9am 1st floor in council chambers. Haven't seen an agenda.
Also the start of One Spark and a Boat Show at metropolitan marina.
Still have an open contest if anyone can take a picture and post it of the New Waterway Signage that was never before the Jacksonville Waterways Commission. I will personally treat you to Chopstick Charley's and we will use Uber.
A new Authority
Embrace It
Or
It will Embrace Us
No Shoes
No Shirt
No Money
No Problem
Visit Jacksonville!
Quote from: Noone on January 27, 2011, 06:34:39 AM
Yesterday I had the opportunity to address the Board of Downtown Vision before the start of their meeting. Terry Lorrince is always so accommodating and gracious to make me feel welcome and any other invited guest or speaker. I'm also starting to feel like family just recognizing the other members when I see them in other functions and events. Angela Corey our state attorney was there and you could see that they also had a full agenda. Councilman Redman was there and basically the only real opportunity I had for talking with him was during introductions just going around the room.
My speech to the board was actually a request that the Board of Downtown Vision support a resolution that could be attached to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River. Just recognize that Downtown is exempt. The Waterways need to be exempt too.
I shared with the Board about TOURISM and the USS Adams coming to Downtown. Tourism and that the SJRA is seeking a statewide designation of a paddling trail. There are 67 counties in Florida and as this Paddling trail is created do we want to be the only county that would ban a transient outfitter from participating?
There were no questions or any motions. But it is out there. And that is important. The ord. is local. Its still active. Has anyone on this forum contacted any council member about this pending piece of legislation?
I stayed for Angela Corey's presentation and Q&A then left and made it back to my vehicle before the meter expired. Whew! Doesn't take much to make my day.
On my way back to work I put a call in and was fortunate to catch Scott Wilson who is Don Redman's assistant and just told him that I just saw Don at the Board meeting for Downtown Vision and wanted to share with Scott that I just saw on the news and in the paper where Don called the police on people feeding the homeless. And I basically said Scott this dovetails exactly with the transient vendor ban. Again I'll use All Wet Sports but there are examples everywhere. Ricker I can't wait to meet you and how this could impact the JMM. But anyway I said Scott you were there at the special committee meeting of Rules, LUZ and RCD. Don basically said to me go find your own waterfront access point a mile away and then you can participate. I'm not making it up. The point is and I said to Scott if Don can call the police for this church group feeding the homeless then Don can call the police if I show up or anyone else for that matter that is a transient vendor outfitter that may want to participate in the future of what could be a state wide paddling trail. Scott said that I had a point.
There are more meetings moving forward. It is still a local issue. I have been asking, asking, asking, asking, asking, my city councilman to offer an amendment to 2010-856 that would exempt the Waterways of the St. Johns River our American Heritage River. It doesn't seem to be happening. If he chooses to do nothing that is OK.
The issue is still a Duval county issue. If nothing happens it immediately sends a message. DON'T VISIT JACKSONVILLE.
and of coarse our new slogan.
Lets get to work- Just not in Jacksonville.
Wanted to bump these posts. Did everyone see the front page TU story on Protectors of the St. Johns? The story highlights Dean Campbell and Sam Carr in Palatka. Next St. Johns River Alliance meeting will be in Palatka 5/28/14 at 1pm
Quote from: Noone on March 11, 2013, 08:13:29 AM
Quote from: Noone on March 05, 2011, 07:21:34 AM
To the special sub committee that was created by Denise Lee and the three chairs Bishop, Redman, and Crescimbeni and as a citizen volunteer appointed by Chairwoman Lee I can assure you that I am working hard and the information that is forthcoming expands outside the boundaries of Duval county especially when it relates to our St. Johns River our American Heritage River.
Will the Promised 680' Bay St. Pier Park be exempt as it relates to Waterway activities especially outside the control of an Independant Authority or will it be another version of SHIPYARDS III?
Two years later.
The mobility fee of the Waterways.
2009-442-Is there just one person in our region that would write a check for a buck to the Artificial Reef Trust Fund and I will deliver it personally on your behalf to the Jacksonville Waterways Commission, The Jacksonville city council, or our new DIA-Downtown Investment Authority.
2013-51- The total misrepresentation by OGC on the Jim Love, Kevin Kuzel Berkman floating dock compromise next to Shipyards III during the 2013 FIND grant application process. Palms Fish Camp.
In less then 10 hours Ethics Commission meeting on the right of Public to speak at noticed meetings. Vote yes.
Another issue that was brought up at the 3/1/13 Ethics subcommittee meeting was that the city intends to consolidate phone service so there will be no RFP.
Sprint has no capacity to retain text messages.
IT would cost us the people of Jacksonville $200,000 to retain text messages. This needs to happen. The PUBLIC TRUST.
Our leaders are dropping city devices and are using their own.
2013-9 Visit Jacksonville- Where our child molesters get pensions too with Board approval.
In less than two hours the Rules agenda meeting. Anyone going? Anybody care?
2014-412 The illegal Unauthorized Purchase of two water taxis by the Executive Branch (Mayor) defrauding the Legislative Branch( Jacksonville City Council)
2014-426 - Doing away with annual Ethics Training for Jacksonville city council members. Vote NO
2014-457- Ethics. Again Vote NO
2014-305 New Docking Rules and PENALTIES attach an amendment that would allow for a sustainable opportunity for everyone especially in our new Super Duper restricted CRA/DIA zone from the Fuller Warren Bridge to the Mathews Bridge. Have asked our St. Johns Riverkeeper for such a letter of support. Have yet to hear back. Stay Positive.
Visit Jacksonville!
The 8/4/14 Rules committee meeting had you just wanting to break all the Rules as legislation was moved forward. Where to start. There were no speaker cards for the Public. Let's approve appointments for No Shows and don't forget to get your library card.
When 2014-412 came up and this is the legislation for the illegal unauthorized purchase of two water taxis by the Executive Branch (Mayor) that defrauded the Legislative Branch ( Jacksonville city council). Councilman Schelenberg informed the committee that they are hoping to have the illegal taxis transporting conspirators from one illegal
side of the RIO St. Johns to the other illegal side of the RIO St. Johns River.
Had to leave but does anyone know if we are doing away with Ethics Training for city council members?
Visit Jacksonville!
Does anyone realize that the 1 mile ban has now been expanded to a 4.8mile Waterfront ban Downtown.
2014-305 New docking Rules and PENALTIES
2014-426 - USS Adams
Both pieces of legislation are in two committees today. Finance and RCD/PHS
I have emailed my elected legislative representative Don Redman District 4 who is also the Chair of RCD/PHS and asked if he will attach a friendly amendment to 2014-305. it's a lob pitch and I hope he knocks it out of the park.
Yesterday at Finance 2014-305 New Docking Rules and PENALTIES was deferred. Let's hope that the PUBLIC TRUST will be restored to our St. Johns River an American Heritage River a FEDERAL Initiative in our yet to be voted on by the Jacksonville city council Super Duper restricted CRA/DIA zone.
Food truck legislation today at city hall. Watercraft legislation today at city hall.
Quote from: Noone on December 13, 2010, 08:58:43 PM
Today at the St. Johns River Alliance meeting there is discussion of a Paddling Trail of the St. Johns River Blueway. I took the opportunity to make the other 12 counties aware of 2010-856 and the transient ban and asked if other counties have a ban if a transient kayak trailer showed up. The Duval county representative made the members aware of Duval counties pending legislation.
After the meeting other county members were shaking there heads.
Lisa Rinaman showed up after the presentation and I told her that I mentioned 2010-856. She asked me if I spoke with councilman Webb and Redman. On the way back from Palatka I called and left a message for both Webb and Redman. I'll let everyone know if I get a response back. Be concerned.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 years later. An item on the agenda for the 11/13/13 Jacksonville Waterways Commission meeting was number III Blue Way Designation Request of St. Johns River Alliance. Terra Meeks, Chief of Waterfront Management Programming.
I'll post more later but it just reinforces the total crushing of the Public Trust in Jacksonville. Paul Astleford the new guy with Visit Jacksonville is a super hero. The new guy with DIA Aundra Wallace (None of this can be pinned on you) Councilwoman Lori Boyer District 5 is just AWESOME! Duval county should be in total absolute shock. RICO guys, snap out of it.
You've got to love it when the CRA consultants use a Public comment period to tell the DIA Board members to tighten up because people go to jail. I believe this was before Aundra Wallace.
2013-384- Councilwoman Daniels are you going to attach an amendment now?
Of coarse this is all positive.
2014-665 Uber and Lyft legislation. 67 counties in Florida. Are we going to be kicking these guys out of Jacksonville like we did with the Baltimore guys from the water? 2014-412
2014-665 will be in Rules at 9 am in council chambers. Agenda meeting at 8:30 am on the 4th floor.
Visit Jacksonville!
Quote from: Noone on November 30, 2010, 05:31:59 PM
Quote from: fieldafm on November 29, 2010, 09:38:28 PM
QuoteAt the last council meeting there was a resolution in a jbill that will create an "Urban Transition Area" in Riverside. A Special Drinking Zone.
I actually see that as a good thing for the neighborhood. North Riverside is in need of some help in order to thrive as it once did. The Urban Transition Area has special allowances to spur commercial businesses that can create vibrancy.... much like the businesses that have made King Street a destination again.
But I think this particular bill(2010-856) really targets the transient 'vendors' that sell rugs, paintings, agricultural products, nursuries, etc on the side of the road. 'Hot Dog Cart Bill' is kind of a misleading title... unless Im not understanding the bill correctly?
"Urban Transition Area" in Riverside I still say its legislative protectionism. Any other bar in the city that wants it allow them the opportunity to do it as well.
You are absolutely right about 2010-856. Its not just a hot dog cart. In fact the scope of what constitutes a transient service is more widespread and diverse in its interpretation. Why is this being pushed NOW?
There is a JCCI study going on right now RECESSION, RECOVERY, and BEYOND. This ordinance should be part of the study. Is anyone on this forum participating in this study?
I've done two and it was horrible. Just a stab in the back to the people of Jacksonville that legislation that could have an impact on a study was acted on or introduced right in the middle of the study. This sounds exactly what is happening again. How wrong.
These studies do guide policy.
We need another round over here!
Can I get a J Bill for this?
Recently participated in the city wide Keep Jacksonville Beautiful city wide cleanup at the Beach Blvd. Boat ramp and sucking down a Sweetwater beer along with Shannon Blankenship and the Rising Tides group of the St. Johns Riverkeeper I was talking with candidate for Dist. 4 Ramon Day who had his campaign signs out and if elected will advance my name for consideration to the Jacksonville Waterways Commission and if elected will also be creating the FOP Friends of Pottsberg Creek.
Sign me up?
Environmental Ethics - Vince Seibold
Visit Jacksonville!
Quote from: north miami on August 28, 2011, 04:10:45 AM
At least three minute allotment is plenty of time to establish legal standing if needed and that is about the only cause for attending,although I see from the attendance list many must attend out of habit.
What was the vision,enabling legislation that created the Waterways Commission?
What are the accomplishments,challenges ?
Fairly recently there were discussions of the need to expand the role,'power' of the Commission.What's up with that?
OK,15 repeat pages going to blur,time for Spring Tide flush.